Thailand Is #2 Place To Live And Work For Wealthy Expats: 100 Country Survey

[webfact]

Where do the wealthiest expatriates live?

SINGAPORE: -- A small island state in Southeast Asia has come out tops in a listing of countries that boast of the richest expatriates.

In an annual survey released by HSBC on Monday — which was conducted across 100 countries and involved more than 5,000 expatriates — Singapore emerged as the most favored expat destination to make money in and accumulate luxuries.

Foreigners, who make up a sizable portion of Singapore’s 5 million-plus population, earn more than those living in any other part of the world. About 54 percent of Singapore-based expats who took part in the poll earn more than $200,000 annually compared to a global average of only 7 percent according to the Expat Explorer 2012 survey.

Singapore, which came in third place last year, moved up two slots to beat Bermuda at No. 2 and Thailand at No. 3. The three other Asian countries that made it to top 10 are Hong Kong, China, and Vietnam.

The survey, in its fifth year, showed 80 percent of the expats who moved to Singapore saw an increase in their disposable income. Around 44 percent reported an increase of 50 percent or more in their disposable income, compared to the global average of just under a fifth.

Given the bleak employment picture in both Europe and the United States, job hunters are increasingly looking eastwards for opportunities, with 70 percent of the expats surveyed citing better career prospects for the move to Singapore.

Better Quality of Life

In terms of quality of life, Singapore also scored high, coming in fourth in the world and second in Asia after Thailand. Better accommodation, less commuting time, and a more active social life were some of the pluses of living in this tropical nation, the survey found.

Singapore is also child-friendly in the eyes of its expats. Ninety-one percent of the respondents said they felt their children were safer here. Costs, however, were a concern with 83 percent saying they are spending more on education for their children.

“Singapore is fast becoming an all-round expat destination for career progression, financial rewards and quality of life,” said Paul Arrowsmith, head of retail banking and wealth management at HSBC Singapore.

Where Are They Investing?

Expats in Singapore do not favor any one asset class and maintain a diversified investment portfolio. Those earning $200,000 to $250,000 a year have moved over time from a higher proportion of cash investments to a relatively even mix of cash, real estate and equities, the survey found.

“Expats have come to realize, given wider economic uncertainties, the advantage of diversification to hedge against volatility,” wrote HSBC in its survey report.

Source: http://www.theblaze....patriates-live/

-- theblaze.com 2012-10-09

[webfact]

Singapore is rich expats' top place to live and work: Survey

By Aaron Low

SINGAPORE: -- Singapore has emerged as the top place for wealthy expatriates to live and work in, a new survey by HSBC Bank has shown.

Expats in the survey ranked Singapore first out of 30 countries based on economic factors such as earning power, disposable income and ability to accumulate luxuries.

Thailand was in the second spot, followed by Cayman Islands in third place. About 44 per cent of respondents said they saw a 50 per cent or more increase in their disposable income after they relocated to Singapore, the report said.

The report, which surveyed more than 5,000 expats in 100 countries, also said that 54 per cent of expats here earned more than US$200,000 (S$246,000) a year. They also ranked Singapore highly for its quality of life, placing the Republic fourth overall, especially for its safe environment in which to bring up children.

Source: http://www.straitsti...survey-20121009

-- straitstimes.com 2012- 10-09

[JurgenG]

Here is the survey http://www.expatexplorer.hsbc.com

[JurgenG]

Quite surprising ? Obviously the HSBC wealthy customers do not post in this forum. Or, the other way around, the grumpy posters of this forums are not among the wealthy expats who were surveyed in this forum.

I compared the results of the two places where I share my time, Hong Kong and Thailand, and I quite agree with the survey. Especially one of the few advantages Hong Kong has on Thailand, by very little I admit, is fitting in the new culture. Probably the British influence.

[lostbuffalo]

It's no wonder expats earn more in Singapore - you have to to survive! Cost of living in Singapore is very high compared to other countries.

[BeforeTigers]

Actually, I believe it says #3 for wealthy expats. It's a little confusing.

But #1 in Asia for quality of living.

I can see that.

[F430murci]

Survey has Mexico like # 6 and India above US. Nuff said . . . Mexico is an absolute war zone with an awful economy right now unless you are into narcotraficking and own a funeral home. India is absolute hole. Awful. Love Thailand and Singapoire though.

