Manchester United

[rixalex]

He can't change tactics within a game either which the top drawer managers can and thats another requirement.

But again you are making broad blanket statements. How did we fight back from 1-2 down against Stoke to win 3-2 in the second half?

Anyway, you won't agree so we'll just have to see for ourselves come may.

With the way the rash and decisive judgements of him began after a handful of games, what are the chances of him being in any way reasonably and fairly judged come May by these people? Zilch i think. They have taken against him because they sense a weak link, and will go on exaggerating,amplifying and focusing on that weak link, in the hope their dreams of United's run of success finally being over, come true.

[rixalex]

Agreed with it all, but the highlighted comment for me is the key. Forget the strategy and tactics, he doesn't strike me as a guy cut out to manage a huge club with everything that brings. It ain't easy and the very large majority of managers aren't cut out for it as well. I think SAF and United made a mistake by not opting for a big time manager. I don't buy the theory that big time managers would have stayed away for fear of failure following SAF. I imagine most of them would have jumped at the chance. You don't become a big time manager without taking on challenges.

The idea that SAF and United were looking for a manager who would be there a long time like SAF, and even approach his success over a long period, strikes me as a fantasy. Best realize that SAF was a humongous one off, hire a manager with a top notch pedigree, do some housecleaning with the players who should have been sent packing one, two or three years ago, and then get on with it.

Instead, they hire a guy because he talks with same accent as Ferguson. My bet is that while Ferguson's huge ego was instrumental in his success as a manager, it didn't serve United well in picking his successor.

With us currently sitting together in the table separated by two points, perhaps mate you should spend more time worrying about your own manager.

[carmine]

He can't change tactics within a game either which the top drawer managers can and thats another requirement.

But again you are making broad blanket statements. How did we fight back from 1-2 down against Stoke to win 3-2 in the second half?

Anyway, you won't agree so we'll just have to see for ourselves come may.

With the way the rash and decisive judgements of him began after a handful of games, what are the chances of him being in any way reasonably and fairly judged come May by these people? Zilch i think. They have taken against him because they sense a weak link, and will go on exaggerating,amplifying and focusing on that weak link, in the hope their dreams of United's run of success finally being over, come true.

Au contraire Rix. I know Nev and MrEd think you are going to challenge for or win the title but putting all that aside i will hold my hands up and congratulate him if you make the top five. If you do then Van Persie is going to have on hell of a season.

Ofcourse the obvious choice for United was Jurgen Klopp. He would have been a fantastic replacement but i understand unwilling to leave the fatherland.

[jellydog]

Agreed with it all, but the highlighted comment for me is the key. Forget the strategy and tactics, he doesn't strike me as a guy cut out to manage a huge club with everything that brings. It ain't easy and the very large majority of managers aren't cut out for it as well. I think SAF and United made a mistake by not opting for a big time manager. I don't buy the theory that big time managers would have stayed away for fear of failure following SAF. I imagine most of them would have jumped at the chance. You don't become a big time manager without taking on challenges.

The idea that SAF and United were looking for a manager who would be there a long time like SAF, and even approach his success over a long period, strikes me as a fantasy. Best realize that SAF was a humongous one off, hire a manager with a top notch pedigree, do some housecleaning with the players who should have been sent packing one, two or three years ago, and then get on with it.

Instead, they hire a guy because he talks with same accent as Ferguson. My bet is that while Ferguson's huge ego was instrumental in his success as a manager, it didn't serve United well in picking his successor.

With us currently sitting together in the table separated by two points, perhaps mate you should spend more time worrying about your own manager.

Not worried about anything mate, and certainly not about United. Expressing an opinion.

[rixalex]

Agreed with it all, but the highlighted comment for me is the key. Forget the strategy and tactics, he doesn't strike me as a guy cut out to manage a huge club with everything that brings. It ain't easy and the very large majority of managers aren't cut out for it as well. I think SAF and United made a mistake by not opting for a big time manager. I don't buy the theory that big time managers would have stayed away for fear of failure following SAF. I imagine most of them would have jumped at the chance. You don't become a big time manager without taking on challenges.

