Thailand Has No Problem With New Chinese Passport: Thai Foreign Ministry

[webfact]

China's new passport not a problem

SUPALAK GANJANAKHUNDEE

THE NATION

BANGKOK: -- Thailand has no problem with the new Chinese passport and recognises it as long as it is legally issued by China as a travel document, the Foreign Ministry said yesterday.

The new passport, which contains a map showing most of the South China Sea belonging to China, provoked angry reaction from many countries in the region including the Philippines, Vietnam, Taiwan and India.

The Philippines and Vietnam said they would not put immigration and visa stamps on the controversial passport. The US also raised concern over the issue. India, angered that the map claims Arunachal Pradesh and Aksai Chin as Chinese territory, is stamping its own map on visas given to Chinese visitors.

The Thai Foreign Ministry's permanent secretary Sihasak Phuangketkeow said the issue of the South China Sea is sensitive for many countries in the region, but the map or graphic in the passport or on other travel documents should not have legal implications on sovereignty over the disputed territory.

"Recognising the travel document is not equivalent to recognition of sovereignty of any country over any disputed territory," he said.

China has territorial disputes in the South China Sea with many countries in Asean, including the Philippines, Vietnam, Brunei and Malaysia.

-- The Nation 2012-11- 29

[maidu]

When most Thai politicians have Chinese ancestry and most large corps/businesses in Thailand are Chinese-Thai owned, it's no surprise they would comment a big yawning 'mai pen rai' about whatever China does. China is the world's biggest illegal ivory dealer. Thailand is #2. Why mess up a good thing? Why offend the 900 lb panda that's about to sit on your chest?

[OzMick]

I thought for a moment Thaksin had gone back to his "Roots".

[maidu]

Even if armed conflicts were to flare up in the South China Sea, regarding China's over-reaching imperialism, Thailand (and Cambodia) would sit on their hands on the sidelines. So happens: the disputed islands in the S.China Sea are, at a minimum, twice the distance from China than they are from the other countries in contention. The smartest course of action would be for all parties to declare the disputed islands as 'World Protected Sites' (or some nomenclature like that), and have them off-limits to commercial and residential activity, similar to Antarctica. Trouble is, Asians can't perceive of that. There's nothing in their heritage or culture which fathoms sharing or protecting properties. In the Americas and Europe, there are 18 shared 'Cultural Heritage Sites.' In Asia: zero.

Same could apply to Preah Vihar temple ruins, but again, it's too far-fetched for Asian consciousness to fathom.

[dcutman]

I am sure this article would read different if Thailand had some claim to this territory.

[MaxLee]

Of course the Thai government does not have a problem with the new Chinese passport because both countries are equally corrupt, And besides have a thought about who rules the people in Thailand in the first place??? ....The whole major part of the political branch in Thailand… Who are they..... THAI CHINESE… the same ethnic group that brought corruption to the (former) land of smiles in the first place.... Do you get the idea????

Why would The Thai-(Chinese) government risk to lose their closest (CORRUPTION)-PARTNER and cause them to lose face…???

Ah yes a little side note, I'm not a historian and I don't want to sound like one, but I think Thailand and its people, I mean the original Thai people have been colonized, by the THAI-CHINESE ELITE, as the majority of them who got into power, is treating the ethnic Thai population as their b********es…

Edited November 29, 2012 by MaxLee

[Ricardo]

Perhaps someone might build a Thai temple, on one of these rocks, thus making the South China Seas of vital national pride interest ?

And didn't want Vietnam's support, in raising world market-prices for rice, recently ? But is now happy to offend them by failing to pretend to care about something important to both Vietnam, and several other Asean countries, diplomacy can be like that !

[Moruya]

Thailand obviously respects its ASEAN partners

[asiawatcher]

I am sure this article would read different if Thailand had some claim to this territory.

Exactly - or if the Chinese laid claim to any island in the Gulf of Thailand a.k.a. Siam. Maybe then they could use their navy!!

[clockman]

Thailand is a colony of China!

[Thai at Heart]

I think they didn't even know the story and just stuck to the standard line " we love China".

[jcw]

It's all over oil and gas.

[punisher]

I think they didn't even know the story and just stuck to the standard line " we love China".

