Head Of Hospital Group Warns Of Doctor Shortage In Thailand

[webfact]

Head of hospital group warns of doctor shortage

PONGPHON SARNSAMAK

THE NATION

BANGKOK: -- Thailand needs to drastically ramp up its training of physicians, as 40,000 more doctors are needed to provide quality healthcare, but only 2,500 graduate every year, the Private Hospital Association said yesterday.

"Thailand still has a severe doctor shortage and there are not enough to provide medical services," said Dr Chalerm Hanpanich, president of the association.

The doctor shortage has to be resolved to enhance the country's competitiveness ahead of the launch of the Asean Economic Community (AEC), the doctor said.

There are not enough physicians to provide medical services not only for the 67 million Thais but also the more than 3 million foreigners, including migrant workers and tourists, expected to be in the country when the AEC kicks off in 2015, Chalerm said.

According to a report by the Public Health Ministry, Thailand has 43,424 physicians working at public and private hospitals across the country. To provide high quality medical services, that figure needs to be doubled.

The 2011 World Health Statistics report of the World Health Organisation showed that in Thailand, there are just three physicians for every 10,000 patients, compared to 18.3 in Singapore, 9.4 in Malaysia, 11.5 in the Philippines and 12.2 in Vietnam.

In Norway, the United Kingdom and US, the ratios were 42, 27 and 24.

A recent survey by the Medical Council found that 18 medical schools across the country could produce only 2,500 doctors per year. The council expects that Thailand would have 10,000 more physicians in five years.

Chalerm was speaking at a seminar on "The Direction for Private Hospital" organised by the Marketing Pharmacy Association of Thailand.

If physician output is not enough to provide medical services in the country, the government should import MDs from other countries, the doctor said.

The government should also designate Thailand as the medical education hub for Southeast Asia and interest students from neighbouring countries who want to be a doctor to study at medical schools in Thailand, he said.

To enhance the country's competitive edge under the AEC, the government has to revise some laws such as the Hospital Act and National Health Act, which block the capacity of private hospitals to compete, Chalerm insisted.

The government should give tax privileges to private hospitals and also use the same standard to regulate public and private hospitals. This would help the government to upgrade hospital standards nationwide, he added.

-- The Nation 2012-10-26

[jackr]

The government should also designate Thailand as the medical education hub for Southeast Asia

Here we go.

The doctor shortage has to be resolved to enhance the country's competitiveness ahead of the launch of the Asean Economic Community (AEC), the doctor said

And not because of the needs of the people?

Number is of course part of the problem, but some of the doctors out there are pretty darn mediocre at best. Many are just not knowledgeable enough on their chosen topic; others are dangerously egoistic and face is not a good thing to take seriously in such a field. There are also, of course, some excellent Thai doctors, even in the government hospitals. Just not enough, and not enough competency.

[LaoPo]

..."Thailand has 43,424 physicians working at public and private hospitals across the country."

Thailand: July 2012 estimated: 67 Million people with some 43.500 doctors ?

Netherlands: July 2012 estimated: 16.7 million people and some 59.000 doctors (Jan 1 - 2010)

Conclusion? The number of Doctors in Thailand should be 174.000 in comparison with Holland; The respective Thai Governments in the past have done little to nothing to improve healthcare for their own -poor- people...

Nothing has changed...everything for the Haves......the Haves-Not are not important.

Source: CIA World Factbook: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/nl.html

[jerrysteve]

HOW can that be? There goes there goes the dream of a being the ASIAN HUB of MEDICAL care.. There is a shortage of Spokes to turn the WheeL around the HUB. But I think, Khao San Road has plenty of medical diplomas to more than make up for the short fall + I heard the medical degrees made on Khao San Rd for specialties in Gynocology are very popular.