The idea that SAF and United were looking for a manager who would be there a long time like SAF, and even approach his success over a long period, strikes me as a fantasy. Best realize that SAF was a humongous one off, hire a manager with a top notch pedigree, do some housecleaning with the players who should have been sent packing one, two or three years ago, and then get on with it.

Instead, they hire a guy because he talks with same accent as Ferguson. My bet is that while Ferguson's huge ego was instrumental in his success as a manager, it didn't serve United well in picking his successor.

With us currently sitting together in the table separated by two points, perhaps mate you should spend more time worrying about your own manager.

Not worried about anything mate, and certainly not about United. Expressing an opinion.

OK, let me try that again. You clearly think United supporters should be worried about their manager. Right?

Well, my feeling is, looking at the table, you should be asking yourself, if Moyes is as hopeless as all us ABUs are saying, what exactly does it say about my manager?

[carmine]

Agreed with it all, but the highlighted comment for me is the key. Forget the strategy and tactics, he doesn't strike me as a guy cut out to manage a huge club with everything that brings. It ain't easy and the very large majority of managers aren't cut out for it as well. I think SAF and United made a mistake by not opting for a big time manager. I don't buy the theory that big time managers would have stayed away for fear of failure following SAF. I imagine most of them would have jumped at the chance. You don't become a big time manager without taking on challenges.

The idea that SAF and United were looking for a manager who would be there a long time like SAF, and even approach his success over a long period, strikes me as a fantasy. Best realize that SAF was a humongous one off, hire a manager with a top notch pedigree, do some housecleaning with the players who should have been sent packing one, two or three years ago, and then get on with it.

Instead, they hire a guy because he talks with same accent as Ferguson. My bet is that while Ferguson's huge ego was instrumental in his success as a manager, it didn't serve United well in picking his successor.

With us currently sitting together in the table separated by two points, perhaps mate you should spend more time worrying about your own manager.

Not worried about anything mate, and certainly not about United. Expressing an opinion.

OK, let me try that again. You clearly think United supporters should be worried about their manager. Right?

Well, my feeling is, looking at the table, you should be asking yourself, if Moyes is as hopeless as all us ABUs are saying, what exactly does it say about my manager?

I think Joe Hart has a greater influence in the points dropped than the manager to be fair

[jellydog]

Agreed with it all, but the highlighted comment for me is the key. Forget the strategy and tactics, he doesn't strike me as a guy cut out to manage a huge club with everything that brings. It ain't easy and the very large majority of managers aren't cut out for it as well. I think SAF and United made a mistake by not opting for a big time manager. I don't buy the theory that big time managers would have stayed away for fear of failure following SAF. I imagine most of them would have jumped at the chance. You don't become a big time manager without taking on challenges.

The idea that SAF and United were looking for a manager who would be there a long time like SAF, and even approach his success over a long period, strikes me as a fantasy. Best realize that SAF was a humongous one off, hire a manager with a top notch pedigree, do some housecleaning with the players who should have been sent packing one, two or three years ago, and then get on with it.

Instead, they hire a guy because he talks with same accent as Ferguson. My bet is that while Ferguson's huge ego was instrumental in his success as a manager, it didn't serve United well in picking his successor.

With us currently sitting together in the table separated by two points, perhaps mate you should spend more time worrying about your own manager.

Not worried about anything mate, and certainly not about United. Expressing an opinion.

OK, let me try that again. You clearly think United supporters should be worried about their manager. Right?

Well, my feeling is, looking at the table, you should be asking yourself, if Moyes is as hopeless as all us ABUs are saying, what exactly does it say about my manager?

I'm not saying anything of the sort. I'm expressing an opinion regarding one of the biggest clubs in football. A club that everybody follows to one degree or another whether they are a fan of the club or not. I have my own concerns about Pellegrini just as any City fan would given their uneven start, though I think that much of the problem with City has to do with defensive woes that are down to injuries and Hart's poor form. Not Pellegrini, though time will tell.

