Immigration At Riverside Owners Meeting Threatened To Jail Any Forang Owners Who Rent Out

[Rancid]

It might be illuminating to know what the issues are between owners and juristic.

Alas Riverside...

In the past the Juristic was a relative of the manager, was flown up first class from out of town and stayed in a 5 star hotel for meetings. Apparently that Juristic refused to allow needed building renovations already passed by an owners AGM to be funded because...

Another Manager was also the Jusistic and reportedly resigned after having some interesting bank accounts linked to another person of interest discovered, also claimed to have been blackmailied over a foreign spouse without a WP to make certain decisions favourable to...

An unpublicized Emergency AGM was held, that although without a quorum, illegally voted out the committee and replaced it with another more acceptable to... Afterwards room prices suddenly stopped rising.

It seems a certain commitee was planning to and another did repossess condos for non-payment of maintenance fees and buying them themselves them for peanuts at unpublicized auctions. Apparently the reception only steers walk-in customers to committee members with multiple units when many owners are in the pool.

It is said that the books have never been audited by an impartial 3rd party and if they had...

It is rumoured that a certain manager accumulated a huge amount of rooms, even buying some of the customers ones in their name as they couldn't read Thai...

Word has it that a former committee member with a large pool of rooms getting paid "committee bonuses for hard work" by an former manager finally got their spouse elected to a new committee to continue the good work.

These are just the well reported stories half the owners have no idea about, and now for the really juicy bits: [cut].

One might also ask if Riverside is reportedly like this what is my condo really like? OK, here is the story about the guy that bought on Canal Rd north of Huay Khow who wanted to know why...and then received a subtle death threat. Or how about the condo manager linked to a police relative near Loy Kroh that can't be evicted. Then there is the one about another near Loy Kroh where the Manager won't give the owner details but markets the propertry 3 times market value. Or how about...

Most of the above is 3rd party comment, no facts are personally known so if post unintentionally libelous please delete.

[hellodolly]

It might be illuminating to know what the issues are between owners and juristic.

Alas Riverside...

In the past the Juristic was a relative of the manager, was flown up first class from out of town and stayed in a 5 star hotel for meetings. Apparently that Juristic refused to allow needed building renovations already passed by an owners AGM to be funded because...

Another Manager was also the Jusistic and reportedly resigned after having some interesting bank accounts linked to another person of interest discovered, also claimed to have been blackmailied over a foreign spouse without a WP to make certain decisions favourable to...

An unpublicized Emergency AGM was held, that although without a quorum, illegally voted out the committee and replaced it with another more acceptable to... Afterwards room prices suddenly stopped rising.

It seems a certain commitee was planning to and another did repossess condos for non-payment of maintenance fees and buying them themselves them for peanuts at unpublicized auctions. Apparently the reception only steers walk-in customers to committee members with multiple units when many owners are in the pool.

It is said that the books have never been audited by an impartial 3rd party and if they had...

It is rumoured that a certain manager accumulated a huge amount of rooms, even buying some of the customers ones in their name as they couldn't read Thai...

Word has it that a former committee member with a large pool of rooms getting paid "committee bonuses for hard work" by an former manager finally got their spouse elected to a new committee to continue the good work.

These are just the well reported stories half the owners have no idea about, and now for the really juicy bits: [cut].

One might also ask if Riverside is reportedly like this what is my condo really like? OK, here is the story about the guy that bought on Canal Rd north of Huay Khow who wanted to know why...and then received a subtle death threat. Or how about the condo manager linked to a police relative near Loy Kroh that can't be evicted. Then there is the one about another near Loy Kroh where the Manager won't give the owner details but markets the propertry 3 times market value. Or how about...

Most of the above is 3rd party comment, no facts are personally known so if post unintentionally libelous please delete.

I wouldn't call the accusations libelous just normal TV fare.

Not often do we get positive news that is except the food threads.LOL

[NancyL]

The fact that the OP referred to the agreived parties as "forang" tells you he doesn't read Thai and doesn't think about non-farang parties who would also be affected. Surely, Japanese and Korean people own units in that building.