Most thais can not even point to BKK on a map.then they sure not care or know about China and some islands in the South China sea,besides that it's typica Thail style,now China seems to be the big brother,if things change in favor of other states I am sure Thailand will change the train fast

[Payboy]

Thais can't afford to upset China. Too much trade legal and illegal.

[Nisa]

Of course the Thai government does not have a problem with the new Chinese passport because both countries are equally corrupt, And besides have a thought about who rules the people in Thailand in the first place??? ....The whole major part of the political branch in Thailand… Who are they..... THAI CHINESE… the same ethnic group that brought corruption to the (former) land of smiles in the first place.... Do you get the idea????

Why would The Thai-(Chinese) government risk to lose their closest (CORRUPTION)-PARTNER and cause them to lose face…???

Ah yes a little side note, I'm not a historian and I don't want to sound like one, but I think Thailand and its people, I mean the original Thai people have been colonized, by the THAI-CHINESE ELITE, as the majority of them who got into power, is treating the ethnic Thai population as their b********es…

Thai Chinese relate to China the same way European Americans relate to their ancestors being from various countries in Europe with the exception that most American families immigrated within a few hundred years ago while most Chinese families came to Thailand 400 to a 1,000 years ago. In other words, Thai Chinese are Thai and they don't relate at all to being Chinese, nor do they have any loyalty to China or can they speak the languages of China..

Edited November 29, 2012 by Nisa

[MaxLee]

Thais can't afford to upset China. Too much trade legal and illegal.

I would rather say 100+% illegal trade and rip-offs.

[JeremyBowskill]

A Chinese passport are they issued for 10 years and break after a couple of weeks like most other Chinese goods?

[Thai at Heart]

Of course the Thai government does not have a problem with the new Chinese passport because both countries are equally corrupt, And besides have a thought about who rules the people in Thailand in the first place??? ....The whole major part of the political branch in Thailand… Who are they..... THAI CHINESE… the same ethnic group that brought corruption to the (former) land of smiles in the first place.... Do you get the idea????

Why would The Thai-(Chinese) government risk to lose their closest (CORRUPTION)-PARTNER and cause them to lose face…???

Ah yes a little side note, I'm not a historian and I don't want to sound like one, but I think Thailand and its people, I mean the original Thai people have been colonized, by the THAI-CHINESE ELITE, as the majority of them who got into power, is treating the ethnic Thai population as their b********es…

Thai Chinese relate to China the same way European Americans relate to their ancestors being from various countries in Europe with the exception that most American families immigrated within a few hundred years ago while most Chinese families came to Thailand 400 to a 1,000 years ago. In other words, Thai Chinese are Thai and they don't relate at all to being Chinese, nor do they have any loyalty to China or can they speak the languages of China..

Is that why they all celebrate Chinese new year, and have Chinese characters on their business signage, have chinese business associations, and their own temples, festivals and actually quite distinct culture?

[Nisa]

Of course the Thai government does not have a problem with the new Chinese passport because both countries are equally corrupt, And besides have a thought about who rules the people in Thailand in the first place??? ....The whole major part of the political branch in Thailand… Who are they..... THAI CHINESE… the same ethnic group that brought corruption to the (former) land of smiles in the first place.... Do you get the idea????

Why would The Thai-(Chinese) government risk to lose their closest (CORRUPTION)-PARTNER and cause them to lose face…???

Ah yes a little side note, I'm not a historian and I don't want to sound like one, but I think Thailand and its people, I mean the original Thai people have been colonized, by the THAI-CHINESE ELITE, as the majority of them who got into power, is treating the ethnic Thai population as their b********es…

Thai Chinese relate to China the same way European Americans relate to their ancestors being from various countries in Europe with the exception that most American families immigrated within a few hundred years ago while most Chinese families came to Thailand 400 to a 1,000 years ago. In other words, Thai Chinese are Thai and they don't relate at all to being Chinese, nor do they have any loyalty to China or can they speak the languages of China..

Is that why they all celebrate Chinese new year, and have Chinese characters on their business signage, have chinese business associations, and their own temples, festivals and actually quite distinct culture?

