Accused Child Abuser, 93, Caught Fleeing Into Burma

[ttelise]

I represented some your school girls who were caught having inappropriate relationships with their teachers and have seen first hand the psychological impact. Most of the pedophile in the US we see is the 20 or so year old with the 15 year old girl friend. Rarely see some old creeper dude like this.

I think you are seeing and believing what you want to see and believe.

Really, so 90 year olds sexually assaulting little children is common in US according to you. Maybe it is in Thailand, but extremely uncommon here.

Because this 90 year old German born Australian was arrested for child molesting in Thailand makes you think that it is common or uncommon in the west or more common in Thailand? Again, I think you are seeing what you want to see.

But for you to ignore or consider ... below are from the first page results of a Google Search for "91 year old child molester" (you can try search for other ages but hopefully the following is enough to make the point)

TUCSON, AZ - A 91-year-old Tucson man has been convicted on five counts of child molestation.

http://www.abc15.com...n#ixzz22ri0va8G

San Diego - 91-Year-Old Accused of Molestation

http://articles.lati...ild-molestation

New York - A 100-year-old pedophile has been released from prison in the U.S. despite fears he is still an "active threat" to children,

http://www.foxnews.c...l#ixzz22rhgxmai

(not sure why this one came up in the search)

Clearly being in your 90s doesn't stop one from being a child molester despite where they live, are born or the nationality of their victims.

Yep, I believe these because I do have faith in the US justice system. My original point was it's sad you don't know whether to believe corrupt Thai cops or a 93 year old accused of pedophile when this happens in Thailand, particularly when there are several instances of attempted extortion.

Sad when cops are not better than the accused.

[ttelise]

Most of the pedophile in the US we see is the 20 or so year old with the 15 year old girl friend.

That is not a pedophile.

Pedophilia is defined as:

Over a period of at least six months, recurrent intense sexual urges and sexually arousing fantasies involving sexual activity with a prepubescent child or children (generally age 13 or younger).

If the charges against this 93 year old man are true, he was having sex with young children and one was 5 years old. That is a pedophile.

For sure, I hear what you are stating. I believe it's splitting hairs though as all child molesters are equally as bad regardless if they are 90 or 25.

[Nisa]

Yep, I believe these because I do have faith in the US justice system. My original point was it's sad you don't know whether to believe corrupt Thai cops or a 93 year old accused of pedophile when this happens in Thailand, particularly when there are several instances of attempted extortion.

Sad when cops are not better than the accused.

Again, I think you are seeing what you want to see and believe.

Typically when somebody is extorted for a crime, it is because there is evidence against the person for the crime and in this case we know of a few things made public including his having 100s of pictures / videos of child porn including his posing with nude children as well as his emailing child porn overseas. We have accounts to back up the accusations from the children (victims), a maid and the parents who the children confided in when pressured about why they didn't want to leave the house anymore as well as this guy fleeing and reports from the neighbors who say he has feigned being frail when in fact he had always been mobile including driving a car up until police showed up at his door and he acted like a frail old man who could barely walk on his own.

But you are right, with all the real criminals with money (foreign and domestic) here in Thailand, it only makes sense to believe they would go after an innocent and very old guy (traditionally very respected in Thailand), plant evidence and create a multi-year conspiracy with numerous people and officials in order to get a few thousand from an innocent guy who has lived and help support his community financially for a decade.

Edited August 7, 2012 by Nisa

[biggunguy]

It is one of those loopholes in the law here. You can't make it, sell it, distribute it or buy it but there is no specific law about possessing it.

are you saying, overseas can sent megabytes of childporn here, and the thai authorities/internet providers would never act on this?

are people doing something, to close this "loophole"?

what could they do?

Edited August 7, 2012 by biggunguy

[MAJIC]

I have no idea if this man is guilty or not? but there does seems a big incentive in this Country to fabricate a story,with the intention of gaining money. And the accusers even have two chances at the payoff,once when the accused has a chance of buying off the prosecution charges,and a second time,if found guilty,in Court, with a compensation payout.

The system appears to favour false accusations,and to make it seem worthwhile,to have a try on.

[Nisa]

It is one of those loopholes in the law here. You can't make it, sell it, distribute it or buy it but there is no specific law about possessing it.

are you saying, overseas can sent megabytes of childporn here, and the thai authorities/internet providers would never act on this?

