Contaminated Food May Have Killed Canadian Sisters: Phi Phi Island

[mommysboy]

its more than likely, that they took ibuprofen, every painkiller available... they had hours of dieing to go...

and much pain, they actually seem to have died in cramped positions, unable to relax in any way - till the end...

this was a horrible dead and as long as possible, they might have taken what had with them.. painkillers, stomach problems, diarrhoe things...

yes, a lot of drugs in the system... a spin for the dumb...

I doubt they were overdosing on ibuprofen. As said before it takes a hell of a lot of it to overdose and MOST reasonable educate people know not to od on medication.

The only thing I can say is I took ibuprofen and travel sickness medication before going on a plane. Dont do that. I was freaking out hallucinating, sweating and thought I was going to die. Only lasted 30 minutes.

Too many inconsistances with Thai TV, english reports etc, it seems one news for the Thai's (falang od on drugs 'again') and one for the english (accidental food poisoning). I love Thailand, and the people are great, but the politicians and those high up. Much to be desired.

As I said on the other thread, they meet Samantha Kay who is a bar pimp for Velvet Dojo. They party all night drinking loads of buckets and maybe popping some pills. All three of them get sick - the Canadians get back to their room and pop some ibuprofen which mixed together with the vast quantity of alcohol and whatever else causes severe stomach bleeding and they die. The cops also said right at the beginning that there were other prescription drugs in the room. Severe stomach bleeding can cause cyanosis, bleeding from the mouth and bruising on the body. Ibuprofen can also cause vomiting and rashes if mixed with alcohol.

Samantha Kay takes herself off to the hospital and they keep here there for 3 days with suspected food poisoning and dehydration (I doubt food poisoning - maybe saengsom poisoning ;-) And no one seems to think this Kay woman is important. She was most likely the last person to interact with them. She was partying with them before they died-Jeez someone needs to talk to this girl.

Imagination or logical thought process?

Imagination or logical thought process?

Well those may be ingredients, but I'd suggest speculation at best, and quite possibly utter bol**cks.

[annabel]

its more than likely, that they took ibuprofen, every painkiller available... they had hours of dieing to go...

and much pain, they actually seem to have died in cramped positions, unable to relax in any way - till the end...

this was a horrible dead and as long as possible, they might have taken what had with them.. painkillers, stomach problems, diarrhoe things...

yes, a lot of drugs in the system... a spin for the dumb...

I doubt they were overdosing on ibuprofen. As said before it takes a hell of a lot of it to overdose and MOST reasonable educate people know not to od on medication.

The only thing I can say is I took ibuprofen and travel sickness medication before going on a plane. Dont do that. I was freaking out hallucinating, sweating and thought I was going to die. Only lasted 30 minutes.

Too many inconsistances with Thai TV, english reports etc, it seems one news for the Thai's (falang od on drugs 'again') and one for the english (accidental food poisoning). I love Thailand, and the people are great, but the politicians and those high up. Much to be desired.

As I said on the other thread, they meet Samantha Kay who is a bar pimp for Velvet Dojo. They party all night drinking loads of buckets and maybe popping some pills. All three of them get sick - the Canadians get back to their room and pop some ibuprofen which mixed together with the vast quantity of alcohol and whatever else causes severe stomach bleeding and they die. The cops also said right at the beginning that there were other prescription drugs in the room. Severe stomach bleeding can cause cyanosis, bleeding from the mouth and bruising on the body. Ibuprofen can also cause vomiting and rashes if mixed with alcohol.

Samantha Kay takes herself off to the hospital and they keep here there for 3 days with suspected food poisoning and dehydration (I doubt food poisoning - maybe saengsom poisoning ;-) And no one seems to think this Kay woman is important. She was most likely the last person to interact with them. She was partying with them before they died-Jeez someone needs to talk to this girl.

Imagination or logical thought process?