Edited October 26, 2012 by jerrysteve

[turboturtle]

I feel that the healthcare system in Thailand is certainly over rated! Most doctors don't even graduate medical school with earned credentials, everything is like a reach around, you yank me and I'll yank you.....(Just dont yank out my kidneys when I'm only getting a gallstone out)!!

[asiawatcher]

I feel that the healthcare system in Thailand is certainly over rated! Most doctors don't even graduate medical school with earned credentials, everything is like a reach around, you yank me and I'll yank you.....(Just dont yank out my kidneys when I'm only getting a gallstone out)!!

"Most doctors don't even graduate medical school with earned credentials,..."

Care to back up that ridiculous statement with facts?

[fstarbkk]

Oh boy! They almost made it trough an entire article and then there it was - the dreaded H-word!

I'm shocked by the statistics concerning the ratio of MD's to patients. Clearly this bodes very poorly for the value one can expect in terms of the, once reasonably priced, high quality healtcare one cane expect in private hospitals here. Already the charges are escalating and the services are deteriorating in the high-end facilities. Based on the information presented here, this trend is likely to continue and accelerate in the coming years.

[lostinisaan]

The doctor shortage has to be resolved to enhance the country's competitiveness ahead of the launch of the Asean Economic Community (AEC), the doctor said.

There are not enough physicians to provide medical services not only for the 67 million Thais but also the more than 3 million foreigners, including migrant workers and tourists, expected to be in the country when the AEC kicks off in 2015, Chalerm said

It's not because of the country's competitiveness regarding the ASEAN Muppet show in 2015.Not enough doctors means not enough doctors, right?

As far as I know is the population of Thailand already 70 million people. The numbers of migrant workers will be much higher than all the 'foreigners' and tourists together.

Thailand, the hub of no idea what's up ...

Edited October 26, 2012 by lostinisaan

[cloudhopper]

This delusional thinks that just by declaring LOS a hub of medical education people will flock here to study medicine. No doubt the medical schools here teach entirely in English.

[chiangmaikelly]

Oh boy! They almost made it trough an entire article and then there it was - the dreaded H-word!

I'm shocked by the statistics concerning the ratio of MD's to patients. Clearly this bodes very poorly for the value one can expect in terms of the, once reasonably priced, high quality healtcare one cane expect in private hospitals here. Already the charges are escalating and the services are deteriorating in the high-end facilities. Based on the information presented here, this trend is likely to continue and accelerate in the coming years.

I have been going to the same hospital for quite some time for the same heart condition and the service has gotten better (they added a cath lab) and the charges have gotten less (switched me to generic meds). Unless you can back up your claims perhaps they are just rumors.

[Thai at Heart]

Quite frightening statistics. but then when was the last new medical school in Thailand created?

[fstarbkk]

I can back them up, don't worry. Not in the habit of making posts based on speculation or rumor. Nice for you that your hospital bought new hardware and switched you to cheaper generics. But buy those meds at a normal pharmacy and see how much extra the hospital makes on these.

Been here for 10 years and have seen the basic charges at the same top private hospitals steadily go up over the years. Also, they have learned to enrich the revenue stream with an endless array of extra charges, in the same way the US commercial hospital groups do.

Edited October 26, 2012 by fstarbkk

[tebee]

. No doubt the medical schools here teach entirely in English.

The bulk of the teaching Thai but several parts are in English and most of the main textbooks used are in English so most future MD should be able to understand English. On the other hand if you don't want to remain in Thailand after you have qualified you have to pay about half a million baht towards your tuition.

Stepson's a medical student at Mahidol

[Arkady]

Nevertheless Thailand is promoting itself as a medical tourism hub and at the same time is refusing to honour its commitment to the AEC to allow free inflow of ASEAN medical workers by 2015. They still insist that foreign doctors and nurses must pass exams in Thai to treat the foreign medical tourists who cannot speak Thai. Duh.

[hansnl]

I can back them up, don't worry. Not in the habit of making posts based on speculation or rumor. Nice for you that your hospital bought new hardware and switched you to cheaper generics. But buy those meds at a normal pharmacy and see how much extra the hospital makes on these.