I celebrate Chinese New Year as well as attend a Chinese temple but nobody would mistake me for being Chinese. They don't have Chinese characters on their signs and business cards unless they speak Chinese and that is a very tiny percentage of Thai-Chinese but any person who speaks Chinese who and wants to do business with people from China would certainly put such things on their advertising. What you may be doing also is confusing Chinese with Thai-Chinese but would you make such a mistake visiting Pattaya and seeing all the Russian language signs? Do you accuse Thais of having some secret loyalty to English speaking nations because they use English on their advertising even though it is not an official language of Thailand? You might also want to consider that religion has nothing to do with national origin as does what festivals we attend. Yes different groups within countries have different cultures and people of similar ethnic make up tend to group together but this is certainly not unique to Thailand and certainly not an indication of loyalty towards a country. Bottom line is you are wayyyyyyyyyyyyy off you if you think Thai-Chinese, as a general rule, have some loyalty towards China and don't consider themselves 100% Thai as much as any other Thai citizen.

[Thai at Heart]

Of course the Thai government does not have a problem with the new Chinese passport because both countries are equally corrupt, And besides have a thought about who rules the people in Thailand in the first place??? ....The whole major part of the political branch in Thailand… Who are they..... THAI CHINESE… the same ethnic group that brought corruption to the (former) land of smiles in the first place.... Do you get the idea????

Why would The Thai-(Chinese) government risk to lose their closest (CORRUPTION)-PARTNER and cause them to lose face…???

Ah yes a little side note, I'm not a historian and I don't want to sound like one, but I think Thailand and its people, I mean the original Thai people have been colonized, by the THAI-CHINESE ELITE, as the majority of them who got into power, is treating the ethnic Thai population as their b********es…

Thai Chinese relate to China the same way European Americans relate to their ancestors being from various countries in Europe with the exception that most American families immigrated within a few hundred years ago while most Chinese families came to Thailand 400 to a 1,000 years ago. In other words, Thai Chinese are Thai and they don't relate at all to being Chinese, nor do they have any loyalty to China or can they speak the languages of China..

Is that why they all celebrate Chinese new year, and have Chinese characters on their business signage, have chinese business associations, and their own temples, festivals and actually quite distinct culture?

I celebrate Chinese New Year as well as attend a Chinese temple but nobody would mistake me for being Chinese. They don't have Chinese characters on their signs and business cards unless they speak Chinese and that is a very tiny percentage of Thai-Chinese but any person who speaks Chinese who and wants to do business with people from China would certainly put such things on their advertising. What you may be doing also is confusing Chinese with Thai-Chinese but would you make such a mistake visiting Pattaya and seeing all the Russian language signs? Do you accuse Thais of having some secret loyalty to English speaking nations because they use English on their advertising even though it is not an official language of Thailand? You might also want to consider that religion has nothing to do with national origin as does what festivals we attend. Yes different groups within countries have different cultures and people of similar ethnic make up tend to group together but this is certainly not unique to Thailand and certainly not an indication of loyalty towards a country. Bottom line is you are wayyyyyyyyyyyyy off you if you think Thai-Chinese, as a general rule, have some loyalty towards China and don't consider themselves 100% Thai as much as any other Thai citizen.

Every business that is Chinese in the town i live in has Chinese signage on the front gate.

Yes, Thai chinese people are integrated into Thai society, but to me, they retain their distinctions quite clearly. Loyalty to the country is one thing, keeping your culture is another thing entirely.

This is the nonsense of thainess. It isn't one entity, no matter how much politicians may like it to exist. As for loyalty to China, wasn't it the boss of CP i saw on channel news Asia who said.

"we were so successful in China because we considered it like going home", when he was interviewed. Why is there such a Trans national entity as the south east Asian Chinese business association, of which hasn't Thai companies are members if they are so integrated?

I am not saying it's good or bad, but to claim that the Chinese community doesn't stand just the tiniest bit distinct in Thailand is to deny reality. Yes they are integrated better than in other countries, but that is all relative.

They conduct many things in ways utterly distinct from Thai society and culture.