Why oh why would someone sign a contract involving large sums of money without understanding its meaning? I'm not saying everyone should learn to read Thai (although its not a bad idea), but rather they should recognize their shortcomings and hire a professional to explain a contract to them.

The average "thii rak" can't do that -- and that isn't a slam toward Thai women. Everytime we bought or sold property in the U.S. , our lawyer reviewed the contract before we signed and often, we'd ask our tax accountant for an opinion.

[letitbe]

The fact that the OP referred to the agreived parties as "forang" tells you he doesn't read Thai and doesn't think about non-farang parties who would also be affected. Surely, Japanese and Korean people own units in that building.

Why oh why would someone sign a contract involving large sums of money without understanding its meaning? I'm not saying everyone should learn to read Thai (although its not a bad idea), but rather they should recognize their shortcomings and hire a professional to explain a contract to them.

The average "thii rak" can't do that -- and that isn't a slam toward Thai women. Everytime we bought or sold property in the U.S. , our lawyer reviewed the contract before we signed and often, we'd ask our tax accountant for an opinion.

We are Siamese if you please and who on earth cares about non folang like Japanese and Taiwanese and all the rest. folang bring this sort of thing onto themselves by bringing their bigoted forang ways here and being stupid enough to believe that the same rules apply here as in their own country. Obviously most GF BF (to not be sexist) or Thai wives do not have a clue as for that matter nor do average western partner. The issue is not if its illegal which if your doing it with intention of renting out it clearly is unless you have a WP but the fact that no one or virtually no one obeys that law and no one or almost no one pays tax on their rentals. This is well known and like most illegal things in Thailand a blind eye is turned. The issue is this is first time I know off that an immigration officer was invited by the manager to speak at the meeting and to clearly point out what the law was and by inference stating it was well known that many folang in the block were breaking the law and subject to imprisonment. As stated nothing is likely to happen but this is the first time ive heard of it being openly threatened in the case of condos and renting out. Also the non Thai non folang will I believe in 2015 be able to legally buy property in Thailand. I don’t know if this applies to Japanese or who since it seems to depend on which countries are in the planned Asian common block. Thailand is one of those and I believe 13 other non folang countries. Not to confuse those not here and those who have Tii-raks who don’t talk to then Thais consider only non Asian people as folang but of course I could not possible have known that

[PoodMaiDai]

How much trouble would you get into if you owned two condos, lived in one, and had a farang open jam music night in the extra one?

[ThailandInvestmentGuide]

First a general observation ... boy there a lot of aggressive assertions (mostly based on misinformation) and personal attacks in this thread .. calm down folks.. the chiang mai sub-forum is the helpful chilled-out one, remember

folang bring this sort of thing onto themselves by bringing their bigoted forang ways here and being stupid enough to believe that the same rules apply here as in their own country. <snip>The issue is not if its illegal which if your doing it with intention of renting out it clearly is unless you have a WP but the fact that no one or virtually no one obeys that law and no one or almost no one pays tax on their rentals.

I don't fully get the basis for your seemingly overblown comments so excuse me if I have misunderstood ... so foreigners expect thai people to act in accordance with thai law ... that might be naive but hardly "bigoted"? And receiving rental income without holding a work permit is NOT "clearly" illegal. Foreigners may receive income from passive investments without the need for a work permit. It is only when foreigners are actively involved, e.g. take bookings, liaising with tenants, serving on the condo committee, maintaining the property etc that you move to a situation where a work permit might be required (according to thai law, rather than general practice).

This issue was discussed in more detail in one or more older Thaivisa threads dealing with a US guy who was in hot water with the immigration ppl in Phuket. He owned several condos and was actively involved on the condo committee. I can probably dig out a reference/link if anyone is interested.

[CMNightRider]

How much trouble would you get into if you owned two condos, lived in one, and had a farang open jam music night in the extra one?

You and your tenant would probably end up sharing a prison cell. The condo and music police are no one to mess with.

