De Facto Partner Visa - Aus

[eek]

Looking for some advice regarding the De Facto partner visa. Concerned about the De Facto criteria.

My partner (Australian), and I (British), have evidence of our relationship spanning nearly 2 years.

This in the form of Email, Skype, msn (when he was working away), phone messages, photos, facebook stuff etc.

As we both are pretty independent, and didnt want to be in each others pockets, we kept our own small studio apartments (in close proximity of each other).

About 5 months ago i moved into his place, but only because it made sense financially, as he was going back to Aus for work.

His name is on the lease and bills, but i have paid them via my bank account, and i have mail which has come here etc.

He came to visit for a couple of weeks recently, and will return again in December to stay for 3 months (and if all going well visa-wise, i may join him at that time in Australia). I may go to visit him in October, but depends on our finances (at present we are trying to build up funds for the future. He lost all his savings in the stock market a while ago, and i have some SMALLLLL savings, so nothing great!).

Does this sound like enough evidence to satisfy the De Facto criteria, or, will the fact that we havent lived together be an issue?

He has suggested marriage, as we are planning a long-term future together anyway, but to be honest i prefer the concept of getting married when and IF we want to, not for the stipulation of a visa! !!

ANy thoughts/advice?

Thanks so much!!

Edited July 19, 2012 by eek

[simple1]

The Australian government does grant visa for partners; all the info about this and any other options are at:

http://www.immi.gov.au/migrants/family/family-visas-partner.htm

Understand your observation about not wanting to marry for the sake of a visa, but as I said the pros/cons of the visa's available are detailed on the website. Visa applications for your circumstances are transparent and straightforward. In case it's in the back of your mind, there is absolutely no need to engage the services of a visa "consultant".

[eek]

Thanks SImple, i had printed out the pdf booklet already, but was just unsure if we meet the de facto criteria. I suspect not, and if we want to go down the de facto route, will need to wait a further 5-6 months or so. The fact that the visa itself can take many many months to process, means that route will take a long time.

Im in no major rush to be in Australia or anything, it just would be nice to have the option to be together there, rather than being apart when he works away, so its just frustrating. ..also frustrating when you add in the fact that the visa is so costly!!

[simple1]

For de facto partner criteria I assume you have reviewed the content at:

http://www.immi.gov....ity-defacto.htm

In my experience with dealing with Australian Immigration (for Thai GF & later her son). I found them willing to listen to cirumstances outside of the norm so long as one is polite and to the point (I'm sure you and your man would be). If you want to put in the effort I would recommend your man in Oz making an appointment with Immigration and walk them though your situation. If the two of you then decide to go ahead with an application, reference the meeting in the documentation. The personal contact always assists. Once the visa is approved you can then can plan your re-location date - can't remember the timeline for utilisation of the visa.

At least with the appropriate visa it's a one time cost, don't have to report every 90 days, re-apply every year and so on. As you will know after 2 years in Oz you can then obtain permanent residency. If life in Oz all goes to the good you can, if you want, obtain Citizenship whilst also retaining UK citizenship (there is a minimal fee) that again is an easy & transparent process. so no; it's not expensive

Edited July 19, 2012 by simple1

[edwinclapham]

The very fact that you have not lived together Eek is of no importance when applying for a defacto 309 visa.

The proof required is that you have had an ongoing relationship for over 12 months and over.

See.. http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/booklets/1127.pdf Page 35.

I cannot remember which state your b/f is a resident, I thought it was Queensland, in which case when you are over you can both register your relationship .. http://www.justice.q...edrelationships.

You can add to your "proof of relationship" by a joint Will for example.

You can be the beneficiary of his Super.

Joint bank accounts /Joint car insurance/ etc etc.

The very fact that your/bf's funds are low shouldnt be a prime requisite for a visa.. Your B/f is your sponsor, therefore he has to show that he is able to support you for 2 years and that you will not be a burden on the government during that period. Your bf is working so proof of income on his part will be required.

We also (Pom & Australian citizen at that time) gave the following.

