Songkran Death Toll Way Over Last Year As Millions Return To Bangkok

[Thai at Heart]

There are about 12000 traffic deaths in Thailand each year. 250 per week or so. Songkran deaths are not any worse than any other week when you figure kilometers travelled.

Interesting post.

And that is those who pass away at the scene. It really is an astonishingly dangerous place to drive, I am always surprised that considering that the rules are made up by concensus as opposed to people knowing the rules, that there aren't more accidents.

[Markaew]

Personally writing I think the actual "body count" /Casualty/accident rates is way over those that are portrayed , "head onners" in the UK are extremely rare ,yet here they are the order of the day ,simply because (1) they overtake were they cannot see like on a blind bend or the brow of a hill , or (2) when turning right they invariably take the corner on the WRONG SIDE of the road!, the results of these insane moves are obvious.

I have a restaurant close to a small but very busy road that has a T junction with no lights and just 5 meters left of the junction there is a small road to get to a bunch of small apts.

In 3 years sitting around the restaurant for an hour a day i have NEVER seen a single thai turn from the bottom of the T to the right without by moving forward then turning right once he crosses the line, im not exagerating, 0 in 3 years, they all try to run over the motorbikes turning left into the lane. Also never seen a single thai coming from the left of the T junction turning into the bottom lane doing it right. They always stop right at the junction ini front of the incoming and they turning straight, trying to cut to the right of the cars waiting in the wrong lane instead of moving forward to their left lane and turning in it. Almost everyday this creates massive jams as the guys going forward on the upper part of the junction have no stops. So once someone wwants to turn in the mini APT road 5meters down the people will leave a spot open in front of the bottom of the T to turn in but since they are too dumb to move forward to the lane and want to cut from A to C directly they block the APT road, waiting to cut into parked car instead of moving 2meters forward and now everyone is completely stuck for 5-10mins untill either the guy turning home gives up or the idiot who doesnt want to go from A to B to C decides to finaly hit the B point. 2meters ahead where he should be turning in a 90 degre angle.

Then after i see this daily i remember people telling me that all thais need is education and time to evolve..

yeah right, have 3 years of data to prove the complete oposite. It's the same people who do the same mistake everyday.

After foreigners have been here for years I think they (and me) would have to agree with your finishing statement.

[Billmont]

Twelve Songkran's in and I'm really finding it difficult to enjoy it any more. The balance between fun and outright stupidity is now weighted very heavily against fun.

What Songkran I did see in Bangkok yesterday resembled some sort of aquatic Mad Max. Drunk people standing in the middle of Sukhumvit road, which is very often handles more traffic than a busy UK "A" road. Large swarms of people on bikes in gangs, drunk and covered in that powder. No helmets, obviously, but I did see one guy wearing a snorkel.

And then there's the trucks of people, all drunk. But, of course the drivers have volunteered to stay sober now, haven't they?

Although I spotted a few cops here and there over the past few days, yesterday I could see none.

Call me a grump. I think I'm pretty much through with Songkran's like these now...

Better to be a Grump than a Corpse!!!!!!

I must be even more grumpy. Although I live in a small village and it is fun for young children I no longer participate. I stock up with all the necessaries, including Chang and good Scotch and spend 3 days without leaving my house. I cook large batches of food for my freezer and then on each evening sample my dish of the day after a few Chang's, maybe some wine and a good measure of Scotch to go to bed with some chocolate and watch a movie or some sport. I really enjoy my Sonkran and have many dishes such as Chilli, Bolognese, fillings for Beef in Beer and Chicken, Bacon and Leak pies already for when I do not fancy cooking or have some surprise guests. Driving in Thailand is not the most pleasant experience during normal days but during Sonkran is really is a nightmare. I prefer to end my days with a inflated waistline from my cooking than at the hands or feet of some person who has over indulged in alcohol with a 4 wheel weapon not under his control. I love to live here in Thailand but still want to live and accept there are risks in all walks of life, here and in Europe but at Sonkran I minimise these risks by staying home! Sometimes Grumpy is Good!