Been here for 10 years and have seen the basic charges at the same top private hospitals steadily go up over the years. Also, they have learned to enrich the revenue stream with an endless array of extra charges, in the same way the US commercial hospital groups do.

Maybe, just maybe, stay away from private hospitals?

They are there solely for generating profit, most certainly not there for giving the best treatment.

As a Thai Professor Cardiology once told me:

"Dear sir, if you want to pay a lot of money, go to a private hospital, if you want the best care you can get for reasonable prices, you visit me, or my collegues, in this hospital"

The hospital is a well known state run University Hospital, working together with big state run hospital.

And yes, I have some friends that were always very fond of the private sector.

The rising costs and the many obvious things solely done to promote the bill gave them a push away from private hospitals

Not any more, they get better care in the hospitals mentioned above, for a much lower price.

Three years ago I had a medical for an insurance in a private hospital.

The nitwit doctor over there, reading my test document, declared I had a heart infarct in the past......

Panic!

Went to the Professor mentioned above.

Intake talk, and then the whole show.

The whole thing, including ECG, Ultrasound. blood tests, walking tests, you name it....

After studying the documents and test results the prof asked me: "Excuse me, but what are you doing here?"

Heart is ok, no signs of any heart trouble.

Most certainly not a heart infarct.

The bill?

1780 baht

[khunken]

'The government should give tax privileges to private hospitals and also use the same standard to regulate public and private hospitals. This would help the government to upgrade hospital standards nationwide, he added.'

The part in bold above is what the 'head' is getting at. More money-making for the rip-off hospitals.

The country certainly does need more doctors & make sure that incentives are there to get them to work in public hospitals. Too many of the current public hospital doctors are moonlighting by running clinics in private hospitals (I've had experience of them). The government loves to tout it's 'free' medical care but not nearly as good at funding it.

[harryfrompattaya]

..."Thailand has 43,424 physicians working at public and private hospitals across the country."

Thailand: July 2012 estimated: 67 Million people with some 43.500 doctors ?

Netherlands: July 2012 estimated: 16.7 million people and some 59.000 doctors (Jan 1 - 2010)

Conclusion? The number of Doctors in Thailand should be 174.000 in comparison with Holland; The respective Thai Governments in the past have done little to nothing to improve healthcare for their own -poor- people...

Nothing has changed...everything for the Haves......the Haves-Not are not important.

Source: CIA World Factbook: https://www.cia.gov/...ok/geos/nl.html

If Thailand lowed their standards they good get American doctors to work in their wonderful Hospitals

[drdoom6996]

Not enough Doctors, and the nurses are all going to quit and go into private pratice. Now if we could just get the PTP to quit and go away amd make room for more Doctors and pay for the Nurses, life would be grand.

[MEL1]

ASEAN will sort this out. Plenty of opportunities for ASEAN Doctors from all around, countries bordering Thailand, and the likes of Singapore and Philippines to fill the numbers. No problems come 2015!

-mel.

[culicine]

ASEAN will sort this out. Plenty of opportunities for ASEAN Doctors from all around, countries bordering Thailand, and the likes of Singapore and Philippines to fill the numbers. No problems come 2015!

-mel.

But who will they be allowed to treat? If they can't speak Thai they would not be working in government hospitals. I assume they would work in the private sector, treating foreign patients.

Edited October 26, 2012 by culicine

[culicine]

'The government should give tax privileges to private hospitals and also use the same standard to regulate public and private hospitals. This would help the government to upgrade hospital standards nationwide, he added.'

The part in bold above is what the 'head' is getting at. More money-making for the rip-off hospitals.

The country certainly does need more doctors & make sure that incentives are there to get them to work in public hospitals. Too many of the current public hospital doctors are moonlighting by running clinics in private hospitals (I've had experience of them). The government loves to tout it's 'free' medical care but not nearly as good at funding it.