Bank statements which gave evidence of a joint life together even though we were living apart)

Wills

Car insurances

Bank statements

Details on accomodation

Joint invitations

A small selection of photographs together

Phone bills showing contact had been maintained

Membership of clubs we had joined together

Statements from friends & family

Proof of holidays together.

There is no compulsion to marry at all on this application for a subclass 309. After 2 years you automatically will be given a PR on evidence that your relationship is on going and bone fide along with a satisfactory Federal Police Check from Australia.

One thing I would say is that on a subclass 309, although you are issued with full working rights, many people have come across difficulties in obtaining work because the visa is classed as a temporary 309. Despite the fact that your intention is to remain permanently in a relationship, many employers just do not understand that temporary will then lead into PR.

If you wait that extra year (3 yrs) with sufficient evidence you should be granted PR directly.

Certainly applying for your visa off shore is cheaper than on shore Eek.

You will have to take into account your DIAC panel doctor for medicals and x rays.. in your case I would imagine it will be ...

Chiangmai

Medical and Radiology Clinic

Chiangmai Ram Hospital

8 Boonruangrit Road

A. Muang

Chiangmai 50200

Telephone: </span> </span> </span>+66 53 920 300</span></span> </span></span> </span>

Fax: +66 53 224 880

Doctor(s):

Dr Kitti Ratdilokpanich

Dr Dolrithai Rabin

You are then required to submit police checks for any country you have resided in for a year or more in the last 10 years. British police checks dont come cheap! Luckily for you Thai PC's are FOC .

Just my thoughts.

Eddie

Edited July 19, 2012 by edwinclapham

[edwinclapham]

Eek... I forgot to add, my wife added me to her Medibank Private even though I was living ourseas at the time.. all good evidence where applicable.

Also you are more than likely aware of Scoot.. http://book.flyscoot.com/Select.aspx which fly BKK /Gold Coast... typing in random dates in October, came up with a figure of (Total Package Price)

THB 20,478

621.037 AUD return

Maybe some members can recommend to you some decent fares also ex ChiangMai - Gold Coast also.

Edited July 19, 2012 by edwinclapham

[David48]

eek, thanks for starting this because, sometime in the future, I will also walk down this road.

So I am learning from reading the replies above.

In reverse order from above ...

Scoot Airlines is the budget carrier of Singapore Airlines and fly into both Sydney and the Gold Coast.

Currently, even though there are ex-Bangkok flights with Scoot into Australia, you have to change in Singapore and the flights don't match up.

So, my lassie flies here in 10 days time taking Air Asia from BKK to SIN the Scoot onto Australia.

The return link From Australia into Bangkok is smooth with a few (maybe 3 or 4) hour stop-over in Singapore.

Air Asia also fly into the Gold Coast (Coolangatta or OOL) and Sydney and offer good specials.

Thai fly into Brisbane Airport.

Oddly, all flights into Australia, with the above three are overnighters.

[David48]

Quite unusual is the practise of not physicially issueing a Visa stamp, so the current method of Australian Visas are electronic and not normally visable in your Passport. Here.

The Visa you speak about is not cheap at about $2,000. Here.

For you and others ...

What does the visa let me do?

The table below gives a summary of what you can do in Australia if you have a temporary or permanent Partner visa.

Partner temporary visa (subclass 309)

• you are permitted to enter or remain in Australia with your partner, until a decision is made regarding your permanent visa
  
• you are entitled to work in Australia
  
• you are entitled to study in Australia, but you will not have access to government funding for tertiary study
  
• you may enrol in Australia's medical benefits expenses and hospital care scheme, Medicare.
  

Lastly, the link to Medicare is here.

Medicare is Australia's publicly funded universal health care system, operated by the government authority Medicare Australia.

Residents with a Medicare card can receive subsidised treatment from medical practitioners who have been issued a Medicare provider number, and fully subsidised ("free") treatment in public hospitals.

[edwinclapham]

Quite unusual is the practise of not physicially issueing a Visa stamp, so the current method of Australian Visas are electronic and not normally visable in your Passport. Here.

The Visa you speak about is not cheap at about $2,000. Here.

