Phi Phi Poisonings: Autopsy Results On Canadian Sisters ‘Inconclusive’

[Yunla]

My problem with the 'they are doing this to protect tourism' is that I am a tourist, and I would be happy to visit Phi Phi if the authorities had issued a firm statement saying they suspect poisoning of the people who died a few years ago, and poisoning of the two Canadian girls this year, the offficial statement is they died of poisoning and that police are investigating if it was accident or a possible serial poisoner. I would be happy to visit that place as a tourist, just taking precautions to eat packaged food etc.

I would never visit a place where officials are trying to cover-up serial poisonings, because to me that is far more sinister location than than just one lone killer poisoning drinks or food. So to do as the officials have done, blame food poisoning and drug OD, both of which blame the victims to one extent or another, blame foreign mystery men, get the time wrong by 12 to 48 hours, etc.etc. then fail to locate a poison in autopsy, is far more sinister to me as a tourist than if they had just said (a few years ago and this year too) 'we suspect poisoning and we are investigating if it was deliberate'. That would reassure me as a tourist, far more than all this shady circumnavigating the issue.

Edited June 29, 2012 by Yunla

[Briggsy]

Tourists will keep coming to Phi Phi anyone who thinks differently is in dream land. Shame about the deaths but life goes on and this ultimately will end up as forum fodder when next unexplained death occurs.

Yep, meaningless forum fodder, unless of course it is your daughters that turn up dead.

I can't think of anything less helpful to the parents than reading the posts here ... not one thing I recall having read on this thread that would be the least bit helpful or comforting to them, including my posts.

I have to say your insinuation of suicide is the worst thing I have read on this thread.

[apetley]

The results are inconclusive because the Thai's want them to be inconclusive. After all the tourism industry might suffer if the cause was found to be local incompetence or worse. Shocker!!!!

The bodies were embalmed in an attempt to prevent the true cause of death being known although tissue and hair samples may prove otherwise. Were the Canadians prevented from taking samples prior to embalming? If so, why?

The Portuguese guy is just a red herring. He is not Thai, enough said.

The cops here have no interest in the matter because there is no money in it for them. I say this because I know personally that the cops in Phuket have no interest in investigating anything in which they cannot make money.

Now all please bow down and make merit to the almighty God of money

Edit: my typing

Is it written anywhere that the bodies were embalmed? You can't do this without the expressed permission of the family, the deceased belong to the family and not the Thai authorities. You require permission to do anything (apart from a coronial autopsy) because of cultural and religous rites and as the family have requested an autopsy by canadian specialists I doubt very very much if they would have agreed to embalming.

I can't recall reading about embalming although I stand to be corrected. Maybe something lost in translation?

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

[Nigel1500]

“I want to explain to the public that we have already done our best at every step of the investigation, but we still have yet to determine the cause of the death,” he said.

Maj Gen Boontawee said that police realized that, “the Portuguese friend of the two sisters who stayed at the same hotel and carried them into their room is a significant witness who might have information that could reveal what caused their deaths.”

However, he added, “By the time police reviewed the CCTV footage on June 16, it was too late to track down the man. He left the country on June 17 because his visa had expired.”

Maj Gen Boontawee did not elaborate on what further steps police had taken in order to contact the man.

I think your killer is in there somewhere ....

[kkup]

I'm not down with all the codes can someone pls tell the stupid user what BIB means?

[geriatrickid]

As a reminder to those that want to speculate about the character of these two university students. Take a look at the picture and ask yourself if these are the faces of two suicidal or drug crazed women. Or, more likely, they were two happy well adjusted people that were victims of either intentional or unintentional poisoning. Those could have been anybody's kids and based upon all reports to date, they were exemplary people.

[geriatrickid]

I'm not down with all the codes can someone pls tell the stupid user what BIB means?

Boys in Brown. Thai police have brown uniforms.

[EyesWideOpen]

I agree with GK. By all accounts these were wonderful young women. For the Thai police to throw out weird intimations of drug use is a true insult....

Edited June 29, 2012 by EyesWideOpen

[sunshine51]

Again my condolences to the family of the girls. What a mess this has become.

Personally I suspect poisoning; either by ingestion or contact but I'm not a

forensic expert. It's easy to watch television programmes like CSI Wherever

and deduce that in one hour a case is closed cause the lab has found

undeniable proof that the victim died because of so and so. In real life lab

tests can take ages...or at least a seemingly hell of a long time and that's a

lab with all the modern kit in it to do the testing. I have never been in a forensic

lab here in Thailand however I can deduce from economic reports this ain't

Vegas, Miami or New York. Or Toronto, Montreal or for that matter anywhere

but Thailand.

Inconclusive isn't a nice call however maybe that's the best that was accomplished

in Bangkok. And no...I'm not sticking up for anybody...I'm just taking what's

been given in the media and drawing my own conclusion. I'm sure there's more

to the case than what we've been tgold or led to believe that's why I'm hopeful

that the Canadians will be able to do a better job...simply because perhaps they

have better equipment.