I had the same question regarding the Autralian girl who died in exact similar circumstances here in Chiang Mai at Downtown Inn last year .... her 2 very close friends survived ... BUT ,,, were never questionned and they themselves never reported on anything that happened that evening before their friends death, and even after... when they themselves became very ill and were also hospitalized at the very same time. And then.... just went straight back to Australia and were never heard of as I said , before their departure, during the event or even after .... WHY...?? Isn't that so weird... your best buddy dies and at the same time of her death, you are also violently sick with the same symptons and almost dying yourself and , are in the hospital at the same time as her and then SHE DIES !! ... And you just run away and never speak to anybody about it after she dies but you survived ??... What is wrong in this pic all you Shelock Holmes out there ?? Please tell me cause ... Sorry but I have chills here !! Threats ?? Even the Australian father who was yes, with reason, livid and pursued the case for months never mentioned them or pursued questionning these girls to find some logic ...WHY???

[ttelise]

Canadian officials said that report contained several inaccuracies. They said diplomats never asked anyone to delay the autopsies, said the autopsies had already been completed, and that the family had no plans to travel to Thailand. http://www.cbc.ca/ne...es.html?cmp=rss

Interesting . . .

[mommysboy]

What are these people sucking at the hospital? Is that a treatment for food poisoning, which is common when visiting another country, especially a less developed one ...

The body has a wonderful and robust defense system against tainted food. Food poisoning that requires hospitalization and/or medical care beyond a simple prescription and some advice, is not a common malady anywhere. I, as well as many other posters to these boards, have traveled extensively in less developed areas and have had plenty of experience with minor tummy issues that required us to remain close to the hong naam (water closet) for a day or two. Call that what you will, but I don't call it food poisoning. But to the best of my knowledge, I am the only one here so far to have experienced serious food poisoning that required professional medical care and that instance occured in a developed country.

In Thailand it is normal to hospitalise someone suffering from food poisoning, as a big danger is dehydration, thus one is usually placed on an intravenous drip, and when vomiting has subsided and ORS are being accepted orally you are discharged. This was my early experience and it happens to quite a few people when first in Thailand.

The bug in question need not be E.Coli, because if you ingest enough tainted food then the toxins can make you vomit severely. In hot weather countries bacteria multiply rapidly so the food can be loaded with toxins in a short space of time.

Thus, I contend your post is inaccurate.

If the presentation is simply dehydration, they probably could be treated in the ER and released within 4 to 6 hours if young and healthy. They would simply run maybe two bags of Saline and/or soduim chloride and send them on their way.

Hospitalizations in the states generally would only occur if presentation of dehydration was secondary to a massive infection or sepsis requiring IV antibiotics (give oral otherwise) or was secondary to something like food poisoning where bacterium must be treated or IV fluids must be constantly administered until the bug/bacteria runs its course because the patient cannot maintain adequate hydration orally.

Partying ain't going to do that. All food posioning ain't going to that. Most food poisoning can runs its course in normal healthy adults. Camplobactor or Almonella perhaps from raw poutlry can be pareticularly nasty to some though.

I told you what happened to me and many others, and I didn't say they present themselves with dehydration.

Typically, the patient turns up complaining of prolonged vomiting, the runs, and headache with fever. The diagnosis will be made of gastro enteritis or acute gut infection, and the patient hooked up to the drip. The drip is commonly used out here to ward of dehydration which is actually the bigger danger than the infection itself, which as we know subsides within hours usually.

When the patient has recovered sufficiently to take in water, he is usually discharged with an antibiotic, and painkillers, and a few packets of ORS.

This is what happens.

[ttelise]

The body has a wonderful and robust defense system against tainted food. Food poisoning that requires hospitalization and/or medical care beyond a simple prescription and some advice, is not a common malady anywhere. I, as well as many other posters to these boards, have traveled extensively in less developed areas and have had plenty of experience with minor tummy issues that required us to remain close to the hong naam (water closet) for a day or two. Call that what you will, but I don't call it food poisoning. But to the best of my knowledge, I am the only one here so far to have experienced serious food poisoning that required professional medical care and that instance occured in a developed country.

In Thailand it is normal to hospitalise someone suffering from food poisoning, as a big danger is dehydration, thus one is usually placed on an intravenous drip, and when vomiting has subsided and ORS are being accepted orally you are discharged. This was my early experience and it happens to quite a few people when first in Thailand.