If I turn out to be wrong about Moyes and United management in general, I'll be the first to admit it.

[rixalex]

OK, let me try that again. You clearly think United supporters should be worried about their manager. Right?

Well, my feeling is, looking at the table, you should be asking yourself, if Moyes is as hopeless as all us ABUs are saying, what exactly does it say about my manager?

I'm not saying anything of the sort. I'm expressing an opinion regarding one of the biggest clubs in football. A club that everybody follows to one degree or another whether they are a fan of the club or not. I have my own concerns about Pellegrini just as any City fan would given their uneven start, though I think that much of the problem with City has to do with defensive woes that are down to injuries and Hart's poor form. Not Pellegrini, though time will tell.

If I turn out to be wrong about Moyes and United management in general, I'll be the first to admit it.

At the end of the day, the table is king, and to deride the job that Moyes has done so far, and to write him off, just seems a bit funny coming from the supporter of a team that sits two points above us.

Looking at the team you have on paper, and the team we have on paper, i just can't help feeling that not all the questions about management should be directed at Moyes, which is what they have been.

[jellydog]

OK, let me try that again. You clearly think United supporters should be worried about their manager. Right?

Well, my feeling is, looking at the table, you should be asking yourself, if Moyes is as hopeless as all us ABUs are saying, what exactly does it say about my manager?

I'm not saying anything of the sort. I'm expressing an opinion regarding one of the biggest clubs in football. A club that everybody follows to one degree or another whether they are a fan of the club or not. I have my own concerns about Pellegrini just as any City fan would given their uneven start, though I think that much of the problem with City has to do with defensive woes that are down to injuries and Hart's poor form. Not Pellegrini, though time will tell.

If I turn out to be wrong about Moyes and United management in general, I'll be the first to admit it.

At the end of the day, the table is king, and to deride the job that Moyes has done so far, and to write him off, just seems a bit funny coming from the supporter of a team that sits two points above us.

Looking at the team you have on paper, and the team we have on paper, i just can't help feeling that not all the questions about management should be directed at Moyes, which is what they have been.

Rix, I'd have the same opinion about Moyes if City was battling Leyton Orient for top spot in League One. I honestly don't see what my being a fan of City has to do with my opinion about Moyes or United, though I can understand how you might think so. I think you're barking up a non-existent tree. Only calling 'em as I see 'em.

[rixalex]

Rix, I'd have the same opinion about Moyes if City was battling Leyton Orient for top spot in League One. I honestly don't see what my being a fan of City has to do with my opinion about Moyes or United, though I can understand how you might think so. I think you're barking up a non-existent tree. Only calling 'em as I see 'em.

Actually, i'm not suggesting that your support for City is particularly affecting your opinion of Moyes, what i am suggesting is that City fans are happily dissecting Moyes performances every game, and placing blame firmly at his feet for everything that happens, but then when it comes to their own manager, who to repeat, has successfully guided them to a position two points above us, it seems like they aren't really interested in discussing him much, and seem to have an excuse for every bad performance as to why it wasn't really down to him.

Personally i think the truth is that both managers have struggled equally so far. Can you really argue at this stage that Pelligrini has done a better job than Moyes?

[MrRed]

Moyes has managed United in about 16? competitive games how many has he lost? Three! I rest our case .......admittedly we have not been at the heights we generally play at,but what do you expect with an all new set up right from the coaches up to the chief exec?

Come Christmas we will have a better view and opinion but i can say here and now don't rule out United based on a quarter of the season Carmine.....remember we had a tough start an all

It is like most things in life there is always room for improvement or as a mate once said to me always let the tax man find something cos it makes him happy and justify's his job,football is similar in the aspect of improvement and implementing new plans and setting up future business plans.....United are most definitely in transition(that word)you should understand that after what Spurs have been doing under AVB!

