Driving 125 Cc Scooter And Have Licence For 50 Cc - No Problem In Pattaya

[NomadJoe]

I think the law is that you must have a valid international licence, not just a licence from your own country.

If your home license is in English and has a photo, it is already an "international license."

Even then, some of the cops won't accept the International licence

Untrue.

and also be aware that after 3 months in Thailand the International licence is no longer valid.

Also untrue. There is no time limit. If you are a visitor then you can use your home license in English with a photo or get an accompanying IDP. You can only drive the class of vehicle that you are licensed for despite the fact that cops at checkpoints particularly in tourist areas almost always accept a car license if you are on a scooter. If you are a resident then you need a Thai license.

.

Edited May 27, 2012 by NomadJoe

[Polanskiman]

...You will as minimum need a international licence.

Untrue. If your license is in English and has a picture on it, it already is an "international license." You don't need an IDP.

Well, I wanted to be sure what you were saying was correct/wrong. I googled and fell on this link from the Royal Thai Consulate in Hull in the UK: http://www.thaiconsu...d=499bO6KhnvQPg

You need an International Driving License.

Edited May 27, 2012 by Polanskiman

[NomadJoe]

...You will as minimum need a international licence.

Untrue. If your license is in English and has a picture on it, it already is an "international license." You don't need an IDP.

Well, I wanted to be sure what you were saying was correct/wrong. I googled and fell on this link from the Royal Thai Consulate in Hull in the UK: http://www.thaiconsu...d=499bO6KhnvQPg

You need an International Driving License.

Yes, as I said, if your license has a photo and is English, it is considered an international license. Until recently UK licenses did not have photos. Many people still have those paper licenses as they were valid until age 70. The info on that site you provided is out of date. I barely got through the first 2 paragraphs before I found 3 inaccuracies.

Firstly, we know "A Thai Driving Licence can be obtained at the Thailand Transportation Department in Bangkok only if you possess a valid International Driving Licence which has been issued in the country of your nationality." to be incorrect. Firstly, I and many others have found that only your home license was needed to obtain a Thai license, no IDP. This is because it's already an international license if in English and with a photo. Think about it, why would insurance, car rental companies, or the cops car about a translation of your license into several languages, none of them Thai, which is exactly what an IDP is.

Secondly, we also know that one does not have to go to the LTD in Bangkok. Any LTD can convert your home DL into a Thai DL.

Thirdly, we know that "....it is not possible to obtain a Thai Driving Licence with a Tourist Visa" is also untrue, as many people have reported this is in fact possible.

Lastly, "Take a written test (in Thai language only) on the rules of driving " is also wrong. It's available in English now.

The most telling evidence is that not one person has ever reported needing an IDP in Thailand for anything, but there are countless reports of people being able to rent, insure vehicles, have accidents, and get though police checkpoints without needing an IDP regardless of what websites will warn you, it's simply no longer the case in practice. Many other countries have begun the same practice. The websites do very little research and are playing it safe, plus they are usually trying to sell you an IDP.

This is my favorite part of the embassy-produced document you provided a link to: "The following has been extracted from the Thaivisa.com website." You've created a circular reference!

.

Edited May 27, 2012 by NomadJoe

[BigBikeBKK]

...You will as minimum need a international licence.

Untrue. If your license is in English and has a picture on it, it already is an "international license." You don't need an IDP.

Well, I wanted to be sure what you were saying was correct/wrong. I googled and fell on this link from the Royal Thai Consulate in Hull in the UK: http://www.thaiconsu...d=499bO6KhnvQPg

You need an International Driving License.

Actually all you really need is a couple hundred baht TiT

[madjbs]

Not all police are careless as you seem to assume and the day you are confronted with a police officer that isn't, then I believe your "official looking foreign card" will be of no use.

You are right, they are not careless. They care a lot about how much money they can extort from you.

At the end of the day you can find exceptions to any case. Whether you like it or not what I said is generally true for Thailand at this point of time. Anyone who has driven a lot here will agree.

Like I said, this is not a suggestion to break the law or any type of advice, it is simply stating the truth of the situation.

[madjbs]

...You will as minimum need a international licence.

Untrue. If your license is in English and has a picture on it, it already is an "international license." You don't need an IDP.

Well, I wanted to be sure what you were saying was correct/wrong. I googled and fell on this link from the Royal Thai Consulate in Hull in the UK: http://www.thaiconsu...d=499bO6KhnvQPg

You need an International Driving License.