[jackr]

Cynicism aside, I think if one has the means to invest in extra property and is looking for some passive income, probably best to do so in a first world country.

[CMNightRider]

Cynicism aside, I think if one has the means to invest in extra property and is looking for some passive income, probably best to do so in a first world country.

That would be my guess too. This is a good place to live but a little shaky on the investment end.

[wanttobuyacondo]

It might be illuminating to know what the issues are between owners and juristic.

Alas Riverside...

In the past the Juristic was a relative of the manager, was flown up first class from out of town and stayed in a 5 star hotel for meetings. Apparently that Juristic refused to allow needed building renovations already passed by an owners AGM to be funded because...

Another Manager was also the Jusistic and reportedly resigned after having some interesting bank accounts linked to another person of interest discovered, also claimed to have been blackmailied over a foreign spouse without a WP to make certain decisions favourable to...

An unpublicized Emergency AGM was held, that although without a quorum, illegally voted out the committee and replaced it with another more acceptable to... Afterwards room prices suddenly stopped rising.

It seems a certain commitee was planning to and another did repossess condos for non-payment of maintenance fees and buying them themselves them for peanuts at unpublicized auctions. Apparently the reception only steers walk-in customers to committee members with multiple units when many owners are in the pool.

It is said that the books have never been audited by an impartial 3rd party and if they had...

It is rumoured that a certain manager accumulated a huge amount of rooms, even buying some of the customers ones in their name as they couldn't read Thai...

Word has it that a former committee member with a large pool of rooms getting paid "committee bonuses for hard work" by an former manager finally got their spouse elected to a new committee to continue the good work.

These are just the well reported stories half the owners have no idea about, and now for the really juicy bits: [cut].

One might also ask if Riverside is reportedly like this what is my condo really like? OK, here is the story about the guy that bought on Canal Rd north of Huay Khow who wanted to know why...and then received a subtle death threat. Or how about the condo manager linked to a police relative near Loy Kroh that can't be evicted. Then there is the one about another near Loy Kroh where the Manager won't give the owner details but markets the propertry 3 times market value. Or how about...

Most of the above is 3rd party comment, no facts are personally known so if post unintentionally libelous please delete.

Rancid,

Why you not just name the horses? At least with their first letter.

If you know more, put it on the tabel please.

Could learn alot to some people who need it

Thanks

[TommoPhysicist]

Nothing new here. If you do some business, be prepared to show a WP.

its completely new lots of forang rent out their condos and none I know have a WP or pay tax. Leaving aside the tax issue the real question is can immigration claim just renting out your condo is working. I have 2 units one i live in one I rent out. An agent found the tenant and I paid the agents commission but after that if theirs any problems I pay someone to fix them. What guy from immigration department seemed to be saying is that is considered working and he also said they had put forang in jail for doing it. I doubt if any forang have ever been put in jail or im sure I would have heard about it. Their is some dispute between some owners and juristic manager so it could well be a warning arranged by JM to be careful or things could get nasty.

By that same thinking you would need a WP to buy shares or invest in a Thai company, or even make interest on a Thai bank account, it's &lt;deleted&gt;!.

But you do have to pay 15% interest on any investment income (including condos), and they can backdate payment 5 years.

(15% on the gross ..... no deductions)

[Dante99]

Nothing new here. If you do some business, be prepared to show a WP.

its completely new lots of forang rent out their condos and none I know have a WP or pay tax. Leaving aside the tax issue the real question is can immigration claim just renting out your condo is working. I have 2 units one i live in one I rent out. An agent found the tenant and I paid the agents commission but after that if theirs any problems I pay someone to fix them. What guy from immigration department seemed to be saying is that is considered working and he also said they had put forang in jail for doing it. I doubt if any forang have ever been put in jail or im sure I would have heard about it. Their is some dispute between some owners and juristic manager so it could well be a warning arranged by JM to be careful or things could get nasty.