[Jim walker]

Chon Buri, no accidents so if you want to feel safe in the Songkran come to the place with sensible responsible drivers and have a wonderful New Year party.

[mca]

Chon Buri, no accidents so if you want to feel safe in the Songkran come to the place with sensible responsible drivers and have a wonderful New Year party.

I think you'll find that's no fatalities as opposed to no accidents Jim.

[Robroy]

Yeah, Songkran has become a piss-up and a melee. In my experience, most Thais over 30 don't like it either.

Cambodia, where water celebrations have been banned, is IMO a nicer place to be living, come New Year.

[Jim walker]

oops sorry mca I stand corrected

[MAJIC]

Drove down to tak and back to Chiang mai no problems no wrecks just a lot of water, the loss of life is a shame but then again I am here for the mai bpen rai life style and if people where honest that is the reason many of you came here as well but now you want it to be like home. Get a grip no nanny state here unless you are rich and famous

Nothing to do with the Nanny State,just plain common sense!

[sandhurstmolonski]

Drove down to tak and back to Chiang mai no problems no wrecks just a lot of water, the loss of life is a shame but then again I am here for the mai bpen rai life style and if people where honest that is the reason many of you came here as well but now you want it to be like home. Get a grip no nanny state here unless you are rich and famous

The mai bpen rai lifestyle is great? So you wouldn't complain if a loved one got killed/maimed by a drunk driver? Some rules are necessary (like a ban on drink-driving), but I agree not to the level of nanny states like some countries in the west. There can be compromise.

Its a Bit like Moving next to a Golf Course and complaining because you GET smacked with a Ball .

Yes , there is a huge element of Danger on the roads no doubt ..But you knew that when you came here , you must be escaping from something or you wouldn't live here ..there must be something drawing you to Thailand ??

You cant just move in ..say Great ..Ive been here for 15 years ..Now this is wrong ..that is wrong ..They have to change etc etc etc etc

" They " dont have to do anything , and Yep , its a dangerous , unregulated place in many respects . But many of us dont WANT it to be the UK , USA .. or anywhere else ..we came to get away from that . The answer is obvious ...

Everything Cannot be perfect .. This is NOT Europe .. and thank Buddah for that !

[soundman]

More overly negative posts directed at all Thai's removed from view.

[sandhurstmolonski]

Twelve Songkran's in and I'm really finding it difficult to enjoy it any more. The balance between fun and outright stupidity is now weighted very heavily against fun.

What Songkran I did see in Bangkok yesterday resembled some sort of aquatic Mad Max. Drunk people standing in the middle of Sukhumvit road, which is very often handles more traffic than a busy UK "A" road. Large swarms of people on bikes in gangs, drunk and covered in that powder. No helmets, obviously, but I did see one guy wearing a snorkel.

And then there's the trucks of people, all drunk. But, of course the drivers have volunteered to stay sober now, haven't they?

Although I spotted a few cops here and there over the past few days, yesterday I could see none.

Call me a grump. I think I'm pretty much through with Songkran's like these now...

Better to be a Grump than a Corpse!!!!!!

I must be even more grumpy. Although I live in a small village and it is fun for young children I no longer participate. I stock up with all the necessaries, including Chang and good Scotch and spend 3 days without leaving my house. I cook large batches of food for my freezer and then on each evening sample my dish of the day after a few Chang's, maybe some wine and a good measure of Scotch to go to bed with some chocolate and watch a movie or some sport. I really enjoy my Sonkran and have many dishes such as Chilli, Bolognese, fillings for Beef in Beer and Chicken, Bacon and Leak pies already for when I do not fancy cooking or have some surprise guests. Driving in Thailand is not the most pleasant experience during normal days but during Sonkran is really is a nightmare. I prefer to end my days with a inflated waistline from my cooking than at the hands or feet of some person who has over indulged in alcohol with a 4 wheel weapon not under his control. I love to live here in Thailand but still want to live and accept there are risks in all walks of life, here and in Europe but at Sonkran I minimise these risks by staying home! Sometimes Grumpy is Good!

I believe this is a good Stategy ... You have made you decision , its a logical view , and you are enjoying your Cooking , choosing not to be involved I can well understand ..Your Grumpy , only affects you ..and fair enough .