[Cloggie]

Never trust information from a bank so just ignore this survey.

[Docno]

I'm an expat in Singapore, and I can see how it would appeal to some, especially if money is not an issue. But the place doesn't have much 'soul', and they're killing more of it each year in their bid to turn it into an upscale disneyland. There used to be dirtier, edgier places here where things went on that you wouldn't want your mother to know about. But those places are being squeezed out by shiny new shopping malls and condos. So yeah, a great place if your priorities are on efficiency, predictability, cleanliness, safety, education, air conditioning, being able to speak English with people, and shopping for branded goods. Some of these things I appreciate too. But I find that I'm much happier when I go to Thailand (usually Isaan) where there is a rich culture and more warmth and openness to foreigners... and where my money goes so much further.

[keemapoot]

Quite surprising ? Obviously the HSBC wealthy customers do not post in this forum. Or, the other way around, the grumpy posters of this forums are not among the wealthy expats who were surveyed in this forum.

I compared the results of the two places where I share my time, Hong Kong and Thailand, and I quite agree with the survey. Especially one of the few advantages Hong Kong has on Thailand, by very little I admit, is fitting in the new culture. Probably the British influence.

Thanks for providing the link. I too, have spent many years in both HK and SG, and also agree with the survey comparison. I prefer HK, though I understand why SG scores better. Also, I agree with comments that SG has become too disney-parkish and lost much of its charm.

[Billmont]

It's no wonder expats earn more in Singapore - you have to to survive! Cost of living in Singapore is very high compared to other countries.

Yes Singapore may be expensive but it would appear that disposable income is higher in Singapore which is the most important part necessary to accumlate wealth as well as having a good standard of living.

[Docno]

Oh yeah, the other issue here in Singapore is that there is now a strong backlash against foreigners here. When I first came here 13 years ago, the population was at 4 million, including 1 million foreigners (from maids and labourers to professional expats). Now we're at over 5 million, and the citizen population has increased only a bit in that time... we're talking about another million foreigners using the infrastructure here. Streets are more crowded, there are more traffic jams, things break down more often, etc. So the anti-foreigner sentiment here is very strong... you see it everyday in forums, in the news, etc. Of course, this place wouldn't be so successful without foreigners (cheap labour as well as professionals), but a lot of Singaporeans have lost sight of this and simply want to get rid of all those smelly unkempt foreigners that dirty the place and cause all the crime (in their minds).

Had a laugh yesterday: sitting in a pub over-hearing a Singaporean 'auntie' chastising a Filipina waitress for not having Chinese food on the menu. The waitress repeatedly tried to explain that it was supposed to be an IRISH pub, but the Singaporean lady was incensed that she could not get her Bee Hoon there.

[tropico]

I lived in Singapore before and to be honest if you want to have a decent life you need to earn about 6000-8000 SGD a month. I was not that fortunate since I was just a research associate and getting only 4000SGD/month. I could barely make it, the rental alone was almost half of my salary. The place I could afford was just a very tiny HDB apartment (close to university though) in a 30 years old building. I surveyed plenty places before deciding and i have seen some of the worst, dirtiest, tiniest apartments in my life, but still expensive.

The public transportation would be good if you do not have to take it during pick hours, when it is a total mess!

I love cycling, and Singapore it is not a bicycle friendly place, and actually quite dangerous.

In terms of places to go, if you like shopping and going from malls to malls, then it is your place. I just can take that!

I could talk for hours about what i did not like in Singapore, maybe it would have been different if I earned 200,000 USD a year!

But there is one things I really like about Singapore and that is safety. You won't feel as much safe anywhere else!

In Thailand (chiang mai) I have definitely a better quality life!

[Docno]

It's no wonder expats earn more in Singapore - you have to to survive! Cost of living in Singapore is very high compared to other countries.

Yes Singapore may be expensive but it would appear that disposable income is higher in Singapore which is the most important part necessary to accumlate wealth as well as having a good standard of living.