By that same thinking you would need a WP to buy shares or invest in a Thai company, or even make interest on a Thai bank account, it's &lt;deleted&gt;!.

But you do have to pay 15% interest on any investment income (including condos), and they can backdate payment 5 years.

(15% on the gross ..... no deductions)

15% interest? Who do you pay the interest to?

[TommoPhysicist]

15% interest? Who do you pay the interest to?

'tax' not 'interest' .......... that'll teach me to cut and paste in my posts.

[cheeryble]

Riverside has long standing problems with warring factions trying to gain control of the committee, best to just leave it at that.

My understanding is that you can rent a room if you pay tax (have to apply for it) and that no WP is required for a few rooms within reason.

I think you're right Rancid the warring factions tend to be Thai on one side as well so no doubt one of them has caused the problem......so I very much think it will stay in Riverside.

As for working if a gf or agent is organizing or a lease signed once in a blue moon and a contractor does any jobs Thais don't see that as work.

[cmexpat999]

First a general observation ... boy there a lot of aggressive assertions (mostly based on misinformation) and personal attacks in this thread .. calm down folks.. the chiang mai sub-forum is the helpful chilled-out one, remember

folang bring this sort of thing onto themselves by bringing their bigoted forang ways here and being stupid enough to believe that the same rules apply here as in their own country. <snip>The issue is not if its illegal which if your doing it with intention of renting out it clearly is unless you have a WP but the fact that no one or virtually no one obeys that law and no one or almost no one pays tax on their rentals.

I don't fully get the basis for your seemingly overblown comments so excuse me if I have misunderstood ... so foreigners expect thai people to act in accordance with thai law ... that might be naive but hardly "bigoted"? And receiving rental income without holding a work permit is NOT "clearly" illegal. Foreigners may receive income from passive investments without the need for a work permit. It is only when foreigners are actively involved, e.g. take bookings, liaising with tenants, serving on the condo committee, maintaining the property etc that you move to a situation where a work permit might be required (according to thai law, rather than general practice).

This issue was discussed in more detail in one or more older Thaivisa threads dealing with a US guy who was in hot water with the immigration ppl in Phuket. He owned several condos and was actively involved on the condo committee. I can probably dig out a reference/link if anyone is interested.

Here in CM there are many foreigners on many condo committees and im sure very few if any have a WP. So their are a lot of foreigners breaking the law if this comment was at all true. However here TIT nothing is clear. Please dig up post re previous discussion on this. As stated I very much doubt anything will happen but the immigration office who I believe was invited to the meeting by the manager was quite clear about it. Even if as often Thai officials are wrong its up to officer to interpret the rules and so this is of concern to a lot of people. Most foreigners investing in condos to rent out are it seems almost certainly breaking the law but its being going on for ever and the law here is not the same as in the west especially when applied to foreigners. People can moan and complain as much as they want about it not being right, not fair and the rest but pure fact is whatever the spirit of the law of what it says any foreigner trying to argue against a judgment or even start fighting any Thai is from the start at a huge disadvantage and mostly are fighting a lost cause. So best to ignore the detail of the law and concentrate on actual practice if you want to survive. Plenty have ignored this fact to their dear cost.

[cmexpat999]

Nothing new here. If you do some business, be prepared to show a WP.

its completely new lots of forang rent out their condos and none I know have a WP or pay tax. Leaving aside the tax issue the real question is can immigration claim just renting out your condo is working. I have 2 units one i live in one I rent out. An agent found the tenant and I paid the agents commission but after that if theirs any problems I pay someone to fix them. What guy from immigration department seemed to be saying is that is considered working and he also said they had put forang in jail for doing it. I doubt if any forang have ever been put in jail or im sure I would have heard about it. Their is some dispute between some owners and juristic manager so it could well be a warning arranged by JM to be careful or things could get nasty.

By that same thinking you would need a WP to buy shares or invest in a Thai company, or even make interest on a Thai bank account, it's &lt;deleted&gt;!.

But you do have to pay 15% interest on any investment income (including condos), and they can backdate payment 5 years.

