Thai Banking Products And Services...info Please

[OMGImInPattaya]

I am in the process of setting up some new bank accounts in Thailand. I have lived here for a decade and have had several basic savings accounts with a variety of Thai banks (kasikorn, BAY, Bangkok bank) and these have served their purposes of obtaining ATM cards for local spending of money transferred in from abroad. Now I am thinking of transferring the bulk of my financial assets into a Thai banking institution and need advice of some the products on offer and general banking recommendations on premium banking services, as the amount in question will be around B 40M.

Basically, want several linked accounts, including a basic savings account, some type of higher yield deposit account, a credit card, and securities trading account. So far, I have spoken to representatives of SCB and Kasikorn re their offerings. Of the two, SCB seems to have the better offerings. Currently, they are offering a one-year fund account at 3.04 percent. They will also provide me with their First Priviledge Master Card. Kasikorn will only give a similar account with a rate of less than 2 percent, that is also taxable. If I understood correctly, the SCB fund was non-taxable. Kasikorn also offers either a Premium or Wisdom credit card, depending on deposit amount, which come with lots of bells and whistles.

Anyone out there have any experience with these banks and the accounts mentioned above and/or their credit card offerings? Any comments appreciated.

[rgs2001uk]

Personally I would take what some counter clerk in a place like Pattaya tells me with a pinch of salt.

These offers and promos are changing all the time.

With that sort of money you cant be serious about putting it in a Thai bank, I would be headed for Singapore.

If you must be in Thailand get yourself up to Bkk and talk to either Stan Chart, or UOB.

I would also head over to Aberdeen and ING and talk to them about LTFs.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Personally I would take what some counter clerk in a place like Pattaya tells me with a pinch of salt.

These offers and promos are changing all the time.

With that sort of money you cant be serious about putting it in a Thai bank, I would be headed for Singapore.

If you must be in Thailand get yourself up to Bkk and talk to either Stan Chart, or UOB.

I would also head over to Aberdeen and ING and talk to them about LTFs.

Thanks for advice...am american so not particularly welcome at many banks, including ones in Singapore. As you say, I will discuss with Aberdeen and maybe just use Thai banks for living expense and ATM linked accounts and credit cards. However,, in general, I have not had any issues with Thai banks so far.

[Soutpeel]

"Now I am thinking of transferring the bulk of my financial assets into a Thai banking institution and need advice of some the products on offer and general banking recommendations on premium banking services, as the amount in question will be around B 40M"

I personally wouldnt do that, considering we are talking about a significant amount of money here, whats wrong with leaving it were it is, by all means bring some of it to Thailand, but not all of it...if you really need premium services....HSBC, Citibank, Standard Chartered on someone similar

[fletchsmile]

I wouldn't (and don't) put the bulk of my assets into Thailand and more so not in a single name financial institution.

I would (and do) spread your money around both within Thailand. The Thai baks you mention are OK.

I would (and do) hold money where I come from, in Thailand and offshore like Singapore)

I know you're not a UK citizen, but a similar principle may apply. For a UK citizen I would try and limit assets in Thailand in my own name to about THB 15mio because of inheritance tax. Thailand doesn't really have "trust" structures.

Happily married with kids, I also put money in Thailand in the kids names for several reasons including: 1) tax 2) protection and guarantees in case the financial institution folds

[OMGImInPattaya]

"Now I am thinking of transferring the bulk of my financial assets into a Thai banking institution and need advice of some the products on offer and general banking recommendations on premium banking services, as the amount in question will be around B 40M"

I personally wouldnt do that, considering we are talking about a significant amount of money here, whats wrong with leaving it were it is, by all means bring some of it to Thailand, but not all of it...if you really need premium services....HSBC, Citibank, Standard Chartered on someone similar

I used to think like you but have come around to the other-side. I have lived in LOS for 15 years and am tired of the death of a thousand cuts of converting currency for my living expenses and of course, the slow devaluation of the UD$. ( I know, as soon as I transfer the bulk of my assets to Thailand it will immediately reverse course and the dollar will start a long term appreciation against the Thai baht.) In any case, Thailand is now my home and I will probably die here so why not have all my funds in baht, make investments in a growing economy in baht denominated investment and savings accounts? Thai banks have had their problems in the past (during the Asian financial crisis of over a decade ago) but none of the major private banks went under. And in contrast to many western banks in the current crisis of the past few years, no Thai banks have gone under nor required any government bailouts and many receive solid ratings from the major international credit rating agencies. Therefore, I don't feel there is much risk of putting funds in them.

