More To Reconciliation Than Amnesty: Slain Thai Officer's Wife

[webfact]

More to reconciliation than amnesty: slain officer's wife

The Nation

BANGKOK: -- The wife of an Army commander killed in a clash two years ago yesterday during a red shirt anti-government protest urged the government not to make granting amnesty the sole focus of efforts to achieve reconciliation

Nicha Hirunburana Thuwatham said yesterday that there are four factors in reconciliation - finding facts, entering the justice process, providing compensation and granting amnesty.

"We cannot just touch on any of the issues and claim that is reconciliation. The four steps must be done in that order," Nicha said. "I want an explanation on why the fact-finding step has been skipped. They are now jumping to the amnesty step."

She said a rush to amnesty, without sufficient participation of the different parties in the reconciliation process, would do more harm than good to the country.

"We don't know the exact meaning of 'reconciliation'. The word has been used so often, it's become a cliche. In fact, to reach reconciliation, you need acceptance from all sides," she said.

Nicha's husband Colonel Romklao Thuwatham was killed on the night of April 10, 2010, near the Democracy Monument when grenades were fired at his unit. Romklao was among six soldiers killed in the incident. Armed men in black were blamed for the deaths and injuries of many people, including red shirt protesters and soldiers.

A religious ceremony was held late yesterday morning at Bowon Niwet Wihan Temple in memory of the soldiers and civilians killed in the clash two years ago. Among those attending the event were Nicha, senior Army officers including First Army Region commander Lt-General Udomdej Sutabutr, opposition Democrat Party deputy leader Korn Chatikavanij, People's Alliance for Democracy spokesman Panthep Puapongpan, and multicoloured shirt group leader Dr Tul Sitthisomwong.

Nicha said she shared the feelings of people whose family members and loved ones were killed or injured in the political unrest two years ago.

She said she has come out publicly because she felt that two years' time was enough to collect facts about her husband's death. "There was some progress but then there seemed to be a change. I don't want to make trouble; I just sincerely want to know the answer," she said.

At the Khok Wua intersection, where a bomb attack on Romklao's unit took place, some 20 Democrat MPs led by Korn placed white wreaths in memory of those killed in the April 10 incident. Some other people attending the event wore black T-shirts with the message "The truth will be known". One minute of silence was also observed.

Separately, the red shirts held an event at the nearby Democracy Monument yesterday in memory of the protesters killed on the same day.

-- The Nation 2012-04-11

[Roadman]

Condolences to Khun Nicha on the loss (murder) of her partner at the hands of Thaksins and the Reds armed militia.

She is correct in her observation that this current government is not about reconciliation but rather amnesty for those, or more importantly the financer and ring leader of the whole mess. the fugitive criminal Thaksin only - reconciliation is simply bring back the criminal at all costs. One does not need to look far than the last two paragraphs of this item to see the huge divide between the two groups, Thaksins rabble and the educated, that is never going to go away.

Some interesting comments in there that really show up Pheu Thai's agenda for what it is and the full contempt that they have for reconciliation.

[sparebox2]

I have no sympathy for Romklao or any solider who die in the course of duty.

They are in the business of war, and they knew the risk when they sign up for a position in the army.

In Thailand, professional army is a career choice. If you are afraid to die, they do not have to join.

Most solider join the army because they know and expected to be compensated heavily from the under-table money from govt defense budget (and tax free too)

Just show me 1 general (just 1 and I am happy) that does not drive a Merc S class and have million dollar home. Look back their records 30 years, and I bet most come from poor rural farming family with land less than 10 rai.

Edited April 11, 2012 by sparebox2

[KireB]

I have no sympathy for Romklao or any solider who die in the course of duty.

They are in the business of war, and they knew the risk when they sign up for a position in the army.

In Thailand, professional army is a career choice. If you are afraid to die, they do not have to join.

Most solider join the army because they know and expected to be compensated heavily from the under-table money from govt defense budget (and tax free too)

Just show me 1 general (just 1 and I am happy) that does not drive a Merc S class and have million dollar home. Look back their records 30 years, and I bet most come from poor rural farming family with land less than 10 rai.

Some bold statements you make here!

[heiwa]

I have no sympathy for Romklao or any solider who die in the course of duty.

They are in the business of war, and they knew the risk when they sign up for a position in the army.

In Thailand, professional army is a career choice. If you are afraid to die, they do not have to join.

Most solider join the army because they know and expected to be compensated heavily from the under-table money from govt defense budget (and tax free too)

Just show me 1 general (just 1 and I am happy) that does not drive a Merc S class and have million dollar home. Look back their records 30 years, and I bet most come from poor rural farming family with land less than 10 rai.

