Tensions Flare As Protesters Urge Yingluck To Quit: Thailand

[fabianfred]

I hope they will be successful, By any means necessary. ​Their cause is just and the need great. I wish them the best of luck and tenacity.

There is nothing just about stealing a Nation from its elected government...especially by foul and underhand means.

Anyone who advocates violence is evil....

...and Farangs should stay out of local politics..... I am not involved, nor should I be...just warning those who are treading where they shouldn't...

[Fozfromoz]

Each nation, country, have collective state of mind which reflects their culture and history.

If you think you can impose democracy and you think democracy is the "good" choice universally, then you ... don't know. Stop watching TV go fishing .. I don't know what. You're proof why democracy is failing miserably.

Saddam Hussein was a mate with western politicians, same as Gaddafi was. After they stopped being mates, that is.. after two "dictators" decided to do whatever they want, they got "phased out". So your example sucks. Our system and our world is not what teacher repeated to you in school, or mass media.

And for all u farangs... that shit on Thai political or whatever, system ... why are you here ? Pack up your bags and go to your real democracy. Stop forcing your shit on other nations. Including your beliefs, prejudices and thoughts how things should or shouldn't work.

I would assert that having an opinion about Thai politics does not infer that one is "shitting" on the Thai political system. Virtually every political system in the world is corrupt in some way or other. Take the US for instance,.. probably the most corrupt of all but at the same time the most sophisticated at hiding it and disguising it as something that it is not. Such systems are not only ripe for criticism (yes... even to the extent of "shitting" on them as they deserve little better) but actually call for criticism by people that would oppose tyranny and corruption.

I may be farang,.. but I live here and have a wife and children here and that qualifies me by my own declaration to express an opinion regardless of whether it is heard as a legal voice or simply one that is willing to be heard.

I long for the day when I can hardly bring to mind the comments left by some members that make the reference "...stop whining, stop interfering, or go home".

This IS home my friend,... and as such I and others like me that have a voice will at least use this forum to make it heard!

Yep and forming an opinion, AKA free speech is part of a democracy.

[GentlemanJim]

Thailand, on 2012-11-24 17:16:48, said:

P.S.

Mnay of us on this forum as fathers and spouses of Thai wives are entitled to an opinion along with voicing opinion and concern as to what the future of this beloved country will be like in thier life times and beyond.

Correct! I live in Thailand, my children have Thai passports and attend Thai schools, I have a right to voice an opinion on Thai politics and how my children are educated. I am not naieve enough to think I will be heard, but I have the right. Far more right than those on this board living in Europe or the USA who come to Thailand three times a year to get rid of their potato water in a variety of bar girls over a two week period.

[Moruya]

I hope they will be successful, By any means necessary. ​Their cause is just and the need great. I wish them the best of luck and tenacity.

There is nothing just about stealing a Nation from its elected government...especially by foul and underhand means.

Anyone who advocates violence is evil....

...and Farangs should stay out of local politics..... I am not involved, nor should I be...just warning those who are treading where they shouldn't...

baaaaa. Baaaaaaa

[silent]

I didn't see any truck crashing through a barrier on Thai TV

Yah but the story wouldn't have gone far without the excitement of a crash added to it

[whybother]

I didn't see any truck crashing through a barrier on Thai TV

I would like to know if anyone saw the truck. If they were ramming a barricade with a truck, were they yellow shirts, or red shirts (trying to inflame the situation), in the truck? The police were doing their job correctly if violence was taking place, so you can't really blame them if there was a truck. I had read that with the government invoking the ISA that no recording devices would be allowed, so the truth may be hard to come by.

http://www.thaivisa....00#entry5873805

To: whybother

Thank you so much for the link to the video. Next Question: Where did you get the picture of my golden Retriever! Great picture. Sorry, off topic.

Not mine. It's Tywais'

[bigbamboo]

Thailand, on 2012-11-24 17:16:48, said:

P.S.

Mnay of us on this forum as fathers and spouses of Thai wives are entitled to an opinion along with voicing opinion and concern as to what the future of this beloved country will be like in thier life times and beyond.

Correct! I live in Thailand, my children have Thai passports and attend Thai schools, I have a right to voice an opinion on Thai politics and how my children are educated. I am not naieve enough to think I will be heard, but I have the right. Far more right than those on this board living in Europe or the USA who come to Thailand three times a year to get rid of their potato water in a variety of bar girls over a two week period.