Not sure what you exactly you are asking but know you are asking about internet child porn. There are separate crimes, which I am not fully aware of, that fall under the Computer Crimes Act that would probably cover your question from a point of accessing, distributing or downloading child porn (possibly any porn). My reply was regarding the other poster quoting the police who said there is no specific law about possession of child porn.

[ttelise]

Yep, I believe these because I do have faith in the US justice system. My original point was it's sad you don't know whether to believe corrupt Thai cops or a 93 year old accused of pedophile when this happens in Thailand, particularly when there are several instances of attempted extortion.

Sad when cops are not better than the accused.

Again, I think you are seeing what you want to see and believe.

Typically when somebody is extorted for a crime, it is because there is evidence against the person for the crime and in this case we know of a few things made public including his having 100s of pictures / videos of child porn including his posing with nude children as well as his emailing child porn overseas. We have accounts to back up the accusations from the children (victims), a maid and the parents who the children confided in when pressured about why they didn't want to leave the house anymore as well as this guy fleeing and reports from the neighbors who say he has feigned being frail when in fact he had always been mobile including driving a car up until police showed up at his door and he acted like a frail old man who could barely walk on his own.

But you are right, with all the real criminals with money (foreign and domestic) here in Thailand, it only makes sense to believe they would go after an innocent and very old guy (traditionally very respected in Thailand), plant evidence and create a multi-year conspiracy with numerous people and officials in order to get a few thousand from an innocent guy who has lived and help support his community financially for a decade.

Yep, this guy is an easy target. Haha, the cops don't take on mob dudes because they are a part of the criminal enterprise. I guess we occasionally see bust, like all the sex toys, when some decides to cut cops out of payment loop.

If you believe old man, he did nit play ball, refused to pay extortion, then got arrested and extorted again, and the cops cleaned his bank accounts out.

Once again, I am not saying true and you don't know either. I am just saying his story is plausible due to police corruption in Thailand which us a sad state of affairs.

[ttelise]

I have no idea if this man is guilty or not? but there does seems a big incentive in this Country to fabricate a story,with the intention of gaining money. And the accusers even have two chances at the payoff,once when the accused has a chance of buying off the prosecution charges,and a second time,if found guilty,in Court, with a compensation payout.

The system appears to favour false accusations,and to make it seem worthwhile,to have a try on.

Exactly, you say this much clearer than I.

[Nisa]

Yep, I believe these because I do have faith in the US justice system. My original point was it's sad you don't know whether to believe corrupt Thai cops or a 93 year old accused of pedophile when this happens in Thailand, particularly when there are several instances of attempted extortion.

Sad when cops are not better than the accused.

Again, I think you are seeing what you want to see and believe.

Typically when somebody is extorted for a crime, it is because there is evidence against the person for the crime and in this case we know of a few things made public including his having 100s of pictures / videos of child porn including his posing with nude children as well as his emailing child porn overseas. We have accounts to back up the accusations from the children (victims), a maid and the parents who the children confided in when pressured about why they didn't want to leave the house anymore as well as this guy fleeing and reports from the neighbors who say he has feigned being frail when in fact he had always been mobile including driving a car up until police showed up at his door and he acted like a frail old man who could barely walk on his own.

But you are right, with all the real criminals with money (foreign and domestic) here in Thailand, it only makes sense to believe they would go after an innocent and very old guy (traditionally very respected in Thailand), plant evidence and create a multi-year conspiracy with numerous people and officials in order to get a few thousand from an innocent guy who has lived and help support his community financially for a decade.

Yep, this guy is an easy target. Haha, the cops don't take on mob dudes because they are a part of the criminal enterprise. I guess we occasionally see bust, like all the sex toys, when some decides to cut cops out of payment loop.

If you believe old man, he did nit play ball, refused to pay extortion, then got arrested and extorted again, and the cops cleaned his bank accounts out.

Once again, I am not saying true and you don't know either. I am just saying his story is plausible due to police corruption in Thailand which us a sad state of affairs.

It is only hard to believe if you choose to not want to believe. Consider years ago I got asked for something like a 2,000 baht fine (donation) for throwing a cigarette down on Sukimvit a few years ago. While I was negotiating the amount of my contribution the cops kept bringing numerous other foreigners to the pay off guy in his little corner office box. This was a couple years ago and since they I have talked to and seen numerous people caught up in this same offense. Funny thing is that none of the people on the street that day or anyone I have seen and spoke to in the years since I got nailed ever said they didn't actually throw their cigarette down. The certainly could make their job a lot easier and make a ton more just pulling people aside and accusing them of throwing something down (doesn't have to be a cigarette as the crime is littering) but no they actually wait for somebody to do the crime.