A colleague went to a private hospital with chest pains - they wanted to put him in ICU at a cool 400K baht a night ....they even took his passport. A few calls and the boss moved him to a significantly cheaper hospital. Yep most are all about money!

[culicine]

I can back them up, don't worry. Not in the habit of making posts based on speculation or rumor. Nice for you that your hospital bought new hardware and switched you to cheaper generics. But buy those meds at a normal pharmacy and see how much extra the hospital makes on these.

Been here for 10 years and have seen the basic charges at the same top private hospitals steadily go up over the years. Also, they have learned to enrich the revenue stream with an endless array of extra charges, in the same way the US commercial hospital groups do.

Maybe, just maybe, stay away from private hospitals?

They are there solely for generating profit, most certainly not there for giving the best treatment.

As a Thai Professor Cardiology once told me:

"Dear sir, if you want to pay a lot of money, go to a private hospital, if you want the best care you can get for reasonable prices, you visit me, or my collegues, in this hospital"

The hospital is a well known state run University Hospital, working together with big state run hospital.

And yes, I have some friends that were always very fond of the private sector.

The rising costs and the many obvious things solely done to promote the bill gave them a push away from private hospitals

Not any more, they get better care in the hospitals mentioned above, for a much lower price.

Three years ago I had a medical for an insurance in a private hospital.

The nitwit doctor over there, reading my test document, declared I had a heart infarct in the past......

Panic!

Went to the Professor mentioned above.

Intake talk, and then the whole show.

The whole thing, including ECG, Ultrasound. blood tests, walking tests, you name it....

After studying the documents and test results the prof asked me: "Excuse me, but what are you doing here?"

Heart is ok, no signs of any heart trouble.

Most certainly not a heart infarct.

The bill?

1780 baht

Gotta love government hospitals:) I've always had good service - kidney stone issues. Paid 100 baht extra for after hours service. Luckily my wife is a civil servant so I'm under her health cover.

[Unwisemonkey]

The government should also designate Thailand as the medical education hub for Southeast Asia

Here we go.

The doctor shortage has to be resolved to enhance the country's competitiveness ahead of the launch of the Asean Economic Community (AEC), the doctor said

And not because of the needs of the people?

Number is of course part of the problem, but some of the doctors out there are pretty darn mediocre at best. Many are just not knowledgeable enough on their chosen topic; others are dangerously egoistic and face is not a good thing to take seriously in such a field. There are also, of course, some excellent Thai doctors, even in the government hospitals. Just not enough, and not enough competency.

If done right this will be extremely successful. When Hilary Clinton visited Myanmar last year I said it then and I'll say it again. The U.S. was drawing a line in the sand across South East Asia all the way across to India to tell China to chill out for a Myriad of reasons. At the time I was investigating a lot of Thai policies which were levied heavily against foreigners including Cambodians, Burmese, Loations too. Thailand has the infrastructure albeit mediocre by our lofty western standards to be the educational hub for the entire region save city states like Singapore. I was in fact toying with the idea of pursuing a degree in medicine but saw that those degree programs were (unless I was mistaken) reserved for Thai nationals only. With rising education costs in the west an advanced degree like that would cost the same as a mediocre liberal arts degree from a good University back home even with the foreign student price gouges (which every country does). So... why not. This is a very good step in the right direction and I'm glad to see it. I just hope it doesn't get flogged and bogged down by corrupt money grubbing savages in Parliament.

[ttelise]

A by product of cheap or affordable healthcare.

A doc I know recently went to Bkk to perform operations on children that Thai doctors do not offer or cannot do.

He said conditions there are pretty dismal. ORs have outdated or damaged/bent equipment, stuff missing and he had serious concerns about thoracic surgeons who always do the initial openings and the anesthesiologist. Said he will take own team and equipment if he decides to back. Different standards are care are to be expected in smaller communities, but not in large cities like Bangkok.