But as i mentioned earlier and so did the eloquent Rex and Jelly it boils down to United being feared and everybody wants us to fail.......they fear us after years of unprecedented success in the Premier league....that my friend is the bottom line and you know it.

I forgot to add that us Reds know this feeling very well,well those old enough to remember Liverpool's dominance in the 70's and 80's when i also wanted them to fail ....it is no different now with United.

Edited October 31, 2013 by MrRed

[carmine]

Rix, I'd have the same opinion about Moyes if City was battling Leyton Orient for top spot in League One. I honestly don't see what my being a fan of City has to do with my opinion about Moyes or United, though I can understand how you might think so. I think you're barking up a non-existent tree. Only calling 'em as I see 'em.

Actually, i'm not suggesting that your support for City is particularly affecting your opinion of Moyes, what i am suggesting is that City fans are happily dissecting Moyes performances every game, and placing blame firmly at his feet for everything that happens, but then when it comes to their own manager, who to repeat, has successfully guided them to a position two points above us, it seems like they aren't really interested in discussing him much, and seem to have an excuse for every bad performance as to why it wasn't really down to him.

Personally i think the truth is that both managers have struggled equally so far. Can you really argue at this stage that Pelligrini has done a better job than Moyes?

Well if i'm honest Rex, i reckon that bar for the obvious failings of Hart in goal, City would argueably be eight points clear of you

[jellydog]

Rix, I'd have the same opinion about Moyes if City was battling Leyton Orient for top spot in League One. I honestly don't see what my being a fan of City has to do with my opinion about Moyes or United, though I can understand how you might think so. I think you're barking up a non-existent tree. Only calling 'em as I see 'em.

Actually, i'm not suggesting that your support for City is particularly affecting your opinion of Moyes, what i am suggesting is that City fans are happily dissecting Moyes performances every game, and placing blame firmly at his feet for everything that happens, but then when it comes to their own manager, who to repeat, has successfully guided them to a position two points above us, it seems like they aren't really interested in discussing him much, and seem to have an excuse for every bad performance as to why it wasn't really down to him.

Personally i think the truth is that both managers have struggled equally so far. Can you really argue at this stage that Pelligrini has done a better job than Moyes?

Well, I can see that you are rabidly intent on skewing my original post away from United management, SAF's role in picking Moyes, the option of picking a "bigger" manager and Moyes limitations. I haven't the slightest idea what City or Pellegrini have to do with those topics, but knock yourself out.

[rixalex]

Rix, I'd have the same opinion about Moyes if City was battling Leyton Orient for top spot in League One. I honestly don't see what my being a fan of City has to do with my opinion about Moyes or United, though I can understand how you might think so. I think you're barking up a non-existent tree. Only calling 'em as I see 'em.

Actually, i'm not suggesting that your support for City is particularly affecting your opinion of Moyes, what i am suggesting is that City fans are happily dissecting Moyes performances every game, and placing blame firmly at his feet for everything that happens, but then when it comes to their own manager, who to repeat, has successfully guided them to a position two points above us, it seems like they aren't really interested in discussing him much, and seem to have an excuse for every bad performance as to why it wasn't really down to him.

Personally i think the truth is that both managers have struggled equally so far. Can you really argue at this stage that Pelligrini has done a better job than Moyes?

Well, I can see that you are rabidly intent on skewing my original post away from United management, SAF's role in picking Moyes, the option of picking a "bigger" manager and Moyes limitations. I haven't the slightest idea what City or Pellegrini have to do with those topics, but knock yourself out.

Moyes has been done to death on here, and my opinion about him and the job he is doing is all repeated numerous times, so i just feel, that when other supporters come on here to post another Moyes is crap, out of his depth type comment, it's fair for me to turn the question around and ask them about the job their own manager is doing, particularly when they are right next to us in the table.

[uptheos]

Quite. It really amuses me when some defend Moyes on the basis that it took Ferguson time too!!! <deleted> are those numb nuts talking about. Ferguson was already a seasoned winner having done it the hard way.