I had an electronic visa obviously, but there were a couple of instances at various SE Asian airports, this came into question which surprised me. Not a good feeling!

I then rapidly took a trip to DIAC and had a paper visa placed in my passport which proved far more convenient for various institutions... a very simple procedure.

Despite there being a telephone number for employers, etc to make contact with DIAC to establish the authenticity of the visa, it is amazing how few people like to make that one phone call!

Eek being a British citizen can enjoy free reciprocal medicare health care as a tourist in Australia.

On a sub class 309, she will receive as a resident a temporary medicare card, escalating to a permanent MHC on receiving her permanent visa.

Edited July 20, 2012 by edwinclapham

[Will27]

eek

There should not be any problems with future employers getting confused over your visa status.

This may have been a problem a while ago, but the majority of employers now use VEVO whereas

they input your passport and personal details online.

Employers will then be able to find out the work conditions of the visa online.

Regards

Will

[eek]

This is really great information guys, thank you.

My bf works in the mines, so for him, finding time is hard. But, he plans to visit his parents during his next time off in a couple of weeks from now, so will ask him to try arrange an appointment with immigration there and discuss our visa and concerns etc with them.

As an aside, friend suggested that the simplist option might be to arrive on a tourist visa (actually, she said a 6 month tourist, but i thought they were for 3 months. Confused....) and then apply. But, i recal reading somewhere that wasnt possible. Any thoughts on that?

Due to us both being such independent people, my bf and didnt even THINK to set up a joint account. We didnt enter the relationship on the basis of trying to prove it as legit to anyone...lol. We split rent by either handling in cash if he is here, or (at one point) payment via paypal. The bills are all in his name, but as he is not living here atm, i am paying (via my internet banking). The rent contract is in his name only also. De facto, or married, i would always want to keep my (our) independent element..although a joint account for paying bills or some savings etc, would make sense probably down the line. As much as people like to think of a relationship never going sour, i was stung in the past where i lost all my deposit money on a house i bought with my ex in the UK, because i didnt stipulate in the contract that the deposit was soley mine. So..as it was legally a 50/50 split, and i lost a lot. So that has also made me wary about the sharing thing!

Thanks again for the information.

Glad it might help you too David, and hopefully others.

[BookMan]

I wouldn't get hung up about the joint account if u haven't had one. If you have lots of other proof it should be okay. My sister's ex got a residency visa (Uk/HK citizenship), and also 2 friends partners (Dutch and Korean) have got them. I highly doubt any of those had joint accounts. I know I never have, even when married. Sounds like you have lots of proof of other payments and your relationship together anyway.

You should love downunder. Australia is a beautiful country, diverse in landscape and culture. Plus it has many handsome men.

[edwinclapham]

This is really great information guys, thank you.

My bf works in the mines, so for him, finding time is hard. But, he plans to visit his parents during his next time off in a couple of weeks from now, so will ask him to try arrange an appointment with immigration there and discuss our visa and concerns etc with them.

As an aside, friend suggested that the simplist option might be to arrive on a tourist visa (actually, she said a 6 month tourist, but i thought they were for 3 months. Confused....) and then apply. But, i recal reading somewhere that wasnt possible. Any thoughts on that?

Due to us both being such independent people, my bf and didnt even THINK to set up a joint account. We didnt enter the relationship on the basis of trying to prove it as legit to anyone...lol. We split rent by either handling in cash if he is here, or (at one point) payment via paypal. The bills are all in his name, but as he is not living here atm, i am paying (via my internet banking). The rent contract is in his name only also. De facto, or married, i would always want to keep my (our) independent element..although a joint account for paying bills or some savings etc, would make sense probably down the line. As much as people like to think of a relationship never going sour, i was stung in the past where i lost all my deposit money on a house i bought with my ex in the UK, because i didnt stipulate in the contract that the deposit was soley mine. So..as it was legally a 50/50 split, and i lost a lot. So that has also made me wary about the sharing thing!

Thanks again for the information.

Glad it might help you too David, and hopefully others.

I too work in the mining field Eek, so appreciate the time and inconvenience factor involved.