[chiangmaikelly]

A by product of cheap or affordable healthcare.

A doc I know recently went to Bkk to perform operations on children that Thai doctors do not offer or cannot do.

He said conditions there are pretty dismal. ORs have outdated or damaged/bent equipment, stuff missing and he had serious concerns about thoracic surgeons who always do the initial openings and the anesthesiologist. Said he will take own team and equipment if he decides to back. Different standards are care are to be expected in smaller communities, but not in large cities like Bangkok.

Is that all the hospitals in Bangkok? I mean you did say conditions there are pretty dismal.

[atyclb]

I feel that the healthcare system in Thailand is certainly over rated! Most doctors don't even graduate medical school with earned credentials, everything is like a reach around, .....(Just dont yank out my kidneys when I'm only getting a gallstone out)!!

"you yank me and I'll yank you"

Could also fit the relationship between many farang and their trophy wives / gf's

[chiangmaikelly]

I feel that the healthcare system in Thailand is certainly over rated! Most doctors don't even graduate medical school with earned credentials, everything is like a reach around, .....(Just dont yank out my kidneys when I'm only getting a gallstone out)!!

"you yank me and I'll yank you"

Could also fit the relationship between many farang and their trophy wives / gf's

Don't you mean boyfriends?

[lockman]

I don't know about all government hospitals, often I've just gotten the runaround there. Spent 3 nights trying to see a Rheumatologist; never saw one (they had 3) (whole lobby full of people, some waiting a week) but saw numerous others who were training but didn't know about my condition. Finally talked to a nurse who told me to go to a private hospital the next day as the professors would be working there. Govt hospital wanted to do a scan for 6000B. Went to private, 1.5 hours done and out. Knew immediately what I had, wanted an ultrasound to ensure no other problems, got shots and meds. Total bill was 1800B. 3 nights in hotel was 4000B. Now just contact nurse there to see if DR available, go and come back. Excellent care every time.

[fstarbkk]

A by product of cheap or affordable healthcare.

A doc I know recently went to Bkk to perform operations on children that Thai doctors do not offer or cannot do.

He said conditions there are pretty dismal. ORs have outdated or damaged/bent equipment, stuff missing and he had serious concerns about thoracic surgeons who always do the initial openings and the anesthesiologist. Said he will take own team and equipment if he decides to back. Different standards are care are to be expected in smaller communities, but not in large cities like Bangkok.

Is that all the hospitals in Bangkok? I mean you did say conditions there are pretty dismal.

It's fairly well known that the government hospitals are chronically underfunded. Hardly a week without some reports on this.

I would have lost my arm in an accident a few years back, if I had stayed at the nation's premier university hospital... literally!

I know this because the chief orthopedic surgeon told me so with a resigned shrug. Not for a lack of skill, but he told me they simply didn't have the advanced facilities and supplies available to deliver the best outcome. He then referred me to a colleague at Bumrungrad who got the job done.

It's unfortunate, but true - the private hospitals can afford to be picky and select the best of the crop, mostly with overseas board cert's. Plus they can send their doctors to Europe to learn the latest, cutting edge procedures, as was the case with my arm.

Sadly, being the commercial operations they are, the private hospitals seize the advantage to the max and squeeze you for every baht they can get. Even more apallingly, the insurance companies play along and just roll over the out-of-control charges on their customers... and pretty soon we'll end up exactly where the US healthcare industry is already.

[dundee48]

I feel that the healthcare system in Thailand is certainly over rated! Most doctors don't even graduate medical school with earned credentials, everything is like a reach around, .....(Just dont yank out my kidneys when I'm only getting a gallstone out)!!

"you yank me and I'll yank you"

Could also fit the relationship between many farang and their trophy wives / gf's

Could also fit the relationship between many Thai and their trophy wifes / gf`s.Whats you`re point?