[h90]

Of course the Thai government does not have a problem with the new Chinese passport because both countries are equally corrupt, And besides have a thought about who rules the people in Thailand in the first place??? ....The whole major part of the political branch in Thailand… Who are they..... THAI CHINESE… the same ethnic group that brought corruption to the (former) land of smiles in the first place.... Do you get the idea????

Why would The Thai-(Chinese) government risk to lose their closest (CORRUPTION)-PARTNER and cause them to lose face…???

Ah yes a little side note, I'm not a historian and I don't want to sound like one, but I think Thailand and its people, I mean the original Thai people have been colonized, by the THAI-CHINESE ELITE, as the majority of them who got into power, is treating the ethnic Thai population as their b********es…

I doubt that the Chinese brought the corruption to Thailand. There are a lot countries without Chinese influence and they do very well in corruption.

As well most Chinese came here without any money and got rich by their own hard work....But it is always easy to find a racist reason why others are more successful....

[Nisa]

Thai at Heart - Your thinking is like saying an Italian American with a Pizza franchise is somehow how not as American as other Americans because he opened up shops in Italy or speaks Italian. Are people from Issan, whose language is closer to Laos than Thai less Tha? They have their own cultures too .. do they harbor some loyalty to Laos? And again what you think is Thai-Chinese is actually just Chinese in terms of shops because the overwhelming vast majority of Thai Chinese cannot speak any Chinese dialect and most have probably never been to China and neither has their parents or their parents parents. Try getting to know some Thais and Thai Chinese and simply do a little research. These folks are 100% Thai and have absolutely no allegiance to China and just because some of them are rich has nothing to do with anything nor does if they do business with Chinese or any other country or its citizens. Be it Whites, Jews, people of a certain heritage or light skinned ____ (fill in the blank) who may control a significant percentage of a countries wealth is one thing but to suggest in any way shape or form because of this they are not somehow real citizens or hold any allegiance to another country is both ignorant and insulting.

Thai Chinese are a part of Thailand, its culture and history and they are not a part of China within Thailand. Thai Chinese are 100% Thai and a part of Thailand as much as Irish Americans or Italian Americans whose families have spent generation in America are part of the United States.

Here is some light reading to give you a better understanding ... http://en.wikipedia....ki/Thai_Chinese

Edited November 29, 2012 by Nisa

[Thai at Heart]

Thai at Heart - Your thinking is like saying an Italian American with a Pizza franchise is somehow how not as American as other Americans because he opened up shops in Italy or speaks Italian. Are people from Issan, whose language is closer to Laos than Thai less Tha? They have their own cultures too .. do they harbor some loyalty to Laos? And again what you think is Thai-Chinese is actually just Chinese in terms of shops because the overwhelming vast majority of Thai Chinese cannot speak any Chinese dialect and most have probably never been to China and neither has their parents or their parents parents. Try getting to know some Thais and Thai Chinese and simply do a little research. These folks are 100% Thai and have absolutely no allegiance to China and just because some of them are rich has nothing to do with anything nor does if they do business with Chinese or any other country or its citizens. Be it Whites, Jews, people of a certain heritage or light skinned ____ (fill in the blank) who may control a significant percentage of a countries wealth is one thing but to suggest in any way shape or form because of this they are not somehow real citizens or hold any allegiance to another country is both ignorant and insulting.

I know plenty of Thai Chinese, the god mother and probably longest standing friend I have in Thailand is Thai Chinese, as are many of my closer friends. I am part of the Chamber of Commerce of my local town, which is probably 95% Thai Chinese, have plenty of kids are friends of my kids who are Thai Chinese and have worked for two Thai Chinese companies in my time. Allegiance to China is not my issue in terms of stating that they would support China over Thailand. Do they do a lot of business with Chinese companies, yes, but that is linguistic and cultural connections.

They are Thai Chinese, that's it. Does an Italian American feel some kinship with Italy and his ancestry, most do. Does an Irish American feel some kinship with the Irish and his ancestry, most do.

Does this give them a slightly distinct part of their character that connects them with other people of the same group? Yes it does. Are they all Americans. Yes. Is the culture of a Mexican American the same as an Irish or Italian American? Nope. Thai's are not some homogenous group simply because they have the same passport. If and when I finally get my Thai passport, will that make me the same culturally as Thai Chinese, Laos-Thai, or Lanna Thai?