I read once somewhere that if one is going to truly make a new home in a foreign country, one has to commit to it in all ways, including financially. Those of my friends who have done so have done well, without the hassles of leading a dual financial life and keeping track of taxes filings in separate countries.

Edited December 20, 2012 by OMGImInPattaya

[OMGImInPattaya]

I wouldn't (and don't) put the bulk of my assets into Thailand and more so not in a single name financial institution.

I would (and do) spread your money around both within Thailand. The Thai baks you mention are OK.

I would (and do) hold money where I come from, in Thailand and offshore like Singapore)

I know you're not a UK citizen, but a similar principle may apply. For a UK citizen I would try and limit assets in Thailand in my own name to about THB 15mio because of inheritance tax. Thailand doesn't really have "trust" structures.

Happily married with kids, I also put money in Thailand in the kids names for several reasons including: 1) tax 2) protection and guarantees in case the financial institution folds

Interesting but no wifey or kidlets nor any Western relatives I would want to leave any money too. I will try to spend most of it myself and the remainder, maybe set-up to leave to a Thai charity through a will.

[KHR1010]

Have a look at Standard Chartered, ICBC, or Citi Bank. I have accounts with the first two in the Bangkok locations. These are linked to my primary accounts in HK. They both offer excellent premium banking options. With only 40M Baht you will not get the top tier offerings, but very good none-the-less. If this 40M represents a significant percentage of your net worth I would strongly recommend you do not put it all into Thai institutions. There is simply too much risk for your cash on many levels.

Personally I generally do not keep more than 30M Baht in Thai institutions. My rule of thumb over the years is that not more than 10% of my cash assets will be risked in any bank less than top rated. Your US citizenship will not be a problem at the banks listed above, or be a hinderance to open your main accounts in HK. These banks offer multi-currency accounts, by linking these HK accounts with a local Thai branch of the same bank you will get the benefits you are seeking locally without the risk and lack of proper premier bank services. One other point to ponder regarding your citizenship is that ICBC is one institution that will not be strong-armed by the IRS. Personally I have slowly moved much of my personal and business banking towards Chinese banks, this is for a multitude of reasons, not the least of which is their stance against US interference with their customers.

Edited December 20, 2012 by KHR1010

[OMGImInPattaya]

Have a look at Standard Chartered, ICBC, or Citi Bank. I have accounts with the first two in the Bangkok locations. These are linked to my primary accounts in HK. They both offer excellent premium banking options. With only 40M Baht you will not get the top tier offerings, but very good none-the-less. If this 40M represents a significant percentage of your net worth I would strongly recommend you do not put it all into Thai institutions. There is simply too much risk for your cash on many levels.

Personally I generally do not keep more than 30M Baht in Thai institutions. My rule of thumb over the years is that not more than 10% of my cash assets will be risked in any bank less than top rated. Your US citizenship will not be a problem at the banks listed above, or be a hinderance to open your main accounts in HK. These banks offer multi-currency accounts, by linking these HK accounts with a local Thai branch of the same bank you will get the benefits you are seeking locally without the risk and lack of proper premier bank services. One other point to ponder regarding your citizenship is that ICBC is one institution that will not be strong-armed by the IRS. Personally I have slowly moved much of my personal and business banking towards Chinese banks, this is for a multitude of reasons, not the least of which is their stance against US interference with their customers.

