Owning Land Under The Us Amity Treaty

[SoCalChris]

The story goes that I tried to work together with my Thai gf and her family to acquired a piece of land to build a small house on somewhere close to the family in Isaan. The family became way too controlling on where and what I should be buying. Specifically, I have an MBA in real estate and they were suggesting some really stupid approaches. This created some serious tensions which was dissappointing since I've had a good relationship with the family up to this point.

In moving forward, I am a US citizen, 47 years old, with a good paying job in Ekkamai under a non-B Visa/work permit. My Thai gf and I are not married, but we just had a baby not too long ago. I would like to take advantage of this Amity Treaty setup for this goal of building a house. I like my privacy and want to do as I wish to the property as well. My understanding is I actually need to form a majority-owned company, which buys the land (up to a rai) and then I rent this from the company to build the house. Unfortunately, I heard this can take very long to process.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Amity_and_Economic_Relations_(Thailand%E2%80%93United_States)

If anyone on the forum has done this, what is your experience with it? Also, any reality checks for using the Amity Treaty to just own the land and build a house would be appreciated. IE, do I also have to have some other type of business operation in addition to just the land rental? TIA!

[Sophon]

A company opened under the Amity Treaty will be a foreign company and as such cannot own land. Only Thai companies (and individuals) can own land.

Sophon

[transam]

Seems the family knows their stuff. Your money, but their house/land, so their requirements.

[ballbreaker]

Save yourself the hassle and buy land in GF's name then have her give you usufruct on the property till end of your life. Use the usufruct form at the land office rather than draw one up yourself. The usufruct gives you full control of the property except ownership. Find yourself a builder, get building permit in your name and then proceed with construction.

Worst mistake you can make is moving near the Thai family in most cases.

[SoCalChris]

Thanks again for the responses. See below:

@ sophon: True and not true; an American citizen through the Amity Treaty can have majority (up to 100%) shareholding in a Thailand company, a company which can then own up to 1 rai of land. This is what makes it unique.

"The treaty allows for American citizens and businesses incorporated in the U.S, or in Thailand to maintain a majority shareholding or to wholly own its company in Thailand," (Wikipedia)

@Transam: The gf/family will have little to no say in the requirements....my company. I can also have my Amity Treaty Thailand company buy/own/invest in the property instead of just renting it from someone in a usufruct.

@ballbreaker: Agreed, I am considering exactly what you are proposing with the usufruct. However, I heard about this Amity Treaty thing and wanted to learn more before final commitment.

Cheers,

Chris

Edited April 9, 2012 by SoCalChris

[Sophon]

@ sophon: True and not true; an American citizen through the Amity Treaty can have majority (up to 100%) shareholding in a Thailand company, a company which can then own up to 1 rai of land. This is what makes it unique.

I am afraid you are misinformed, but maybe I should have said that a Amity company would be a foreign owned company and not a Thai company. Try searching on this site and you will find plenty of threads confirming that Amity companies cannot own land in Thailand.

Sophon

[Sophon]

Even the Wikipedia article you have quoted from continues to say:

Under the Treaty, Thailand restricts American investment only in the following fields of business:^[1]

1. Communications
   
2. Transportation
   
3. Fiduciary functions
   
4. Banking involving depository functions
   
5. Exploitation of land and natural resources
   
6. Owning land; and
   
7. Domestic trade in agricultural products.
   

Granted the wording "restricts" isn't very clear as to wether it just limits or totally forbids it, so here is a more clear statement from a Thai legal firm:

Can Amity Treaty Companies engage in all the same activities as Thai companies?

The Amity Treaty specifies that companies with majority US ownership will receive national treatment, or will be able to operate on the same basis as Thai companies, however, there are certain exceptions. Amity Treaty Companies are not allowed to own land or engage in certain enterprises such as domestic trade in agricultural products, land and natural resources exploitation and the liberal professions.

Sophon

[SoCalChris]

Hi Sophon,

I actually searched for quite a bit, but I ran into a lot of ambiguity, which is why I posted my question. I'm pretty sure an Amity Treaty company is considered a foreign-owned majority Thai company with almost all of the rights/privileges of a Thai-own majority Thai company. The question is can they own land and if so, how much.

After more searching, I found that your were correct, I was mis-informed. The person(s) who stated a US citizen could own up to one rai of land under the Amity Treaty confused it with the 40 million baht foreign investment law made in 1999. No thank you! Anyhow, I appreciate you clearing this up for me.

Looks like my moving forward plans will be usufruct strategy. -Chris

[sscsamui]

Here is a legal explanation of a usufructs by Thai law... Very interesting... http://www.isaanlawyers.com/Usufruct%20agreements%20in%20Thailand.pdf

[dksharron]

Don't buy!

Easy decision. Plus, if you will not be able to stay there full time during the construction of the house, you will not get what you had planned on.

Currently, your assets, money, stocks, etc., are under your control.

Once you put money forward to buy this land in your gf's name, and she leases it or usufruct's it to you, what do you have?

SHE OWNS THE LAND.

You have the right to live there for 30 years or until you die or?, but you do not own the land.

I have moved a lot in my life, and I am sure the majority of the posters here have as well, but if you wanted to sell the land, good luck! You cannot simply move and sell the house.

Your gf family will object to no ends. What they will say to your gf will be beyond belief, as you are already starting to see their interference and desire for control as to where the land will be.

They want to make the decision because as far as they are concerned, IT IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE THEIRS!

Buy a condo in Bkk instead, one that can be in your own name, if you have plans on staying there for a while.

Buying property in your wife's name; would you do it back in your country?

Best of luck to you.

[strollling]

Don't be pressured into anything.

Rent, don't buy.

They don't like it, tough.

I'm a grumpy young bastard and I have nothing to do with my inlaws and the family. It's great.

If you're having trouble with the concept, perhaps try to order some testicle developers through a pharmacy or something.

[JeffreyMcCollum]

BOI 2002 law, if you transfer in 30,000,000 Baht,, you can buy in your name up to 1 rai of land to build a home in your name.

[Naam]

BOI 2002 law, if you transfer in 30,000,000 Baht,, you can buy in your name up to 1 rai of land to build a home in your name.

only in wet dreams.

[yougivemebaby]

I too have stayed with my GF very close to her family's house. What a nightmare. Always asking you for money. Directly or indirectly. You are the sugar daddy for EVERYONE. Sometimes even the neighbors. I cut this off REAL quick. I told my gf I am not an ATM and frequently told them I don't have money. Sorry I wish I could help you. Bought groceries every once and a while but they put a lot of pressure on you daily to buy things or improve their life. It is very literally flushing your money down the toilet. I'd rather buy lottery tickets. I also made the mistake of buying my gf's mom some products for her little shop. Food, soap, etc. Daily they'd try to get me to buy more. I asked my gf why doesn't your mom buy more with the money she made? Reply: Mom is putting the money in the bank. LOL I might as well have just transferred her mom the money. Would have saved me time. The neighbors will put pressure on you too. Honestly. You'll feel very alone and not have any freedom at all if you're within 1km of her family. I'd try a whole different part of Thailand if I were you. Make sure your place doesn't have extra rooms the in laws can stay.