If you are going to lodge on shore, additional expense is incurred. You would have to be "on shore" in this case to activate your visa.

I know you applied for a 3 month TV and I dont believe you had a "no further stay" clause issued on it. If this is the case you can then lodge your application whilst you are there and remain there subject to approval by your Case officer. Initially you can remain there for the duration of your tourist visa and then a bridging visa would kick in until your approved Grant has been issued. In certain cases DIAC can approve "full working rights" but in many cases they dont whilst you are on a bridging visa!

I have been in possession of a 6 & 12 months visas and had a "no further stay" was executed on it as I had planned to do exactly the same as you. Your existing visa should allow you to do this. Having said this, it is stipulated that a tourist visa is for that express purpose "tourism" ! Although many go down this route.

Whilst on a Bridging Visa and you require to leave the country, you would have to apply for a Bridging Visa B and give compelling reasons as to the reason why you are leaving Australia.

http://www.immi.gov....ms/pdf/1006.pdf...To seek permission to travel

If you do lodge in Thailand (off shore) for example, this does not restrict your movements, as long as you inform your Case officer as to your whereabouts, your visa grant can be activated from anywhere off shore through any international port in Australia. (Tasmania excepted lol)

Edited to add. I agree with Bookman, a joint account isnt necessary but we felt as a couple it showed a joint commitment etc etc.

You could always have a joint account for joint expenses if you choose to go down this route.

Bookman is quite correct, its one gorgeous country, and I am sure you will be very happy here. Its certainly the best thing I have ever done. Love the place!

Edited July 20, 2012 by edwinclapham

[simple1]

if possible avoid the Bridging Visa path, to much uncertainty. Better to be patient and apply offshore for the de facto visa

[edwinclapham]

if possible avoid the Bridging Visa path, to much uncertainty. Better to be patient and apply offshore for the de facto visa

Agreed, its a PITA

[David48]

As an aside, friend suggested that the simplist option might be to arrive on a tourist visa (actually, she said a 6 month tourist, but i thought they were for 3 months. Confused....) and then apply.

eek ... since I started writing this, 2 of the other guys have kindly posted so please read my thoughts with that in mind.

I'll kick it off and then let the more seasoned continue.

And I'll start with a qualifier ... more of our collective experience has been with Thai Lassies coming ... not one with a UK Passport however ...

It sort does smooth the process if you have travelled to Australia before, abided by the Visa conditions.

The most common path is an initial 3 month, single entry Visa.

The Lass comes, tours, goes home ... all within the 3 month period.

Then, the next application could be a single entry, 6 month Visa or, more likely applying for a multiple entry 12 month Visa.

But it doesn't allow you to stay continuously for 12 months. It allows 3 months at a time, then you leave Australia and return ... the Aussie version of a 'Visa Run'

The over-riding fact which you should be aware of is the 'no further stay provision'.

You can read more about that here.

I'll finish here because the other posters have given you more detailed information on more advanced issues.

If you are contemplating the Tourist Visa path ... have a read of this. It's a blow by blow of how to do the Tourist Visa ... but that's 'my knitting' ... after that, the other posters here would help you.

[simple1]

@eek just to put things in context I hold British & Australian citiizenship, so did go through the Oz citizenship process and enjoyed living in Australia, now retired in Thailand. As already posted Australia has some beautiful scenery, great beaches (in my opinion better than Thailand), world class restaurants and wine, if that's of interest to you.

Big decisions ahead, I wish you and BF a happy future

[edwinclapham]

and from me also Eek, I hope you are very happy here in Australia. Although I am a very proud Brit, I felt it a deep privilege when I became an Australian citizen.

Also we re not too far away from Asia which is always nice when you fancy a change

[Will27]

eek

Just to clarify, once your tourist visa ceases and you are granted a bridging visa A,

it will have the same conditions of your expired tourist visa which will mean "no work".

You will then have to apply for a variation of bridging visa conditions to get permission

to work. You can apply due to financial hardship but it isn't easy to get approved.

