Poorly Skilled Drivers And The Law: Thailand

[zakk9]

Zakk 9 I've had a home in Thailand for 6 years but I travel the world as a training consultant.

Just joking, but in reality, most drivers in Thailand have had no training whatsoever. The average Thai seem to believe that having a drivers license is somehow included in The Declaration of Human Rights.

Edited September 14, 2012 by zakk9

[DDuval]

Driving standards are not that bad in Thailand are they...

thx

Ray Charles

You have got to be JOKING!!!!

Tongue and Cheek. The main reason I will be leaving my Expat Job and Thailand next year is because its simply not safe to transport my 3 year old girl around in Thailand.

[noitom]

So what was the relevance of the opening salvo about the 16 year old van driver killing 9 and the ferrari driver assuring that the cop was dead by dragging him through the streets and then attempting to bargain a "servant" into taking the fall? If you are talking about driver safety and testing that's one thing. Breaking the law and total disregard for it and utilizing "superiority" of class to attempt to obstruct justice is another.

What is the latest and greatest of the Ferrari case yet? Has anyone heard anything?

[fareastguy]

In reply to various above posts:

Checking mirrors !! In my neck of the woods they think mirrors are an optional extra !!

Under cutting is a standard procedure (reinforced by the person waiting behind you)

overtaking at junctions, corners or any where else in fact is exceptable behaviour.

Railway crossings are a free for all (police in attendance or not)

School times are for "Mums" not regulations.

Vehicles loaded to the maximum & beyond is excepatable ( tea money)

As for vehicles having fully functioning brakes, lights etc well lets not even go there !!

[Payboy]

It's the SMS factor most of the time - and I'm not talking here about texting while driving.

[Kalbo]

What an absolute crock o' <deleted>. Cars are fitted with more 'innovative' equipment so the quality of the driver decreases ?

He needs to spend time in Japan where the cars are extremely innovative, the drivers are very well-mannered, and more to the point,accidents are very few and far between. The reason for this being that there is discipline in Japan, from a young age, as well as a respect for the law. I challenge anyone to find both in Thailand.

[Rionoir]

hahahaha Oh my gosh and I thought this was going to be a serious article.

[Kalbo]

As one who has been actively involved in road safety for over 23 years and has experience of 38 countries I can tell you it is easy to point the finger at the driver. However, someone trained that driver and even more relevant, someone tested that driver and deemed the driver to be safe and competent!

standard and knowledge of driving is far superior to them!

I can appreciate what you're saying, but you are also making the assumption that all drivers here went to driving school, which is just not the case,especially when it comes to motorcycles. Outside of Bangkok, a very significant number of riders don't even have a license.

[simple1]

When taking the computer based Q&A test for a driving license there are no questions regarding spacial awareness e.g. when driving at 80ks how long to come to a stop. Drink driving ? no questions e.g. if you have three standard drinks in X time would you expect to be over the limit. Driving tests are not conducted in traffic conditions, so zero assessment of practical driving skills. No wonder there is such a high incident of traffic accidents.

[NangrongJ]

Kalbo. I'm well aware of that and it's training that makes a driver not testing! There's little hope when we see the police driving badly!

[tingtongfarang]

As one who has been actively involved in road safety for over 23 years and has experience of 38 countries I can tell you it is easy to point the finger at the driver. However, someone trained that driver and even more relevant, someone tested that driver and deemed the driver to be safe and competent!

standard and knowledge of driving is far superior to them!

I can appreciate what you're saying, but you are also making the assumption that all drivers here went to driving school, which is just not the case,especially when it comes to motorcycles. Outside of Bangkok, a very significant number of riders don't even have a license.

I know a few in bkk that drive and ride daily and dont have a licence so i assume there are many.

[NangrongJ]

tingtongfarang- of course there are many and not just Bangkok, all over the country, I know of several here. It's glaringly evident when a 12 or 13 year old is riding a motorcycle that they don't, or can't have a licence so when it comes to cars why should they change the habit?

A law is only a law if it can be enforced!

[Kilgore Trout]

Almost sounds like the diversionary tactics which appear in threads.

Forget any bad driving issue in Thailand because it happens all over the world

Exactly, what a crap article from a crap writer. And did we really need a picture of this loser thats bigger than the article itself?

[DocN]

This article was a waste of time; writing and reading it!

Just for the record: I for ones am not angry about the 16 year old highway- crash girl or the Scuderia Torro Rosso- guy, becuase they are RICH...but because what is happening is a travesty.

The court has given good reasons for the sentence (or rather: the absense of one) of the girl???

Name me one good reason, please!

[zakk9]

Google the author of the article and read the long interview with him in "The Newspaper that cannot be named here". He's apparently considered one of the greatest experts on automotive questions in Thailand. That alone is a scary thought and should be reason for considering another dwelling for future years. Unfortunately, I'm not joking.

Edited September 14, 2012 by zakk9

[NangrongJ]

The article is headed 'auto'! No sorry Mr. Author, this is NOT about autos it's about road safety, entirely different!