Thanks for your input. I would be curious to know why you feel the Chinese state banks would be a safe (safer?) place to put one's money than a Thai bank or Hong Kong bank. There has been much speculation about a huge real estate bubble in China with these Chinese banks holding the bag if the market should crash. There has also been much written regarding non-performing or under-performing loans in their portfolios. I don't want to speculate on the "real" health of the Chinese banking sector...just to point out that IMHO there is at least as much, if nor more, risk in placing funds in these banks as any Thai bank.

Regarding Thai banks, what specific risks do you see for a non-Thai retired in Thailand in placing substantial funds in them. Other than the obvious ones like limited deposit insurance limits and of course out and out failure of the bank. In addition, I like being "close" to my money and even having to deal with issues with my USA bank from Thailand gets to be tiring. The Thai banking sector has thrived over the decade I have been here and the economy continues to be strong so I don't see any major issues with these banks.

[Soutpeel]

I read once somewhere that if one is going to truly make a new home in a foreign country, one has to commit to it in all ways, including financially. Those of my friends who have done so have done well, without the hassles of leading a dual financial life and keeping track of taxes filings in separate countries.

Seeing as we are quoting things.....my one would relate to eggs and baskets...

As regards dual financial lives....guess these days getting harder and harder for US citizens....personally I have always had a dual financial life and its not a problem, after 11 years in working here, I hold my primary financial stuff in Singapore and have a small "working" account in Thailand for day to day...pay my tax in Thailand, no taxation in Singapore as a non-resident, and do not have to deal with the taxman in my home country as I am non-resident...so this arrangement works well for me..

[Soutpeel]

Regarding Thai banks, what specific risks do you see for a non-Thai retired in Thailand in placing substantial funds in them. Other than the obvious ones like limited deposit insurance limits and of course out and out failure of the bank. In addition, I like being "close" to my money and even having to deal with issues with my USA bank from Thailand gets to be tiring. The Thai banking sector has thrived over the decade I have been here and the economy continues to be strong so I don't see any major issues with these banks.

Based on my experience of Thai banks....incompetence..Thai banks are ok for day to day stuff..deposits....withdrawals...but anything more complicated thats when the problems start...

Personally I would be looking at Singapore or HK...but seeing as your a US citizen...you will find problems trying to open accounts there..

Edited December 21, 2012 by Soutpeel

[bangkokburning]

Yesterday set up joint acct w/ the wife. They tried to upsell us into 3% acct, locked for two (three?) years. Needed to make addl deposits as well, not sure if I understood correctly but same amnt or more as initial deposit.

Have no intention of wding the money but why would any fool lock money up for 3% minus ten percent of that, so abt b2700 per 100k.

Then there are the five year accts, who knows where inflation will be in Thai in five years. Thailand is one of few countries that has not YET debased its currency, but has many reasons to do so.

[OMGImInPattaya]

I read once somewhere that if one is going to truly make a new home in a foreign country, one has to commit to it in all ways, including financially. Those of my friends who have done so have done well, without the hassles of leading a dual financial life and keeping track of taxes filings in separate countries.

Seeing as we are quoting things.....my one would relate to eggs and baskets...

As regards dual financial lives....guess these days getting harder and harder for US citizens....personally I have always had a dual financial life and its not a problem, after 11 years in working here, I hold my primary financial stuff in Singapore and have a small "working" account in Thailand for day to day...pay my tax in Thailand, no taxation in Singapore as a non-resident, and do not have to deal with the taxman in my home country as I am non-resident...so this arrangement works well for me..

That's basically what I intend to do but in Thailand (with a combination of basic savings/term deposits at the "big four" private banks) for day to day living expenses. As has been suggested, I will also look into placing the bulk of my assets into some combination of income/dividend and growth funds at Aberdeen and/or ING.

I'm not looking to avoid taxing necessarily, just want to simplify my financial affairs and record keeping Having multiple bank and brokerage accounts here and in the USA and dealing with all the paperwork, taxes, and regulations from near and far has gotten to be a pain in the backside.

If I can get anywhere from 3-5 percent returns on my money, with a degree of safety, then I'm fine. This seems quite doable here in Thailand with the above mentioned mix of investments/savings.

