Americans Fight For Right To Bear Arms - At Work

[DocN]

It would also appear that the burglar was unarmed.

I re-read the article and couldn't find any reference to whether the man breaking and entering the house illegally was armed or not.

Since we are in the habit of assuming things around here...let us further assume the burglar is a 6'4" illegal immigrant and she is a 5'2" housewife with two daughters to protect. OK?

...ahm...that is exactly what I am saying: there a lot of things, that are not said in the article and that is why I have questions.

[Credo]

I don't know too many people in the US who call their husband, and 911 and get a gun because somebody was at the door. You might want to ask what they want (and you don't have to open the door).

The problem with things like this is that lots of stuff happens. Kids playing ball and the ball goes into someone's yard. The gate to the back yard is locked, kid goes to the door....

I am not going to cast dispersion on this poor woman and an obvious burglar. She did what she felt she had to do.

This story, however, is a very poor justification for the argument of the OP.

[chuckd]

I don't know too many people in the US who call their husband, and 911 and get a gun because somebody was at the door. You might want to ask what they want (and you don't have to open the door).

The problem with things like this is that lots of stuff happens. Kids playing ball and the ball goes into someone's yard. The gate to the back yard is locked, kid goes to the door....

I am not going to cast dispersion on this poor woman and an obvious burglar. She did what she felt she had to do.

This story, however, is a very poor justification for the argument of the OP.

Your next excuse for this guy would be that he had a troubled childhood and cannot be blamed for his actions.

From the Atlanta Journal Constitution...

"The Loganville mother of two assumed the knocks on her front door Friday afternoon were from a solicitor.

“Don’t answer,” she yelled to her 9-year-old twins playing downstairs.

When the visitor began repeatedly ringing the doorbell, she called her husband at work."

...and from the same article...

Slater was transported to Gwinnett Medical Center and is expected to survive, the sheriff said.The Long Island native, who now lives in Gwinnett County, was released from the Gwinnett jail in late August after serving six months for simple battery and three counts of probation violation. Slater has six other arrests in Gwinnett dating back to 2008, according to jail records."

http://www.ajc.com/n...gunshots/nTnGR/

[DocN]

I don't know too many people in the US who call their husband, and 911 and get a gun because somebody was at the door. You might want to ask what they want (and you don't have to open the door).

The problem with things like this is that lots of stuff happens. Kids playing ball and the ball goes into someone's yard. The gate to the back yard is locked, kid goes to the door....

I am not going to cast dispersion on this poor woman and an obvious burglar. She did what she felt she had to do.

This story, however, is a very poor justification for the argument of the OP.

Your next excuse for this guy would be that he had a troubled childhood and cannot be blamed for his actions.

From the Atlanta Journal Constitution...

"The Loganville mother of two assumed the knocks on her front door Friday afternoon were from a solicitor.

“Don’t answer,” she yelled to her 9-year-old twins playing downstairs.

When the visitor began repeatedly ringing the doorbell, she called her husband at work."

...and from the same article...

Slater was transported to Gwinnett Medical Center and is expected to survive, the sheriff said.The Long Island native, who now lives in Gwinnett County, was released from the Gwinnett jail in late August after serving six months for simple battery and three counts of probation violation. Slater has six other arrests in Gwinnett dating back to 2008, according to jail records."

http://www.ajc.com/n...gunshots/nTnGR/

So?

She ASSUMED ...and then YELLED....and the guy still kept ringing?

And he was a convict...and that was written on his forehead, so she knew?

[Credo]

No, I did not make any excuses for him and I resent you implying that I did. I did not criticize the woman either.

You, however, have picked a very poor piece of fox news to present as a case for the right to bear arms.

[chuckd]

No, I did not make any excuses for him and I resent you implying that I did. I did not criticize the woman either.

You, however, have picked a very poor piece of fox news to present as a case for the right to bear arms.

Are you a defense lawyer by chance?

I never claimed you criticized the woman, now did I. Although this part of an earlier post of yours certainly implies criticism...

"I don't know too many people in the US who call their husband, and 911 and get a gun because somebody was at the door. You might want to ask what they want (and you don't have to open the door)."

My last article was NOT from Fox News, but I knew somebody would post just such a remark when I made the original one.

[chuckd]

I don't know too many people in the US who call their husband, and 911 and get a gun because somebody was at the door. You might want to ask what they want (and you don't have to open the door).