There's still time to find the COD but sadly not enough time for the family to get

on with their life. It's all out of our hands...we can only speculate...lets leave the

forensics to the Canadian experts in their lab.

By the way...here's a couple interesting links that may apply to poisonings if

anybody is interested...

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2707/whats-the-fastest-acting-most-lethal-poison

http://webecoist.momtastic.com/2008/09/16/16-most-unassuming-yet-lethal-killer-plants/

If one bothers to leave the barstool and go for a walk in the bush once in a while or

go and check out a hardware store and read some labels on cans & bottles

one will find the things listed on these pages...especially in the plant poisons...ok...

maybe not all of them...but quite a lot of em.

ss51

[sunshine51]

I'm not down with all the codes can someone pls tell the stupid user what BIB means?

Boffins In Boots

[pauljones]

Early on, I read the family requested the Police Hospital not examine the bodies.

There was a request to send them to another hospital.

[jomtienbob]

Wow... That pretty much ends my plan to visit that part of Thailand.

What a mess. What a pointless and senseless end of life.

I cannot imagine what the family is going threw.

Really is Amazing Thailand. Amazingly corrupt.

Try not to confuse blinding incompetence and 'couldn't give a clap' attitudes with corruption. Corruption takes some intelligence, effort and planning. There is no sign of anything nearing that in this case yet. The parents of the 2 girls are already accusing the police of cover-ups but it's no doubt just covering up their incompetence I would guess.

[jayjayjayjay]

This is getting very scary.... is there a new Charles Sobhraj among the Asian tourist set. Where, who, why......very scary. The backpacking set a very open and friendly group of people.

This needs to be an international effort to determine what is really going on here. The first component required is the the Thai authorities to acknowledge their inability to deal with this alone and make it a pan-Asia investigation with western forensic brought in to deal at the highest level.

[ttelise]

Predictable, Not one top person in charge ???, sending samples to a host of departments and await results. Were they initially just wanting to know if it was drugs ?? now they said inconclusive. Looking elswhere ?? Just doesn't sound thorough enough, time wasted again maybe this is natural to find out if anyone is treading on someones toes ?? sorry but this is not the first time it's happened.

Just supposing the girls were poisoned,maybe I'm missing something here, but what motive can anyone have for poisoning them? Did they upset someone? Did they know something that could get someone into trouble? Or, could it have been accidental? If this happens again, or should I say when, the Thai authorities should get someone from the victims country to carry out a post mortem, and quickly. If they have nothing to hide, then they should not object.

Rohypnol

I am not saying this was used here but it gives a motive for someone to poison someone, I know technically it is drugging someone but if someone administers a bad batch then it is in effect poison.

Rophynol is just a benzo. Not cause anything like symptoms described. If ODed, they would gave just fallen asleep and never woke up. No blood, no puke everywhere, no lesions, and no akimbo.

GHB, <deleted>. I used to buy that at the health food store before Timothy Leary told congress LSD should be legal if they can see GHB at health food stores. Everything about GHB is media hype. Stuff will cause a wicked headache if you take too much though.

[sunshine51]

This is getting very scary.... is there a new Charles Sobhraj among the Asian tourist set. Where, who, why......very scary. The backpacking set a very open and friendly group of people.

This needs to be an international effort to determine what is really going on here. The first component required is the the Thai authorities to acknowledge their inability to deal with this alone and make it a pan-Asia investigation with western forensic brought in to deal at the highest level.

This sounds like about the best answer to the problem so far. However....how does one

get the "first component" accomplished? That's the real problem with the implementation

of a good plan of attack.

[ttelise]

As a reminder to those that want to speculate about the character of these two university students. Take a look at the picture and ask yourself if these are the faces of two suicidal or drug crazed women. Or, more likely, they were two happy well adjusted people that were victims of either intentional or unintentional poisoning. Those could have been anybody's kids and based upon all reports to date, they were exemplary people.

Exactly my sentiment.

[sirchai]

When I renewed my work permit, I had to make a drug and syphilis test and some other nonsense.

They tested me only if I'd taken "speed" because so many Thais are using this here......

I could have been hooked up to heroine, crack or even Krokodile and still being super healthy.

Sorry, for being just a little off topic, but that shows how 'good' they are in what they do. Full stop.

Edited June 29, 2012 by sirchai

[boooker]

If 2 adults deaths caused at the same place and time ,and surely from the same cause,an idiot would know this is not self handed.

Here we conclude the inconclusive and leave it the way it is ,until nobody has interest in the same .

However,just from the perspective that not knowing the cause of death is enough to dig deeper to find it,as it appears that the next person is already schedule for the same incident

[ttelise]

This is getting very scary.... is there a new Charles Sobhraj among the Asian tourist set. Where, who, why......very scary. The backpacking set a very open and friendly group of people.

This needs to be an international effort to determine what is really going on here. The first component required is the the Thai authorities to acknowledge their inability to deal with this alone and make it a pan-Asia investigation with western forensic brought in to deal at the highest level.