[KHR1010]

Have a look at Standard Chartered, ICBC, or Citi Bank. I have accounts with the first two in the Bangkok locations. These are linked to my primary accounts in HK. They both offer excellent premium banking options. With only 40M Baht you will not get the top tier offerings, but very good none-the-less. If this 40M represents a significant percentage of your net worth I would strongly recommend you do not put it all into Thai institutions. There is simply too much risk for your cash on many levels.

Personally I generally do not keep more than 30M Baht in Thai institutions. My rule of thumb over the years is that not more than 10% of my cash assets will be risked in any bank less than top rated. Your US citizenship will not be a problem at the banks listed above, or be a hinderance to open your main accounts in HK. These banks offer multi-currency accounts, by linking these HK accounts with a local Thai branch of the same bank you will get the benefits you are seeking locally without the risk and lack of proper premier bank services. One other point to ponder regarding your citizenship is that ICBC is one institution that will not be strong-armed by the IRS. Personally I have slowly moved much of my personal and business banking towards Chinese banks, this is for a multitude of reasons, not the least of which is their stance against US interference with their customers.

Thanks for your input. I would be curious to know why you feel the Chinese state banks would be a safe (safer?) place to put one's money than a Thai bank or Hong Kong bank. There has been much speculation about a huge real estate bubble in China with these Chinese banks holding the bag if the market should crash. There has also been much written regarding non-performing or under-performing loans in their portfolios. I don't want to speculate on the "real" health of the Chinese banking sector...just to point out that IMHO there is at least as much, if nor more, risk in placing funds in these banks as any Thai bank.

Regarding Thai banks, what specific risks do you see for a non-Thai retired in Thailand in placing substantial funds in them. Other than the obvious ones like limited deposit insurance limits and of course out and out failure of the bank. In addition, I like being "close" to my money and even having to deal with issues with my USA bank from Thailand gets to be tiring. The Thai banking sector has thrived over the decade I have been here and the economy continues to be strong so I don't see any major issues with these banks.

I am not going to pontificate on a public forum as to the risks I know are associated with holding substancial money in a Thai bank. But to generalize, you must never forget that Thailand is a Pineapple-Republic that has no rule of law for the so called "elite" or well connected within the Kingdom. This is a country who's citizens consider you less than equal, this includes the dirt-poor Thai pushing a food cart down the side of the road. You are, and always will be, less than the Thais in their eyes. You give up any and all initiative to your financial means by putting your cash into a system run by "elites" who have made their money through graft and extortion. Essentially you are having the fox guard the hen-house and you would not be the first farang to be parted from his money through smarmy tactics generated internally from banking connections.

There are excellent options that allow you to mitigate risk and still accomplish the ease of everyday transactions you are seeking. It sounds as if you are enamored with Thailand and either your rose-colored-glasses or naiveté are clouding you vison of the reality that exists here. I gained Thai citizenship 10 years back and my family has been doing business here since 1967. despite the advantages I have with strong JV partners in Thailand and Thai citizenship I have learned through the years this is a very dangerous place, and money is far more important to many Thais than my well being. Good luck on your decision I hope it goes well for you.

[rgs2001uk]

Have a look at Standard Chartered, ICBC, or Citi Bank. I have accounts with the first two in the Bangkok locations. These are linked to my primary accounts in HK. They both offer excellent premium banking options. With only 40M Baht you will not get the top tier offerings, but very good none-the-less. If this 40M represents a significant percentage of your net worth I would strongly recommend you do not put it all into Thai institutions. There is simply too much risk for your cash on many levels.

Personally I generally do not keep more than 30M Baht in Thai institutions. My rule of thumb over the years is that not more than 10% of my cash assets will be risked in any bank less than top rated. Your US citizenship will not be a problem at the banks listed above, or be a hinderance to open your main accounts in HK. These banks offer multi-currency accounts, by linking these HK accounts with a local Thai branch of the same bank you will get the benefits you are seeking locally without the risk and lack of proper premier bank services. One other point to ponder regarding your citizenship is that ICBC is one institution that will not be strong-armed by the IRS. Personally I have slowly moved much of my personal and business banking towards Chinese banks, this is for a multitude of reasons, not the least of which is their stance against US interference with their customers.