Actually all you really need is a couple hundred baht TiT

I have yet to meet a policeman who has ever asked for an international drivers license to be presented, I doubt 99% of them even know what they are.

On the other hand, I was once stopped at an official police road block upcountry on unlicensed bikes with friends who had no motorcycle license to present and the policemen said there was no problem because we were all foreigners....

Many of the people on here have never left Pattaya/Phuket, which is why they don't seem to understand the situation in the vast majority of the country.

[Polanskiman]

Yes, as I said, if your license has a photo and is English, it is considered an international license. Until recently UK licenses did not have photos. Many people still have those paper licenses as they were valid until age 70. The info on that site you provided is out of date. I barely got through the first 2 paragraphs before I found 3 inaccuracies.

Firstly, we know "A Thai Driving Licence can be obtained at the Thailand Transportation Department in Bangkok only if you possess a valid International Driving Licence which has been issued in the country of your nationality." to be incorrect. Firstly, I and many others have found that only your home license was needed to obtain a Thai license, no IDP. This is because it's already an international license if in English and with a photo. Think about it, why would insurance, car rental companies, or the cops car about a translation of your license into several languages, none of them Thai, which is exactly what an IDP is.

Secondly, we also know that one does not have to go to the LTD in Bangkok. Any LTD can convert your home DL into a Thai DL.

Thirdly, we know that "....it is not possible to obtain a Thai Driving Licence with a Tourist Visa" is also untrue, as many people have reported this is in fact possible.

Lastly, "Take a written test (in Thai language only) on the rules of driving " is also wrong. It's available in English now.

The most telling evidence is that not one person has ever reported needing an IDP in Thailand for anything, but there are countless reports of people being able to rent, insure vehicles, have accidents, and get though police checkpoints without needing an IDP regardless of what websites will warn you, it's simply no longer the case in practice. Many other countries have begun the same practice. The websites do very little research and are playing it safe, plus they are usually trying to sell you an IDP.

This is my favorite part of the embassy-produced document you provided a link to: "The following has been extracted from the Thaivisa.com website." You've created a circular reference!

I agree with you, I myself had to translate my French DL into English in order to obtain my Thai DL. Now, strictly legally speaking, some solid reference would be appreciated such as regulations/law regarding an English driving License being considered as an international DL in Thailand.

As for the Thaivisa.com website reference in the document I must admit I didn't read all the document through, but it only refers to the second page onward. Next time I will be more careful on what I post, however I did made the effort of sustaining my words by referring to an official website.

[Polanskiman]

...You will as minimum need a international licence.

Untrue. If your license is in English and has a picture on it, it already is an "international license." You don't need an IDP.

Well, I wanted to be sure what you were saying was correct/wrong. I googled and fell on this link from the Royal Thai Consulate in Hull in the UK: http://www.thaiconsu...d=499bO6KhnvQPg

You need an International Driving License.

Actually all you really need is a couple hundred baht TiT

Few thousands perhaps if you are a tourist. Thais usually get out of silly situations for 20 baht or so. Seen it countless times.

The problem that I am trying to raise though is different. It's respect of foreign laws and respect of the hosting country. Not that I think I can change a whole nation by not complying with their "corruption habits" but I don't agree with them and therefore I don't like to contribute to these practices that I qualify harmful and very detrimental to the society. I have been stopped many times by the police, sometimes I was wrong and I paid the legal fine at the police station, sometimes they were simply inventing stuff and I would make it clear I would not pay anything. Sometimes I would make clear that I am not some ambulant wallet when they get too zealous. Up to know it has worked and they've let me go, and as I have already told you, they even complementing me on how nice the bike is in one occasion.

That's how I like to roll. I understand not everyone does it this way.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Polanskiman

[Polanskiman]

Not all police are careless as you seem to assume and the day you are confronted with a police officer that isn't, then I believe your "official looking foreign card" will be of no use.

You are right, they are not careless. They care a lot about how much money they can extort from you.

At the end of the day you can find exceptions to any case. Whether you like it or not what I said is generally true for Thailand at this point of time. Anyone who has driven a lot here will agree.

Like I said, this is not a suggestion to break the law or any type of advice, it is simply stating the truth of the situation.

See my comment above. It clarifies a bit further my point of view.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Polanskiman

[madjbs]

So if you eventually meet a police officer who does actually care about the law, what do you think he's going to do? 1000 baht official fine.......? I would be quivering in my boots!

[Polanskiman]

So if you eventually meet a police officer who does actually care about the law, what do you think he's going to do? 1000 baht official fine.......? I would be quivering in my boots!

