After Opening Your Eyes It's Hard To Shut Them, Advice On Relocating Family To Thailand...

[dcnyli]

After spending some time in thailand over the last two years, and seeing the possibilities to change my families life into something other then the current "american dream" aka "nightmare", i am seriously contemplating leaving the USA for good....

I obviously know i will have to work and am ready and willing, but curious as to what would be a good direction? I would like to provide a comfortable life for my wife and two daughters, great education, healthcare, and be able to spend alot of quality time with my family. Ideally owning my own business would be the best, and outside of Bangkok since the hustle and bustle isn't for me anymore. Possibly and Island in the south, open a bar or restaurant...

anyone have any advice, tips or talk me out of my insanity...

[Khun Jean]

That is a dream. Be prepared for some reality.

Spend the next 6 months reading everything you can about Thailand.

Study visa options, workpermits etc.

Then make that decision.

Is the wife Thai? That would make some things easier.

Edited November 29, 2012 by Khun Jean

[dcnyli]

thanks Khun Jean, i know it's a bit of a "long shot", because in life there is no easy solution to any real problem. I will take your advice and keep up with my research, i am currently 4 months into thai language lessons also. The wife is not thai, but is open to adventure.

[jamescollister]

thanks Khun Jean, i know it's a bit of a "long shot", because in life there is no easy solution to any real problem. I will take your advice and keep up with my research, i am currently 4 months into thai language lessons also. The wife is not thai, but is open to adventure.

If your wife is not a Thai and you don't have a few mill US, then Thailand is out. Look to Cambodia, or may be Lao. Jim

[MichaelJohn]

Facing reality - unless you have western money you cannot "provide a comfortable life for my wife and two daughters, great education, healthcare, and be able to spend alot of quality time with my family". If you have a Thai job and earn Thai salary then you'll live to a Thai standard - unfortunatley quite different from your dream.

If you have USA money- a house you can sell and live of the capital, or rent it out, etc then you have a start.

If you're a "business man" and can run a business then there are a lot of opportunities to make money in Thailand (but you need capital), although I doubt a bar would be feasible/realistic without a Thai wife?

Like any emigration, until you thoroughly understand the local rules and regulations you'll be on the back foot and unfortunatley with corruption and little "help" for foreigners I hate to put a damper on things but .......

Having saidthe above, if you want something bad enough then you'll make it happen. A better quality of life is definatley possible.

Good luck :-)

[Gary A]

I would have to agree with your insanity statement. Thailand is a great place to live if you have money but is a poor place to live if you are scraping to make a living and especially if you want a decent education for your children. A good friend of mine had retired here more than fifteen years ago and as unplanned things go, he ended up with a daughter. He had her in a private school that left a lot to be desired. About a year or two ago he pulled up stakes and took his daughter to the US. He is one of the fortunate guys who is financially independent and he placed his daughter's education above his desire to stay here in Thailand.

[TPI]

You could always look to Malaysia, they're much more accommodating and English is the strong second language. If you're going to open a business then that is the place to start, the people are generally honest and don't think it's a national pastime to rip off farang! the schools are pretty good and your kids could enrol in a state school without suffering too much, on top of that Bahasa Malay is a much, much easier language to learn...I'd check out Malaysia first and then maybe Vietnam. My advice is don't bring your family to the LOS.

[MAJIC]

Sorry to be Pessimistic, but be careful diving into a Bar Restaurant,by far the majority are a quick way to lose your money,and end in failure/Bankruptcy. Just look around and see,how many are for sale,which should tell you something.

[fletchsmile]

To enjoy the lifestyle I want, I need a reasonable amount of money in Thailand. Over the years I've generally done well here investing, and when working have generally earned decent money and again invested part of it here. I also have a lovely Thai wife and children.

I like a lot of things about Thailand. There are some things I don't like

As a guy with a family, if I wasn't financially comfortable, and if I didn't have Thai family I would probably choose somewhere else

I should add that having kids is probably one of the biggest reasons for thinking about moving away from Thailand, even if they do have dual nationality and are fluent in both languages.