Bottom line is there is no common tendency in Thailand for the police to extort money from innocent foreigners ... not when there are enough of them doing wrong to extort. Payoff common but setting up innocent people to try to extort money .. not common especially in a case like this. It is almost laughable to suggest the kind of conspiracy and fabrication of evidence you are suggesting they may have done.

[ttelise]

Yep, I believe these because I do have faith in the US justice system. My original point was it's sad you don't know whether to believe corrupt Thai cops or a 93 year old accused of pedophile when this happens in Thailand, particularly when there are several instances of attempted extortion.

Sad when cops are not better than the accused.

Again, I think you are seeing what you want to see and believe.

Typically when somebody is extorted for a crime, it is because there is evidence against the person for the crime and in this case we know of a few things made public including his having 100s of pictures / videos of child porn including his posing with nude children as well as his emailing child porn overseas. We have accounts to back up the accusations from the children (victims), a maid and the parents who the children confided in when pressured about why they didn't want to leave the house anymore as well as this guy fleeing and reports from the neighbors who say he has feigned being frail when in fact he had always been mobile including driving a car up until police showed up at his door and he acted like a frail old man who could barely walk on his own.

But you are right, with all the real criminals with money (foreign and domestic) here in Thailand, it only makes sense to believe they would go after an innocent and very old guy (traditionally very respected in Thailand), plant evidence and create a multi-year conspiracy with numerous people and officials in order to get a few thousand from an innocent guy who has lived and help support his community financially for a decade.

Yep, this guy is an easy target. Haha, the cops don't take on mob dudes because they are a part of the criminal enterprise. I guess we occasionally see bust, like all the sex toys, when some decides to cut cops out of payment loop.

If you believe old man, he did nit play ball, refused to pay extortion, then got arrested and extorted again, and the cops cleaned his bank accounts out.

Once again, I am not saying true and you don't know either. I am just saying his story is plausible due to police corruption in Thailand which us a sad state of affairs.

It is only hard to believe if you choose to not want to believe. Consider years ago I got asked for something like a 2,000 baht fine (donation) for throwing a cigarette down on Sukimvit a few years ago. While I was negotiating the amount of my contribution the cops kept bringing numerous other foreigners to the pay off guy in his little corner office box. This was a couple years ago and since they I have talked to and seen numerous people caught up in this same offense. Funny thing is that none of the people on the street that day or anyone I have seen and spoke to in the years since I got nailed ever said they didn't actually throw their cigarette down. The certainly could make their job a lot easier and make a ton more just pulling people aside and accusing them of throwing something down (doesn't have to be a cigarette as the crime is littering) but no they actually wait for somebody to do the crime.

Bottom line is there is no common tendency in Thailand for the police to extort money from innocent foreigners ... not when there are enough of them doing wrong to extort. Payoff common but setting up innocent people to try to extort money .. not common especially in a case like this. It is almost laughable to suggest the kind of conspiracy and fabrication of evidence you are suggesting they may have done.

What is laughable is YouTube videos of Thai cops counting their pockets full of extorted money taken off people. Haha, even the police entrance exam process was tainted with corruption. What one may see as a victim, you and the Thai authorities apparently view as an opportunity. You have even gone so far as to accuse or suggest that a child rape victim of lying because it involved allegations of police corruption.

Edited August 7, 2012 by ttelise

[ttelise]

Yep, I believe these because I do have faith in the US justice system. My original point was it's sad you don't know whether to believe corrupt Thai cops or a 93 year old accused of pedophile when this happens in Thailand, particularly when there are several instances of attempted extortion.

Sad when cops are not better than the accused.

Again, I think you are seeing what you want to see and believe.

Typically when somebody is extorted for a crime, it is because there is evidence against the person for the crime and in this case we know of a few things made public including his having 100s of pictures / videos of child porn including his posing with nude children as well as his emailing child porn overseas. We have accounts to back up the accusations from the children (victims), a maid and the parents who the children confided in when pressured about why they didn't want to leave the house anymore as well as this guy fleeing and reports from the neighbors who say he has feigned being frail when in fact he had always been mobile including driving a car up until police showed up at his door and he acted like a frail old man who could barely walk on his own.