Like you, Jim, Marshbags, EarthAlien and others I am married to a Thai and have lived here in Thailand with my family for many years. My main concern that for the future of the country and the Thai people not the sensibilities of politicains or political activists. I don't expect much from anyone, anywhere who 'enters' politics as they rarely do so for purely altruistic reasons care but equally I don't care who they are as long as they do so with at least a modicum of honesty and fairness.

Edited November 24, 2012 by bigbamboo

[anon467367354]

it's not that the government was not democratically elected, it's that is just so dam_n corrupt.

All they are doing is filling their pockets with the Thai people's money, reshuffling the cabinets so everybody

gets a piece of the pie, and bringing TS back and having all those charges dropped as if nothing has happened is a priority.

Taksin is the one that paid for the last catastrophe, now they want to bring him back.

who knows what damage he's going to cause next.

Edited November 24, 2012 by gr8fldanielle

[punisher]

Anyone living in Thailand for the past decade has witnessed a series of protests and surely has heard people on both sides call for coups and deaths and revoloutions of all sorts. They have urged their followers to occupy government buildings, airports, public spaces. We have seen grenade attacks, gunfire in the streets, and many people die. Some may be shocked at such antics and feel that a protest that uses these tools would be illegitimate. Here in Thailand that is what happens because it has been effective. The current government decided that it would actively undermine this protest even before it started. Yes what the Pitak Siam was calling for was not a good option, but the government gave them what they wanted and demonstrated how heavy handed they were and how intolerant of any dissent they are.

As someone not involved with either side, I do wonder if the government has made this a thousand times worse. Behind the scenes, the army must feel humiliated and disgraced. It has nothing to do with the rally organizer pe se but with the symbol of national authority seemingly being given over to the police. The army, in effect, has been told to shut up, put on parades, and leave the defense of the country to policeman. It's like the SS state establishing rule over the Wehrmacht. What will the army do in light of the immense loss of face they have just suffered? Best for all outsiders to just sit back and watch, I think, instead of take sides.

The army are the bad guys,who kicked out the last free elected government,so why current government should get involved with the army?

[Rancid]

As I've said before this is all about elite wealthy factions wanting to get more even more ill gotten wealth through controlling the governmnet and being able to steal from the Treasury. As someone once said behind every fortune is a crime, and greed certainly knows no bounds, this is just about money and power.

You don't have to like the Yingluk government but they were legally and convincingly elected, as such it is their turn to get their snouts in the trough and they certainly are. 20,000 is not a great turnout, the mood of the people will not yet tolerate the army having a coup and handing power back to Abhisit like last time. However no doubt that time will come, then we just get the new regime just like the old one, who could really give a sh*t which group robs the country blind? After all nothing of actual significance ever changes.

Abhisit wasn't handed power following the last coup. There was a junta government, then a PPP government (Samak, then Somchai), then for a short time there was a PTP government, but they chose to go to parliament to elect a PM instead of calling an election ... and they lost. That's when Abhisit came to power.

You may or may not have gathered from my post I am apolitical as believe any one pararsite is as bad as another, however short term memory loss is not an affliction yet. Phuea Thai won the election through Samak who was ousted over a cooking show (come on, you couldn't make this stuff up ), then Takis Whimpy brother in law was ousted, the army cut a deal on behalf of their sponsors with PT allies and bamm Abhisit was PM, which parts of this did you miss? All this while the Yellows sponsored by same army sponsors were rioting. Now that is democracy you can bank on, after all it is a very saleable commodity.

Don't worry unless PT can throw enough money around Abhi will be back even though the poor bugger can't win a straight election. Don't despair though his family is CP, he will always be filthy rich.

[lemoncake]

Anyone living in Thailand for the past decade has witnessed a series of protests and surely has heard people on both sides call for coups and deaths and revoloutions of all sorts. They have urged their followers to occupy government buildings, airports, public spaces. We have seen grenade attacks, gunfire in the streets, and many people die. Some may be shocked at such antics and feel that a protest that uses these tools would be illegitimate. Here in Thailand that is what happens because it has been effective. The current government decided that it would actively undermine this protest even before it started. Yes what the Pitak Siam was calling for was not a good option, but the government gave them what they wanted and demonstrated how heavy handed they were and how intolerant of any dissent they are.