JYI

Regards

Will

Edited July 21, 2012 by Will27

[nightwatch]

Eek, my partner has a defacto partner visa lodged with immigration waiting for a decision at the moment,she is a Thai citizen.

Reading about your living arrangment's with each other, i am not sure how the department will look at that.

As a previous post said i would try and talk to someone with DIAC and explain your circumstances and try and find out if you still may be considered on other evidence of your relationship,

You said you were not in a major rush to be in Australia, but if you do not meet the criterior for the defacto visa it might be worth considering doing a visitors visa first this would add weight to a defacto visa in the future.

De facto partners (not married but in a de facto relationship)

To apply for a Partner visa as a de facto partner, you and your partner must show that you have been in a de facto relationship for the entire 12 months immediately prior to lodging your application.

To be eligible for a Partner visa as a de facto partner, you must:

• be sponsored by an eligible person (usually by your partner)
  
• not be related by family;
  
• together with your de facto partner, be aged at least 18 years at the time your application is made;
  
• show that you and your partner have a mutual commitment to a shared life to the exclusion of all others;
  
• show that you have a genuine and continuing relationship with your partner
  
• show that you and your partner have been in a de facto relationship for the entire 12 months immediately prior to lodging your application;
  
• show that you and your partner have been in a de facto relationship for the entire 12 months immediately prior to lodging your application;
  
• show that you and your partner are living together or, if not, that any separation is only temporary; and
  
• meet health and character requirements
  

In assessing a claimed de facto relationship, the department looks at evidence of things such as living together full-time, sharing important financial and social commitments, and setting up a household separately from other people (for acceptable types of evidence

[edwinclapham]

It is not a requirement to have lived together!

The requirement is to have a proven relationship for 12 months and more.

I was not living with my then partner/ now my wife at any stage due to the distance involved.

[nightwatch]

It is not a requirement to have lived together!

The requirement is to have a proven relationship for 12 months and more.

I was not living with my then partner/ now my wife at any stage due to the distance involved.

That is correct edwin,

There is reason,s that couples cannot be living together such as work commitments or visa regulations preventing travel or extended stays in your partners country,

In the statements she and her sponser(partner) will have to supply with the application they will have to give,details of dates and how long seperation occured and why .And also how they maintained there relationship whilst seperated. this could be in showing proof of constant contact through phone or e-mail;

[edwinclapham]

It is not a requirement to have lived together!

The requirement is to have a proven relationship for 12 months and more.

I was not living with my then partner/ now my wife at any stage due to the distance involved.

That is correct edwin,

There is reason,s that couples cannot be living together such as work commitments or visa regulations preventing travel or extended stays in your partners country,

In the statements she and her sponser(partner) will have to supply with the application they will have to give,details of dates and how long seperation occured and why .And also how they maintained there relationship whilst seperated. this could be in showing proof of constant contact through phone or e-mail;

Correct. Also DIAC fully respect "religious grounds" as to not living together as well.

[bra]

Adding to the responses so far (all good) I confirm that you do not have to live together prior to making the application. My son was living in Australia and his Italian partner in London because of work requirements and it all went OK. They did have a joint bank account, and my wife and I (both Australians) also provided a sworn statement confirming their long term relationship - this can help if you can get one either from family or someone of good standing. Being married does not help that much as you still have to go through a similar procedure (to stop marriages of convenience being accepted). My son and his partner are still not married and she has been in Australia for 11 years and has both Australian and Italian citizenship. Their 2 children can also get Italian citizenship and I think the same applies for the UK. This is a big help later on in visiting and working in Euro countries. I hope you are successful and enjoy your life in Australia if this is what you want.

[ozziebloke]

if possible avoid the Bridging Visa path, to much uncertainty. Better to be patient and apply offshore for the de facto visa

you can apply for the de facto visa in Thailand and still visit Aus via a TV while your application is being dealt with and stay here for up to 12 months via bridging visa's without any problems

cheers ron

[weegee]

The very fact that you have not lived together Eek is of no importance when applying for a defacto 309 visa.

The proof required is that you have had an ongoing relationship for over 12 months and over.

See.. http://www.immi.gov....oklets/1127.pdf Page 35.