Now that would be stretching it too far wouldn't it.

[smedly]

The area that China are claiming is quite frankly rediculous

[Nisa]

Thai at Heart - Your thinking is like saying an Italian American with a Pizza franchise is somehow how not as American as other Americans because he opened up shops in Italy or speaks Italian. Are people from Issan, whose language is closer to Laos than Thai less Tha? They have their own cultures too .. do they harbor some loyalty to Laos? And again what you think is Thai-Chinese is actually just Chinese in terms of shops because the overwhelming vast majority of Thai Chinese cannot speak any Chinese dialect and most have probably never been to China and neither has their parents or their parents parents. Try getting to know some Thais and Thai Chinese and simply do a little research. These folks are 100% Thai and have absolutely no allegiance to China and just because some of them are rich has nothing to do with anything nor does if they do business with Chinese or any other country or its citizens. Be it Whites, Jews, people of a certain heritage or light skinned ____ (fill in the blank) who may control a significant percentage of a countries wealth is one thing but to suggest in any way shape or form because of this they are not somehow real citizens or hold any allegiance to another country is both ignorant and insulting.

I know plenty of Thai Chinese, the god mother and probably longest standing friend I have in Thailand is Thai Chinese, as are many of my closer friends. I am part of the Chamber of Commerce of my local town, which is probably 95% Thai Chinese, have plenty of kids are friends of my kids who are Thai Chinese and have worked for two Thai Chinese companies in my time. Allegiance to China is not my issue in terms of stating that they would support China over Thailand. Do they do a lot of business with Chinese companies, yes, but that is linguistic and cultural connections.

They are Thai Chinese, that's it. Does an Italian American feel some kinship with Italy and his ancestry, most do. Does an Irish American feel some kinship with the Irish and his ancestry, most do.

Does this give them a slightly distinct part of their character that connects them with other people of the same group? Yes it does. Are they all Americans. Yes. Is the culture of a Mexican American the same as an Irish or Italian American? Nope. Thai's are not some homogenous group simply because they have the same passport. If and when I finally get my Thai passport, will that make me the same culturally as Thai Chinese, Laos-Thai, or Lanna Thai?

Now that would be stretching it too far wouldn't it.

If and when you get a Thai Passort or citizenship then you will still be an immigrant. Thai-Chinese have been around hundreds to thousands of years and near 1/2 of all Thais claim Chinese ancestry. You started this by trying to contradict my stating they were 100% Thai and didn't relate to being Chinese and if you want to back off from that is fine but lets not pretend you weren't trying to suggest they were not somehow 100% Thai. You my friend will never be 100% Thai in this regards as the vast majority of Thai Chinese whose language is solely Thai, were born here along with their parents and whose culture has become a part of Thai Culture. Be it Chinese New Year (which is a Thai public holiday along with numerous other Chinese origin holidays/festivals) or the week of fasting, these are things celebrated not just but Thai-Chinese but Thais in general.

[Nisa]

The area that China are claiming is quite frankly rediculous

No to mention it is not any area which Thailand claims as theirs. So, for anyone to suggest that Thailand should make some sort of political statement against one of their largest trading partners for the sole benefit of a couple small and poor countries is akin to wanting to them to shoot themselves in the foot. They are doing the right thing by staying at of this issue.

[Thai at Heart]

Thai at Heart - Your thinking is like saying an Italian American with a Pizza franchise is somehow how not as American as other Americans because he opened up shops in Italy or speaks Italian. Are people from Issan, whose language is closer to Laos than Thai less Tha? They have their own cultures too .. do they harbor some loyalty to Laos? And again what you think is Thai-Chinese is actually just Chinese in terms of shops because the overwhelming vast majority of Thai Chinese cannot speak any Chinese dialect and most have probably never been to China and neither has their parents or their parents parents. Try getting to know some Thais and Thai Chinese and simply do a little research. These folks are 100% Thai and have absolutely no allegiance to China and just because some of them are rich has nothing to do with anything nor does if they do business with Chinese or any other country or its citizens. Be it Whites, Jews, people of a certain heritage or light skinned ____ (fill in the blank) who may control a significant percentage of a countries wealth is one thing but to suggest in any way shape or form because of this they are not somehow real citizens or hold any allegiance to another country is both ignorant and insulting.