The problem with things like this is that lots of stuff happens. Kids playing ball and the ball goes into someone's yard. The gate to the back yard is locked, kid goes to the door....

I am not going to cast dispersion on this poor woman and an obvious burglar. She did what she felt she had to do.

This story, however, is a very poor justification for the argument of the OP.

Your next excuse for this guy would be that he had a troubled childhood and cannot be blamed for his actions.

From the Atlanta Journal Constitution...

"The Loganville mother of two assumed the knocks on her front door Friday afternoon were from a solicitor.

“Don’t answer,” she yelled to her 9-year-old twins playing downstairs.

When the visitor began repeatedly ringing the doorbell, she called her husband at work."

...and from the same article...

Slater was transported to Gwinnett Medical Center and is expected to survive, the sheriff said.The Long Island native, who now lives in Gwinnett County, was released from the Gwinnett jail in late August after serving six months for simple battery and three counts of probation violation. Slater has six other arrests in Gwinnett dating back to 2008, according to jail records."

http://www.ajc.com/n...gunshots/nTnGR/

So?

She ASSUMED ...and then YELLED....and the guy still kept ringing?

And he was a convict...and that was written on his forehead, so she knew?

Uh, tell me again...exactly WHO kicked in the door and broke into the house?

[DocN]

I don't know too many people in the US who call their husband, and 911 and get a gun because somebody was at the door. You might want to ask what they want (and you don't have to open the door).

The problem with things like this is that lots of stuff happens. Kids playing ball and the ball goes into someone's yard. The gate to the back yard is locked, kid goes to the door....

I am not going to cast dispersion on this poor woman and an obvious burglar. She did what she felt she had to do.

This story, however, is a very poor justification for the argument of the OP.

Your next excuse for this guy would be that he had a troubled childhood and cannot be blamed for his actions.

From the Atlanta Journal Constitution...

"The Loganville mother of two assumed the knocks on her front door Friday afternoon were from a solicitor.

“Don’t answer,” she yelled to her 9-year-old twins playing downstairs.

When the visitor began repeatedly ringing the doorbell, she called her husband at work."

...and from the same article...

Slater was transported to Gwinnett Medical Center and is expected to survive, the sheriff said.The Long Island native, who now lives in Gwinnett County, was released from the Gwinnett jail in late August after serving six months for simple battery and three counts of probation violation. Slater has six other arrests in Gwinnett dating back to 2008, according to jail records."

http://www.ajc.com/n...gunshots/nTnGR/

So?

She ASSUMED ...and then YELLED....and the guy still kept ringing?

And he was a convict...and that was written on his forehead, so she knew?

Uh, tell me again...exactly WHO kicked in the door and broke into the house?

Okay...again and very slow...this guy broke the law...no question about that!

Before he did that, by RINGING THE DOORBELL for a loooooong time and repeatedly, he made sure that no one was home.

Ergo, it is safe to say, he was not out for a physical confrontation.

He exactly made every effort to find an EMPTY house.

Now here is my point: walk up to the door, ask him what he wants and he -speculation alert- might have made up an excuse and went wandering off into the sunny afternoon.

No harm done! No burglary, no shooting!

There is so much missing in this story and you are so "American" that you don't even notice it!

Where I come from, we open the door when the bell rings and see, who it is and what he wants!

I opened my front door numerous times from the age of 18 until now and NEVER called 911, nor did I hide in the closet!

Never I got robbed neither did I shoot anybody!

The problem in this story is NOT a burglar and a "heroic mom, who did what every responsible gun owner should do", but a story of paranoia and mistrust (inflicted by a media, that tells you, that there is evil lurking everywhere, that turned a (yes I am saying it) relatively "harmless" burglary into a shooting!

[beechguy]

Frankly, we don't care where you come from or how you do things there. In the U.S. I drive on the right side of the road, how good do you think that will work here in Thailand? She chose not to open the door, that is within her right, and in some places common practice, he chose to break the law and he suffered the consequences.

My suggestion, is when the guy gets out of jail next time, he should use some of that energy to look for a less hazardous occupation!

Edited January 7, 2013 by beechguy

[Scott]

He may have used up his 3 strikes, which means he might need a good retirement plan when he gets out.