Thanks for your input. I would be curious to know why you feel the Chinese state banks would be a safe (safer?) place to put one's money than a Thai bank or Hong Kong bank. There has been much speculation about a huge real estate bubble in China with these Chinese banks holding the bag if the market should crash. There has also been much written regarding non-performing or under-performing loans in their portfolios. I don't want to speculate on the "real" health of the Chinese banking sector...just to point out that IMHO there is at least as much, if nor more, risk in placing funds in these banks as any Thai bank.

Regarding Thai banks, what specific risks do you see for a non-Thai retired in Thailand in placing substantial funds in them. Other than the obvious ones like limited deposit insurance limits and of course out and out failure of the bank. In addition, I like being "close" to my money and even having to deal with issues with my USA bank from Thailand gets to be tiring. The Thai banking sector has thrived over the decade I have been here and the economy continues to be strong so I don't see any major issues with these banks.

I am not going to pontificate on a public forum as to the risks I know are associated with holding substancial money in a Thai bank. But to generalize, you must never forget that Thailand is a Pineapple-Republic that has no rule of law for the so called "elite" or well connected within the Kingdom. This is a country who's citizens consider you less than equal, this includes the dirt-poor Thai pushing a food cart down the side of the road. You are, and always will be, less than the Thais in their eyes. You give up any and all initiative to your financial means by putting your cash into a system run by "elites" who have made their money through graft and extortion. Essentially you are having the fox guard the hen-house and you would not be the first farang to be parted from his money through smarmy tactics generated internally from banking connections.

There are excellent options that allow you to mitigate risk and still accomplish the ease of everyday transactions you are seeking. It sounds as if you are enamored with Thailand and either your rose-colored-glasses or naiveté are clouding you vison of the reality that exists here. I gained Thai citizenship 10 years back and my family has been doing business here since 1967. despite the advantages I have with strong JV partners in Thailand and Thai citizenship I have learned through the years this is a very dangerous place, and money is far more important to many Thais than my well being. Good luck on your decision I hope it goes well for you.

At last, an insight telling what I have always suspected or has been hinted at elsewhere, coming from a Thai makes it all the more remarkable.

I have had Thais tell me the same, look at me as if I was some sort of madman, go to Singapore I was told.

As for Kasikorn bank, isnt that the old Thai farmers bank?

Remember when ADB were here?

[OMGImInPattaya]

Have a look at Standard Chartered, ICBC, or Citi Bank. I have accounts with the first two in the Bangkok locations. These are linked to my primary accounts in HK. They both offer excellent premium banking options. With only 40M Baht you will not get the top tier offerings, but very good none-the-less. If this 40M represents a significant percentage of your net worth I would strongly recommend you do not put it all into Thai institutions. There is simply too much risk for your cash on many levels.

Personally I generally do not keep more than 30M Baht in Thai institutions. My rule of thumb over the years is that not more than 10% of my cash assets will be risked in any bank less than top rated. Your US citizenship will not be a problem at the banks listed above, or be a hinderance to open your main accounts in HK. These banks offer multi-currency accounts, by linking these HK accounts with a local Thai branch of the same bank you will get the benefits you are seeking locally without the risk and lack of proper premier bank services. One other point to ponder regarding your citizenship is that ICBC is one institution that will not be strong-armed by the IRS. Personally I have slowly moved much of my personal and business banking towards Chinese banks, this is for a multitude of reasons, not the least of which is their stance against US interference with their customers.

Thanks for your input. I would be curious to know why you feel the Chinese state banks would be a safe (safer?) place to put one's money than a Thai bank or Hong Kong bank. There has been much speculation about a huge real estate bubble in China with these Chinese banks holding the bag if the market should crash. There has also been much written regarding non-performing or under-performing loans in their portfolios. I don't want to speculate on the "real" health of the Chinese banking sector...just to point out that IMHO there is at least as much, if nor more, risk in placing funds in these banks as any Thai bank.