(15% on the gross ..... no deductions)

TIT and your applying western logic here which is very unwise. Investing in shares or receiving bank interest is passive investing. Renting out condos is not unless you give all the work to an agent. Doing it yourself and arranging advertising, liaising with builders, sorting out tenants problems and all rest is work and here any form of work even if unpaid requires a WP.

And where on earth did you get 15% nonsense. Investment income here is taxed as in most countries on a sliding scale starting at 10% and going up to 47% and like most countries there are allowances. These allowances as in the case of UK (for foreigner’s) may only be for their. Share dividends here are like most countries taxed at source. In the case of condos hardly anyone pays any tax even though they are liable.IF you did not know that then you are simply naive or never involved here at all.

You sir are theo ne talking total &lt;deleted&gt;.

[TommoPhysicist]

You sir are theo ne talking total &lt;deleted&gt;.

No you!

[dru2]

The fact that the OP referred to the agreived parties as "forang" tells you he doesn't read Thai and doesn't think about non-farang parties who would also be affected. Surely, Japanese and Korean people own units in that building.

Why oh why would someone sign a contract involving large sums of money without understanding its meaning? I'm not saying everyone should learn to read Thai (although its not a bad idea), but rather they should recognize their shortcomings and hire a professional to explain a contract to them.

The average "thii rak" can't do that -- and that isn't a slam toward Thai women. Everytime we bought or sold property in the U.S. , our lawyer reviewed the contract before we signed and often, we'd ask our tax accountant for an opinion.

We are Siamese if you please and who on earth cares about non folang like Japanese and Taiwanese and all the rest. folang bring this sort of thing onto themselves by bringing their bigoted forang ways here and being stupid enough to believe that the same rules apply here as in their own country. Obviously most GF BF (to not be sexist) or Thai wives do not have a clue as for that matter nor do average western partner. The issue is not if its illegal which if your doing it with intention of renting out it clearly is unless you have a WP but the fact that no one or virtually no one obeys that law and no one or almost no one pays tax on their rentals. This is well known and like most illegal things in Thailand a blind eye is turned. The issue is this is first time I know off that an immigration officer was invited by the manager to speak at the meeting and to clearly point out what the law was and by inference stating it was well known that many folang in the block were breaking the law and subject to imprisonment. As stated nothing is likely to happen but this is the first time ive heard of it being openly threatened in the case of condos and renting out. Also the non Thai non folang will I believe in 2015 be able to legally buy property in Thailand. I don’t know if this applies to Japanese or who since it seems to depend on which countries are in the planned Asian common block. Thailand is one of those and I believe 13 other non folang countries. Not to confuse those not here and those who have Tii-raks who don’t talk to then Thais consider only non Asian people as folang but of course I could not possible have known that

It's Farang for Christ's sake - and it means Westerner, White Caucasian Westerner, not foreigner.

[mcgriffith]

By that same thinking you would need a WP to buy shares or invest in a Thai company, or even make interest on a Thai bank account, it's &lt;deleted&gt;!.

Not to split hairs, but no it is not quite the same thing.

As in owning rental properties and deriving income from them, and investing in the Thai stock market or being paid interest on a Thai bank acct.

When a foreign individual investor (I'm not talking about a major foreign investment bank or an institutional investor based overseas, different rules apply in this case) buys stocks here, we are required to buy NVDR's. As in Non Voting Depository Receipts. The shares we buy trade identical to Thai citizen bought shares. But we have no voting rights on our shares. This is a passive investment, as the shares owned have no voting rights.

When you deposit money in a Thai bank, as a foreigner, this is a passive investment. Earning interest on a bank account is hardly operating a business, as I'm sure you'll agree.

When you buy 2 or 3 or a dozen condos, live in one, and rent the others out- it's a business. You are a landlord. You are earning rental income which is taxable under Thai law. As noted above, you can keep them as a passive investment by using a 3rd party- an estate agent, property management company, etc. to advertise, interview prospective clients, sign the rental contract, and manage the property

Look, don't shoot the messengers here.