But you are right, with all the real criminals with money (foreign and domestic) here in Thailand, it only makes sense to believe they would go after an innocent and very old guy (traditionally very respected in Thailand), plant evidence and create a multi-year conspiracy with numerous people and officials in order to get a few thousand from an innocent guy who has lived and help support his community financially for a decade.

Yep, this guy is an easy target. Haha, the cops don't take on mob dudes because they are a part of the criminal enterprise. I guess we occasionally see bust, like all the sex toys, when some decides to cut cops out of payment loop.

If you believe old man, he did nit play ball, refused to pay extortion, then got arrested and extorted again, and the cops cleaned his bank accounts out.

Once again, I am not saying true and you don't know either. I am just saying his story is plausible due to police corruption in Thailand which us a sad state of affairs.

It is only hard to believe if you choose to not want to believe. Consider years ago I got asked for something like a 2,000 baht fine (donation) for throwing a cigarette down on Sukimvit a few years ago. While I was negotiating the amount of my contribution the cops kept bringing numerous other foreigners to the pay off guy in his little corner office box. This was a couple years ago and since they I have talked to and seen numerous people caught up in this same offense. Funny thing is that none of the people on the street that day or anyone I have seen and spoke to in the years since I got nailed ever said they didn't actually throw their cigarette down. The certainly could make their job a lot easier and make a ton more just pulling people aside and accusing them of throwing something down (doesn't have to be a cigarette as the crime is littering) but no they actually wait for somebody to do the crime.

Bottom line is there is no common tendency in Thailand for the police to extort money from innocent foreigners ... not when there are enough of them doing wrong to extort. Payoff common but setting up innocent people to try to extort money .. not common especially in a case like this. It is almost laughable to suggest the kind of conspiracy and fabrication of evidence you are suggesting they may have done.

Oh yeah, smoking is nasty. You got off cheap.

[biggunguy]

Causes of the problems

Social Structure

1. Child sexual abuse problems are raised from structural violence traditionally placed in the Thai society. Thai society is a male dominated society where the patriarchal culture allows their male members to freely have irresponsible sex, extramarital sex, and to practice very little consideration when there is sexual needs. This structure and cultural violence leaves other members of the society with unsafe life conditions and with risk of sexual violence. A micro-level study indicated male teenagers' view on rape. Some of teenagers believe that rape act on a women is an acceptable situation if there is an opportunity to do so.

3. The country's deep-rooted corruption. A middle rank policeman clearly explained, 'rape cases are widely regarded among policemen as easy money-making opportunities. The defendant is willing to pay and this is why you see all sorts of tactics to discourage the victim to back off... the attorney, too, it ill be opted into this process.

http://www.seameo.or...child/text1.htm

Southeast Asian Ministers of Education Organization (SEAMEO)

Edited August 7, 2012 by biggunguy

[ttelise]

Causes of the problems

Social Structure

1. Child sexual abuse problems are raised from structural violence traditionally placed in the Thai society. Thai society is a male dominated society where the patriarchal culture allows their male members to freely have irresponsible sex, extramarital sex, and to practice very little consideration when there is sexual needs. This structure and cultural violence leaves other members of the society with unsafe life conditions and with risk of sexual violence. A micro-level study indicated male teenagers' view on rape. Some of teenagers believe that rape act on a women is an acceptable situation if there is an opportunity to do so.

3. The country's deep-rooted corruption. A middle rank policeman clearly explained, 'rape cases are widely regarded among policemen as easy money-making opportunities. The defendant is willing to pay and this is why you see all sorts of tactics to discourage the victim to back off... the attorney, too, it ill be opted into this process.

http://www.seameo.or...child/text1.htm

Southeast Asian Ministers of Education Organization (SEAMEO)

What, no Nisa to come along and to debunk the article with his first hand knowledge that Thai corruption dies nit exist and that SAMEO is just a bunch of liars trying to make Thailand look bad.

So true about the above observation compounding an already very difficult problem.

Sexual abuse of a child is as bad as it gets, but the second worst crime in society is accusing an innocent person io child abuse. Young children, 5 or 6, are impressionable and not good historians on this subject.

Being a lawyer, I am all too familiar with spouses making false allegation of child abuse in order to gain leverage in domestic disputes. This can be almost impossible defend as society automatically assumes guilt and the stigma is unshakeable even if their is a suspicion of child abuse.