The bug in question need not be E.Coli, because if you ingest enough tainted food then the toxins can make you vomit severely. In hot weather countries bacteria multiply rapidly so the food can be loaded with toxins in a short space of time.

Thus, I contend your post is inaccurate.

If the presentation is simply dehydration, they probably could be treated in the ER and released within 4 to 6 hours if young and healthy. They would simply run maybe two bags of Saline and/or soduim chloride and send them on their way.

Hospitalizations in the states generally would only occur if presentation of dehydration was secondary to a massive infection or sepsis requiring IV antibiotics (give oral otherwise) or was secondary to something like food poisoning where bacterium must be treated or IV fluids must be constantly administered until the bug/bacteria runs its course because the patient cannot maintain adequate hydration orally.

Partying ain't going to do that. All food posioning ain't going to that. Most food poisoning can runs its course in normal healthy adults. Camplobactor or Almonella perhaps from raw poutlry can be pareticularly nasty to some though.

I told you what happened to me and many others, and I didn't say they present themselves with dehydration.

Typically, the patient turns up complaining of prolonged vomiting, the runs, and headache with fever. The diagnosis will be made of gastro enteritis or acute gut infection, and the patient hooked up to the drip. The drip is commonly used out here to ward of dehydration which is actually the bigger danger than the infection itself, which as we know subsides within hours usually.

When the patient has recovered sufficiently to take in water, he is usually discharged with an antibiotic, and painkillers, and a few packets of ORS.

This is what happens.

Yep. Sounds about right. I think I was referring more to the hound of hell who seems to think these girls died because of dehydration due to partying.

I will say I have seen camplobactor make people very, very sick. I just pulled this article. I knwo from a case I worked on it can hit within 24 hours where this article states like 2 to 10 days.

Campylobacter Symptoms

Symptoms of food poisoning from Campylobacter usually occur 2 to 5 days after a person eats contaminated food, but may take up to 10 days to appear. The most common symptom of a Campylobacter infection is diarrhea, which is often bloody. Typical symptoms include:

• Diarrhea: Diarrhea ranges from mild to severe and is often bloody
  
• Fever
  
• Nausea
  
• Vomiting
  
• Abdominal pain
  
• Headache
  
• Muscle pain
  

Two age groups are most commonly affected by Campylobacter: children under 5 years of age and young adults aged 15-29.

Complications of Campylobacter Infection

Although complications from Campylobacter food poisoning are unlikely, they do occur in some cases. The following is a list of possible long-term consequences of Campylobacter infection.

Guillan-Barré Syndrome (GBS): Although rare, Guillan-Barré Syndrome is the most common cause of acute generalized paralysis in the western world. GBS occurs when the antibodies the body builds up against Campylobacter attack one’s nerve cells. Symptoms of GBS appear several weeks after diarrheal illness. Approximately one in every 1000 reported Campylobacter cases results in GBS.

Reactive Arthritis: Campylobacter infection may also lead to reactive arthritis. Symptoms include inflammation of the joints, eyes, or reproductive or urinary organs. On average, symptoms appear 18 days after infection.

Other complications: Campylobacter may also cause appendicitis or infect specific parts of the body, including the abdominal cavity, the heart, the central nervous system, the gall bladder, the urinary tract, or the blood stream.

Diagnosis of Campylobacter Infection

To assess whether someone has a Campylobacter infection, doctors take a stool sample and send it to a laboratory for testing. However, if the stool sample is taken after an individual has begun antibiotic treatment, the test results may be falsely negative.

Campylobacter Treatment

Campylobacter infections usually resolve after about a week, although treatment with antibiotics can shorten the course of the illness. Patients with Campylobacter poisoning should drink lots of fluids to stay hydrated as long as the diarrhea lasts. Antidiarrheal medication may also help lessen symptoms.

The amount of foodborne bacteria resistant to antibiotics is on the rise, so certain antibiotics may prove ineffective at treating a given type of Campylobacter. Finding an effective antibiotic is key to treating this bacterial infection.