The Thai authorities are notoriously lax on enforcing laws, especially tax laws, as noted above.

There are no doubt millions of Thai landlords, who collect rent, and don't pay a satang of tax on that taxable income.

Why? Because this is largely a cash economy and folks can get away with it.

When ASEAN 2015 opens, much of this anything-goes free-for-all black/grey market mishmash will be under scrutiny.

Combined with that is the Ombudsman of the Senate declaring increased scutiny of nominees working for farang property owners.

And many pushes by the gov't to increase tax revenues to pay for new populist spending schemes (rice mortgage, etc.).

The good old bad days are coming to a close for the grey market under the radar folks, IMO.

My best advice is redo your rental contracts, and get on the right side before they crack the whip over your head....

[Mapguy]

I am not a landlord/owner, nor an expert on Thai law regarding this issue, but I'll just say this:

Logically, someone who is a foreigner in Thailand, who buys a single condo, that they reside in....has no reason to be concerned.

Another foreigner, who owns multiple condos, who rents them out and derives income from same- surely they must be aware that this income is taxable under Thai law, and that probably they need to have a work permit to do this business here. Renting out condos is a business, just like any other business: owning a bar or restaurant, operating a tour company, etc. Perhaps the Thai tax authorities are just now getting around to enforcing laws that are already on the books?

A Thai national, living in Brighton, or Los Angeles, or Berlin, who owns multiple units, who rents them out, and derives income from same, no doubt has to pay tax on that rental income in those countries.

+1

[Mapguy]

Use a property agent to manage condo rentals. Problem solved.

Really? What about the issue of taxes?

[ThailandInvestmentGuide]

<snip>And where on earth did you get 15% nonsense. Investment income here is taxed as in most countries on a sliding scale starting at 10% and going up to 47% and like most countries there are allowances.<snip>

Whoa. The 15% is not "nonsense". This is withholding tax not income tax - google on "thailand withholding tax" to find many references such as http://www.sherrings.com/Withholding-Tax.php and http://www.pwc.com/en_th/th/publications/2011/assets/thai-tax2011-booklet-update100311.pdf

Also do a TV forum search on withholding tax for personal experiences, including info about how some ppl can claim it back

[ThailandInvestmentGuide]

<snip> Please dig up post re previous discussion on this. <snip>

Here it is:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Canadian-Condo-Owner-Claims-False-A-t252387.html

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Condominium-Act-2008-t232883.html

[cmexpat999]

<snip>And where on earth did you get 15% nonsense. Investment income here is taxed as in most countries on a sliding scale starting at 10% and going up to 47% and like most countries there are allowances.<snip>

Whoa. The 15% is not "nonsense". This is withholding tax not income tax - google on "thailand withholding tax" to find many references such as http://www.sherrings...holding-Tax.php and http://www.pwc.com/e...pdate100311.pdf

Also do a TV forum search on withholding tax for personal experiences, including info about how some ppl can claim it back

<snip>And where on earth did you get 15% nonsense. Investment income here is taxed as in most countries on a sliding scale starting at 10% and going up to 47% and like most countries there are allowances.<snip>

Whoa. The 15% is not "nonsense". This is withholding tax not income tax - google on "thailand withholding tax" to find many references such as http://www.sherrings...holding-Tax.php and http://www.pwc.com/e...pdate100311.pdf

Also do a TV forum search on withholding tax for personal experiences, including info about how some ppl can claim it back

True but as always not whole story. 15% is mostly not final tax and as far as ive researched only needs to be taken by an agent if you use one. No agents seem to take this unless the owner owns a large number of units. Any owner who owns enough units and is honest enough to pay tax would in nearly all cases be registered for tax and so no withholding tax is payable. Anyway hardly any Thai or forang owners pay any tax unless they own a whole apartment block. If you are married you can always appoint your wife as your manager and agent and so even if you decide to pay any tax satisfy both WP and tax issues. Last time I checked if you bothered to pay tax then if your aThai you can claim a tax allowance of 150,000 baht a year plus extra allowance for your spouse and children. You can also I believe claim 40 % for furniture and other items. Then when i last checked was as below but I believe bands have been raised since then.