Not an English native speaker so not sure what you mean by "quivering in my boots" but clearly sounds ironic. If you read carefully my post, I have already been in that situation. I was speeding on the highway over the limit. I was stopped at the toll. He asked for my DL. I gave it to him and paid my 800 baht fine, if I remember well, at the police station the day after where I got my DL back.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Polanskiman

[BigBikeBKK]

Untrue. If your license is in English and has a picture on it, it already is an "international license." You don't need an IDP.

Well, I wanted to be sure what you were saying was correct/wrong. I googled and fell on this link from the Royal Thai Consulate in Hull in the UK: http://www.thaiconsu...d=499bO6KhnvQPg

You need an International Driving License.

Actually all you really need is a couple hundred baht TiT

Few thousands perhaps if you are a tourist. Thais usually get out of silly situations for 20 baht or so. Seen it countless times.

The problem that I am trying to raise though is different. It's respect of foreign laws and respect of the hosting country. Not that I think I can change a whole nation by not complying with their "corruption habits" but I don't agree with them and therefore I don't like to contribute to these practices that I qualify harmful and very detrimental to the society. I have been stopped many times by the police, sometimes I was wrong and I paid the legal fine at the police station, sometimes they were simply inventing stuff and I would make it clear I would not pay anything. Sometimes I would make clear that I am not some ambulant wallet when they get too zealous. Up to know it has worked and they've let me go, and as I have already told you, they even complementing me on how nice the bike is in one occasion.

That's how I like to roll. I understand not everyone does it this way.

Actually I believe the ACTUAL fine for driving / riding without a valid license in Thailand is only 400 Baht or some such ridiculously low figure... No wonder then why so many choose to drive / ride without a license...

[BigBikeBKK]

So if you eventually meet a police officer who does actually care about the law, what do you think he's going to do? 1000 baht official fine.......? I would be quivering in my boots!

I don't think the official fine is even that much

[Polanskiman]

So if you eventually meet a police officer who does actually care about the law, what do you think he's going to do? 1000 baht official fine.......? I would be quivering in my boots!

I don't think the official fine is even that much

Depends what the infraction is. For not having an DL I cannot tell. For speeding, I think I paid 800 and for a orange/red traffic light I think I paid 500.

[NomadJoe]

Yes, as I said, if your license has a photo and is English, it is considered an international license. Until recently UK licenses did not have photos. Many people still have those paper licenses as they were valid until age 70. The info on that site you provided is out of date. I barely got through the first 2 paragraphs before I found 3 inaccuracies.

Firstly, we know "A Thai Driving Licence can be obtained at the Thailand Transportation Department in Bangkok only if you possess a valid International Driving Licence which has been issued in the country of your nationality." to be incorrect. Firstly, I and many others have found that only your home license was needed to obtain a Thai license, no IDP. This is because it's already an international license if in English and with a photo. Think about it, why would insurance, car rental companies, or the cops car about a translation of your license into several languages, none of them Thai, which is exactly what an IDP is.

Secondly, we also know that one does not have to go to the LTD in Bangkok. Any LTD can convert your home DL into a Thai DL.

Thirdly, we know that "....it is not possible to obtain a Thai Driving Licence with a Tourist Visa" is also untrue, as many people have reported this is in fact possible.

Lastly, "Take a written test (in Thai language only) on the rules of driving " is also wrong. It's available in English now.

The most telling evidence is that not one person has ever reported needing an IDP in Thailand for anything, but there are countless reports of people being able to rent, insure vehicles, have accidents, and get though police checkpoints without needing an IDP regardless of what websites will warn you, it's simply no longer the case in practice. Many other countries have begun the same practice. The websites do very little research and are playing it safe, plus they are usually trying to sell you an IDP.

This is my favorite part of the embassy-produced document you provided a link to: "The following has been extracted from the Thaivisa.com website." You've created a circular reference!

I agree with you, I myself had to translate my French DL into English in order to obtain my Thai DL. Now, strictly legally speaking, some solid reference would be appreciated such as regulations/law regarding an English driving License being considered as an international DL in Thailand.

As for the Thaivisa.com website reference in the document I must admit I didn't read all the document through, but it only refers to the second page onward. Next time I will be more careful on what I post, however I did made the effort of sustaining my words by referring to an official website.

The problem was a lot of the info contained in the first portion was clearly taken from the quoted sections that someone at Thaivisa wrote.