[colind88]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

[ttelise]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

Well he did on other thread and he implied that they got drunk, took ibu and that set chain of events in motion.

Normal healthy 20 something year old girls don't just drop dead from partying. Especially both of them at the same time. There had to be some sort of toxin involved. Food poisoning is what Thai authorities say and I would buy that way before purely alcohol and drug related rant from the hound of hell.

The above also negates that we have reports of bleeding mucus membranes, blood under eyes and lesions of strange skin spotting. Again, toxins of some type.

Edited June 21, 2012 by ttelise

[Hellhound66]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

http://www.mcot.net/cfcustom/cache_page/379378.html

[Hellhound66]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

Well he did on other thread and he implied that they got drunk, took ibu and that set chain of events in motion.

Normal healthy 20 something year old girls don't just drop dead from partying. Especially both of them at the same time. There had to be some sort of toxin involved. Food poisoning is what Thai authorities say and I would buy that way before purely alcohol and drug related rant from the hound of hell.

The above also negates that we have reports of bleeding mucus membranes, blood under eyes and lesions of strange skin spotting. Again, toxins of some type.

I believe I said multiple buckets and popped a few pills prior to the ibu. Anyway it's all speculation. I still say this girl Samantha Kay is an important person and I am not surprised she is trying to leave the island as quick as possible.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Hellhound66

[Thaddeus]

Campylobacter infections usually resolve after about a week, although treatment with antibiotics can shorten the course of the illness. Patients with Campylobacter poisoning should drink lots of fluids to stay hydrated as long as the diarrhea lasts. Antidiarrheal medication may also help lessen symptoms.

The amount of foodborne bacteria resistant to antibiotics is on the rise, so certain antibiotics may prove ineffective at treating a given type of Campylobacter. Finding an effective antibiotic is key to treating this bacterial infection.

I have really resisted from making any comments on this topic about my personal experience, as I thought that it would be disrespectful to the family of the girls.

I have suffered from a dose of campylobacter, for me it was incredibly painful, it was like being a sausage forced through a mangle and my entire body was trying to leave by the nearest orifice.

However, even after three days or being practically chained to the bathroom, I was still able enough to call for help.

That was severe food poisoning ..... this case isn't.

[ttelise]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

http://www.mcot.net/...age/379378.html

Let's see, I have said early on in both threads and about 6 pages ago that the Thai authorities would do well to latch on to this guy and use him as a patsy or fall guy. So easy to say a farang poisoned them and we got him, case solved, everything is safe. I would hate to be in that guy's shoes as there would be no way to get a fair trial.

Alas, however, earlier newspaper reports stated that they had this guy and he was in custody. So did they lose him? Hard to read article you cited.

[ttelise]

Campylobacter infections usually resolve after about a week, although treatment with antibiotics can shorten the course of the illness. Patients with Campylobacter poisoning should drink lots of fluids to stay hydrated as long as the diarrhea lasts. Antidiarrheal medication may also help lessen symptoms.

The amount of foodborne bacteria resistant to antibiotics is on the rise, so certain antibiotics may prove ineffective at treating a given type of Campylobacter. Finding an effective antibiotic is key to treating this bacterial infection.

I have really resisted from making any comments on this topic about my personal experience, as I thought that it would be disrespectful to the family of the girls.

I have suffered from a dose of campylobacter, for me it was incredibly painful, it was like being a sausage forced through a mangle and my entire body was trying to leave by the nearest orifice.

However, even after three days or being practically chained to the bathroom, I was still able enough to call for help.

That was severe food poisoning ..... this case isn't.

I am inclined to agree with you whole heartedly. I still think a toxin is involved. Perhaps blowfish, arsenic, bad mushrooms or what ever. Doubtful food posioning would take out both simultaneously and that quickly.

[ttelise]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

Well he did on other thread and he implied that they got drunk, took ibu and that set chain of events in motion.

Normal healthy 20 something year old girls don't just drop dead from partying. Especially both of them at the same time. There had to be some sort of toxin involved. Food poisoning is what Thai authorities say and I would buy that way before purely alcohol and drug related rant from the hound of hell.