The poster that stated about " Most Thais over 30 " ..Would agree that most/ many dont enjoy the water aspect .. I think most just enjoy the family get together ( generally ) ..unless some Males over indulge , which does happen .

[sandhurstmolonski]

[

Drove down to tak and back to Chiang mai no problems no wrecks just a lot of water, the loss of life is a shame but then again I am here for the mai bpen rai life style and if people where honest that is the reason many of you came here as well but now you want it to be like home. Get a grip no nanny state here unless you are rich and famous

Nothing to do with the Nanny State,just plain common sense!

Well it is actually .. the whole concept of " Nanny State " is what many wish to leave in the past . The point is , you cant just move in Say " Im here 15 years " ..Now I want to reproduce Europe , with speed cameras ..Booze Buses on every corner ..Police knocking on doors ..

I certainly dont want this ....

Will everything always be perfect ? No never ....

If thats a problem ... The Farang knows the choice the Farang makes .

Mai Pelai ... It comes with the territory . Sometimes it will be negative ..Rarely will it be regulated .

[yummypizza]

The road toll in every country rises around new year,because more people are on the road wanting to go to family and festivities fast, it's a drunken time of year in most places, and breathalyser tests are very frequent every where, so!, at all these check points along the roads,why doesn't some one enforce alcohol tests? there should be check points every where, with heavy fines, at this time of year, i know the police are a part of the (drunken) problem,but they will

need to start sooner or later....

[JohnAllan]

So much for zero tolerance. And so much for common sense . . .

[JohnAllan]

The road toll in every country rises around new year,because more people are on the road wanting to go to family and festivities fast, it's a drunken time of year in most places, and breathalyser tests are very frequent every where, so!, at all these check points along the roads,why doesn't some one enforce alcohol tests? there should be check points every where, with heavy fines, at this time of year, i know the police are a part of the (drunken) problem,but they will

need to start sooner or later....

Somewhat generalistic. Countries that have pursued the issue of drink-driving for many years tolerate a zero or next to zero blood-alcohol level. Moreover, they rigorously apply the law; hence suffer substantially less fatalities or injuries through drunk drivers than, for example, Thailand.

[chrissables]

Drove down to tak and back to Chiang mai no problems no wrecks just a lot of water, the loss of life is a shame but then again I am here for the mai bpen rai life style and if people where honest that is the reason many of you came here as well but now you want it to be like home. Get a grip no nanny state here unless you are rich and famous

I could not agree more!

[allan michaud]

How about a road safety campain 24/7, not just lip service during holidays. How about the police actually doing their jobs and enforcing the law. How about requiring that drivers actually take driving lessons and actually pass a drivers test. None of this slip the police 100 baht to ignore the infraction or slip the test examiner 1000 baht to get the license nonsense.

Nothing will change until all the corruption stops. So not in my lifetime.

some scary public information films on drunk driving would be useful , same as they show every xmas time in the UK with kids being killed and the spirit leaving the body , i think it would scare the sh*t out of thais , ............ well worth it if it saves a life though ! , i can never understand why there are no safety ads on thai TV , at least it would make the people think the Govt cares .

They don't want to offend people, sad but true.

Drove down to tak and back to Chiang mai no problems no wrecks just a lot of water, the loss of life is a shame but then again I am here for the mai bpen rai life style and if people where honest that is the reason many of you came here as well but now you want it to be like home. Get a grip no nanny state here unless you are rich and famous

I agree to some extent but as a lifelong motorcyclist, getting a bucket of water thrown in my face when I have my wife or son on the bike makes me bloody angry. No to the UK style "nanny state" but yes to just a little bit of common bloody sense.

[CaptainPeacock]

There are about 12000 traffic deaths in Thailand each year. 250 per week or so. Songkran deaths are not any worse than any other week when you figure kilometers travelled.

Yeah right on, maybe be a little worse over Songkran...however,

Thailand is a top tourist destination - but what the guidebooks don't tell you is ... Thailand has ranked as the world's second most dangerous country...Did folks here know that...The world's second most dangerous country..