Yep, I've saved a lot more here than would have ever been possible in Canada. That said, I would be hard-pressed to claim that my quality of life is better here. I live in a rather small apartment (foreigners cannot buy 'landed property') and refuse to pay the prices they demand for cars here. In Canada, it was a 20 cycle ride to a national park with fantastic trails... I gave up on cycling when I came here because the drivers feel you have no right to be on the road and will blast you for driving in the gutter. The appeal for me is being to able to do my work in English, have access to a relatively cosmopolitan society (my friends come from all over the old), and being able to hop up to places like Thailand, Cambodia, Laos, etc. cheaply once or twice a month to keep my sanity. In Canada, you fly three hours on a plane and when you land, everything looks and sounds the same.

[peter37]

I'm an expat in Singapore, and I can see how it would appeal to some, especially if money is not an issue. But the place doesn't have much 'soul', and they're killing more of it each year in their bid to turn it into an upscale disneyland. There used to be dirtier, edgier places here where things went on that you wouldn't want your mother to know about. But those places are being squeezed out by shiny new shopping malls and condos. So yeah, a great place if your priorities are on efficiency, predictability, cleanliness, safety, education, air conditioning, being able to speak English with people, and shopping for branded goods. Some of these things I appreciate too. But I find that I'm much happier when I go to Thailand (usually Isaan) where there is a rich culture and more warmth and openness to foreigners... and where my money goes so much further.

Very nicely put!

[Arkady]

Tantalisingly the survey doesn't say why Thailand came in second in Asia. We are left to assume that it comes in very close after Singapore in terms of earning power, career progression, low commuting time and child safety.

Then I noticed a quote from HSBC's head of retail banking and wealth management in Singapore which makes me wonder. If Thailand ranks so highly in this survey, why has HSBC just closed down its retail banking and wealth management unit in Bangkok and is about to close its credit card division? Perhaps the next regional CEO will have to execute a rapid about turn and re-launch these businesses. However, they will have to try harder next time. By the end the quality of staff and service at HSBC Bangkok was absolutely pitiful.

[Docno]

I lived in Singapore before and to be honest if you want to have a decent life you need to earn about 6000-8000 SGD a month. I was not that fortunate since I was just a research associate and getting only 4000SGD/month. I could barely make it, the rental alone was almost half of my salary. The place I could afford was just a very tiny HDB apartment (close to university though) in a 30 years old building. I surveyed plenty places before deciding and i have seen some of the worst, dirtiest, tiniest apartments in my life, but still expensive.

The public transportation would be good if you do not have to take it during pick hours, when it is a total mess!

I love cycling, and Singapore it is not a bicycle friendly place, and actually quite dangerous.

In terms of places to go, if you like shopping and going from malls to malls, then it is your place. I just can take that!

I could talk for hours about what i did not like in Singapore, maybe it would have been different if I earned 200,000 USD a year!

But there is one things I really like about Singapore and that is safety. You won't feel as much safe anywhere else!

In Thailand (chiang mai) I have definitely a better quality life!

Yep, completely sucks for cycling here, and I miss that badly. And now you have to make A LOT more than $8000/month to truly be comfortable.

[Gweiloman]

I'm an expat in Singapore, and I can see how it would appeal to some, especially if money is not an issue. But the place doesn't have much 'soul', and they're killing more of it each year in their bid to turn it into an upscale disneyland. There used to be dirtier, edgier places here where things went on that you wouldn't want your mother to know about. But those places are being squeezed out by shiny new shopping malls and condos. So yeah, a great place if your priorities are on efficiency, predictability, cleanliness, safety, education, air conditioning, being able to speak English with people, and shopping for branded goods. Some of these things I appreciate too. But I find that I'm much happier when I go to Thailand (usually Isaan) where there is a rich culture and more warmth and openness to foreigners... and where my money goes so much further.

Fully agree. In the last 20 or so years, I've lived in Hong Kong, Thailand, Malaysia, Singapore, Switzerland and the UK. Thailand is bottom of my list as far as conveniences, cleanliness, efficiency etc is concerned but still where I would prefer to live (and do) because of it's uniqueness and character

[lothda]

You not wealthy if you still have to work

[pbeieio]

BKK is a disorganised, filthy, dangerous DUMP compared to Singapore. So Thailand could only have ranked so high if they excluded those expats who currently live in BKK!!!!!