The above also negates that we have reports of bleeding mucus membranes, blood under eyes and lesions of strange skin spotting. Again, toxins of some type.

I believe I said multiple buckets and popped a few pills prior to the ibu. Anyway it's all speculation. I still say this girl Samantha Kay is an important person and I am not surprised she is trying to leave the island as quick as possible.

No doubt. I would get the hell out of dodge. They will be looking for a fall guy or girl if toxicology reports are not as they had hoped.

[Hellhound66]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

http://www.mcot.net/...age/379378.html

Let's see, I have said early on in both threads and about 6 pages ago that the Thai authorities would do well to latch on to this guy and use him as a patsy or fall guy. So easy to say a farang poisoned them and we got him, case solved, everything is safe. I would hate to be in that guy's shoes as there would be no way to get a fair trial.

Alas, however, earlier newspaper reports stated that they had this guy and he was in custody. So did they lose him? Hard to read article you cited.

Most likely the "candy man", or he may just have been a decent guy helping a couple of plastered girls back to their rooms. I can't read the Thai also. Did he help them back, visit them, stay around -Thai Papers tomorrow will have the story.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Hellhound66

[mommysboy]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

Well he did on other thread and he implied that they got drunk, took ibu and that set chain of events in motion.

Normal healthy 20 something year old girls don't just drop dead from partying. Especially both of them at the same time. There had to be some sort of toxin involved. Food poisoning is what Thai authorities say and I would buy that way before purely alcohol and drug related rant from the hound of hell.

The above also negates that we have reports of bleeding mucus membranes, blood under eyes and lesions of strange skin spotting. Again, toxins of some type.

It has to be toxins, the thought that it could be due to a heavy night on the booze and a few painkillers is as much nonsense as it is suggest an offending prawn, given the extreme symptoms the like of which were plain horrendous.

The word 'murder' hasn't cropped up much on this thread so far. can't think why given similar suspicious deaths.

Maybe the thought of it spoils the party, wouldn't want that now would we? especially over such a minor event.

Personally, you can blow the god forsaken island out the sea for all I freakin care, hell hole!

[Hellhound66]

The hound from hell said no such thing I believe he said this is drug/binge/alcohol related.

Well there are almost 400 crackpot theories on this website and the simplest one, that they went out on the binge and died as a result is now taking shape. Thai media are reporting that multiple drugs were found in the girls bodies. You know the Thais they can't keep anything secret. So I know you all will still be spouting the "usual" until the Canadians have done an independent autopsy but as the hound said this one is going to be drug/alcohol misadventure. There is also footage of a guy (Thais are saying Portuguese) who apparently helped them get back to their hotel. Another twist.

Or it could be utter bol**cks. You figure it out.

Well he did on other thread and he implied that they got drunk, took ibu and that set chain of events in motion.

Normal healthy 20 something year old girls don't just drop dead from partying. Especially both of them at the same time. There had to be some sort of toxin involved. Food poisoning is what Thai authorities say and I would buy that way before purely alcohol and drug related rant from the hound of hell.

The above also negates that we have reports of bleeding mucus membranes, blood under eyes and lesions of strange skin spotting. Again, toxins of some type.

I believe I said multiple buckets and popped a few pills prior to the ibu. Anyway it's all speculation. I still say this girl Samantha Kay is an important person and I am not surprised she is trying to leave the island as quick as possible.

No doubt. I would get the hell out of dodge. They will be looking for a fall guy or girl if toxicology reports are not as they had hoped.

Or indeed if the toxicology reports indicate illicit drugs they will be looking for the supplier.

[Thaddeus]

Dear Hellhound, don't click 'like this' on the post I made a few minutes ago because it may fit with your agenda, as I think most of the stuff you have written is a pile of tosh.

[Thaddeus]

Campylobacter infections usually resolve after about a week, although treatment with antibiotics can shorten the course of the illness. Patients with Campylobacter poisoning should drink lots of fluids to stay hydrated as long as the diarrhea lasts. Antidiarrheal medication may also help lessen symptoms.