[F430murci]

I am glad she defended herself and saved her family from harm. These stories, however, are way too few and far between to overcome danger posed by guns and are certainly outnumbered by number of in-home accidental discharge injuires and children killed or injured by weapons kept in homes. Alas, I believe people should have the right or ability to keep certain handguns in their homes for protection provided they pass background checks including mental background checks and are required to register.

Edited January 7, 2013 by F430murci

[F430murci]

First let me apologize for citing a Fox News source. However since the liberal main stream media doesn't often report on such incidents as this, it is sometimes necessary to link to an article only Fox will report.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mom hides children, shoots intruder Paul Ali Slater 5 times

Posted on: 12:06 am, January 6, 2013, by Web Staff, updated on: 07:48pm, January 6, 2013

LOGANVILLE, Ga. — A Georgia mother hid her two 9-year-old twins and shot an intruder, Paul Ali Slater, several times during a home invasion on Friday, according to multiple media reports.

The Loganville mother said she didn’t initially answer when someone knocked on her door around 1 p.m. Friday. When the visitor began repeatedly ringing the doorbell, she called her husband at work, according to the Atlanta Journal Constitution.

He then dialed 911 and his 37-year-old wife gathered their 9-year-old twins and hid them in a crawlspace inside the home.

According to the report, the intruder then forced his way into the home and started “rummaging” through the family’s belongings. When the suspect went into the closet where the family was hiding ,the woman fired six bullets at the suspect, five of which hit alleged suspect Paul Ali Slater in the face and neck area.

“He opens the closet door and finds himself staring down the barrel of a .38 revolver,” Walton County Sheriff Joe Chapman told the Atlanta Journal-Constitution.

Read more here: http://myfox8.com/20...saves-children/

For everyone of these feel good stories, which actually get a lot more press than accidental gun discharge stories that happen all the time, there are hundreds of these:

ALVIN, TX (KTRK) -- Alvin police say a 13-year-old was fatally shot while playing with a gun Wednesday evening.

Mercer Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania State Police said on Sunday Craig Allen Loughery, 7, was shot in the chest and died at the scene when his father Joesph V Loughery, 44, handgun went off by accident inside his truck as he was sitting down while his son was buckling up his seat belt in the front seat.

PORTLAND, Ore. - The 2-year-old child who police said was accidentally shot in the stomach in Dallas, Ore. Friday night has been released from OHSU. Initially, investigators said the 3-year-old accidentally shot his younger brother. But now investigators say they have not been able to determine exactly which boy fired the gun.

DALE CITY, Va. (WUSA) --- A four-year-old boy died after shooting himself in the head after finding a handgun in an unlocked pickup truck parked in front of his home on Empire Street here.

BIRMINGHAM, AL (WBRC) -Birmingham police say a child was accidentally shot by his brother on Thursday morning. Sergeant Johnny Williams says the 12-year-old boy and his 16-year-old brother were playing with the gun when the 16-year-old tried to uncock the gun and accidentally fired it. The 12-year-old was struck in the neck.

KANSAS CITY, Kan.—An 8-year-old boy is in the hospital after being accidentally shot in the head by his grandfather at a Kansas City, Kansas, Cabela's sporting goods store on Friday.

A 2-year-old is recovering after getting shot at a Tallahassee apartment. Tallahassee Police responded to the Forest Hills apartments at 1817 West Call Street around 6:30 p.m. Tuesday night.

STANWOOD, Wash. – The 7-year-old daughter of a Marysville police officer died Sunday after being shot by her young sibling on Saturday.

Edited January 7, 2013 by F430murci

[canman]

Okay...again and very slow...this guy broke the law...no question about that!

Before he did that, by RINGING THE DOORBELL for a loooooong time and repeatedly, he made sure that no one was home.

Ergo, it is safe to say, he was not out for a physical confrontation.

He exactly made every effort to find an EMPTY house.

Now here is my point: walk up to the door, ask him what he wants and he -speculation alert- might have made up an excuse and went wandering off into the sunny afternoon.

No harm done! No burglary, no shooting!

There is so much missing in this story and you are so "American" that you don't even notice it!

Where I come from, we open the door when the bell rings and see, who it is and what he wants!

I opened my front door numerous times from the age of 18 until now and NEVER called 911, nor did I hide in the closet!

Never I got robbed neither did I shoot anybody!

The problem in this story is NOT a burglar and a "heroic mom, who did what every responsible gun owner should do", but a story of paranoia and mistrust (inflicted by a media, that tells you, that there is evil lurking everywhere, that turned a (yes I am saying it) relatively "harmless" burglary into a shooting!