Visiting family have rented cars and had accidents while vacationing, all on a US license with no IDP. Never an issue. They don't ask for an IDP at license checks here in Phuket, nor have I ever heard of anyone saying a police officer has asked for one in any other part of Thailand. I have read many posts by people who specifically asked their insurance company if they are legal and not in violation of contract if they drive on just their home license. Not a problem. That is what got me interested in looking into it further.

I obviously have not provided any references to back up what I am sure regular readers here have begun to tire hearing me repeat ad-nauseam. You will find endless references on the internets which claim an IDP is needed in Thailand, but after having boots on the ground here for 11 years I found that to simply not be the case. I did recently find one travel website stating that "generally car rental companies and police accept your home license." Hardly definitive.

I don't just make this stuff up. The basis of my knowledge began with what I was taught about IDP's in a US police academy some years ago, and then much more recently in the big bike highway police volunteer seminar here in Thailand, as well as talking to police officers here. The drivers license sections of the oft-referenced but obsolete UN conventions was to bridge the gap between all the different types of licenses out there, and the different levels of instruction needed to get them which ranged from none at all to a lot. Some DL's had photo's, some didn't. Now a photograph and at least some training is standard and many countries have English as well as the native language on them, like Thailand now does. (Which is why I am able to legally use my Thai DL without an IDP when I visit family back in the states if my US license is expired, as long as I am visiting and not a resident.) It took a lot of searching to confirm my understanding but I did eventually find a quote from an official verifying that a foreign licenses with a photo and in English qualifies as "international" since an IDP would only provide a translation of your home DL into several languages that aren't Thai, thus is pointless. But I don't have the energy or desire to do all the research again to find it. Sorry.

But as I always say, having an IDP doesn't hurt.

.

Edited May 28, 2012 by NomadJoe

[BigBikeBKK]

Yes, as I said, if your license has a photo and is English, it is considered an international license. Until recently UK licenses did not have photos. Many people still have those paper licenses as they were valid until age 70. The info on that site you provided is out of date. I barely got through the first 2 paragraphs before I found 3 inaccuracies.

Firstly, we know "A Thai Driving Licence can be obtained at the Thailand Transportation Department in Bangkok only if you possess a valid International Driving Licence which has been issued in the country of your nationality." to be incorrect. Firstly, I and many others have found that only your home license was needed to obtain a Thai license, no IDP. This is because it's already an international license if in English and with a photo. Think about it, why would insurance, car rental companies, or the cops car about a translation of your license into several languages, none of them Thai, which is exactly what an IDP is.

Secondly, we also know that one does not have to go to the LTD in Bangkok. Any LTD can convert your home DL into a Thai DL.

Thirdly, we know that "....it is not possible to obtain a Thai Driving Licence with a Tourist Visa" is also untrue, as many people have reported this is in fact possible.

Lastly, "Take a written test (in Thai language only) on the rules of driving " is also wrong. It's available in English now.

The most telling evidence is that not one person has ever reported needing an IDP in Thailand for anything, but there are countless reports of people being able to rent, insure vehicles, have accidents, and get though police checkpoints without needing an IDP regardless of what websites will warn you, it's simply no longer the case in practice. Many other countries have begun the same practice. The websites do very little research and are playing it safe, plus they are usually trying to sell you an IDP.

This is my favorite part of the embassy-produced document you provided a link to: "The following has been extracted from the Thaivisa.com website." You've created a circular reference!

I agree with you, I myself had to translate my French DL into English in order to obtain my Thai DL. Now, strictly legally speaking, some solid reference would be appreciated such as regulations/law regarding an English driving License being considered as an international DL in Thailand.

As for the Thaivisa.com website reference in the document I must admit I didn't read all the document through, but it only refers to the second page onward. Next time I will be more careful on what I post, however I did made the effort of sustaining my words by referring to an official website.

The problem was a lot of the info contained in the first portion was clearly taken from the quoted sections that someone at Thaivisa wrote.

Visiting family have rented cars and had accidents while vacationing, all on a US license with no IDP. Never an issue. They don't ask for an IDP at license checks here in Phuket, nor have I ever heard of anyone saying a police officer has asked for one in any other part of Thailand. I have read many posts by people who specifically asked their insurance company if they are legal and not in violation of contract if they drive on just their home license. Not a problem. That is what got me interested in looking into it further.

I obviously have not provided any references to back up what I am sure regular readers here have begun to tire hearing me repeat ad-nauseam. You will find endless references on the internets which claim an IDP is needed in Thailand, but after having boots on the ground here for 11 years I found that to simply not be the case. I did recently find one travel website stating that "generally car rental companies and police accept your home license." Hardly definitive.