The amount of foodborne bacteria resistant to antibiotics is on the rise, so certain antibiotics may prove ineffective at treating a given type of Campylobacter. Finding an effective antibiotic is key to treating this bacterial infection.

I have really resisted from making any comments on this topic about my personal experience, as I thought that it would be disrespectful to the family of the girls.

I have suffered from a dose of campylobacter, for me it was incredibly painful, it was like being a sausage forced through a mangle and my entire body was trying to leave by the nearest orifice.

However, even after three days or being practically chained to the bathroom, I was still able enough to call for help.

That was severe food poisoning ..... this case isn't.

I am inclined to agree with you whole heartedly. I still think a toxin is involved. Perhaps blowfish, arsenic, bad mushrooms or what ever. Doubtful food posioning would take out both simultaneously and that quickly.

I agree, a toxin is involved and I doubt that it was self administered, when the autopsy results come through they may tell us which toxin it was, the only question remaining then is, was it intentional or accidental.

Either one, Thailand has a lot to answer for.

[Hellhound66]

Dear Hellhound, don't click 'like this' on the post I made a few minutes ago because it may fit with your agenda, as I think most of the stuff you have written is a pile of tosh.

Thought that was the whole point of clicking "like". If you don't like what I post then I suggest you refrain from making comments which fit in with exactly what i have been saying. Anyway time will tell. If I am wrong I will pony up unlike you miserable sobs who just conveniently forget and move on to the next conspiracy.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Hellhound66

[ttelise]

Dear Hellhound, don't click 'like this' on the post I made a few minutes ago because it may fit with your agenda, as I think most of the stuff you have written is a pile of tosh.

Thought that was the whole point of clicking "like". If you don't like what I post then I suggest you refrain from making comments which fit in with exactly what i have been saying. Anyway time will tell. If I am wrong I will pony up unlike you miserable sobs who just conveniently forget and move on to the next conspiracy.

Haha, I can totally admit when I am wrong. Unfortunately, there is no good outcome in this except if in some manner or some way there is way to keep this from happening to somebody elses children. I would love for my daughters to be able to go to Thailand for a summer while in college and see the world.

[Hellhound66]

Dear Hellhound, don't click 'like this' on the post I made a few minutes ago because it may fit with your agenda, as I think most of the stuff you have written is a pile of tosh.

Thought that was the whole point of clicking "like". If you don't like what I post then I suggest you refrain from making comments which fit in with exactly what i have been saying. Anyway time will tell. If I am wrong I will pony up unlike you miserable sobs who just conveniently forget and move on to the next conspiracy.

Haha, I can totally admit when I am wrong. Unfortunately, there is no good outcome in this except if in some manner or some way there is way to keep this from happening to somebody elses children. I would love for my daughters to be able to go to Thailand for a summer while in college and see the world.

With this I agree -the bigger picture of what is going on in Thailand at the moment is very scary. I have had nieces and nephews out making exactly the same trips as I am sure many of you have. Whatever the outcome, the island backpacking scene and general tourism is fast becoming more deadly than it has ever been. And i apologise if you don't like my posts either

[Thaddeus]

Dear Hellhound, don't click 'like this' on the post I made a few minutes ago because it may fit with your agenda, as I think most of the stuff you have written is a pile of tosh.

Thought that was the whole point of clicking "like". If you don't like what I post then I suggest you refrain from making comments which fit in with exactly what i have been saying. Anyway time will tell. If I am wrong I will pony up unlike you miserable sobs who just conveniently forget and move on to the next conspiracy.

Haha, I can totally admit when I am wrong. Unfortunately, there is no good outcome in this except if in some manner or some way there is way to keep this from happening to somebody elses children. I would love for my daughters to be able to go to Thailand for a summer while in college and see the world.

With this I agree -the bigger picture of what is going on in Thailand at the moment is very scary. I have had nieces and nephews out making exactly the same trips as I am sure many of you have. Whatever the outcome, the island backpacking scene and general tourism is fast becoming more deadly than it has ever been. And i apologise if you don't like my posts either

On that, I whole heartedly agree with you.