As someone not involved with either side, I do wonder if the government has made this a thousand times worse. Behind the scenes, the army must feel humiliated and disgraced. It has nothing to do with the rally organizer pe se but with the symbol of national authority seemingly being given over to the police. The army, in effect, has been told to shut up, put on parades, and leave the defense of the country to policeman. It's like the SS state establishing rule over the Wehrmacht. What will the army do in light of the immense loss of face they have just suffered? Best for all outsiders to just sit back and watch, I think, instead of take sides.

The army are the bad guys,who kicked out the last free elected government,so why current government should get involved with the army?

keep your friends close and your enemies closer

[whybother]

The army are the bad guys,who kicked out the last free elected government,so why current government should get involved with the army?

Are you saying that the PPP was kicked out by the army or that it wasn't a free elected government?

Or maybe you're saying that Thaksin's caretaker government was a free elected government??

[punisher]

Each nation, country, have collective state of mind which reflects their culture and history.

If you think you can impose democracy and you think democracy is the "good" choice universally, then you ... don't know. Stop watching TV go fishing .. I don't know what. You're proof why democracy is failing miserably.

Saddam Hussein was a mate with western politicians, same as Gaddafi was. After they stopped being mates, that is.. after two "dictators" decided to do whatever they want, they got "phased out". So your example sucks. Our system and our world is not what teacher repeated to you in school, or mass media.

And for all u farangs... that shit on Thai political or whatever, system ... why are you here ? Pack up your bags and go to your real democracy. Stop forcing your shit on other nations. Including your beliefs, prejudices and thoughts how things should or shouldn't work.

I would assert that having an opinion about Thai politics does not infer that one is "shitting" on the Thai political system. Virtually every political system in the world is corrupt in some way or other. Take the US for instance,.. probably the most corrupt of all but at the same time the most sophisticated at hiding it and disguising it as something that it is not. Such systems are not only ripe for criticism (yes... even to the extent of "shitting" on them as they deserve little better) but actually call for criticism by people that would oppose tyranny and corruption.

I may be farang,.. but I live here and have a wife and children here and that qualifies me by my own declaration to express an opinion regardless of whether it is heard as a legal voice or simply one that is willing to be heard.

I long for the day when I can hardly bring to mind the comments left by some members that make the reference "...stop whining, stop interfering, or go home".

This IS home my friend,... and as such I and others like me that have a voice will at least use this forum to make it heard!

Yep and forming an opinion, AKA free speech is part of a democracy.

Just to bad here is no freedom of speech,rapists,thieves,killers go free for a payment,if u talk to much about certain people,all money can't help, u sit in prison for a couple of yrs,as long it is like that the trouble goes on and on,does not matter which government is in power.

[whybother]

You may or may not have gathered from my post I am apolitical as believe any one pararsite is as bad as another, however short term memory loss is not an affliction yet. Phuea Thai won the election through Samak who was ousted over a cooking show (come on, you couldn't make this stuff up ), then Takis Whimpy brother in law was ousted, the army cut a deal on behalf of their sponsors with PT allies and bamm Abhisit was PM, which parts of this did you miss? All this while the Yellows sponsored by same army sponsors were rioting. Now that is democracy you can bank on, after all it is a very saleable commodity.

Don't worry unless PT can throw enough money around Abhi will be back even though the poor bugger can't win a straight election. Don't despair though his family is CP, he will always be filthy rich.

I think I'd check on that memory problem if I was you. It was PPP that won the election, not PTP. Samak was forced to step down because he had two jobs, AND lied about it. He could have been elected PM again the next day, but Thaksin chose his brother in law instead. Then the PPP was disbanded, and new PTP was in government but without a PM. A faction of the PPP formed their own party, and they, along with some smaller parties that said that they wouldn't support the PPP, decided to support the Democrats. So, the PTP, who chose to go to parliament to elect a new PM rather than calling a general election, lost the vote and Abhisit was elected PM.

PTP will have enough money to throw around at the next election. They've been collecting quite a bit through the rice scam.

[punisher]

The army are the bad guys,who kicked out the last free elected government,so why current government should get involved with the army?

Are you saying that the PPP was kicked out by the army or that it wasn't a free elected government?

Or maybe you're saying that Thaksin's caretaker government was a free elected government??

