Chiangmai Ram, What Would Your Reaction Be?

[cloudhopper]

2nd Opinion: YES

2nd Treatment: NO

Sometimes it can be a hard call; a third opinion would be indicated if the first 2 significantly differ. BTW I'd recommend not disclosing one's intentions to seek multiple opinions to any of them.

[hellodolly]

Jumping from hospital to hospital and doctor to doctor leaves you open for bad advice such as one doctor telling you to take and Warfarin and another telling you to take Ibuprofen for some thing else. The two are a dangerous combination. Best to have a doctor who has knowledge of all your conditions and medications.

This sounds like good advice to me.

Good advice is to always get a second opinion

That is why she sends me to see a specialist.

[scorecard]

If I were you I would hotfoot it to Bangkok to the Bhumijad (spelling?) hospital near Sukhumvit. One regular poster on this board goes there often and swears by their treatment and professionalism. Send me PM if you need more details. And best of luck to you.

Incidentally, you can fully recover from small strokes. The common treatment is wayfarin (spelling?) which thins the blood, not baby aspirin! Strokes, for those that do not know, are caused by a burst blood vessel in the brain. Large bursts, thus flooding an area of the brain with blood, are dangerous and can cause dysfunctions such as word retrieval, memory loss and partial paralysis. Go easy and get some good advice, please.

And I would not, Bumrungrad is expensive, overated and there are far better doctors available in other hospitals at a fraction of the price - my personal view is that Bumrungrad is primarily a marketing machine.

Warafin (it's actually rat poison) is not intended for strokes and asprin is not a bad choice for a first line of defense, anticoagulants such as Plavix are probably more suitable. I agree about getting professional advice however which neither of our posts is.

I also would not give the big B in Bkk a glowing report. My wider family has had several instances of mistakes at this hospital. In terms of cost, I'd use the word outrageous rather than the word expensive.

Edited May 11, 2012 by scorecard

[LarryBird]

Get to another hospital for a 2nd opinion ASAP. Sripat at CMU would be an excellent choice. Not as fancy as RAM but there are many good docs there. Ask/demand to see a senior Professor of Neurology for a 2nd opinion.

Best of luck.

This is excellent, grade A advice.

Don`t waste any more time at the Ram, and obtain a proper diagnoses before the situation becomes any worse.

Really, the thread could have ended here...

[Rama]

My father had a similar condition. It was not the brain at all. It was his inner ear. I think he was given some on-going medication that reduced the effect, but it was incurable. Your condition sounds similar. You might do another check of your inner ears by a competent ENT.

[doppa]

My father had a similar condition. It was not the brain at all. It was his inner ear. I think he was given some on-going medication that reduced the effect, but it was incurable. Your condition sounds similar. You might do another check of your inner ears by a competent ENT.

competent ent, mmmm that may be a problem, but it's a thought to get it checked again, funnily enough, a great deal of friends have also commented that it maybe an ear prob.

[HughJass]

My father had a similar condition. It was not the brain at all. It was his inner ear. I think he was given some on-going medication that reduced the effect, but it was incurable. Your condition sounds similar. You might do another check of your inner ears by a competent ENT.

competent ent, mmmm that may be a problem, but it's a thought to get it checked again, funnily enough, a great deal of friends have also commented that it maybe an ear prob.

last year i had dizzy spells for about 3 months and got the usual raft of pharmacuticals from CM Ram when i went to see the doctor.The side effects of which were so horrendous i ended up not taking them. I made a trip back to the UK to see family and paid a visit to my doctor who immediately said i had blocked sinuses behind my eardrums and recommended i buy a bottle of Olbas Oil from Boots the chemist on the way home.a few drops in hot water and inhale with a towel over your head..the problem cleared up almost immediately....as somebody else said it is worth the effort to do some keep fit like swimming or the gym especially if u are not working and eating and drinking too much

http://www.olbas.co.uk/products/olbas-oil.ashx

Edited May 11, 2012 by HughJass

[JimSiam]

Get to another hospital for a 2nd opinion ASAP. Sripat at CMU would be an excellent choice. Not as fancy as RAM but there are many good docs there. Ask/demand to see a senior Professor of Neurology for a 2nd opinion.

Best of luck.

I went to Sripat to see a hand specialist, he treated my like what are you doing here? you can afford to use the private hospitals (also had to wait sooo long), went to RAM the hand surgeon there was excellent and sorted everything and the price was very good, previous hospital in Bangkok made a mess of it and charged so much more, re break, microsurgery on ligaments and tendons, 4 days on stacks of morphine was only 65,000 baht.