I refer back to my previous comments where anybody can comment on matters they know little about and it seem to me (until I'm proven wrong) that this author has no background, qualifications or accreditations in road safety, just 'auto's'!

[tingtongfarang]

tingtongfarang- of course there are many and not just Bangkok, all over the country, I know of several here. It's glaringly evident when a 12 or 13 year old is riding a motorcycle that they don't, or can't have a licence so when it comes to cars why should they change the habit?

A law is only a law if it can be enforced!

One girl i know when showing me her brand new toyota pickup and expecting me to be impressed got very angry with me when i told her i would be more impressed if she actualy went and got a driving licence,

Another that comes to visit although she has a licence asks me to park her car for her....she finds it impossible to get this honda civic closer than 1.5 meters to the curb!

My ex landlady who at one point owned a ferrari but could,nt drive it...she had tried, Bought her daughters a mini cooper to drive to school and back...both under age,

I did question her what happens in the event of an accident and she told that had already happened but she rushed to the scene and paid the police a couple of hundred to write in the report that she herself was driving.

[eezergood]

This has to be one of, if not the most poorly written pieces I have EVER read! This is pure drivel, written for imbeciles! This is the kind of rubbish that gets printed on April fools day in the UK.

Perhaps Thailand, and I DO realise this will fall on mainly deaf ears, should have some recourse for law breakers - and to make merit should not count. Of course it never will, 200THB fine for no license!? Why WOULD you bother to get one???

To the editor of the Nation - I suspect yesterday was a half day for you? perhpas you should EDIT what your staff write, or was this a sponsored piece?

[T_Dog]

I have not witnessed the level of tail gating, passing unsafely, and road rage anywhere else in the world that we see here in Thailand. Just yesterday I was driving through a small town getting ready to make a u-turn so in the right lane. The left lane was full of side cars, people waiting to cross the road, and slower traffic. No place anyone should be speeding through. A van came up behind me and less than a meter from my rear bumper flashing his lights and then honking the horn. I had my directional on and when I hit the turn lane I saw that the impatient driver was at the helm of a school van full of kids. No reason for him to be in a hurry, but I see it all the time. Even when markets have a highway almost closed off, you will see people driving by way too fast. Lots of driving freedom here and no enforcement, but it leads to awfully bad driving habits.

Edited September 14, 2012 by T_Dog

[jaltsc]

"why do fewer and fewer people know traffic rules and drive with extremely bad manners than in the past?" "Most importantly, we must strictly follow traffic laws, while authorities need to enforce them evenly in every area."

Here is one of the problems. Many people have no idea that "manners" have a different purpose than "traffic laws" and the two are not interchangeable on the road. The purpose of traffic laws is to provide order, predictability and safety. I have seen people driving with the green light and stop to let someone who has a red light cut out of a street and make a turn. Good manners, Yes...Dangerous...Hell Yes! Drivers develop the idea that they can ignore the red light since it is good manners to let them make the turn whenever they please. The other situation I witness all the time is drivers not stopping at an intersection or end of a driveway to see if there is traffic coming. They drive to the middle of the crossroad and then look to see if there is oncoming traffic.

The person who follows the laws will usually be the victim of the crash since he assumes that others are also obeying traffic laws and procedures.

People are driving with the same mindset they had while riding a horse and cart 100 years ago. It's a lot different going 10 km. an hour and 50 km. an hour. And of course, you had the reaction of the horse which could spot danger a lot better than many of today's drivers.

As for the driver's test. Stevie Wonder could pass the driver's test if he flashed 600 THB.

[creck]

The OP mentions two well publicised accidents. They are remarkable accidents but that is not why they came to prominence. It was because of the clear mismanagement of justice and policing. Not much to do with road safety.

The most important thing needed in Thailand is the setting of standards, training and licencing of driver training schools. The driving licence test needs to be to be useful. These two can only cause a long term improvement in accident rates but almost all other attempts are useless without this being implemented. Of course, the real enforcement of regulations must also happen before we will see any improvement.

The OP’s example of the hill start problem is a good example. The driving instruction and test needs to include a demonstration of this simple technique. I go about in taxis and rarely come across a driver who can do a faultless hill start. It certainly is nothing to do with the introduction of cars that help in this – how can it be?

The OP seems to be saying that better cars make worse drivers. This is an illogical and unproven connection. Cars have been steadily improved from the beginning. A reduction in vehicle caused accidents has been clearly shown. A mitigation of accident in car injuries is also evident. Other improvements have helped the driver in his difficult task of driving safely.

A better standard of accident recording and investigation would show improvements that could be made in the road environment. Many privately (and some utility) erected items block views and even intrude onto the road space. Road design and construction is quite good but maintenance and reinstatement is poor even when it happens.

Signs and white lines are not bad in Thailand; although the use of warning signs seems to be almost non-existent. The use of warning rumble lines is either over applied or absent depending on the route. Such things need to be consistently applied.

I dare not start to mention traffic control. It is so bad it needlessly causes driver frustration.

[NangrongJ]

creck - you mention 'a better standard of accident reporting'. Thailand has not been accepted into the UN/WHO list of world road safety as it is non-compliant. One of the reasons why it is non-compliant is the recording of statistics! At best they are vastly inaccurate and at worst Walter Mitty was the author!