I cannot remember which state your b/f is a resident, I thought it was Queensland, in which case when you are over you can both register your relationship .. http://www.justice.q...edrelationships.

You can add to your "proof of relationship" by a joint Will for example.

You can be the beneficiary of his Super.

Joint bank accounts /Joint car insurance/ etc etc.

The very fact that your/bf's funds are low shouldnt be a prime requisite for a visa.. Your B/f is your sponsor, therefore he has to show that he is able to support you for 2 years and that you will not be a burden on the government during that period. Your bf is working so proof of income on his part will be required.

We also (Pom & Australian citizen at that time) gave the following.

Bank statements which gave evidence of a joint life together even though we were living apart)

Wills

Car insurances

Bank statements

Details on accomodation

Joint invitations

A small selection of photographs together

Phone bills showing contact had been maintained

Membership of clubs we had joined together

Statements from friends & family

Proof of holidays together.

There is no compulsion to marry at all on this application for a subclass 309. After 2 years you automatically will be given a PR on evidence that your relationship is on going and bone fide along with a satisfactory Federal Police Check from Australia.

One thing I would say is that on a subclass 309, although you are issued with full working rights, many people have come across difficulties in obtaining work because the visa is classed as a temporary 309. Despite the fact that your intention is to remain permanently in a relationship, many employers just do not understand that temporary will then lead into PR.

If you wait that extra year (3 yrs) with sufficient evidence you should be granted PR directly.

Certainly applying for your visa off shore is cheaper than on shore Eek.

You will have to take into account your DIAC panel doctor for medicals and x rays.. in your case I would imagine it will be ...

Chiangmai

Medical and Radiology Clinic

Chiangmai Ram Hospital

8 Boonruangrit Road

A. Muang

Chiangmai 50200

Telephone: </span> </span> </span>+66 53 920 300</span></span> </span></span> </span>

Fax: +66 53 224 880

Doctor(s):

Dr Kitti Ratdilokpanich

Dr Dolrithai Rabin

You are then required to submit police checks for any country you have resided in for a year or more in the last 10 years. British police checks dont come cheap! Luckily for you Thai PC's are FOC .

Just my thoughts.

Eddie

ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!!!!!!

[Will27]

if possible avoid the Bridging Visa path, to much uncertainty. Better to be patient and apply offshore for the de facto visa

you can apply for the de facto visa in Thailand and still visit Aus via a TV while your application is being dealt with and stay here for up to 12 months via bridging visa's without any problems

cheers ron

Hi Ron

You've confused me a bit which isn't hard.

I take it you mean lodge the spouse application in Thailand

and visit Australia on a tourist visa?

I'm not sure how you think she will be granted a bridging visa though.

Assuming she has "no further stay" condition and a spouse application pending.

Regards

Will

[eek]

Just a quick comment about Scoot. VERY cheap prices, but looks to be an 11 hour or so wait at Singapore...at least for all the dates i looked at.

Has anyone flown with Scoot?

If so, and you had to wait, what did you decide to do about your wait at Sing?

Thank yoU!

[simple1]

Just a quick comment about Scoot. VERY cheap prices, but looks to be an 11 hour or so wait at Singapore...at least for all the dates i looked at.

Has anyone flown with Scoot?

If so, and you had to wait, what did you decide to do about your wait at Sing?

Thank yoU!

Why spend 11 hours in Singapore when you're on your way to see your man

[eek]

Just a quick comment about Scoot. VERY cheap prices, but looks to be an 11 hour or so wait at Singapore...at least for all the dates i looked at.

Has anyone flown with Scoot?

If so, and you had to wait, what did you decide to do about your wait at Sing?

Thank yoU!

Why spend 11 hours in Singapore when you're on your way to see your man

err..its not by choice..its a connecting flight. Thats why im asking about others who have had used Scoot. We are trying to work out if the saving is worth it...

Edit: but i dont actually get why you would ask this question..or in fact why im answering it...! Seemed to be oddly loaded. If i WANTED to stop off for 11 hours in Sing, why on earth not!

Edited July 25, 2012 by eek