[Flatouthruthefog]

Get to another hospital for a 2nd opinion ASAP. Sripat at CMU would be an excellent choice. Not as fancy as RAM but there are many good docs there. Ask/demand to see a senior Professor of Neurology for a 2nd opinion.

Best of luck.

This is excellent, grade A advice.

Don`t waste any more time at the Ram, and obtain a proper diagnoses before the situation becomes any worse.

Really, the thread could have ended here...

Absolutely right, but let me add a PS. CM Ram is grossly overpriced on everything they do, especially since they were taken over recently by Bangkok Hospital. (I invite them to defend themselves against this here and now). They will not, of course!

Despite going there some years back after a m/cyc accident with a broken collar bone and 4 broken ribs (the latter being 'invisible' on their x-ray) and sent home in (increasing) agony, I trusted them with my 3 year old sons sudden soaring temperature. Twice. Fool me, huh?

First time there was 2,000b on the bill they couldn't explain, 2nd time, 4,000b. And NO diagnosis!!

The 3rd and last time it happened we took him to Rajavej (opposite Holiday Inn on the river). Excellent, intelligent, treatment and diagnosis and NO hidden charges!

In 17 years in CM I have never heard a single credible complaint about Rajavej.

Your decision(s)!

[uptheos]

My father had a similar condition. It was not the brain at all. It was his inner ear. I think he was given some on-going medication that reduced the effect, but it was incurable. Your condition sounds similar. You might do another check of your inner ears by a competent ENT.

competent ent, mmmm that may be a problem, but it's a thought to get it checked again, funnily enough, a great deal of friends have also commented that it maybe an ear prob.

I know we're slagging off Ram, but regarding ENT, I have good things to say about Dr. Chalermpong.

[elektrified]

I went to Sripat to see a hand specialist, he treated my like what are you doing here? you can afford to use the private hospitals (also had to wait sooo long), went to RAM the hand surgeon there was excellent and sorted everything and the price was very good, previous hospital in Bangkok made a mess of it and charged so much more, re break, microsurgery on ligaments and tendons, 4 days on stacks of morphine was only 65,000 baht.

Sripat is a private hospital. It is not cheap by any means. Suan Dok Maharaj is semi-privatized/semi-government.

[doppa]

My father had a similar condition. It was not the brain at all. It was his inner ear. I think he was given some on-going medication that reduced the effect, but it was incurable. Your condition sounds similar. You might do another check of your inner ears by a competent ENT.

competent ent, mmmm that may be a problem, but it's a thought to get it checked again, funnily enough, a great deal of friends have also commented that it maybe an ear prob.

I know we're slagging off Ram, but regarding ENT, I have good things to say about Dr. Chalermpong.

is she/he the specialist at ram?

[chiang mai]

Sripat is a private hospital. It is not cheap by any means. Suan Dok Maharaj is semi-privatized/semi-government.

What do you mean by "semi"? And if you think that Sriphat is not cheap, compared to where?

[thaibeachlovers]

If I were you I would hotfoot it to Bangkok to the Bhumijad (spelling?) hospital near Sukhumvit. One regular poster on this board goes there often and swears by their treatment and professionalism. Send me PM if you need more details. And best of luck to you.

Incidentally, you can fully recover from small strokes. The common treatment is wayfarin (spelling?) which thins the blood, not baby aspirin! Strokes, for those that do not know, are caused by a burst blood vessel in the brain. Large bursts, thus flooding an area of the brain with blood, are dangerous and can cause dysfunctions such as word retrieval, memory loss and partial paralysis. Go easy and get some good advice, please.

That's the Bumrungrad Hospital on Soi 3. It has a web site.

If you go there, you must have your passport to register.

Sorry, but strokes are not caused by burst blood vessels, they are caused by OBSTRUCTED blood vessels, which deprives the cells of blood, and they die.

[elektrified]

Sripat is a private hospital. It is not cheap by any means. Suan Dok Maharaj is semi-privatized/semi-government.

What do you mean by "semi"? And if you think that Sriphat is not cheap, compared to where?

What I meant was prices have gone up considerably at Sriphat (like anywhere else - sign of the times).

The structure of the administration is changing little by little at Suan Dok. They could not afford to continue operating as they were as there was too much abuse by government officials, people skipping out on their bills and so forth. Eventually it will be 'privatized' but with government subsidization as I understand it.

Edited May 12, 2012 by elektrified

[chiang mai]

Sripat is a private hospital. It is not cheap by any means. Suan Dok Maharaj is semi-privatized/semi-government.