Edited October 9, 2012 by pbeieio

[Fozfromoz]

Oh yeah, the other issue here in Singapore is that there is now a strong backlash against foreigners here. When I first came here 13 years ago, the population was at 4 million, including 1 million foreigners (from maids and labourers to professional expats). Now we're at over 5 million, and the citizen population has increased only a bit in that time... we're talking about another million foreigners using the infrastructure here. Streets are more crowded, there are more traffic jams, things break down more often, etc. So the anti-foreigner sentiment here is very strong... you see it everyday in forums, in the news, etc. Of course, this place wouldn't be so successful without foreigners (cheap labour as well as professionals), but a lot of Singaporeans have lost sight of this and simply want to get rid of all those smelly unkempt foreigners that dirty the place and cause all the crime (in their minds).

Had a laugh yesterday: sitting in a pub over-hearing a Singaporean 'auntie' chastising a Filipina waitress for not having Chinese food on the menu. The waitress repeatedly tried to explain that it was supposed to be an IRISH pub, but the Singaporean lady was incensed that she could not get her Bee Hoon there.

So......... Did you slip across the road to the Towers after a few at Muddy's?

Seriously, I have been expat in Singapore too. Agree with the negative foreigner sentiment increasing. The reason it's favoured is if an expat is on a good package with car and condo, 2 of the most expensive things there, then disposable income is good, due to the low tax rates. Don't know where they get the > 250k salaries, certainly not in my industry, getting heavier than air objects to leave the ground. Perhaps I should get a job in Banking.

[khunbillmex]

Survey has Mexico like # 6 and India above US. Nuff said . . . Mexico is an absolute war zone with an awful economy right now unless you are into narcotraficking and own a funeral home. India is absolute hole. Awful. Love Thailand and Singapoire though.

So sad the press on Mexico. Seems every article has to include, "...since Calderon took power 47,xxx have been killed" True enuf - mostly the bad guys but on par, given the narco war, with the sport shooting of innocents in the US over the same period. The schools and cinemas here are safer. I have lived in dead [no pun intended] central Mexico for over 16 years along with 2% of the country's Thai population. It is a great place in many regards and lacking in others: food: yuk. Architecture, cultural activity and parks excellent. Most every town looks the same but not in a Thai way. Border runs not a problem [immigration, obtuse as it is, wants us here] - our BR's are to the Mall del Norte located in Laredo TX. On one biennial run when being harassed by a US border agent as to why we were traveling in with empty suitcases we had to explain that the name of the mall was for 'us' [Mexicans and ex-pats] - and had nothing to do with 'them'.

If the narco war is so terrible why are multi-nationals investing billions here [just in my state] ? I think it is a bell-weather of what [unreported in the press] is the eventual and probably not so far off recovery of the US economy.

All that said we are trying to sell our place and move to KK where we have a larger parcel of land. No rush - the twins are only 2 now although I'm aging but my wife never seems to.

Also - expat-dom is more boring here albeit safer. As I get daily posts from Thaivisa.com you'll be happy to know that a lot fewer of us are getting our members chopped off, murder our girlfriends or are 93 year old bail jumping pedophiles. Oh, I forgot the story about the masturbaters jumping out of the bushes. We just can't match that stuff. Our airlines though seem just as bad and way more expensive than what you have at Swampy or Don M,

Viva Mexico - and beware of whatever Tequila you see in the Land of Smiles - we've never heard of it [the brands] here.

[sunshine51]

So much for survey's....HSBC is also involved in money laundering in Mexico

with the narcotrafficers. Singapore is too "clean" for my tastes...I need a bit

of dirt in my life to make my day complete...and I don't wanna get fined for

playing around in it either. Yeah...Singapore is a "fine" nation state...they got

fines for everything...and enforce em too.

I can't help to wonder where the worlds not so wealthy expats live....

the Philippines? Sure can't be LOS.....or can it be?....Hmmmm

[Chads]

I'm an expat in Singapore, and I can see how it would appeal to some, especially if money is not an issue. But the place doesn't have much 'soul', and they're killing more of it each year in their bid to turn it into an upscale disneyland. There used to be dirtier, edgier places here where things went on that you wouldn't want your mother to know about. But those places are being squeezed out by shiny new shopping malls and condos. So yeah, a great place if your priorities are on efficiency, predictability, cleanliness, safety, education, air conditioning, being able to speak English with people, and shopping for branded goods. Some of these things I appreciate too. But I find that I'm much happier when I go to Thailand (usually Isaan) where there is a rich culture and more warmth and openness to foreigners... and where my money goes so much further.