Your points are valid to an extent. However there are parts of America where there is as you say 'paranoia and distrust', some, to a degree justified, possibly the majority not. There may be more to the back story on this one, for example in one of the news articles on this it is mentioned she thought it was a lawyer at the door. Also the husband telling her to hide and call 911 suggests they were for some reason expecting trouble. At the end of the day if you are going to break into a house in America you should not be suprised if you are shot at. I think that is only common sense. The case you try to make for him being a responsible criminal by ringing the bell is frankly laughable.

[Sing_Sling]

There may be more to the back story on this one, for example in one of the news articles on this it is mentioned she thought it was a lawyer at the door. Also the husband telling her to hide and call 911 suggests they were for some reason expecting trouble.

So, it is just fine to shoot a lawyer . . . your logic and justifications astound me

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(yes, my wife is one and at times I'd like to shoot her)

[canman]

There may be more to the back story on this one, for example in one of the news articles on this it is mentioned she thought it was a lawyer at the door. Also the husband telling her to hide and call 911 suggests they were for some reason expecting trouble.

So, it is just fine to shoot a lawyer . . . your logic and justifications astound me

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(yes, my wife is one and at times I'd like to shoot her)

I wasn't suggesting that in this case it was OK to shoot a lawyer, I think you knew that.

[chuckd]

To recap this incident...

Their home is located on a large plot of land separated from their nearest neighbor by perhaps 50-60 meters. The home is in a suburb of Atlanta with other large homes.

Her car was parked in the garage with the garage doors open. The burglar could have assumed (there's that word again) that somebody was home and considering the time of day he acted, it would very likely be the wife.

The husband was at work earning money and paying state taxes, so the state could continue housing and feeding the burglar for most of the rest of his adult life.

The wife called her husband and he advised her to take the 9 year old twins, and the handgun,to the attic and hide.

The HUSBAND then called 911 and reported a possible breaking and entering in progress at his home.

The perpetrator then broke in using a crow bar and began ransacking the house, working his way to the attic.

And that is where the bad guy made his nearly fatal mistake. He opened the door to the closet his victim and the girls were in and came face to face with an armed homeowner who knew how to use the firearm.

By the time the police arrived at the home, the wife had taken care of the problem. The burglar had run for his life and was apprehended near the crime scene.

My son lives in the same general area of Gwinnett and he tells me nearly all the homeowners are armed.

These are the people Obama, the liberal "elite" and the Democrats want to disarm.

[Sing_Sling]

There may be more to the back story on this one, for example in one of the news articles on this it is mentioned she thought it was a lawyer at the door. Also the husband telling her to hide and call 911 suggests they were for some reason expecting trouble.

So, it is just fine to shoot a lawyer . . . your logic and justifications astound me

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(yes, my wife is one and at times I'd like to shoot her)

I wasn't suggesting that in this case it was OK to shoot a lawyer, I think you knew that.

I did know that but the way you put it was asking for that reply (Just a bit of banter)

[chuckd]

There may be more to the back story on this one, for example in one of the news articles on this it is mentioned she thought it was a lawyer at the door. Also the husband telling her to hide and call 911 suggests they were for some reason expecting trouble.

So, it is just fine to shoot a lawyer . . . your logic and justifications astound me

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-

-

-

-

(yes, my wife is one and at times I'd like to shoot her)

I wasn't suggesting that in this case it was OK to shoot a lawyer, I think you knew that.

I did know that but the way you put it was asking for that reply (Just a bit of banter)

Uh, just to clear up a small issue between you two. The article said she thought it was a solicitor at the front door.

In the UK, a solicitor is a lawyer.

In the US, a solicitor is a salesperson.

[Chicog]

These are the people Obama, the liberal "elite" and the Democrats want to disarm.

And where did Obama say that?

[F430murci]

These are the people Obama, the liberal "elite" and the Democrats want to disarm.

And where did Obama say that?

Exactly. It is almost an irrational fear or paranoia that the evil liberals want to take everyone's guns away. Perhaps this is the same mentality that leads one to believe they need an AR-15 to defend their home when every single one of their neighbors not only have no guns, but leave their doors unlocked.