What do you mean by "semi"? And if you think that Sriphat is not cheap, compared to where?

What I meant was prices have gone up considerably at Sriphat (like anywhere else - sign of the times).

The structure of the administration is changing little by little at Suan Dok. They could not afford to continue operating as they were as there was too much abuse by government officials, people skipping out on their bills and so forth. Eventually it will be 'privatized' but with government subsidization as I understand it.

Indeed prices are increasing every where and Sriphat is not immune I would guess, having said that I think when compared to other hospitals Sriphat still represents very good value for money. I'm not sure which hospitals to compare against Sriphat, RAM is unquestionably more expensive as is Bumrungrad and the rest of Bangkok Hospital chain. But there again the quality of medical expertise at Sriphat is arguably higher than at most hospitals hence higher pricing than say a Provincial hospital is perhaps justified. For those not aware the doctors fees at Sriphat range from between 150 and 400 baht per consultation and the cost of medical testing is, in my experience, quite low - head and neck MRI at 8k, abdominal CT scan at 12k, complete blood works at 2,200 based on fees I have had to pay recently.

As for being semi private: I suppose that's a good description since Sriphat is the private fee paying wing of Suan Doc which is a government provincial hospital, it's kind of an inbetween of RAM and Mahraraj I suppose.

[letitbe]

Interesting. I've had alot of dizziness recently which has progressed to being quite severe, I went to the doctor who told me it was low blood pressure and I didn't need to do anything, there was no cause. I've still got the dizziness, it's driving me crazy too, but I don't like to take medicine unless it's absolutely vital so I continue to live with it for the time being.

As for CM Ram, they were great when I had dental work done there, although expensive. Since my brother's experience recently there though my faith was lost.

Siripat were great when my friend had an accident and recently for serious stuff I've gone there and they have proved to be very good.

interesting for last few years ive started suffering from a bit of dizziness quack said it was probably meds for hypertension i take but I think heat has something to do with it and of course my alcohol intake because I note when i visit a colder country its either gone or much reduced. Or just old age I am 87.

[AndersSN]

If I were you I would hotfoot it to Bangkok to the Bhumijad (spelling?) hospital near Sukhumvit. One regular poster on this board goes there often and swears by their treatment and professionalism. Send me PM if you need more details. And best of luck to you.

Incidentally, you can fully recover from small strokes. The common treatment is wayfarin (spelling?) which thins the blood, not baby aspirin! Strokes, for those that do not know, are caused by a burst blood vessel in the brain. Large bursts, thus flooding an area of the brain with blood, are dangerous and can cause dysfunctions such as word retrieval, memory loss and partial paralysis. Go easy and get some good advice, please.

That's the Bumrungrad Hospital on Soi 3. It has a web site.

If you go there, you must have your passport to register.

Sorry, but strokes are not caused by burst blood vessels, they are caused by OBSTRUCTED blood vessels, which deprives the cells of blood, and they die.

Actually you are both right.

There are two main kinds of stroke, ischemic stroke and hemorrhagic stroke.

Ischemic stroke accounts for about 75% of all strokes and occurs when a blood clot, or thrombus, forms that blocks blood flow to part of the brain. If a blood clot forms somewhere in the body and breaks off to become free-floating, it is called an embolus. This wandering clot may be carried through the bloodstream to the brain where it can cause ischemic stroke.

A hemorrhagic stroke occurs when a blood vessel on the brain's surface ruptures and fills the space between the brain and skull with blood (subarachnoid hemorrhage) or when a defective artery in the brain bursts and fills the surrounding tissue with blood (cerebral hemorrhage). Both result in a lack of blood flow to the brain and a buildup of blood that puts too much pressure on the brain.

Edited May 12, 2012 by AndersSN

[jonwilly]

Had four minor operations at Ram CM, no problems no complaints.

Used Dr. T Loy Khro for 11 years since I came here, good Dr.

Changed to Dr. Morgan as I can book an appointment and not wait for ages.

Early days but very impressed, she has a more modern approach in my opinion and had new views on my Kidney Stone problem a major concern of mine since my B50,000 emergency op at Ram the other year.

john

[Lifer]

Get to another hospital for a 2nd opinion ASAP. Sripat at CMU would be an excellent choice. Not as fancy as RAM but there are many good docs there. Ask/demand to see a senior Professor of Neurology for a 2nd opinion.

Best of luck.