Also as most things in Thailand if you want to pay tax then having shall we say a friend in tax office reduces any tax bill to very little.

Hardly any thai or forang owner who rents out units pays any tax. Its always amazed me why tax authorities dont simply get a list from land office of all owners of more than one unit and investigate. This if they wanted they could do very easily. I assume its never done because their are many hiso thais renting out and paying no tax and here no lower Thai such as officers in tax department would dare tackle rich and powerful.

Her unless you work for a company or run a company tax is voluntary. Much same as in Greece or Italy and other developed western nations.

0 - 150,000 Exempt - -

150,001 - 500,000 10% 35,000 35,000

500,001 - 1,000,000 20% 100,000 135,000

1,000,001 - 4,000,000 30% 900,000 1,035,000

4,000,001 and over 37%

[binjalin]

Why do you spell it "forang"?

The op mostly, but could just as well be mentioned by anyone else who spells it that way. Though I've never seen anyone else spelling it so.

who cares? Jeeze this is about rooms don't sidetrack us from a very important issue with a grammar Nazi thing

[binjalin]

Riverside has long standing problems with warring factions trying to gain control of the committee, best to just leave it at that.

My understanding is that you can rent a room if you pay tax (have to apply for it) and that no WP is required for a few rooms within reason.

I think you're right Rancid the warring factions tend to be Thai on one side as well so no doubt one of them has caused the problem......so I very much think it will stay in Riverside.

As for working if a gf or agent is organizing or a lease signed once in a blue moon and a contractor does any jobs Thais don't see that as work.

I sold my rooms at Riverside as there has always been a 'history' of fighting and I advise anyone never to buy there just because of this problem. Make of this what you will but better leave it at that but suffice it to say no one 'invites' and causes trouble for no reason (apart from their own reasons)

[binjalin]

Use a property agent to manage condo rentals. Problem solved.

Really? What about the issue of taxes?

there are no agents (I know of) in CM who give this service (i.e. total property management including taxes etc.) - if there is one (or preferably a choice) please LIST THEM and they may be in for a killing

PS I own 2 houses in UK and pay tax - they are NOT considered a 'business' by the authorities but an 'investment'

[cheeryble]

The funny thing is Riverside remains a clean, generally well-run condo with adequate finances yet fees half those of the new blocks.

Right on the river and close to major highways and very close indeed to a hospital is important to many.

The fact is it is very popular with many including elderly Japanese and Farang including two friends of mine who it seems want to stay nowhere else for the rest of their days.

[Mapguy]

What's the latest on this brouhaha?

[Greenside]

One of the problems that prevents full discussion of this kind of issue is that the Thai Defamation Laws make it easy and cheap for an individual to file a civil or even a criminal suit against others who may only have complained to the proper authorities via the normal channels. Even though the suit may have no grounds and simply an obvious part of an attempt at intimidation, it can be enough to scare both Thai and non-Thai Co-Owners into throwing in the towel and allowing Big Power and vested interests to prevail. I have no connection with Riverside or knowledge of the case beyond this thread but I do know that this kind of action is frequently used to silence condo owners who simply want to ensure proper and accountable management of their building.

The Condo Act was a good move in the right direction but getting action against even flagrant breaches is a lot harder than you might think given how clear some of the provisions are. Newcomers may think that foreign ownership of a condo seems like a safe bet given the alternatives, but as many people have found out to their cost, if the management is negligent or less than transparent it can quickly turn into a nightmare as most developers are well connected and of them many feel they are more or less above the law.

It never fails to amaze me that the Thai owners who invest in condos seem indifferent to the maintenance and management issues which so clearly affect their property. Perhaps they don't see it as an investment.

Never buy without talking to a decent cross section of owners, checking the accounts for previous years and inspecting the fire escapes! Never believe the vendor without doing your own due diligence.