Edited November 29, 2012 by fletchsmile

[WhizBang]

Well, that is quite the dream However, it would be better if you were to spend some 'quality' time in Thailand and learn about life here. Then, 'After Opening Your Eyes', you may find that 'It's Hard To Shut Them'.

Seriouslty, Thailand is very xenophobic. The Thai educational system is among the worst in the world, even the very expensive 'International Schools' are not very good. The medical industry here is out to just make money off you. Rampant corruption, EVERYWHERE, and little or no hope for a better future.

As for owning a business, you better do some serious research into what would be involved. When I first came to Thailand in 2000, I wanted to open a business here. It didn't take me very long to realize that I could not operate my business in Thailand, because I run my businesses to very high moral and ethical standards.

There are much better options than Thailand. Especially if you are not a single male.

[manarak]

thanks Khun Jean, i know it's a bit of a "long shot", because in life there is no easy solution to any real problem. I will take your advice and keep up with my research, i am currently 4 months into thai language lessons also. The wife is not thai, but is open to adventure.

OP, I have been going through the same process, which is now ending in a divorce, but me being more happy in Thailand.

For you to be able to provide for everything your family needs, I quote your post,

I would like to provide a comfortable life for my wife and two daughters, great education, healthcare, and be able to spend alot of quality time with my family.

for that your move needs to be a financial success, because private international schools and full coverage medical insurance aren't cheap.

There are 2 ways to achieve this:

- build a local business providing you with income.

Wake up: a guesthouse, a restaurant, a bar, laundry, whatever small business is not going to generate enough money (in addition of being a bit of a headache because of the required work permit).

A good local business generating enough money will be something like an industrial factory, a hotel with 50 rooms+, etc. not a small scale self-employed business.

Investment money, skill, intelligence and charisma is needed to succeed with such a business.

- second possibility: run a business remotely from Thailand that generates western money. This is by far the best variant, but requires creativity, skill and intelligence. Many webmasters live in Thailand.

and finally, if you think as WhizBang above, Thailand simply is not the right place to bring your family to.

Edited November 29, 2012 by manarak

[ThaiRich]

Unless you are wealthy, even by western standards, you would not be able to provide this high standard of living you are dreaming of here in Thailand. A school where English is the first language would limit you to some international schools in Bangkok, Pattaya or Chaing Mai. The cost of those schools alone would cost you a minimum of $20,000 per a year, per a child. Your children are not Thai so they would have no right to any of the free education available here in Thailand even if they could read and speak Thai. Your best bet is to stay where you are and work through your problems when your children are older and on their own then you and the wife should come over.

[CaptHaddock]

>>After spending some time in thailand over the last two years, and seeing the possibilities to change my families life into something other >>then the current "american dream" aka "nightmare", i am seriously contemplating leaving the USA for good....

I am a retired American happy to be living in Thailand, but I can't quite grasp what are the problems in American life for which you imagine Thailand is the solution. Thailand is not really the Land of Opportunity, unless you happen to be a Burmese peasant. It's much harder to make a living here than in the US. Both the salaries and the standard of living are lower. As far as running a business here, have you ever run a business successfully in the US? If not, what do you think the odds will be against you attempting to do so in an alien culture that you don't understand? In addition, the standard of living you describe, and which you seem to regard as somehow modest, would be an impressive achievement here which few Thais attain.

If I were you I would list out in great detail the problems in your American life that you now face and your expectation for how they would be better in Thailand. And then run that by the people here for a reality check.

[Paul888]

You may think that life in America is hard, but it won't take long for you to be yearning for it.

Even with a sizeable chunk of cash behind you, two non Thais and their non Thai children will find it pretty much impossible to replicate the standard of living they have in their own country and forget about a business without a Thai wife or other trusted Thai to front you, that is a no go.

As others have said, lovely country that Thailand is, there are other countries beter suited to your particular circumstances.