I know plenty of Thai Chinese, the god mother and probably longest standing friend I have in Thailand is Thai Chinese, as are many of my closer friends. I am part of the Chamber of Commerce of my local town, which is probably 95% Thai Chinese, have plenty of kids are friends of my kids who are Thai Chinese and have worked for two Thai Chinese companies in my time. Allegiance to China is not my issue in terms of stating that they would support China over Thailand. Do they do a lot of business with Chinese companies, yes, but that is linguistic and cultural connections.

They are Thai Chinese, that's it. Does an Italian American feel some kinship with Italy and his ancestry, most do. Does an Irish American feel some kinship with the Irish and his ancestry, most do.

Does this give them a slightly distinct part of their character that connects them with other people of the same group? Yes it does. Are they all Americans. Yes. Is the culture of a Mexican American the same as an Irish or Italian American? Nope. Thai's are not some homogenous group simply because they have the same passport. If and when I finally get my Thai passport, will that make me the same culturally as Thai Chinese, Laos-Thai, or Lanna Thai?

Now that would be stretching it too far wouldn't it.

If and when you get a Thai Passort or citizenship then you will still be an immigrant. Thai-Chinese have been around hundreds to thousands of years and near 1/2 of all Thais claim Chinese ancestry. You started this by trying to contradict my stating they were 100% Thai and didn't relate to being Chinese and if you want to back off from that is fine but lets not pretend you weren't trying to suggest they were not somehow 100% Thai. You my friend will never be 100% Thai in this regards as the vast majority of Thai Chinese whose language is solely Thai, were born here along with their parents and whose culture has become a part of Thai Culture. Be it Chinese New Year (which is a Thai public holiday along with numerous other Chinese origin holidays/festivals) or the week of fasting, these are things celebrated not just but Thai-Chinese but Thais in general.

Where did I say they weren't 100% Thai? My kids are labelled Loog Kreung, it is what they are, but they will be brought up here, and have Thai passports. The influences on their life will be in the vast majority Thai, but they will be what they are.

There are differences in Thai Chinese culture, although yes, Thai culture and Thai chinese culture have enmeshed themselves greatly over the years, but they are not the same.

Edited November 29, 2012 by Thai at Heart

[maidu]

Thailand obviously respects its ASEAN partners

China is not a core ASEAN member. It is a peripheral member (ASEAN + 3), but it acts like it is chairman at meetings. Japan and S.Korea are also members of ASEAN + 3. China is also not a signatory to the Mekong River Commission even though it's the 900 lb panda when any decisions are broached. It's not a signatory, so that it can say it's not bound by any of their group decisions. In other words, it does what it wants. Period. China has the same attitude toward the S.China Sea. It knows it's going to get all the territory it wants. It will either get it by behind-the-scenes pressure or it will get it by military action, if its hand is forced. Unless, of course, the US Navy sails along to contest it. As much as anything else, it's a waiting game, and China thinks it can out-wait all the other players. It won't back down an inch, any more than it's backed down on Taiwan or Tibet. Personally, I hope their is confrontation with the US, and China gets its nose bloodied. It may also enable Tibetans to get their country back.

Nisa mentions that 'most Chinese families came to Thailand 400 to a 1,000 years ago'. I think that's a misconception. Granted, some families from China first came here during those hundreds of years ago, but the majority quite likely came within the past decades. I personally know of some Chinese who came here in a large group. They do menial type work and all got Thai passports between 5 and 10 years after sneaking across the border. Chinese-Thai know there's no advantage (for them) to advertise their heritage (and their very strong and long-lived ties with their families in their 'home country'), so they keep v. low key about it, except maybe Chinese new year and such. Still, there are clues. In all their businesses, there are knick knacks hanging around which attest to Chinese roots. It's similar to Latinos and US Americans, except Chinese in Thailand are much better organized, with assistance/support for new arrivals, ease of getting passports, and blending in with Thailand.

[asdecas]

So much for much-vaunted ASEAN solidarity.

[Sydebolle]

So the Thai passports then will feature Khao Phra Viharn soon?