So a young man is sent to somewhere in Thailand to protect the interests of the elite (an ignorant pawn) and he gets his legs blown off and blinded and for this ends up selling lottery tickets for the rest of his life. Yep, I agree you have no sympathy. I admire your honesty. Nothing beats saying what one really things. Well done. If only everyone was as honest as you about the way you feel. Agree to agree to differ.

[edwinchester]

You have to doubt the chances of true reconciliation when the different groups have to have separate memorial services to remember the dead. So very sad.

Posted with Thaivisa App http://apps.thaivisa.com

[metisdead]

Some off topic posts have been removed.

[CalgaryII]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

Edited April 11, 2012 by CalgaryII

[Bagwan]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

What a load of codswallop. You should be marketing soap powder, toothpaste or any of the overpriced crap that women slap on their dials. Or maybe you generate all the BS that Amsterdam spews out.

Protesting taxpayers my ass. How many rural folk do you know who pay tax? As for the crap about fighting for their political rights, only so that they could sell them to the highest bidder?

[WhizBang]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

Good grief. What a load of rubbish. You must be getting paid by both Thaksin and Amsterdam to spew this tripe.

[whybother]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

Do you mean that they weren't against the Democrat government? They were just protesting against something that happened 5 years earlier?

[allan michaud]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

Total codswallop, you're frothing again

[letitbe]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

Total codswallop, you're frothing again

its people like that who make me wish they were caught up in a red shirt rampage disgusting pathetic man. when will those forang who support reds wake up. They are exact ones whod probably cheer on Hiotlers brown shirts Stalins gangs Saddams killings and Mugabwie encouraging mobs to murder whites in that country. I had no love for aparteit or exploitation of whites in southern africa against blacks and dont like thailand elite who only care for themselves first amongst them being this idiots heros

[ramrod711]

Please don't try to confuse Calgary with facts, he's like one of those autmated telephone dialers, He sees an article about Thaksin or red shirts and he begins typing without thinking.

[Nickymaster]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

What a nonsense. Educated people don't fall for this crap. Your "it's the coup's fault strategy" is outdated. I suggest you find a new strategy because you are more and more a laughing-stock.

Edited April 11, 2012 by Nickymaster

[Phatcharanan]

Please don't try to confuse Calgary with facts, he's like one of those autmated telephone dialers, He sees an article about Thaksin or red shirts and he begins typing without thinking.

LOL! Poor old Calgary. Writes such rubbish.

[backtonormal]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

Calgaryll does not need support as he eloquently states his case. The opposition are trying bury this before it gets out, which is what they have done on 3 previous occasions recently(last 20 years), where the killing of Thai nationals was covered up. No more cover ups.

Cut the time wasting and just ask what the orders were, who gave them etc etc That will sure open a can of worms

Edited April 11, 2012 by backtonormal

[hyperdimension]

Calgaryll does not need support as he eloquently states his case.

He eloquently writes rubbish. "R'song was not an anti-govt. protest"? They were protesting against the Democrat-led government. Who else thinks that they were not?

[heiwa]

Calgaryll does not need support as he eloquently states his case.

He eloquently writes rubbish. "R'song was not an anti-govt. protest"? They were protesting against the Democrat-led government. Who else thinks that they were not?

I guess it was for both reasons. The majority were denied their voting rights many times with coups. So you are both right. So you both deserve a pat on the back. Comments comparing the Reds to Hitler? Please explain? History shows violence is the only way forward and sometimes backward. The elite rarely hand a better life to the peasants without a kind of Oliver Twist rendition on over-drive. One must fight for their rights to escape oppression of the elite. Now they have the 300 baht wages - which will be good news for some and bad news for others who lose their jobs. Hard to know what the winning formula is. Higher wages and less jobs or Lower wages and more jobs as investment goes to Burma and Indonesia. Edited April 11, 2012 by heiwa

[hellodolly]

I have no sympathy for Romklao or any solider who die in the course of duty.

They are in the business of war, and they knew the risk when they sign up for a position in the army.

In Thailand, professional army is a career choice. If you are afraid to die, they do not have to join.

Most solider join the army because they know and expected to be compensated heavily from the under-table money from govt defense budget (and tax free too)

Just show me 1 general (just 1 and I am happy) that does not drive a Merc S class and have million dollar home. Look back their records 30 years, and I bet most come from poor rural farming family with land less than 10 rai.

Yes they sign up for the business of war not to do the policemen job for them.

My condolences to the remaining friends and relatives of all who died.

[hellodolly]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

What a load of codswallop. You should be marketing soap powder, toothpaste or any of the overpriced crap that women slap on their dials. Or maybe you generate all the BS that Amsterdam spews out.

Protesting taxpayers my ass. How many rural folk do you know who pay tax? As for the crap about fighting for their political rights, only so that they could sell them to the highest bidder?