As a Singaporean I'd have to applaud you on your analysis

[Chads]

Well done, those here who have lived and understood the reality of Singapore. I guess the wealthiest may not know what you're all talking about because they probably have very little contact with the real Singapore anyway.

[tropico]

BKK is a disorganised, filthy, dangerous DUMP compared to Singapore. So Thailand could only have ranked so high if they excluded those expats who currently live in BKK!!!!!

Singapore might be more clean, safer and more organized.........but is extremely boring to say the least!

[tropico]

Bangkok might not be the perfect city but it is not boring and expensive like Singapore is!!

[Card]

Tantalisingly the survey doesn't say why Thailand came in second in Asia. We are left to assume that it comes in very close after Singapore in terms of earning power, career progression, low commuting time and child safety.

Then I noticed a quote from HSBC's head of retail banking and wealth management in Singapore which makes me wonder. If Thailand ranks so highly in this survey, why has HSBC just closed down its retail banking and wealth management unit in Bangkok and is about to close its credit card division? Perhaps the next regional CEO will have to execute a rapid about turn and re-launch these businesses. However, they will have to try harder next time. By the end the quality of staff and service at HSBC Bangkok was absolutely pitiful.

No, child safety does not come into Thailand's number 2 - only 'experience' and 'financial'. Look at the link provided by one of the posters.

[cdnski12]

Lothda appropriately points out that you are not wealthy, if you still have to work. $200K USD is upper middle class ... not wealthy. I really doubt the veracity of this survey. Why would wealthy people live in countries with a dismal climates, unless they absolutely had to? I expected Thailand to be around 25 C from Nov - Feb. I usually find it to be nearer 35 C and 85% humidity. I don't recall BKK or Singapore being that hot, when I was there in 1972/73. Singapore is even hotter all year long. Really wealthy people live in Burmuda, the Bahamas & Martineque.If you can get up to 700m or even 1000m altitude, like Dalat in Vietnam ... then you are in Nivarna. Beautiful weather all year long. I doubt the nite life in Da Lat would interest most "wealthy" people. The Golf Course is nice, but grossly over priced as per Cambodia & China. Thailand is admittedly a Golf Nivarna ... which is why I go there ... oh ya ... the gals ...

[Kananga]

I lived in Singapore for 8 years and saw many changes over that time, and not many for the better. 2004 must have been the country's peak. Good infrastructure, not too expensive, government starting to release its parental grip on the nation etc. Then it all started going downhill rapidly from 06 onwards. Rampant inflation, swelling population, old buildings with character systematically destroyed, growing anti foreigner sentiment from locals (although I always remind them when they direct it at me that if they could do the jobs themselves we would gladly leave).

I moved there on a low salary (by Singapore standards) and by the time I left I tripled my salary, had the car and housing allowance, club membership (which I never used) etc and I was still less happy than when I first arrived.

Soul destroying doesn't even come close to describing living in Singapore. There is no homegrown talent or culture worth noticing, everything is imported, from the music, to the clothing fashion etc. There is little in the way of places to take kids and anywhere interesting is overrun on weekends by swarms of locals with no sense of direction and their spoilt little emperor kids. As a result I know people who live in little ex-pat bubbles and have never seen anything of the country despite having lived there for a number of years.

HSBC did a similar survey several years ago ago and while Singapore ranked high for safety, infrastructure it ranked 18th for interaction with the locals. About 14 places lower than Thailand. When you consider that the majority of Singaporeans are well educated and speak good English, something just doesn't add up there. Although when the majority of women would spend $3000 on a handbag and not get their teeth fixed, or men will show off their rolex while wearing cheap shoes and nylon trousers is it really to be expected?

For somewhere the government paints as a sort of utopia, a Switzerland of the East, it still amazes me how the majority of people who spend any time there come to hate the place once they wake up and see it for what it really is. A small, overpriced, arrogant, fake soul destroying, superficial expat posting on a downward spiral.