All he had to do at United was indoctrinate the squad with his RedNosecult type thing! But most importantly, he knew how to win already. Moyes can't win a derby let alone a cup. The charity shield in august was gratis Ferguson

btw, that photo of Moyes looks like Bugs Bunny after a road kill:thumbsup:

Another funny thing is how, before Moyes made the move to United, most people of all persuasions (save perhaps for city rivals), had nothing but good things to say about the job he was doing at Everton, about how he continually got that team punching above their weight, and on a relative shoestring budget. Was there any manager that could have done a better job with that Everton team than he managed, do you think? Was there any manager that would have had that Everton team winning silverware, in your opinion? Personally i have my doubts.

Under Moyes they were a pretty boring team to watch though. I think Martinez is doing a better job already. He started by doing a better job than United in summer market, it didn't take long for him to stamp his philosophy on the team. Now they play a more modern style of possession based football.

He certainly knew which one out of Baines and Fellaini, was the better one to keep.

[mjj]

Tbh, I think Uniteds position in the table is more a reflection of the team. Even though they cruised it last year, too many sides gave up against Fergies United. With Moyes in charge they seem to be more willing to give it a go.

I can't see Man U winning the title this year, just fighting for third which is open to about 3 other teams.

[rixalex]

Rix, I'd have the same opinion about Moyes if City was battling Leyton Orient for top spot in League One. I honestly don't see what my being a fan of City has to do with my opinion about Moyes or United, though I can understand how you might think so. I think you're barking up a non-existent tree. Only calling 'em as I see 'em.

Actually, i'm not suggesting that your support for City is particularly affecting your opinion of Moyes, what i am suggesting is that City fans are happily dissecting Moyes performances every game, and placing blame firmly at his feet for everything that happens, but then when it comes to their own manager, who to repeat, has successfully guided them to a position two points above us, it seems like they aren't really interested in discussing him much, and seem to have an excuse for every bad performance as to why it wasn't really down to him.

Personally i think the truth is that both managers have struggled equally so far. Can you really argue at this stage that Pelligrini has done a better job than Moyes?

Well if i'm honest Rex, i reckon that bar for the obvious failings of Hart in goal, City would argueably be eight points clear of you

I see. The "ifs" "buts" and "maybes" game. Think we can all play that one.

[rixalex]

Tbh, I think Uniteds position in the table is more a reflection of the team. Even though they cruised it last year, too many sides gave up against Fergies United. With Moyes in charge they seem to be more willing to give it a go.

I can't see Man U winning the title this year, just fighting for third which is open to about 3 other teams.

Fair comment.

[nev]

Rix, I'd have the same opinion about Moyes if City was battling Leyton Orient for top spot in League One. I honestly don't see what my being a fan of City has to do with my opinion about Moyes or United, though I can understand how you might think so. I think you're barking up a non-existent tree. Only calling 'em as I see 'em.

Actually, i'm not suggesting that your support for City is particularly affecting your opinion of Moyes, what i am suggesting is that City fans are happily dissecting Moyes performances every game, and placing blame firmly at his feet for everything that happens, but then when it comes to their own manager, who to repeat, has successfully guided them to a position two points above us, it seems like they aren't really interested in discussing him much, and seem to have an excuse for every bad performance as to why it wasn't really down to him.

Personally i think the truth is that both managers have struggled equally so far. Can you really argue at this stage that Pelligrini has done a better job than Moyes?

Well if i'm honest Rex, i reckon that bar for the obvious failings of Hart in goal, City would argueably be eight points clear of you

What a silly statement, its like saying if RVP had not hit the post or Rooney's free kick was not saved United would not have dropped as many points.

[MrRed]

He can't change tactics within a game either which the top drawer managers can and thats another requirement.

But again you are making broad blanket statements. How did we fight back from 1-2 down against Stoke to win 3-2 in the second half?

Anyway, you won't agree so we'll just have to see for ourselves come may.