[Hellhound66]

From the Courier in Fife

Sami Kay (24) also fell ill and spent three days in hospital. However, when she was discharged her travel insurance company refused to pay for her treatment and hospital staff retained her passport.

She has now been told she will not get it back until she pays the £400-plus bill.

Audrey and Noemi Belanger were found on Friday by a maid at at the Phi Phi Palms Hotel on the paradise island, three days after they were last seen while on a night out.

Officials said the sisters were covered in vomit, had skin lesions and were bleeding from their gums. Both women's fingernails and toenails were blue and had blood under them.

It has been said by police that the girls did not die from foul play, however the exact cause of death has not been determined.

The bodies are to be transported to a hospital in Bangkok so post mortems can be carried out.

Speaking from the resort of Phi Phi Island, where the girls died, Sami told The Courier: ''I was just crying the whole day when I heard, it was just heartbreaking. They were lovely and I was just talking with them and dancing with them last week.''

Sami heard the devastating news when she was released from Phi Phi Island Hospital at the weekend.

''I was really ill. Food poisoning has been spoken about but it was dehydration as well. It could have been bacteria or a virus or something. The hospital is full of people with the same thing — it's shocking.

''The hospital kept my passport because the insurance company wouldn't pay up front for my treatment. They've still got it and I can't leave here until my dad pays the £400.

''I'm sure I'll get it back from the insurance, but what if I didn't have my dad? I'd be stuck here and I really just want to get to Australia now. I can't wait to get out of here.''

Sami says she met Audrey (20) and Noemi (26), of Pohenegamook, Quebec, as she was promoting restaurants, bars and a pleasure boat.

''My job is going out and speaking to people and handing them leaflets, taking them into bars and restaurants and chatting to them," she said. ''The girls were lovely. I chatted to them and we ended up dancing at the club."

''One of my friends walked one of them home and he was arrested but they know it wasn't anything to do with him.

''I don't know what's happened, they're saying they were poisoned. There's lots of rumours flying around. Some people said it might have been a gas leak at the hotel, other people said it could have been fumes from cleaning fluid they use in the flats.

''But you can buy all sorts of stuff here and some people say it could have been something they bought on the beach. You have to be really careful about what you buy and where you buy it from.''

Sami's dad Dudley said: ''She thought it was a good medical and travel insurance policy she has, but apparently there is something in the small print. I don't know what it is. But she paid about £200 for a year's insurance.

''I phoned the British Embassy and they say that we will probably have to pay the bill first then claim it back from the insurance company. But they said that the passport actually belongs to the British Government and they had no right to confiscate it. It's a long process and in the meantime Sami is scared now because of the deaths.''

Reports said the Thai authorities confirmed nothing had been taken from the Belanger girls' room and the door had been locked from the inside.

''The police have determined that they had been dead for at least 24 hours,'' Lieutenant Colonel Jongrak Pimthong said. ''All they found was a lot of vomit in the room.''

That, as well as traces of blood on the faces of the two women, is a sign that they may have died as a reaction to poisoning, he added.

''There was no sign of any violence or of any theft, but we did find a lot of medication out in the room, including ibuprofen, which can cause serious stomach distress.''

Three years ago on the same resort island two women, an American and a Norwegian, were found poisoned in their adjoining rooms. The deaths are still unsolved.

The Courier - Dundee woman stranded in Thai resort at centre of probe into Canadian sisters' deaths

[Nisa]

I told you what happened to me and many others, and I didn't say they present themselves with dehydration.

Typically, the patient turns up complaining of prolonged vomiting, the runs, and headache with fever. The diagnosis will be made of gastro enteritis or acute gut infection, and the patient hooked up to the drip. The drip is commonly used out here to ward of dehydration which is actually the bigger danger than the infection itself, which as we know subsides within hours usually.

When the patient has recovered sufficiently to take in water, he is usually discharged with an antibiotic, and painkillers, and a few packets of ORS.

This is what happens.