Regarding Thai banks, what specific risks do you see for a non-Thai retired in Thailand in placing substantial funds in them. Other than the obvious ones like limited deposit insurance limits and of course out and out failure of the bank. In addition, I like being "close" to my money and even having to deal with issues with my USA bank from Thailand gets to be tiring. The Thai banking sector has thrived over the decade I have been here and the economy continues to be strong so I don't see any major issues with these banks.

I am not going to pontificate on a public forum as to the risks I know are associated with holding substancial money in a Thai bank. But to generalize, you must never forget that Thailand is a Pineapple-Republic that has no rule of law for the so called "elite" or well connected within the Kingdom. This is a country who's citizens consider you less than equal, this includes the dirt-poor Thai pushing a food cart down the side of the road. You are, and always will be, less than the Thais in their eyes. You give up any and all initiative to your financial means by putting your cash into a system run by "elites" who have made their money through graft and extortion. Essentially you are having the fox guard the hen-house and you would not be the first farang to be parted from his money through smarmy tactics generated internally from banking connections.

There are excellent options that allow you to mitigate risk and still accomplish the ease of everyday transactions you are seeking. It sounds as if you are enamored with Thailand and either your rose-colored-glasses or naiveté are clouding you vison of the reality that exists here. I gained Thai citizenship 10 years back and my family has been doing business here since 1967. despite the advantages I have with strong JV partners in Thailand and Thai citizenship I have learned through the years this is a very dangerous place, and money is far more important to many Thais than my well being. Good luck on your decision I hope it goes well for you.

At last, an insight telling what I have always suspected or has been hinted at elsewhere, coming from a Thai makes it all the more remarkable.

I have had Thais tell me the same, look at me as if I was some sort of madman, go to Singapore I was told.

As for Kasikorn bank, isnt that the old Thai farmers bank?

Remember when ADB were here?

Yes it is...what of it. They changed their name about 10 years ago...nothing particularly unusual or noteworthy about that. (Not really a name change, if one wants to be pedantic, just Anglicized the Thai name or would it be Thaified the Anglo name.)

[OMGImInPattaya]

Just some follow-up info on what I have been finding about in my research on banking in Thailand as a non-working foreigner and living in Pattaya. First off, you really have to wonder about the geneeral level of education of some of these frontline staff...many seem completely ignorant of their own bank products or the requirements for same. Maybe I'm not explaining myself in very good Thai but in a retirement town like pattaya, you would think the banks would try to put some of their English speaking staff up front.

However, I have found that Bank of Ayudhya (Krungsri) is somewhat of an exception. I have been to several of their branches around town speaking to various of their staff and they all have had staff proficient enough n English thati I could feel comfortable banking there. Kasikorn and Siam Commercial Bank branches are more hit and miss, but there is usually someone in the branch who can speak business English. Apropo Krungsri's English speakers, they also have one of the best English websites of the major Thai banks. Products and services are explained in a clear and plain manner. Another website n the same class (if not better) is UOB Bank. Their site is a model of clarity and information. (Being based out of Singapore may have something to do with this...also Krungsri, being previously owned by GEneral Electric) and now by HSBC may explain their emphasis on English on the website and with their staff.)

One oddity I discovered was when investigating UOB's banking products and was told there was a B 50k minimum for openings any kind of new account (even a plain low-interest savings account). This was unfortunate as they currently have a fixed term deposit promo interest rate of just over 3% for 5 and 10 month deposits and would have liked to get this but have to also open the savings account too. The lady explained that I could withdraw as much as I wanted from the savings account the next day with no penalties...so why not just open a 5 or 10k account to begin with?

The UOB staff also seemed to be completely unfamiliar with the concept of a secured credit card, and besides, they said they needed a work permit in any case, which I, as a retired person, obviously don't have. But never mind, Krungsri staff were thoroughly familiar with the product (and it's also set out plainly on their website). Overall, it just seemed to me that the Krungsri staff just seemed to be better trained than the staff at the other other banks. Maybe this has something to do with their recent history of foreign ownership.