I say let them believe as they believe. No objective evidence, no subjective reasoning or argument will change the way some think when it relates to or potentially contravenes a deep seeded or an inate emotional belief system. Gun control advocates can argue reasonable measures to control, but certain groups will continue to hear "take my guns away.". This just causes more entrenchment and fervor as evidenced on a foreign Visa website . . .

Edited January 8, 2013 by F430murci

[Zatoichi]

The only thing she could have done better was perhaps have a larger caliber weapon. A 12 gauge for example. This guy deserved everything he got and that woman was indeed a hero.

[FDog]

The only thing she could have done better was perhaps have a larger caliber weapon. A 12 gauge for example. This guy deserved everything he got and that woman was indeed a hero.

A woman such as that, with an irrational fear of asking who is at the door is exactly the person that should NOT have a gun.

[Chicog]

The only thing she could have done better was perhaps have a larger caliber weapon. A 12 gauge for example. This guy deserved everything he got and that woman was indeed a hero.

A woman such as that, with an irrational fear of asking who is at the door is exactly the person that should NOT have a gun.

Admittedly, the chances are he would have legged it anyway.

[FDog]

Surely even Americans think it is odd behaviour to not even ask who is at the door.

Ring Ring

Quick phone husband who says to call 911

Ring Ring

Quick go hide in the closet with a gun.

Jeeez what a bunch of fruitloops, both her and her husband.

No only should they not be allowed near a gun they should be seeing a psychiatrist to get over their fear or doorbells.

My God, it could be a Salesman. Shock horror.

[Chicog]

*Deleted quote edited out*

For someone so quick to keep people honest, you sure descend into vacuous one liners very easily.

His point is valid. She didn't even wait for a response before panicking. More to the point, had she answered he probably would have left. The vast majority of burglars do not take unnecessary risks.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Scott

[Zatoichi]

The only thing she could have done better was perhaps have a larger caliber weapon. A 12 gauge for example. This guy deserved everything he got and that woman was indeed a hero.

A woman such as that, with an irrational fear of asking who is at the door is exactly the person that should NOT have a gun.

Weather or not she wants to answer the door is her choice. One that doesn't require you to renounce your citizenship rights either way. You are not required to answer the door. Perhaps for what ever reason her husband doesn't want her answering the door for anyone as a precaution. Good thing she didn't perhaps he would have kicked the door open right then and turned it into a rape/murder case. Good job for her, and I hope this guy rots in prison.

[FDog]

Surely even Americans think it is odd behaviour to not even ask who is at the door.

Ring Ring

Quick phone husband who says to call 911

Ring Ring

Quick go hide in the closet with a gun.

Jeeez what a bunch of fruitloops, both her and her husband.

No only should they not be allowed near a gun they should be seeing a psychiatrist to get over their fear or doorbells.

My God, it could be a Salesman. Shock horror.

*Deleted quote edited out*

My humble apologies, I didn't read the rule stating there was a length of time before one could have an opinion.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Scott

[FDog]

The only thing she could have done better was perhaps have a larger caliber weapon. A 12 gauge for example. This guy deserved everything he got and that woman was indeed a hero.

A woman such as that, with an irrational fear of asking who is at the door is exactly the person that should NOT have a gun.

Weather or not she wants to answer the door is her choice. One that doesn't require you to renounce your citizenship rights either way. You are not required to answer the door. Perhaps for what ever reason her husband doesn't want her answering the door for anyone as a precaution. Good thing she didn't perhaps he would have kicked the door open right then and turned it into a rape/murder case. Good job for her, and I hope this guy rots in prison.

One can answer the door without opening it. Just call out and ask who it is, like any sane person.

No you are not required to answer the door. Odd behaviour not to even ask who is there though, or is that normal practice in the US.

After more ringing, then get a gun and go hide in the closet. More rational behaviour I presume.

She's a nutter and should NOT be anywhere near a gun.

[Scott]

Nasty, inflammatory post and replies have been deleted. FDog, you like other new posters, are welcome to the forum and have every right to your opinion.

It is interesting that some posters seem to think it is their God-given right to have a gun, but it's not a new posters right to express their opinion.

[CrazyKid]

I am loving the posts here.

Here is mine.. I had a conceled weapons permit when in the USAF. It had a reason on it, it said "For Hunting and Fishing".

More than once I was asked by law enforcement why I had a 45 acp in a shoulder holster for hunting and fishing. My reply was ya never know when you might want to hunt.