Leaving The Engine Idling

[bobo42]

I often see drivers here leave their car or truck idling when stopped. For example, stopping at a food shop and ordering some take-away, a lot of people seem to leave their engines running. Generally, I think most Thais are very fuel-conscious - I notice many drivers accelerate from a stop very slowly to save on fuel. So how come I see so many engines idling away with nobody in the car?

Somebody told me before that it was to "cool-down" the engine. Is this a thing? I've driven in very hot climates before, and never had any overheating issues with a relatively modern, well maintained vehicle. I always just shut it off whenever I stop (no need to waste fuel idling-away). Is there something about Thailand, or Thai-made cars that makes this a bad idea?

[David48]

Most of the wear in an engine happens at start up.

Research has indicated that 50 to 75% of your engine's wear happens at (cold) start up.

When the engine runs an oil film between the engine parts avoids metallic contact and wear.

At startup there is no oil pressure and no oil film ... well that's how it was taught to me.

[LongTimeLurker]

Most of the wear in an engine happens at start up.

Research has indicated that 50 to 75% of your engine's wear happens at (cold) start up.

When the engine runs an oil film between the engine parts avoids metallic contact and wear.

At startup there is no oil pressure and no oil film ... well that's how it was taught to me.

But what about the OPs example where you stop to pop into a shop for a few minutes? That's not a cold start up.

Edited November 10, 2012 by LongTimeLurker

[rixalex]

I think it tends to be more to do with wanting to keep the interior cool. The argument about engine wear i think would be valid for a brief stop, but sometimes i've noticed cars getting left ticking over for 10 minutes or more, which from an economy point of view is madness. Can be very annoying when it is a car parked close to where you happen to be, with all the noise and pollution it causes.

On the subject of engine heat, i see quite a few car owners have a habit of putting up the hoods/bonnets when they get home presumably in some effort to cool them down. Really don't understand it. Overheating is really not an issue with newer cars. What they really should be doing if anything is putting a blanket over the engine to keep in the heat, not let it out. Old habits die hard perhaps.

One more habit that i have seen, but this one i have no clue about the reasoning for, is when parking the car on a slope in the person's drive, rather than the usual practice of using the handbrake, using a bag of sand behind the rear wheels. The car i notice in my neighbourhood with which this is done is a brand new Vios, so i can't imagine the owner thinks the handbrake cable is going to snap. It's only a slight incline anyway. Anyone else seen this before?

Edited November 10, 2012 by rixalex

[stevenl]

Agree, think it has to do with keeping the interior cool.

[bobo42]

...

One more habit that i have seen, but this one i have no clue about the reasoning for, is when parking the car on a slope in the person's drive, rather than the usual practice of using the handbrake, using a bag of sand behind the rear wheels. The car i notice in my neighbourhood with which this is done is a brand new Vios, so i can't imagine the owner thinks the handbrake cable is going to snap. It's only a slight incline anyway. Anyone else seen this before?

That's a new one on me. Maybe that guy had a car roll-away on him once before? You would think that between the handbrake and the tranny-lock, he'd be safe. But I suppose its not super-crazy if its a manual transmission, I've had a car that jumps into neutral pretty easily before.

Agree, think it has to do with keeping the interior cool.

Yeah, I suppose that could be it. It just seems strange though, with the way people pull away from stop lights like my great-grandmother just to save a few baht, you'd think they'd be ok with a few minutes of interior heat for the same few baht.

[mogandave]

Engines don't burn a lot of fuel idling, but unnecessary extended idling is not good for the engine.

[funcat]

I keep my engine idling to run the AC,when my wife goes to 7-11...but some times it's more than 5 min ...maybe it's not good for the engine,but better than to get a heat stroke...and I think diesels can cope with this ...

[transam]

Providing the engine provides enough oil pressure to float the big and main bearings at idle you can idle all day long.

[Lickey]

It really depends on what youve been doing with your turboed intercooled truck, if youve been out on a shopping trip or sight-seeing, fine, turn it off when you park, if youve just bought a load of Fertilizer or Cement ect and the truck has worked hard, the turbo will be red hot, so its best to let it idle for a few mins to cool turbo and restrict heat damage to the spindle seals,

[BSJ]

It really depends on what youve been doing with your turboed intercooled truck, if youve been out on a shopping trip or sight-seeing, fine, turn it off when you park, if youve just bought a load of Fertilizer or Cement ect and the truck has worked hard, the turbo will be red hot, so its best to let it idle for a few mins to cool turbo and restrict heat damage to the spindle seals,

There maybe something in that.