I say this because no matter what, this old guy's life is screwed. Guilty or innocent he will always be viewed a pedophile and the Thai justice system is too much of a joke to vindicate him if he is innocent. The police system is too pathetic to investigate it properly to determine if fact or extortion. Even worse, the Thai cops may, and I say may just based on reputation and the above article, actually use this to extort more money and then let dude rot in jail.

This old dude is in about as bad a position as any human could be IF he is innocent. Just imagine being innocent and no one will listen and everyone is trying to profit financially from your predicament.

Edited August 8, 2012 by ttelise

[Nisa]

Causes of the problems

Social Structure

1. Child sexual abuse problems are raised from structural violence traditionally placed in the Thai society. Thai society is a male dominated society where the patriarchal culture allows their male members to freely have irresponsible sex, extramarital sex, and to practice very little consideration when there is sexual needs. This structure and cultural violence leaves other members of the society with unsafe life conditions and with risk of sexual violence. A micro-level study indicated male teenagers' view on rape. Some of teenagers believe that rape act on a women is an acceptable situation if there is an opportunity to do so.

3. The country's deep-rooted corruption. A middle rank policeman clearly explained, 'rape cases are widely regarded among policemen as easy money-making opportunities. The defendant is willing to pay and this is why you see all sorts of tactics to discourage the victim to back off... the attorney, too, it ill be opted into this process.

http://www.seameo.or...child/text1.htm

Southeast Asian Ministers of Education Organization (SEAMEO)

In case you were not aware, the paper you are quoting is 15 years old (1997).

[ttelise]

Causes of the problems

Social Structure

1. Child sexual abuse problems are raised from structural violence traditionally placed in the Thai society. Thai society is a male dominated society where the patriarchal culture allows their male members to freely have irresponsible sex, extramarital sex, and to practice very little consideration when there is sexual needs. This structure and cultural violence leaves other members of the society with unsafe life conditions and with risk of sexual violence. A micro-level study indicated male teenagers' view on rape. Some of teenagers believe that rape act on a women is an acceptable situation if there is an opportunity to do so.

3. The country's deep-rooted corruption. A middle rank policeman clearly explained, 'rape cases are widely regarded among policemen as easy money-making opportunities. The defendant is willing to pay and this is why you see all sorts of tactics to discourage the victim to back off... the attorney, too, it ill be opted into this process.

http://www.seameo.or...child/text1.htm

Southeast Asian Ministers of Education Organization (SEAMEO)

In case you were not aware, the paper you are quoting is 15 years old (1997).

And obviously nothing has changed, except during that time Thai cops executed a lot of people accused of drug charges, some guilty some innocent, courts convicted some cops who committed murder, sentenced them to death and let them go and Thailand is close to getting sanctioned for cops tolerating and/or being involved in ongoing human rights and trafficking violations all in the name of prostitution for the almighty tourist dollar.

Framing an old man to extort a little money would be kids play compared to the level and extent of corruption present.

It's actually people like you that allow this type if stuff to happen to innocent people. People that makes excuses, cover up, condone, look the other way, or do nothing about perpetuate the problem with corruption.

Edited August 8, 2012 by ttelise

[Nisa]

ttelise, do you even live in Thailand?

[Judecalling]

Sheesh .. i don't know this case but for all the reading, it has made me feel physically sick. I wish i hadn't read it all now : ( - if it's not him then it's 'going on somewhere' and that's my reaction. Such a horrible thing - and i believe 'they/it/him/her' should be made to face an appalling death for it. This is the worst of crimes to my mind ... speaking as an average and protective woman.

"eye for an eye and we all go blind" - pwffft. !!!

[balo]

I still don't believe the story that a man in his 90s raped 4 girls. That screams of a set up.

Why don't you believe it ? Because this is Thailand?

Do you really think a man in his 90's need an erection to perform a rape on a 5 year old child ?

Sexual abuse in any form is a rape , and a kid will be destroyed forever psychologically .

Edited August 8, 2012 by balo

[namoi]

Clearly being in your 90s doesn't stop one from being a child molester despite where they live, are born or the nationality of their victims.

what can stop one?

best way to stop them is 1/2oz of lead behind the left ear

[TwoDogz]

Clearly being in your 90s doesn't stop one from being a child molester despite where they live, are born or the nationality of their victims.

what can stop one?

best way to stop them is 1/2oz of lead behind the left ear

What...like an ear ring ?

[Judecalling]

Call or name it anything you like ....