[CaptHaddock]

Here's a new statistic that makes my earlier point. The Economist magazine has ranked countries according to how good a place it is to be born. Switzerland = #1, Australia = #2, US = # 16, Thailand = #50. That's the country in which the OP proposes to raise his children.

http://www.economist.com/news/21566430-where-be-born-2013-lottery-life?fsrc=scn/tw/te/tr/thelotteryoflife

[bushwacker]

If you have truly spend time in Thailand over the last 2 years, and if you had your eyes open i.e. looking, seeing, asking, thinking, then I would respectfully suggest that you coming here and trying to do what you have suggested would become the biggest mistake you have ever made in your life. A better strategy might be to stay in the USA, work and spend all of your money on lottery tickets.

Just take some time and read the various threads on this website and you (if a logical and thinking man) will see how silly and impractical your childish dream truly is. Sorry for my blunt but honest point of view. Stop pouring the coffee over your head and try drink it.

[manarak]

Here's a new statistic that makes my earlier point. The Economist magazine has ranked countries according to how good a place it is to be born. Switzerland = #1, Australia = #2, US = # 16, Thailand = #50. That's the country in which the OP proposes to raise his children.

http://www.economist...helotteryoflife

Switzerland is indeed a good place to be born in, but the best strategy would then be to leave ASAP.

It's a pity the Economist doesn't include the detailed numbers.

[chainarong]

What you are proposing is a big big gamble, advise, think about this , you only get one shot, so the odds of a win , are zero, it's not all peaches n cream in Thailand, especially for a non Thai wife and children

[cheechoo]

who in their right mind would want to raise 2 non thai daughters in thailand.

its downright criminal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

now if you were offered toyota gm job or something......i can see it!

[nong38]

If you saw the number of bars up for sale in Pattaya you would not ask this question, its a dream and let it stay that way. Without a Thai wife, a business is not easy. Education here is not like the west, its geared towards self survival rather education as we know it. I would suggest you read this book. "Investing in Thailand" Bruce Bickerstaff. It will give you some insights into Thai life and mindsets that are not what you may think. Quick example: In Europe when a driver flashes his lights it means after you, in Thailand it means I am coming through get out of the way!

Being shrewd in London, Sydney or New York does not mean you are shrewd in Thailand, different rules apply here and you will only find that out when its to late, be very careful you and we learn something new everyday!

Spend a lot more time on acquiring experience, more visits if needed and it might be that other countries close at hand might be more suitable.

The bars by the way had the for sale sings up in the morning when they were not open, walk by in the evening and you would understand why they are for sale, stand back and think again, time is on your side.

Edited November 30, 2012 by nong38

[Rancid]

I've been here with my kids for quite a few years, they are now fluent in Thai, but I am heading home for high school so that they can acclimatize back into the home country, plus of course job and education potential is better. I know the US is turning into a bit of a facist-corporate state, but most of the west is anyway so no real escape, Thailand is freer on many levels but you can always get done up by the corruption. My wife and I will see how it goes for us and will either return to live or maybe just visit, see how things go. For the OP doesn't look like a good idea, come back after your kids grow up.

[JSixpack]

After spending some time in thailand over the last two years, and seeing the possibilities to change my families life into something other then the current "american dream" aka "nightmare"

What is that "something other," exactly, that MUST be so much better than any lifestyle change you can make in the USA? I've lived here for quite a few years and I don't see it.

Ideally owning my own business would be the best . . . Possibly and Island in the south, open a bar or restaurant...

The USA has plenty of islands and remoteness. Real estate's so cheap there right now, too.

If you haven't run a successful business in the West, you have little to no chance of running one in Thailand, esp. not in your burdened circumstances, any time soon. Most likely you'll just lose your shirt. And you can't imagine the frustrations; you ain't experienced "nightmare" yet. Thailand's great as long as you're just spending money. The illusions still hold then. Try to make money and reality intrudes. It's one thing to try make a go of it when you're free and footloose, quite another when you've got the responsibility of a family and high expectations for your children.

It's just another place, really, with its own set of problems, many of which are far worse than the "american dream." I don't think your eyes are yet seeing the real Thailand at all.

Forget it. Spend some holidays here (but in other countries as well), consider moving the family over when you've got million or so.

[jamescollister]

who in their right mind would want to raise 2 non thai daughters in thailand.

its downright criminal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

now if you were offered toyota gm job or something......i can see it!