[funcat]

It really depends on what youve been doing with your turboed intercooled truck, if youve been out on a shopping trip or sight-seeing, fine, turn it off when you park, if youve just bought a load of Fertilizer or Cement ect and the truck has worked hard, the turbo will be red hot, so its best to let it idle for a few mins to cool turbo and restrict heat damage to the spindle seals,

There maybe something in that.

I've heard that they sell some after market kits to avoid the turbo overheating...but I don't 'buy' that ...to settle down for a few minutes after running hard sounds good thou...

[transam]

It really depends on what youve been doing with your turboed intercooled truck, if youve been out on a shopping trip or sight-seeing, fine, turn it off when you park, if youve just bought a load of Fertilizer or Cement ect and the truck has worked hard, the turbo will be red hot, so its best to let it idle for a few mins to cool turbo and restrict heat damage to the spindle seals,

There maybe something in that.

I've heard that they sell some after market kits to avoid the turbo overheating...but I don't 'buy' that ...to settle down for a few minutes after running hard sounds good thou...

Yep, in the Toyota handbook it does state for turbo motors to idle for a minute if you have been running at high speeds.

[funcat]

How long do you think is OK to idle with the AC on anyway...time wise?...I've never noticed any temp fluctuation on my temp gauge,even sitting in there for 5-10-15 minutes...???

[bobo42]

It really depends on what youve been doing with your turboed intercooled truck, if youve been out on a shopping trip or sight-seeing, fine, turn it off when you park, if youve just bought a load of Fertilizer or Cement ect and the truck has worked hard, the turbo will be red hot, so its best to let it idle for a few mins to cool turbo and restrict heat damage to the spindle seals,

Yep, in the Toyota handbook it does state for turbo motors to idle for a minute if you have been running at high speeds.

Excellent answers, thanks! This is exactly what I was looking for!

I have never owned a turbo diesel truck before, so this is not something I'm familiar with. I assumed there must be some kind of justification for it - real or imagined. It seemed so out-of-character to see so many people doing this here, where most drivers are extremely vigilant about fuel consumption. Sounds like there is probably some sound reasoning behind the practice, and I will certainly check into this if I ever see the day that they finally deliver my truck.

[rixalex]

Providing the engine provides enough oil pressure to float the big and main bearings at idle you can idle all day long.

Idle all day long? We still taking about engines?

[transam]

Providing the engine provides enough oil pressure to float the big and main bearings at idle you can idle all day long.

Idle all day long? We still taking about engines?

, l usually am idle but today l went to salute our sadly lost chums who gave all for us to be free AND NOW l am going to cut down stuff from outside NEXT DOOR cos l can't see to back out my place ..................................

[rixalex]

...

One more habit that i have seen, but this one i have no clue about the reasoning for, is when parking the car on a slope in the person's drive, rather than the usual practice of using the handbrake, using a bag of sand behind the rear wheels. The car i notice in my neighbourhood with which this is done is a brand new Vios, so i can't imagine the owner thinks the handbrake cable is going to snap. It's only a slight incline anyway. Anyone else seen this before?

That's a new one on me. Maybe that guy had a car roll-away on him once before? You would think that between the handbrake and the tranny-lock, he'd be safe. But I suppose its not super-crazy if its a manual transmission, I've had a car that jumps into neutral pretty easily before.

I'm only taking a wild guess here, but my suspicion was, when considering how meticulously he keeps this vehicle, it had something to do with some sort of strange belief that using the handbrake too often would cause it to break, and so the sandbags are put in place and then the handbrake is released. Thais do seem a bit funny about the handbrake. They are so accustomed to not using it when parking in car parks so the car can be pushed about by the security guards, perhaps they don't know how?!

[aussiebebe]

It's to keep the interior cool - just 10 minutes in Thai sunshine is long enough to turn a parked car into an oven. Even with high-grade window film, leather seats can become painfully hot to sit on. To foreigners it looks strange or wasteful to see cars idling but if you stay here long enough you'll start doing it too, like taking shoes off before you enter a room etc.

[Spoonman]

I let mine idle down for 2 minutes bewfore I turn it off. Not a chance will I leave it idling to keep the interior cool as there is a good chance it wont be there when I return.

[Pushit]

I let mine idle down for 2 minutes bewfore I turn it off. Not a chance will I leave it idling to keep the interior cool as there is a good chance it wont be there when I return.

Agree, and insurance cover would be voided I think.

[Spoonman]

I let mine idle down for 2 minutes bewfore I turn it off. Not a chance will I leave it idling to keep the interior cool as there is a good chance it wont be there when I return.

Agree, and insurance cover would be voided I think.

Yep hard to explain vehicle theft when the keys are in the ignition.