Sripat Hospital is not at CMU. It is down the street 1 to 1.5 block from Suan Dok Gate in front of the Government Hospital and Nursing College. Can't miss it. It is almost on the road and a number of stories high. It's a private hospital but shares specialists and some testing facilities with Suan Dok Hospital connect to it. Care is good and prices very reasonable compared to Ram.

Mr. Advanced member, your instructions would have someone looking for Sripat at CMU. Your winded correction was not needed, and had nothing to do with trying to help the poster find Sripat Hospital. You made a big thing out of trying to give a member a little more information on finding the hospital. Glad I never have to ask directions from you; however, your post was good for status.

[Lifer]

I went to Sripat to see a hand specialist, he treated my like what are you doing here? you can afford to use the private hospitals (also had to wait sooo long), went to RAM the hand surgeon there was excellent and sorted everything and the price was very good, previous hospital in Bangkok made a mess of it and charged so much more, re break, microsurgery on ligaments and tendons, 4 days on stacks of morphine was only 65,000 baht.

Sripat is a private hospital. It is not cheap by any means. Suan Dok Maharaj is semi-privatized/semi-government.

Another example!

[Lifer]

There sure is a lot of unqualified medical advice being given on this thread. Also a lot of misinformation about some of the hospitals. Thread beaten to death.

[chiang mai]

Well let's set the misinformation straight, for those who might need to find the place in the future:

"Maharaj (also commonly known as Suan Dok), the "teaching hospital" of the Faculty of Medicine and Faculty of Nursing of Chiang Mai University. The Maharaj "complex" is found on Suthep Road just west of the moat between the moat and Sirimangkalajan Road. It is a large government hospital with a special clinic called the Special Medical Center. That clinic is located on the 13th floor of the building immediately west of and adjacent to the Faculty of Nursing. It is the tall building closest to the moat. It has its own outside entrance (marked by a sign) close to the road". (copyright Mapguy 2008)

An easy visual guide to Sriphat is to look for the Suan Dok Trauma Centre (ER) which is prominent, Sriphat is the 14 storey pink coloured building that sits closest to the road in front of it.

[eek]

Can i just say that today i went to Ram because i hoped to be seen fast, and couldnt face Sri Pats waiting room etc. I'll just be honest and say i wanted to see a gyno about the options regarding pms symptoms that are affecting me. I was given a quick verbal consolation, and prescribed estrogen cream to try on my stomach....afterwards I went to a trusted pharmacist and asked her opinion on the cream. She asked what my blood test results were. I told her no blood tests were taken. .. she told me to go back and have blood work done to find out if i should be taking estrogen or another hormone, to be sure about my health.

Im not going back to Ram. Wasnt cheap either, and no proper investigation, just a doctors fee and an inflated price on the cream.

Im going to Sri Pat for a proper test.

[chiang mai]

Can i just say that today i went to Ram because i hoped to be seen fast, and couldnt face Sri Pats waiting room etc. I'll just be honest and say i wanted to see a gyno about the options regarding pms symptoms that are affecting me. I was given a quick verbal consolation, and prescribed estrogen cream to try on my stomach....afterwards I went to a trusted pharmacist and asked her opinion on the cream. She asked what my blood test results were. I told her no blood tests were taken. .. she told me to go back and have blood work done to find out if i should be taking estrogen or another hormone, to be sure about my health.

Im not going back to Ram. Wasnt cheap either, and no proper investigation, just a doctors fee and an inflated price on the cream.

Im going to Sri Pat for a proper test.

Ouch, that's nasty, can I ask, did you see Dr Cathaleeya (Oby/gyn) at RAM? Dr Cat as she's effectionaltely known is rated very highly by Dr Morgan and others, Mrs CM went to see her a couple of weeks ago and was very impressed at her thoroughness.

[eek]

I was waiting to see Dr Cathaleeya, for a long time actually. Then the nurse told me that i need to see another Gyno because Dr Cathaleeya was having to deal with a patient going into labor.

The Doctor i saw was a male gynecologist: MD. Suppachai Sirisukkasem

---------------

Edit: Dr Cathaleeya may indeed by a good gyno, i have no idea. All i know is im rather tired of the hit and miss nature of Rams medical staff..and you pay inflated prices for what may be terrible medical advice..and in some cases, absolutely damaging to health. Completely counter productive for the reason of actually going there!!