In the end everything is about Thaksin,ask yourself why royalists,army,and elites are so scared Thaksin comes back,I'm not a Thaksin friend but things were better for thais and Thailand with him,and most thais don't care how much he cheats or fills his pockets as long they have a good life,and about army I would say it's never good if the army has to much power and starts a coup whenever they don't like the government,please save ur irony for somebody else

[lemoncake]

there is another angle to look at today's events and possibly it was a plan or part of it

1. Court ruled against the government and rally was legitimate

Government went against court ruling and was blocking people from attending

2. 500 or so people were allowed to dismantle the barb wires/road blocks and then fired upon. Keep in mind police outnumbered the protesters like 3 to 1, they stood by, allowing them to dismantle before taking any actions, which shows police intent or perhaps police orders.

I am not law expert, but i think there is already grounds for some legal action against the government.

The aim of this group and protest is to oust the government, which ever way possible, may be setting up traps was/is the plan

[jackspratt]

It's like the SS state establishing rule over the Wehrmacht.

Uh oh!!

Godwin has made his inevitable, albeit belated, arrival.

[whybother]

The army are the bad guys,who kicked out the last free elected government,so why current government should get involved with the army?

Are you saying that the PPP was kicked out by the army or that it wasn't a free elected government?

Or maybe you're saying that Thaksin's caretaker government was a free elected government??

In the end everything is about Thaksin,ask yourself why royalists,army,and elites are so scared Thaksin comes back,I'm not a Thaksin friend but things were better for thais and Thailand with him,and most thais don't care how much he cheats or fills his pockets as long they have a good life,and about army I would say it's never good if the army has to much power and starts a coup whenever they don't like the government,please save ur irony for somebody else

Things were better under him because of a global economic boom. He doesn't seem to be doing so well now.

[hellodolly]

An estimate of 20,000 as opposed to the anticipated 100K plus would seem to be a major vote for the government.

Violence begets violence so better avoided but it appears that there were those out to cause it in the opposition and itchy trigger fingers on the government side.

Hopefully we will see little more from this lot and just let the elected gov get on with it's job whatever it may be.

Those that are not satisfied with whatever will have an opportunity to vote them out in a couple of years time.

I think you missed the point of the whole thing.

We all want to let the government get on with it's job.

The sooner they do it the better.

[lizardtongue]

I wonder if big brother has given 'Glam Girl' the benefit of his experience?

All this recent 'hot air' about Thailand being sought after/courted by the West, just shows that it was a load of <deleted> !

Thailand the 'hub' of political unrest!!!

Sad thing is that in 3,4 or 5 yrs time we will no doubt be writing similar posts?

[hellodolly]

there is another angle to look at today's events and possibly it was a plan or part of it

1. Court ruled against the government and rally was legitimate

Government went against court ruling and was blocking people from attending

2. 500 or so people were allowed to dismantle the barb wires/road blocks and then fired upon. Keep in mind police outnumbered the protesters like 3 to 1, they stood by, allowing them to dismantle before taking any actions, which shows police intent or perhaps police orders.

I am not law expert, but i think there is already grounds for some legal action against the government.

The aim of this group and protest is to oust the government, which ever way possible, may be setting up traps was/is the plan

Well you may have point there. The only sure fire thing we know is that one way or another the Government was not going to let it be peaceful.

[punisher]

there is another angle to look at today's events and possibly it was a plan or part of it

1. Court ruled against the government and rally was legitimate

Government went against court ruling and was blocking people from attending

2. 500 or so people were allowed to dismantle the barb wires/road blocks and then fired upon. Keep in mind police outnumbered the protesters like 3 to 1, they stood by, allowing them to dismantle before taking any actions, which shows police intent or perhaps police orders.

I am not law expert, but i think there is already grounds for some legal action against the government.

The aim of this group and protest is to oust the government, which ever way possible, may be setting up traps was/is the plan

Well you may have point there. The only sure fire thing we know is that one way or another the Government was not going to let it be peaceful.

The last time yellow was on the streets,government buildings got destroyed,Airports got hijacked,and, and. ,then the government should just sit and watch and let them do?High season is coming I don't think government is interested in any bigger trouble.

[Fozfromoz]

there is another angle to look at today's events and possibly it was a plan or part of it

1. Court ruled against the government and rally was legitimate

Government went against court ruling and was blocking people from attending

2. 500 or so people were allowed to dismantle the barb wires/road blocks and then fired upon. Keep in mind police outnumbered the protesters like 3 to 1, they stood by, allowing them to dismantle before taking any actions, which shows police intent or perhaps police orders.

I am not law expert, but i think there is already grounds for some legal action against the government.

The aim of this group and protest is to oust the government, which ever way possible, may be setting up traps was/is the plan

Well you may have point there. The only sure fire thing we know is that one way or another the Government was not going to let it be peaceful.