[MESmith]

I let mine idle down for 2 minutes bewfore I turn it off. Not a chance will I leave it idling to keep the interior cool as there is a good chance it wont be there when I return.

Agree, and insurance cover would be voided I think.

Yep hard to explain vehicle theft when the keys are in the ignition.

I'm sure some vehicles would be safe. Think Daewoo.......

[VocalNeal]

It really depends on what youve been doing with your turboed intercooled truck, if youve been out on a shopping trip or sight-seeing, fine, turn it off when you park, if youve just bought a load of Fertilizer or Cement ect and the truck has worked hard, the turbo will be red hot, so its best to let it idle for a few mins to cool turbo and restrict heat damage to the spindle seals,

Yep, in the Toyota handbook it does state for turbo motors to idle for a minute if you have been running at high speeds.

Excellent answers, thanks! This is exactly what I was looking for!

In the good 'ole days this was de riguer for oil cooled turbos to stop cooking the oil in the bearings.

Modern water cooler turbos don't really need this. How many drivers drive at high load on the highway and pull straight into their garage and switch off? Even if you were to drive on the motorway at 160 and pull into the service area, by the time you have slowed down to enter and actually get to McDonalds or the toilet you have been running for a while at low load.

As to the idling? Same reason you would do it in Canada in winter. To keep the interior of the car at a comfortable temperature.

[rixalex]

Engines don't burn a lot of fuel idling,

Kind of depends how you look at it. When you take into account the vehicle isn't covering any ground whatsoever, it uses rather a lot compared with how much it uses when on the move.

[harrry]

I would be interested in knowing how long engines can safely idle. Unfortunately for various reasons I must remain in my Vigo for considerable periods while my wife conducts official business so sometimes I must stay for an hour. Currently I tend to run the aircon for a few minutes every 10 to keep the cab tolerable. I wiuld rather run it longer if I could know it is safe.

[rixalex]

I would be interested in knowing how long engines can safely idle. Unfortunately for various reasons I must remain in my Vigo for considerable periods while my wife conducts official business so sometimes I must stay for an hour. Currently I tend to run the aircon for a few minutes every 10 to keep the cab tolerable. I wiuld rather run it longer if I could know it is safe.

An hour?! Bloody 'ell. You need a camper van mate.

[cooked]

Maybe slightly off topic, but in Siberia they never turn the motors off in winter (diesel) as they will otherwise have to skillfully make little fires around the fuel pump to get the diesel to a usable temperature. Diesel motors use very little fuel when idling.

I wonder if this is just another item related to Thai superstition? I was told to tank up in the morning, as the fuel will be cooler and so take up less volume. If there was a temperature difference between 06.00 and midday of say 30 C, a lot, this might have some basis in fact (are we talking about 1 % saving here?) but the fuel is underground, dammit, variation maybe 1 - 2 C every day? But I know of Thais that religiously go tank up early in the morning.

Don't get me started on air conditioning costing 25% more consumption. 40 years ago maybe, not now. Opening the windows increases drag and increases consumption. If you service the A/C regularly, no risk to health.

Ok, rant over.

[harrry]

I would be interested in knowing how long engines can safely idle. Unfortunately for various reasons I must remain in my Vigo for considerable periods while my wife conducts official business so sometimes I must stay for an hour. Currently I tend to run the aircon for a few minutes every 10 to keep the cab tolerable. I wiuld rather run it longer if I could know it is safe.

An hour?! Bloody 'ell. You need a camper van mate.

Medical reasons mate ...not choice.

[kwonitoy]

I would be interested in knowing how long engines can safely idle. Unfortunately for various reasons I must remain in my Vigo for considerable periods while my wife conducts official business so sometimes I must stay for an hour. Currently I tend to run the aircon for a few minutes every 10 to keep the cab tolerable. I wiuld rather run it longer if I could know it is safe.

An hour?! Bloody 'ell. You need a camper van mate.

Medical reasons mate ...not choice.

Harry:

We use Vigo's and other diesel pickups for our work trucks, they sit on a pipeline ROW and idle 12 hours a day. The truck motor is used to supply electrical power to the computer equipment mounted inside the vehicle and the AC has to run all day, also for the computers and operator comfort. Doesn't hurt the motor at all. Does help to change the oil once a week and when they do hit the highway they smoke like crazy for the first 10 minutes or so. The AC won't work as efficently when sitting so we even mount fans in the front of the truck to provide airflow through the radiator.

We've been doing this with these type of trucks and other makes for many years with never an engine failure from idleing. These little diesels in the pickups here are tried and tested and basically bulletproof.