Edited May 13, 2012 by eek

[chiang mai]

I'm really sorry that you had to go through that Eek, I know how frustrating it is when you are unwell and are looking for expert medical advice and that sort of thing happens. But what you've recently experienced is is part of a larger problem that's occuring almost everywhere, you've told us of your previous ecperiences at RAM, I've experienced it at Bangkok/Phuket and Bumrungrad and now I've run into the same thing at Sriphat but it's taken me a while to figure it out. I don't know what can be done about it other than to name and shame as you've already done and to let everyone know who the really good doctors are. I hope you get a resolution to your problems at Sriphat, soon.

Just an idea but it may be worth while for you to go back to RAM and see Dr Cat and to complain about your previous visit, as I said earlier Dr Cat seems very good and perhaps making a complaint at RAM about the other doctor will have some effect. I know frm experience that complaining to the hospital about sub standard treatment/consultations can be a challenging experience but I can't help but feel that it must be of benefit somewhere along the line.

EDIT: include afterthought

Edited May 13, 2012 by chiang mai

[thaibeachlovers]

If I were you I would hotfoot it to Bangkok to the Bhumijad (spelling?) hospital near Sukhumvit. One regular poster on this board goes there often and swears by their treatment and professionalism. Send me PM if you need more details. And best of luck to you.

Incidentally, you can fully recover from small strokes. The common treatment is wayfarin (spelling?) which thins the blood, not baby aspirin! Strokes, for those that do not know, are caused by a burst blood vessel in the brain. Large bursts, thus flooding an area of the brain with blood, are dangerous and can cause dysfunctions such as word retrieval, memory loss and partial paralysis. Go easy and get some good advice, please.

That's the Bumrungrad Hospital on Soi 3. It has a web site.

If you go there, you must have your passport to register.

Sorry, but strokes are not caused by burst blood vessels, they are caused by OBSTRUCTED blood vessels, which deprives the cells of blood, and they die.

Actually you are both right.

There are two main kinds of stroke, ischemic stroke and hemorrhagic stroke.

Ischemic stroke accounts for about 75% of all strokes and occurs when a blood clot, or thrombus, forms that blocks blood flow to part of the brain. If a blood clot forms somewhere in the body and breaks off to become free-floating, it is called an embolus. This wandering clot may be carried through the bloodstream to the brain where it can cause ischemic stroke.

A hemorrhagic stroke occurs when a blood vessel on the brain's surface ruptures and fills the space between the brain and skull with blood (subarachnoid hemorrhage) or when a defective artery in the brain bursts and fills the surrounding tissue with blood (cerebral hemorrhage). Both result in a lack of blood flow to the brain and a buildup of blood that puts too much pressure on the brain.

Thanks for that correction.

It's many many years since I did my nurse training, and I have no recollection of being taught about hemorrhagic strokes, only Ischemic strokes. Certainly, they weren't common when I was doing my medical component, and luckily I never did medical nursing again after graduating.

[anselpixel]

I visited Ram hospital this morning.

Problem? A boil on the back of my neck at the hairline. The infection started up just after my last haircut. The barber shaved my neck.

I sat for a half hour without seeing a doctor. I did see two nurses, but neither could remember which side the boil was on when they checked back.

Finally, the nurse came out and told me the surgeon (who hasn't seen me, you will recall) has decided I need a specialist. An ENT to be exact.

When I asked why in god's name I would need an ENT, she replied the doctor had decided the boil was a naso-pharyngeal problem.

I decided I was looking at shameless bill-padding, and ungraciously left.

It's very convenient to me, but never again.

[doppa]

just to let everyone know, as i'm the original poster, i went back to ram and insisted to see a ent specialist,[considering everything else i had checked out was ok, i thought this had to be an ear problem] fortunately both were working at the time.

first doc basically checked ear drums, ok, next doc gave me a hearing test, not ok, possibly due to my 'mini stroke' its damaged the inner ear, so certain noises for me seem to me far louder than it should be [ eg. thai soaps].

the docs conclusion is i've got 'tinnitus', which i believe there's no known cure, i'm trying some medication which is relatively new, will then try acupuncture after that as the final resort.

so the conclusion for me is, thai hospitals are full of good and poor docs, trouble is we don't know which from which, unless we can get recommendations from other folks history, procedures in just about all the hospitals ive visited are crap, if it wasn't for my persistence in trying to find out what my problem was/is, i really don't know what would have happened, it was me who suggested to these docs, should we check this, should we check that ,they don't seem follow a logical path, i would have thought getting a hearing test done many months ago would have been high on the priority list to do, maybe it was my fault for not doing that in the first place, or suggesting it!

thanks for all your comments, my complaint is still on the hospital table for 2 weeks now, we shall see!