I liked this little tid bit of his

"It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements."

That coming from a man or women who is completely clueless as to what happened and just posts his or her's .fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements." But I will give him her credit they have come a long way they no long try to justify things with what happened in the 90s.

[hellodolly]

"..................................during a red shirt anti-government protest..................."

It is these seemingly innocuous, off-the-cuff references to R'song stated as fact, are 'in fact' misleadingly designed, historically revisionist statements............. R'song was not an anti-govt. protest.....it was an anti-coup protest. This kind of revisionism is simply Coupists trying to hide behind anti-Govt. rhetoric...... What protesting taxpayers fought and died for, was not against any Govt., but against the theft of their political rights - the right to be governed by those they select..........Hence their mantra about early elections, that were violently suppressed and denied by those who feared losing them, as indeed happened last year...........To this Opposition who will be faced with the truth of what they did, as described above, any progress to that objective would be a 'rushed". They want to drown this thing in interminable processes until it fails just by the sheer weight of itself.

Calgaryll does not need support as he eloquently states his case. The opposition are trying bury this before it gets out, which is what they have done on 3 previous occasions recently(last 20 years), where the killing of Thai nationals was covered up. No more cover ups.

Cut the time wasting and just ask what the orders were, who gave them etc etc That will sure open a can of worms

Ya cut the BS

Thaksin ordered the red shirts to do what they did and Abhist ordered the army to put an end to it after the red shirts had negotiated a settlement and backed out of it.

Now are you happy.

[hellodolly]

Calgaryll does not need support as he eloquently states his case.

He eloquently writes rubbish. "R'song was not an anti-govt. protest"? They were protesting against the Democrat-led government. Who else thinks that they were not?

I guess it was for both reasons. The majority were denied their voting rights many times with coups. So you are both right. So you both deserve a pat on the back. Comments comparing the Reds to Hitler? Please explain? History shows violence is the only way forward and sometimes backward. The elite rarely hand a better life to the peasants without a kind of Oliver Twist rendition on over-drive. One must fight for their rights to escape oppression of the elite. Now they have the 300 baht wages - which will be good news for some and bad news for others who lose their jobs. Hard to know what the winning formula is. Higher wages and less jobs or Lower wages and more jobs as investment goes to Burma and Indonesia.

The majority probably don't remember all the coup's most of them probably just remember the last one. And after a year they were given back their rights to vote. Being as Thailand is not a Democracy it uses the Parliamentarian system they wound up with the government they got.

On a side note do you know of any countries that are a democracy. The states is a Republic a very week cousin of the Parliamentarian system.

[TAWP]

One poster calling the murder of a soldier as something to not care about and another claiming a occupation of a downtown business district had anything to do with a coup long before and not the court-case about money just finished...atleast the Reds [fans] show their level.

[anterian]

In the days when inheritance was based on primogeniture, younger sons had two choices to improve their lot, either the clergy or the military. In both cases they started high up the ladder. This is still the case in Thailand.

The poor on the other hand could follow the same route but have to start at the bottom and work their way up by ability.

In the Thai army the predominant attitude is the ranks will fight as needed whilst the officers safely command, so I can feel sad at the death of a soldier but mainly surprise at the death of an officer.

[OzMick]

In the days when inheritance was based on primogeniture, younger sons had two choices to improve their lot, either the clergy or the military. In both cases they started high up the ladder. This is still the case in Thailand.

The poor on the other hand could follow the same route but have to start at the bottom and work their way up by ability.

In the Thai army the predominant attitude is the ranks will fight as needed whilst the officers safely command, so I can feel sad at the death of a soldier but mainly surprise at the death of an officer.

As a random event, it would be surprising. As the opening shot of an ambush, killing the opponent's commander and staff is a sound military tactic, if not what would be expected of "peaceful protesters."

"I want an explanation on why the fact-finding step has been skipped."

The facts are inconvenient.

[anterian]

In the days when inheritance was based on primogeniture, younger sons had two choices to improve their lot, either the clergy or the military. In both cases they started high up the ladder. This is still the case in Thailand.

The poor on the other hand could follow the same route but have to start at the bottom and work their way up by ability.

In the Thai army the predominant attitude is the ranks will fight as needed whilst the officers safely command, so I can feel sad at the death of a soldier but mainly surprise at the death of an officer.

As a random event, it would be surprising. As the opening shot of an ambush, killing the opponent's commander and staff is a sound military tactic, if not what would be expected of "peaceful protesters."

"I want an explanation on why the fact-finding step has been skipped."

The facts are inconvenient.

Perhaps I should have said surprise at such a high ranking officer, a Captain or Major would be more understandable. On the other hand Thailand does have rather a glut of generals and Colonels.