I don't just make this stuff up. The basis of my knowledge began with what I was taught about IDP's in a US police academy some years ago, and then much more recently in the big bike highway police volunteer seminar here in Thailand, as well as talking to police officers here. The drivers license sections of the oft-referenced but obsolete UN conventions was to bridge the gap between all the different types of licenses out there, and the different levels of instruction needed to get them which ranged from none at all to a lot. Some DL's had photo's, some didn't. Now a photograph and at least some training is standard and many countries have English as well as the native language on them, like Thailand now does. (Which is why I am able to legally use my Thai DL without an IDP when I visit family back in the states if my US license is expired, as long as I am visiting and not a resident.) It took a lot of searching to confirm my understanding but I did eventually find a quote from an official verifying that a foreign licenses with a photo and in English qualifies as "international" since an IDP would only provide a translation of your home DL into several languages that aren't Thai, thus is pointless. But I don't have the energy or desire to do all the research again to find it. Sorry.

But as I always say, having an IDP doesn't hurt.

.

Do you happen to recall what the official fine is for driving without a valid license in Thailand? I know it's laughably small, but can't recall the actual figure.

[NomadJoe]

Actually I believe the ACTUAL fine for driving / riding without a valid license in Thailand is only 400 Baht or some such ridiculously low figure... No wonder then why so many choose to drive / ride without a license...

Actually official fines in Thailand are listed as a range and are finally determined by the officer collecting the fine. Bad practice as it invites corruption.

Do you happen to recall what the official fine is for driving without a valid license in Thailand? I know it's laughably small, but can't recall the actual figure.

No I don't. I'd have to look it up.

Edit: Found this, but it only has single amounts. 400B is listed for no license. Interestingly the text that went with this pic stated that the fees were higher here than at a previous station he was at. I know I have seen one of these boards with ranges on it, just have to find it.

.

Edited May 28, 2012 by NomadJoe

[Polanskiman]

The problem was a lot of the info contained in the first portion was clearly taken from the quoted sections that someone at Thaivisa wrote.

Visiting family have rented cars and had accidents while vacationing, all on a US license with no IDP. Never an issue. They don't ask for an IDP at license checks here in Phuket, nor have I ever heard of anyone saying a police officer has asked for one in any other part of Thailand. I have read many posts by people who specifically asked their insurance company if they are legal and not in violation of contract if they drive on just their home license. Not a problem. That is what got me interested in looking into it further.

I obviously have not provided any references to back up what I am sure regular readers here have begun to tire hearing me repeat ad-nauseam. You will find endless references on the internets which claim an IDP is needed in Thailand, but after having boots on the ground here for 11 years I found that to simply not be the case. I did recently find one travel website stating that "generally car rental companies and police accept your home license." Hardly definitive.

I don't just make this stuff up. The basis of my knowledge began with what I was taught about IDP's in a US police academy some years ago, and then much more recently in the big bike highway police volunteer seminar here in Thailand, as well as talking to police officers here. The drivers license sections of the oft-referenced but obsolete UN conventions was to bridge the gap between all the different types of licenses out there, and the different levels of instruction needed to get them which ranged from none at all to a lot. Some DL's had photo's, some didn't. Now a photograph and at least some training is standard and many countries have English as well as the native language on them, like Thailand now does. (Which is why I am able to legally use my Thai DL without an IDP when I visit family back in the states if my US license is expired, as long as I am visiting and not a resident.) It took a lot of searching to confirm my understanding but I did eventually find a quote from an official verifying that a foreign licenses with a photo and in English qualifies as "international" since an IDP would only provide a translation of your home DL into several languages that aren't Thai, thus is pointless. But I don't have the energy or desire to do all the research again to find it. Sorry.

But as I always say, having an IDP doesn't hurt.

Thank you for the explanations. Interesting indeed.

[Polanskiman]

Do you happen to recall what the official fine is for driving without a valid license in Thailand? I know it's laughably small, but can't recall the actual figure.

Here Tony, I found how much it would cost you to drive without DL! ;-) - Enjoy: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/401015-50000baht-fine-for-no-drivers-license/

Edited May 28, 2012 by Polanskiman

[NomadJoe]

Ok, it appears only certain offenses have ranges. Tony's favorite, Section 35, the keep left rule, is 400-1000B.

http://thailaws.com/law/t_laws/tlaw0140_5.pdf