I agree this is best explanation

[Soutpeel]

For the Thai police to throw out weird intimations of drug use is a true insult....

Not just the Thai police...what about some of the posts made on TV on this subject....the BiB are just idiots and dont know any better, but TV posters who should know better and understand the hurt they may be causing the family if they were reading some of the trash posted on TV

[ttelise]

That picture is difficult to look at. They look like such sweet young girls.

Edited June 29, 2012 by ttelise

[evadgib]

This is getting very scary.... is there a new Charles Sobhraj among the Asian tourist set. Where, who, why......very scary. The backpacking set a very open and friendly group of people.

This needs to be an international effort to determine what is really going on here. The first component required is the the Thai authorities to acknowledge their inability to deal with this alone and make it a pan-Asia investigation with western forensic brought in to deal at the highest level.

FACE would prevent this from ever happening.

[Skywalker69]

This is getting very scary.... is there a new Charles Sobhraj among the Asian tourist set. Where, who, why......very scary. The backpacking set a very open and friendly group of people.

This needs to be an international effort to determine what is really going on here. The first component required is the the Thai authorities to acknowledge their inability to deal with this alone and make it a pan-Asia investigation with western forensic brought in to deal at the highest level.

I agree this is best explanation

+1

[Soutpeel]

You don't know anything about the character of these girls - ask yourself if your opinion is any more valid that anyone else's and then spare us the pomposity - go and rag on some blokes who've married bar girls

You are asking them to rag on themselves ?

[theajarn]

"What the foreign media have said about Thai Police ignoring the case, trying to hide the news and allowing an important witness to leave the country is not true."

I'm glad they read ThaiVisa.

[EyesWideOpen]

This is getting very scary.... is there a new Charles Sobhraj among the Asian tourist set. Where, who, why......very scary. The backpacking set a very open and friendly group of people.

This needs to be an international effort to determine what is really going on here. The first component required is the the Thai authorities to acknowledge their inability to deal with this alone and make it a pan-Asia investigation with western forensic brought in to deal at the highest level.

I agree this is best explanation

+1

Wow this guy was a BAD boy !!! Hmmm he seemed to like to poison people and moved in the backpacker set...... Here is my favorite part from the Wikipedia article about him. Guess the Thai police have not changed over the years .....

Sobhraj then went to Calcutta, where he murdered Israeli scholar Avoni Jacob for his passport, and used it to move to Singapore with Leclerc and Chowdhury, then to India and - rather boldly - back to Bangkok in March 1976. There they were interrogated by Thai policemen in connection with the murders, but easily let off the hook because authorities feared that the negative publicity accompanying a murder trial would harm the country's tourist trade.

Edited June 29, 2012 by EyesWideOpen

[theajarn]

As a reminder to those that want to speculate about the character of these two university students. Take a look at the picture and ask yourself if these are the faces of two suicidal or drug crazed women. Or, more likely, they were two happy well adjusted people that were victims of either intentional or unintentional poisoning. Those could have been anybody's kids and based upon all reports to date, they were exemplary people.

What a bullshit post!

What do suicidal drug crazed women look like then?. Advice on judging people by their photos from the man who publically denigrates bar girls.

Surely we've reached an age where we don't need people like you lecturing us about the character of girls from a photo.

For what it's worth I don't think they were suicidal or heavy drug users but I certainly can't stop free speech and people speculating for themselves.

Judging their character from a photo is no better than hat the police have announced with their judgements

You don't know anything about the character of these girls - ask yourself if your opinion is any more valid that anyone else's and then spare us the pomposity - go and rag on some blokes who've married bar girls

Not to forget the statement of the girls' father who had mentioned that they kept in touch all the time... try to look up that statement (there's more too it, it's heart-wrenching) and you'll see that these girls have character better than most.

[coma]

If that is your best than you are a pathetic excuse for a police force. Pathetic.

[Yunla]

Out of respect for the family and friends of the girls we should think what we write on TV.

Yes I agree with you 100% but also I feel that in the case of my own kids, if this happened to them, and there was the possibility of intentional poisoning, I would want this possibility not ruled out, announced publicly as warning, and more importantly I would want the guilty person/s brought to justice ASAP, and at the very least to see the police investigating all these possibilities. It would also prevent future parents from losing more children to the same poisons be those accidentally or intentionaly administered. I think the authorities could have avoided all this internet rumour (on many other sites not just TVF) if they hadn't announced on day one it was probably food poisoning and then added maybe drugs, booze and hallucinogenic mushrooms. The internet is the response to the official 'story' and it is the authorities who have caused speculation by their heavyhanded and suspicious behaviour during this tragedy.

Edited June 29, 2012 by Yunla

[ginjag]

Drugs drugs, all they think about is drugs ( rightly so) but in this case more likely it would be a.n.other cause. Chiang Mai-example. if Canada comes up with other evidence, will the owner demolish this place ??? Why didn't the police send or a top forensic-all swabs etc to all forensic departments before any clean ups or embalming, gaps appear again in the first days of the incident--NO GAPS should occur, and the police have the whole place seeled of from hour 1.