"700 Baht An Hour, Oh, But We Hold 20% Until Course Completion."

[jji23]

Hi,

I recently applied for a part time business English position through ajarn.com. I was contacted by a foreigner working for the company/agency who has the contracts with various factories and we arranged a meet.

At the meeting everything about the position seemed fine, until...

"The salary is 700 baht an hour, oh, but we hold 20% until course completion. The reason for this is that we've had experiences in the past of teachers not completing courses and/or not writing a report for each student."

I said that I would need that in writing and he explained that's fine and it will be in the contract. So, I left the meeting altogether feeling happy at getting this position due to start in June. I told a few of my foreign teacher friends about the position and the majority have said that the withholding of 20% seems suspect. Which in turn has got me starting to feel a little apprehensive about the position.

In the event of completing the course and not receiving the owed 20%, What could I really do? Obviously a lawyer wouldn't be cost effective in this situation so I was just wondering what else I could do.

Thanks

[pipo1000]

Maybe you should decline the position and look for a job where they pay your salary upfront.

[beano2274]

large companies do that, I used to work for one, they kept 10% until the end of the course, so that I had completed the records on each student and also returned the books.

[Scott]

Some regular schools also hold a portion of salary, which is returned to you when you complete your contract.

[puchooay]

It is quite easy. When you have the students reports ask for your money. No money no reports.

[Loaded]

It's not unusual and I think not unreasonable. You will receive 700 baht per hour. They have been burned in the past by teachers who took the money and didn't complete end-of-course admin. They are protecting themselves.

[jji23]

Right, thanks guys.

I just felt slightly cautious, which was then multiplied by friends and colleagues etc.

[Somtamnication]

Yeah, but not 20% witholding. Run!!!! This little Thai way of doing things is also immoral, period.

[siampolee]

Yeah, but not 20% witholding. Run!!!!

That is the very reason that a large number of language school and indeed as has already been said some primary and secondary schools along with uni's and vocational schools hold a percentage of the pay.

Incidentally as the average language school rate seems according to the positions offered hovers around 400 baht an hour even with a 20% withholding on then700 baht, the pay rate is favourable.

Too many transients in the past have created the withholding scene to the short term detriment of the staff concerned.now.. Look upon it as a forced savings scheme, when the course is finished you have a little nest egg to spend or save as you wish. .

Edited May 18, 2012 by siampolee

[phl]

Yeah, but not 20% witholding. Run!!!! This little Thai way of doing things is also immoral, period.

and 560 baht per hour is a bad hourly pay? even assuming they will keep the 20%

[overherebc]

Right, thanks guys.

I just felt slightly cautious, which was then multiplied by friends and colleagues etc.

Keep an eye on the tax you pay. If they tax you on 700 baht an hour then you shouldn't pay any tax on the withheld money when you get it

[plopmeister]

EDIT = The previous poster brought Tax into the equation..

Edited May 18, 2012 by plopmeister

[BlueEasySleep]

My last company did something similar. I never saw the money.

Sent from my GT-P7500 using Thaivisa Connect App

[pipo1000]

My last company did something similar. I never saw the money.

Sent from my GT-P7500 using Thaivisa Connect App

If it is so easy to get away refusing to pay the owned money,while you have adhered to all the rules written in the contract,then I don't understand why they even bother paying the primary salary.

[BlueEasySleep]

Some of the less reputable ones dont pay the last month if you already gave your scores to the school. They can always hire some new teachers fresh off the plane.

Holding onto your final scores and reports is the only leverage you have, because the schools wont be too happy if they dont get them.

[jji23]

Right, so I guess my best option is to firstly talk clearly with the gentleman about how the 'transaction' goes down at the end of the course, so that we're clear. Then to keep an eye on tax as the course progresses, finally to only hand in reports once I've received the witheld 20%?

Whilst 560 baht per hour is still a favorable salary, I strongly feel that its wrong to market the position in this way. I'm pretty sure they would still get applicants at this rate. Once I factor in petrol and travel time, I'm pretty certain that 560 baht isn't for me!

[phl]

Whilst 560 baht per hour is still a favorable salary, I strongly feel that its wrong to market the position in this way. I'm pretty sure they would still get applicants at this rate. Once I factor in petrol and travel time, I'm pretty certain that 560 baht isn't for me!

I am glad to see the local Thai attitude is contagious. after all its only 2 full days of local wages for 1 hour of your time

I guess its better to be unemployed

[thequietman]

Whilst 560 baht per hour is still a favorable salary, I strongly feel that its wrong to market the position in this way. I'm pretty sure they would still get applicants at this rate. Once I factor in petrol and travel time, I'm pretty certain that 560 baht isn't for me!

I am glad to see the local Thai attitude is contagious. after all its only 2 full days of local wages for 1 hour of your time

I guess its better to be unemployed

hi,

please pm me if you are not interested in this position. i would be interested. thanks.

[Scott]

A baiting post has been removed.

[IssanDM]

One thing I'm curious of is why does this school or agency feel it is necessary to hold back 20% of your pay for you to finish your contract? Oh sure, the argument of teachers doing runners and breaking their contract early comes to mind, but I would ask why did the teacher feel the need to do a runner in the first place? Could it be the school or agency has working conditions so poor or their exceptions are completely out of touch with reality that the teacher saw that it was an unworkable situation?

[Scott]

Lets stick to the topic. There are good employers and there are bad employers. There are good employees and bad employees. Some contracts allow for an end of contract payment.

That is not what the topic is about.

[phl]

One thing I'm curious of is why does this school or agency feel it is necessary to hold back 20% of your pay for you to finish your contract? Oh sure, the argument of teachers doing runners and breaking their contract early comes to mind, but I would ask why did the teacher feel the need to do a runner in the first place? Could it be the school or agency has working conditions so poor or their exceptions are completely out of touch with reality that the teacher saw that it was an unworkable situation?

almost all business in Thailand withhold a deposit, some even require an upfront deposit, because culture of work here is not exactly at its best.

people do not show up to work, people come late, people do silly things and list goes on.

foreigners living here are not much different and OP just proved it.

if he is a genuine person with a genuine intention to work and do his best, he would not even raise the question but work the first month and see, he is already declining to take the job(mind you paying ridiculous salary even after the deposit) which only means he was not planning to do much work anyway

[Scott]

OK, let's stick to the topic and not to what we think a poster is or isn't going to do. I know teachers who work weekends for 300-350 baht per hour and they travel a fair distance to do it. I know teachers who won't work for less than 1,000 baht per hour.

I also know teachers who routinely make sure that they have a replacement if they can't make a class for any reason or need to be on leave. I know teachers who pick up their pay and vanish into the Ethereal zone never to be seen again.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Yeah, but not 20% witholding. Run!!!! This little Thai way of doing things is also immoral, period.

Totally disagree. Too many schools have been burned by unreliable fly-by-nights.

Only immoral if they don't pay out at the end, in which case they should be named and shamed, maybe on reddit/r/tefl

[taiwanatoa]

Please PM me the contact info for the job.I'll take it.I need it.

[jji23]

I am taking the job, sorry. I just wanted the opinion of some other people to see if this clause was unusual or not. Thanks to everyone who has given me some constructive advice on the matter. I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt and see what happens at the end of the course.

Cheers