Me, kids born in OZ wife Thai, live in a village ,kids play in the street with cousins watched over by extended family. No locks on doors. Kids can walk to the shop owned by the wife's Uncle, take what they want, goes on the bill.

We go swimming in small rivers never seen by tourist, picnicking in the jungle, for a kid it is magic compared to a back yard or a park..

As for school, that's when they get older, but at 3 and 5 they can speak Thai, Lao and English and can use and I pad and computer fine, What are they missing in the west. Jim

[brd]

you could run a genuine thai massage place in bangkok in partnership with a pro aussie.....see tigerlillymassage.com web site...if you like it come along meet with khun chang. investigate prior relocating.....for schools, hospital and residential privileges.....

Edited November 30, 2012 by brd

[brd]

who in their right mind would want to raise 2 non thai daughters in thailand.

its downright criminal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

now if you were offered toyota gm job or something......i can see it!

Me, kids born in OZ wife Thai, live in a village ,kids play in the street with cousins watched over by extended family. No locks on doors. Kids can walk to the shop owned by the wife's Uncle, take what they want, goes on the bill.

We go swimming in small rivers never seen by tourist, picnicking in the jungle, for a kid it is magic compared to a back yard or a park..

As for school, that's when they get older, but at 3 and 5 they can speak Thai, Lao and English and can use and I pad and computer fine, What are they missing in the west. Jim

right now you are happily right to be missing nothing it is true except not learning self discipline will make the difference between them to be raised like pets or after 2 years old like quality kids.....as they should be taught right, wrong and NO, otherwise they will remain pets........play....play....play....eat....eat....play....play.....how useful is Lao ? English and Thai prime....good connections will be important and all is happening in Bangkok to grow up.....Think to learn or learn to think will be missing if they play, play....I have stopped the excessive play play, play influence of the Thai family....I have stopped international school building up their ego and on sand back to basic papa mammy one in Thai and one in english with discipline, order and play under control...no time wasted on computers only for useful learning otherwise cartoons cartoons, games and cartoons...Good luck to your family...I am struggling to impose reading books, my own will, in laws are out of the way, bouncing back. but not traveling overseas as much as before....my wife understands but has to be reminded my intentions......I am not ATM and every one contributes.....they all of them tried to eat me up with smiles trying to steal our kids etc....Thai style.....ten years later we are together, our kids learn the No and can say it themselves from 1 year old, all of us looking forward in Bangkok to the future no sabai, sabai in Eastern North country....

Edited November 30, 2012 by brd

[kangeroo]

yes i think to go to Thailand is fine but don't look at the place with rose coloured glasses , to have business here you need to be incredibly smart and lucky and any of the guys i know who where decent and honest are themselves bending the rules paying police and paying any body in power to get what they want , having said all that if you have money and are in a decent company and living in a secure area with your family it is possible to live here but remember the rose coloured glasses .

[SteeleJoe]

A comfortable life on an island, ruining a bar, with an income sufficient to provide good education for 2 kids...

Out of all the many many foreigners living in Thailand (including those with decades of experience here and in other ways arguably more likely to be successful than yourself), many would love that -- very few have achieved it.

[USNret]

Me, kids born in OZ wife Thai, live in a village ,kids play in the street with cousins watched over by extended family. No locks on doors. Kids can walk to the shop owned by the wife's Uncle, take what they want, goes on the bill.

We go swimming in small rivers never seen by tourist, picnicking in the jungle, for a kid it is magic compared to a back yard or a park..

As for school, that's when they get older, but at 3 and 5 they can speak Thai, Lao and English and can use and I pad and computer fine, What are they missing in the west. Jim

The difference between you & the OP is your Thai wife. Thus it's not a good comparison.

[WhizBang]

What are they missing in the west. Jim

A FUTURE.

[jamescollister]

What are they missing in the west. Jim

A FUTURE.

Think you may find the future is Asia at the moment, better a well of Thai than an unemployed welfare recipient in the west. Asia has free enterprise, if you are smart and work hard you can make it. The west has controlled enterprise, not free, very hard to make the jump from employee to owner. Jim