Check this out:

http://www.channel4.com/news/the-undocumented-dangers-of-thailands-roads

In my 20 + years here I always thought Thailand was the Safest country in the world...

[Thai at Heart]

Drove down to tak and back to Chiang mai no problems no wrecks just a lot of water, the loss of life is a shame but then again I am here for the mai bpen rai life style and if people where honest that is the reason many of you came here as well but now you want it to be like home. Get a grip no nanny state here unless you are rich and famous

The mai bpen rai lifestyle is great? So you wouldn't complain if a loved one got killed/maimed by a drunk driver? Some rules are necessary (like a ban on drink-driving), but I agree not to the level of nanny states like some countries in the west. There can be compromise.

Its a Bit like Moving next to a Golf Course and complaining because you GET smacked with a Ball .

Yes , there is a huge element of Danger on the roads no doubt ..But you knew that when you came here , you must be escaping from something or you wouldn't live here ..there must be something drawing you to Thailand ??

You cant just move in ..say Great ..Ive been here for 15 years ..Now this is wrong ..that is wrong ..They have to change etc etc etc etc

" They " dont have to do anything , and Yep , its a dangerous , unregulated place in many respects . But many of us dont WANT it to be the UK , USA .. or anywhere else ..we came to get away from that . The answer is obvious ...

Everything Cannot be perfect .. This is NOT Europe .. and thank Buddah for that !

Teaching people how to drive has nothing to do with turning the country into a nanny state though. A road is not a personal domain, and whilst it is possible to have an accident only harm yourself, this is often not the case. I had a discussion with someone who asked me, if he wanted to ride my bike at 150km, is it anyone else's business? My answer was plainly that the road wasn't his own personal domain, and as such he should go and build his own road and ride to his heart's content.

Just because life appears to be cheap here, sometimes people need to be saved from their own selfishness and stupidity because the effect of their actions has effects way beyond their own personal harm.

I had my Songkran where I always do in the centre of my local town with friends, all very well and good other than a group of teenage tatooed bikees next to us, who have been there year on year, but this year there was obviously a lot of drugs going on. This in and of itself wasn't the issue, but the repeated coming and going at 40 to 50km/h up the wrong side of the road, weaving between kids throwing water finally came to a point when some idiot came roaring up the wrong side of the road and nearly took out mine and about 6 other kids who would obviously not be thinking to look the wrong way up the road.

A little arguement ensued and admittedly he apologised, picked up his biker chick on the back of his bike, tried to smoke out the tyres and pull of with a wheelie. At which point his chick, fell off the back of the bike and nearly spread her brains all over the road. It was like something out of a loonie tunes cartoon. The sheer irresponsible, thoughtless, macho crap was so stupid, initially I laughed, and then we proceeded to scoop the poor girl off the road, whilst the other 50 tatooed, high idiots bounced around to their music.

Just all too much sometimes.

Edited April 17, 2012 by Thai at Heart

[MEL1]

Note that the Muslim Southern Provinces had no fatal accidents. Shows what consumption of alcohol does to the statistics.

This is a very astute and interesting observation, and one that never occurred to me. Thank you.

It is astute. But what's more astute is that there was nobody there following the wake of bombings and immigration being closed!

Accidents are hard come-by when roads are empty.

-mel.

Edit: Accidents are hard come-by when roads are empty.

I take that last statement back, as there were a few deaths without cause, as a result of motorcyclists being p*ssed up solo.

Edited April 17, 2012 by MEL1

[LukDod]

Personally writing I think the actual "body count" /Casualty/accident rates is way over those that are portrayed , ...<snipped>...

Me, too!

I don't know if it was mis-information, but I've been told that only hospitals reports deaths (.eg victim dies in the hospital or was dead when they arrived).

If the deceased was taken to a Wat and never to a hospital, the death is not reported by the Wat and isn't reflected in the highway statistics.

If such is true, then the number of actual deaths is surely higher than reported.

[Tonawatchee]

Until the Thais and their government realize and become serious about traffic safety, it'll be the same old saw.

[nickjam]

So the sexy dancing police offers didn't work!