Yep just thinking on that a bit, certainly point 1 WRT the court decision is right, and I don't know on the other parts, but would say that there were lots of obstacles. Perhaps this guy as a retired General is a good tactician.

[brewsterbudgen]

The army are the bad guys,who kicked out the last free elected government,so why current government should get involved with the army?

Are you saying that the PPP was kicked out by the army or that it wasn't a free elected government?

Or maybe you're saying that Thaksin's caretaker government was a free elected government??

In the end everything is about Thaksin,ask yourself why royalists,army,and elites are so scared Thaksin comes back,I'm not a Thaksin friend but things were better for thais and Thailand with him,and most thais don't care how much he cheats or fills his pockets as long they have a good life,and about army I would say it's never good if the army has to much power and starts a coup whenever they don't like the government,please save ur irony for somebody else

Not all them are so scared

[sirGold]

I do not think its over as many like think , yellow shirts never left anything unfinished .

I believe this was a test to see what government will do and how react.

I think numbers will start to increase and perhaps there are surprises still await.

Thai politics is never so obvious , so lets see the next 24-48 hours.

Ps. In my opinion firing tear gas into some 500 people from few thousand police was little excessive and that alone could be used for "whatever"

ah yea sure because it not happens in EVERY OTHER COUNTRY while demonstrations to use tear gas ? fact is this protesters not follow a given route for a demonstration - in every other country i know police will use force with sticks if they want crash a barrier but you now think tear GAS would be a reason to overthrow a gov. ? (speaks totaly for its own thanks for this one) you ever heard about that in civilised countries police will take responsibility on their action? but here undemocratic heads like you think its okay to use force against police to create situations to overthrow governments ? very impressing statement thanks ! you know that tear gas is made for this situations dont you ? you also know that this mob was equipped with professional equipment to brake through the NATO military fence (super strong need big cutting tools for open it) ......... in every other country on mother earth police would react the same way as sawn here............and nearby..... how about you start a new post with "letz jail responsible people of 2010 government for 100 deaths and 2000 injured " ? since 2010 people did ask for ELECTION and now there is a mob want a COUPE - im sure you totaly hate what happend in 2010 dont you? ........ or maybe im such mistaken and you learn how to judge with double standard ?

[mamypoko]

I can't help but flip the channels between news on Gaza and news on Thailand. A bit of gas, ruffled feathers on all sides, lots of partisan TV members. All in all, I applaud you Thailand. Democracy in action.

[Mosha]

there is another angle to look at today's events and possibly it was a plan or part of it

1. Court ruled against the government and rally was legitimate

Government went against court ruling and was blocking people from attending

2. 500 or so people were allowed to dismantle the barb wires/road blocks and then fired upon. Keep in mind police outnumbered the protesters like 3 to 1, they stood by, allowing them to dismantle before taking any actions, which shows police intent or perhaps police orders.

I am not law expert, but i think there is already grounds for some legal action against the government.

The aim of this group and protest is to oust the government, which ever way possible, may be setting up traps was/is the plan

Well you may have point there. The only sure fire thing we know is that one way or another the Government was not going to let it be peaceful.

The last time yellow was on the streets,government buildings got destroyed,Airports got hijacked,and, and. ,then the government should just sit and watch and let them do?High season is coming I don't think government is interested in any bigger trouble.

Mods can we have a slap forehead/groan smiley please?

[Lopburikid]

The rally is illegitimate says Thida, she would certainly know about such things.

can I ask any of you so called fuc_k wits, how long as any government stayed in power in thailand before there was a military coup?

[Lopburikid]

there is another angle to look at today's events and possibly it was a plan or part of it

1. Court ruled against the government and rally was legitimate

Government went against court ruling and was blocking people from attending

2. 500 or so people were allowed to dismantle the barb wires/road blocks and then fired upon. Keep in mind police outnumbered the protesters like 3 to 1, they stood by, allowing them to dismantle before taking any actions, which shows police intent or perhaps police orders.

I am not law expert, but i think there is already grounds for some legal action against the government.

The aim of this group and protest is to oust the government, which ever way possible, may be setting up traps was/is the plan

They didn't use live rounds,did they?

[HAL9000]

Pitak Siam is primarily Yellow Shirt and Democratic Party. A recent thread asked what can Thailand learn from American Democracy? I say learn that if you don't like the government, you have to wait for the next election.