[MartinL]

So, according to the article, the deplorable standard of driving in Thailand is due to the manufacturers having to sell their vehicles to maintain business. Nothing to do with the laughable driving test, almost non-existent enforcement of licensing laws and the use of overloaded & poorly-loaded vehicles, dangerously "maintained" vehicles then. Certainly nothing to do with police or government here.

Proper testing & licensing would reduce the opportunities for manufacturers to "sell vehicles to inexperienced and less capable people". Proper vehicle identification would make drivers less likely to think they could "get away with it" because their vehicle has no registration plates - it should be a case of "no number plates - no use of the vehicle". Enforcement of lane discipline so that vehicle - especially buses - are encouraged to return to left-hand lane after overtaking. I'm sure we've all followed a bus for km after km with it stuck in the RHS lane with no intention of moving over for faster traffic. Even something as basic as mirrors cause a problem here - bike mirrors are for looking at anything other than the road behind you - or even removed entirely (to reduce drag?? ) - so I'd guess many car mirrors are similarly poorly adjusted and useless. If I can see a driver's eyes in his mirrors, he can see me - sadly, I frequently can't see his eyes.

Returning to UK to drive on holiday is an absolute pleasure compared to here. Those resident in UK say driving lacks courtesy there. If only they could experience the Thai standards of driving courtesy. My wife agrees with me that driving in UK is much less hassle than here - although she's only ever been a passenger there, she's noticed how people are usually polite & cooperative on UK roads. I can drive there for 6 hours and feel fresh as a daisy at the end of it - an hour's drive here has me foaming at the mouth.

Edited September 14, 2012 by MartinL

[GeorgeO]

many people don't know traffic rules. corruption is the major cause. issuing driving license is too easy.

Driving skills in the UK were promoted through constant airing of short advertisements on road safety and courtesy. This was then followed by the production of the Highway Code, which all drivers had to study before going forward for their driving test. A basic awareness of right and wrong, what all the signs refer to, and the penalties for ignoring them, makes all the difference!

[Valentine]

When taking the computer based Q&A test for a driving license there are no questions regarding spacial awareness e.g. when driving at 80ks how long to come to a stop. Drink driving ? no questions e.g. if you have three standard drinks in X time would you expect to be over the limit. Driving tests are not conducted in traffic conditions, so zero assessment of practical driving skills. No wonder there is such a high incident of traffic accidents.

Not quite true. When I first sat my driving licence here I went upstairs to the testing centre where it took ages to be acknowledged by the lady who was running it as she seemed to be staring out the window while doing her nails. I was eventually given an old tattered road code book in English & told to learn it as the written test would begin in 20 minutes. It was multi choice & not so hard as most of the rules were similar to back home. I was then told to get in my car drive out the gate, turn right & drive back in the other gate. It now dawned on me the lady was actually working & not slacking off before as she was observing the practical driving test.

There are many inconsiderate drivers in Phuket, many new cars coming on to the roads many of which are becoming potholed & no sign of proper maintenance other than the occasional quick fix. No new roads are planned or being built & so far the only remedy is the building of an underpass at Phuket's most busy intersection which will disrupt traffic for 2 years. These along with the me me attitude all contribute to the road toll of which Phuket has one of the worst in the land.

[eezergood]

The VIP mentality here is astounding, everyone is a VIP & has a ridiculous sense of entitlement and this transcends normal behaviour. It is evident in so many aspects of contemporary Thai culture, unfortunatly the results from this praticular area can & often are deadly!

[NangrongJ]

At least 25 people per day are killed on Thailand's roads but you won't read that in any Thai publication! What is worse tan death is the injuries, they maim or disable the driver which affects the income of a whole family!

[tinfoilhat]

what a crock.

the point is Thailand is remiss in ensuring that people are properly trained and licensed to drive.

the onus is not on car manufacturers, its on government and police.

[NangrongJ]

George O - driving skills in the uk, which is the benchmark for driver training in the world, was achieved through the 3 'E's! It takes at least 2 years to qualify as an Approved Driving Instructor (ADI), there are 3 part exams and the standards must be maintained or the instructor is struck off the register! There are additional and further qualifications including advanced driving tests and up to a university accredited diploma which I have as well as all the advanced driving tests! This is unique to a few EU countries.

Offending drivers are sent for re-training (driver improvement course), this is run by advanced driving instructors and overseen by the police.

Anything that is gained easily, has little value and respect. Something that is difficult to obtain and easy to lose is another matter!

[zakk9]

At least 25 people per day are killed on Thailand's roads but you won't read that in any Thai publication! What is worse tan death is the injuries, they maim or disable the driver which affects the income of a whole family!

WHO documented several years ago that the number of traffic deaths in Thailand are around 30,000 per year, not the officially reported 13-14,000. That's around 80 deaths per day. Probably around 80% of those are people on motorbikes.

The underreporting is due to the fact that many traffic deaths are reported as "Cause of death: unknown". A large majority of the victims are male.

Edited September 14, 2012 by zakk9