[PoodMaiDai]

Drove down to tak and back to Chiang mai no problems no wrecks just a lot of water, the loss of life is a shame but then again I am here for the mai bpen rai life style and if people where honest that is the reason many of you came here as well but now you want it to be like home. Get a grip no nanny state here unless you are rich and famous

At no time does "mai pen rai" mean we shouldn't care about the absolute danger on the roads during Thai holidays. Many innocent people are killed because of these drunken jack asses and to shrug it off as mai pen rai doesn't cut it. I'd wager if your family was killed by a drunk driver, you would think differently.

But you are 100% correct, none of us want a nanny state. But at the same time, we also don't want tens of thousands of drunken morons DRIVING on the roads with reckless abandon. This is just common sense stuff.

[philw]

Personally writing I think the actual "body count" /Casualty/accident rates is way over those that are portrayed , ...<snipped>...

Me, too!

I don't know if it was mis-information, but I've been told that only hospitals reports deaths (.eg victim dies in the hospital or was dead when they arrived).

If the deceased was taken to a Wat and never to a hospital, the death is not reported by the Wat and isn't reflected in the highway statistics.

If such is true, then the number of actual deaths is surely higher than reported.

I don't think may dead people get taken directly to the Temple for cremation.

Wats cannot issue death certificates.

[PoodMaiDai]

Personally writing I think the actual "body count" /Casualty/accident rates is way over those that are portrayed , ...<snipped>...

Me, too!

I don't know if it was mis-information, but I've been told that only hospitals reports deaths (.eg victim dies in the hospital or was dead when they arrived).

If the deceased was taken to a Wat and never to a hospital, the death is not reported by the Wat and isn't reflected in the highway statistics.

If such is true, then the number of actual deaths is surely higher than reported.

I have heard this as well.

Not related to Songkoran but related to accidents, the last time I was at Bangkok-Pattaya Hospital, they told me they have at least 5 CASUALTIES from motobikes PER DAY in that hospital alone. Can't imagine the true number of road deaths that happen in Thailand. And like everything else, you KNOW they will tilt the numbers in their favor. So whatever is reported during any event is probably much, much higher in real life.

[oops]

Yeah, Songkran has become a piss-up and a melee. In my experience, most Thais over 30 don't like it either.

Cambodia, where water celebrations have been banned, is IMO a nicer place to be living, come New Year.

Good bye...

[oops]

Chon Buri, no accidents so if you want to feel safe in the Songkran come to the place with sensible responsible drivers and have a wonderful New Year party.

IT's not over until it's over....The big ones coming..... CRASH!

Edited April 17, 2012 by oops

[tingtongfarang]

Personally writing I think the actual "body count" /Casualty/accident rates is way over those that are portrayed , ...<snipped>...

Me, too!

I don't know if it was mis-information, but I've been told that only hospitals reports deaths (.eg victim dies in the hospital or was dead when they arrived).

If the deceased was taken to a Wat and never to a hospital, the death is not reported by the Wat and isn't reflected in the highway statistics.

If such is true, then the number of actual deaths is surely higher than reported.

As i understand it the ones who die at the accident scene only are reported as road accident fatalaties but not the ones who die on the way too or at the hospital, The true figures could be 2-3 times more than reported.

[kutjebu]

Twelve Songkran's in and I'm really finding it difficult to enjoy it any more. The balance between fun and outright stupidity is now weighted very heavily against fun.

What Songkran I did see in Bangkok yesterday resembled some sort of aquatic Mad Max. Drunk people standing in the middle of Sukhumvit road, which is very often handles more traffic than a busy UK "A" road. Large swarms of people on bikes in gangs, drunk and covered in that powder. No helmets, obviously, but I did see one guy wearing a snorkel.

And then there's the trucks of people, all drunk. But, of course the drivers have volunteered to stay sober now, haven't they?

Although I spotted a few cops here and there over the past few days, yesterday I could see none.

Call me a grump. I think I'm pretty much through with Songkran's like these now...

Better to be a Grump than a Corpse!!!!!!

Yes and special with a lot of alcohol,both are not working properly.