Keep in mind it appears these girls appear to have made no attempt to get help or call a doctor. Yet there was bleeding, vomiting and what appears to be uncontrollable bowl movements. We can't believe everything we read as being completely factual or complete but if true, I can think of only a few plausible explanations for this given what we know ...

1) The illness and effects came on incredibly fast

2) They didn't call for help because they were afraid ... possibly because they took something illicit.

3) They thought they knew what was occurring and it would pass combined with them both not being people who generally seek medical help for an illness.

4) A combination of all 3

1 or 4 would seem the most plausible because even if 2 & 3 are true, one would care about the other enough to seek help for them once things got as bad as the image painted in the room. Incredibly fast would also explain why they appear to have both died or became incapacitated at the same time not being able to pick up the phone and call for help for the other.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Nisa

[Nisa]

Sami Kay (24) also fell ill and spent three days in hospital. She paid about £200 for a year's insurance.

''My job is going out and speaking to people and handing them leaflets, taking them into bars and restaurants and chatting to them,"

"I was just talking with them and dancing with them last week.''

''One of my friends walked one of them home and he was arrested but they know it wasn't anything to do with him."

"you can buy all sorts of stuff here and some people say it could have been something they bought on the beach. You have to be really careful about what you buy and where you buy it from."

"I really just want to get to Australia now. I can't wait to get out of here."

Sounds like a person of interest to me if these girls did ingest something deadly.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Nisa

[Tywais]

Another reminder of this forum rule. Post quoting the Bangkok Post & reply removed.

31) Bangkok Post do not allow quotes from their news articles or other material to appear on Thaivisa.com. Neither do they allow links to their publications. Posts from members containing quotes from or links to Bangkok Post publications will be deleted from the forum. Please note that this is a decision by the Bangkok Post, not by Thaivisa.com and any complaints or other issues concerning this rule should be directed to them. Quotes from and links to Phuketwan are also not allowed and will also be removed. In special cases forum Administrators or the news team may use these sources.

[LomSak27]

1) The illness and effects came on incredibly fast

2) They didn't call for help because they were afraid ... possibly because they took something illicit.

3) They thought they knew what was occurring and it would pass combined with them both not being people who generally seek medical help for an illness.

4) A combination of all 3

Excellent crackpot theory and one the Thai police seem to be gravitating towards, which unfortunatly lessons the credibility of your crackpot theory.

For those with short term memories; when the two girls died in Phi Phi three years back, the first theory tossed out by the Thai police was boozing and drugs. This was then followed by 4 or 5 other speculative theories with nothing, no evidence at all to back them up, which was disseminated to the press. At this time autopsies muffed, or bodies cremated what actually occurred was A Mystery, which it remains to this day

Good to see this game plan is being followed again in this time of crisis! Go Team

[dingdang]

sorry, i thought only other papers were not allowed...

according to the latest news in the bangkok post

- the relatives have arrived in thailand to collect the bodies ... (what is not true)

- the thai FM also stated, that the relatives asked for tissue samples...

sounds, as if there is no (full) canadian autopsy?

no word in the bangkok news about a foreign autopsy to be performed...

Edited June 22, 2012 by dingdang

[dingdang]

a canadian source says today

A second autopsy will be performed on the bodies once they're returned to Canada.

and

A source in the Asian country says surveillance video at a hotel on Phi Phi island shows a man leading the women to a room. The source says the women appeared to be ill in the video.

Edited June 22, 2012 by dingdang

[maidu]

There should be interviews with other visitors to Phi Phi island. It's disturbing that 11 of 14 such poisoning cases were pretty young farang women in their 20's. It's indicative of a date-rape drug attempt gone bad.

Girls getting very sick (but not dying) is not headline news. Yet, there may be some instances of that having happened on Phi Phi, which may shed light on this. They should be interviewed. Young women, who are ordinarily in full health, shouldn't be dying hours after strolling to their gh's after an evening meal and/or drink. There could also be a sting operation. However, Thai authorities are completely inept at staging stings. Also; there needs to be investigations of suspicious men in that area - men who fit the description of possibly preying on pretty young farang chicks, using date-rape or other such chemicals.