With the way the rash and decisive judgements of him began after a handful of games, what are the chances of him being in any way reasonably and fairly judged come May by these people? Zilch i think. They have taken against him because they sense a weak link, and will go on exaggerating,amplifying and focusing on that weak link, in the hope their dreams of United's run of success finally being over, come true.

Au contraire Rix. I know Nev and MrEd think you are going to challenge for or win the title but putting all that aside i will hold my hands up and congratulate him if you make the top five. If you do then Van Persie is going to have on hell of a season.

Ofcourse the obvious choice for United was Jurgen Klopp. He would have been a fantastic replacement but i understand unwilling to leave the fatherland.

Here is another little gem from carmine today who really is having mare Van Persie will score minimum 20 goals in the premier league just like he did and more last season ...it is the goals from other players that we need!! especially midfield....now stop talking shit cos you running around in circles mate.

Jurgen Klopp! carmine had two good seasons were he won the league in Germany.........he previously spent 7 ........yes 7 years at Mainz and won <deleted> all eventually leaving when he got them relegated.

Who knows what he would have done at United but no experience in the Premier League would of needed time to get used to it.

[MrRed]

Tbh, I think Uniteds position in the table is more a reflection of the team. Even though they cruised it last year, too many sides gave up against Fergies United. With Moyes in charge they seem to be more willing to give it a go.

I can't see Man U winning the title this year, just fighting for third which is open to about 3 other teams.

Agree with your first sentence.

What two teams do you think are fighting for the title mjj? Chelsea and?

And which other three do you think are fighting for third?

[mrbojangles]

it boils down to United being feared and everybody wants us to fail.......they fear us

 

"f eared" red? This season I would think the exact opposite tbh. Every team is having a go at you this year as opposed to previously when teams (especially the lower ones) would just sit and defend.

As for Moyes doing a great job at Everton. I think we all "thought" he was doing a great job on a budget but it seems we may have been wrong as Martinez is doing much better and they are playing more attractive

Sent from my GT-N8000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[MrRed]

Yes i was talking about the past.

As for Martinez and Everton i don't care

[jellydog]

As evidence that I don't hate Moyes I will try to amend a horrible wrong done him by Red:

[MrRed]

Its in the wrong thread mate.i preferred the other one

[mjj]

Tbh, I think Uniteds position in the table is more a reflection of the team. Even though they cruised it last year, too many sides gave up against Fergies United. With Moyes in charge they seem to be more willing to give it a go.

I can't see Man U winning the title this year, just fighting for third which is open to about 3 other teams.

Agree with your first sentence.

What two teams do you think are fighting for the title mjj? Chelsea and?

And which other three do you think are fighting for third?

Chelsea and City for the title. Not only do they have the players to dominate games, they also have a squad depth that means 3 or 4 injuries isn't a problem. I'm not saying other teams are one man shows, but it just matters less with Chelsea and City.

At the moment the battle for 3rd I would say is between Arsenal (storming start, but haven't played enough top teams), United (dodgy start, but have played some good sides and won't collapse under pressure as the season progresses), Liverpool (definite improvement, but dodgy defending) and Spurs (great defending, woeful goal return and haven't delivered against top sides).

And if I am to predict an order, it would be that order also. Buuuutttt, as someone once said, it's a funny old game and anything can happen. :-)

[wilai]

Here's a topical one from my little pal Shinji:

Today fancy of dress!

I say to Moyes "Will you be an old withered skelington face or wear costume?"

All team laugh.....I suspended, 3 game!

[alfieconn]

David Moyes had better get out in his car rather sharpish.........
Apparently Wayne Rooney has been spotted knocking on grannies doors asking for a treat

[MrRed]

David Moyes had better get out in his car rather sharpish.........

Apparently Wayne Rooney has been spotted knocking on grannies doors asking for a treat

I thought it would of been more appropriate to say he was asking for a trick

[mad mary]

David Moyes had better get out in his car rather sharpish.........

Apparently Wayne Rooney has been spotted knocking on grannies doors asking for a treat

I thought it would of been more appropriate to say he was asking for a trick

Alfieconn & rooney are both to thick to know the difference.