33 Dead As " Seven Dangerous Days " Of New Year's Break Begin: Thailand

[crazydrummerpauly]

Its not just Thailand.

Check out road deaths in Uk,so far over the festive season.

They have a stringent testing process in place.

Yes, UK in 2011 approx 2,000 road deaths and population of 62,641,000, compared to around 12,000 in Thailand with a population of 69,518,555. Huge difference.

Yep - and that figure has dropped from 3,000+ for various reasons both behavioural and technical (belts, air-bags, stronger cars etc). The breathalyser has also played a big part. Before it was introduced we all - policemen included - drank and drove routinely. In the countryside yrs ago(E.Anglia) i knew GPs who would have a 'nip' of spirits at each house they called at !

[cbrer]

That time of year again? Must be.

I don't venture outside of my Moo-Bahn for New Years and Songkran.

After witnessing Thai society it is much better not to.

[LUSHGOAT]

I have been pulled over everyday driving into KK all they want is money , how does that help the road toll?

That's exactly what it is, a highway toll.

No thats what they call highway robbery

[Mosha]

What gets me with the volunteer checkpoints. Round here I see they turn up on motorbikes. Sit there, drink alcohol, and they are supposed to be policing drunk drivers.

[DocN]

I wonder how many TV,ers could go back to the homeland and pass the requisite test,for a license in the home country.

Very few,I would think.

Though this is not the question, isn't it...as we are talking about Thailand, where a drunk poodle with Alzheimers could do the driving test!

[chrisrazz]

I have to go to Laos tomorrow, not looking forward to it at all. 300km round trip.

Apart from the already mentioned issues regarding licensing and testing standards, one bugbear I have is the way some vehicles are advertised on the TV, and the subsequent attitude of drivers of those vehicles. 9 times out of 10 a black Toyota Vigo will be the vehicle right up my clacker. What genius of marketing called a motorcycle Yamaha Smash. I know most on here won't watch prime time Thai TV, but check out the ads sometime. The Toyota ad particularly implies a king of the road status.

[TackyToo]

Gently pulling on the handbrake usually wakes them up:-)

...yeah good idea if you wanna get shot at the next gas stop!

[TackyToo]

The Thai national sport will always be driving one's car into a tree.

The problem seems to be once they are high on booze, speed and yaba, everythings looks like a tree to them...

[TackyToo]

I wonder how many TV,ers could go back to the homeland and pass the requisite test,for a license in the home country.

Very few,I would think.

Even if you forgot 80 % of what you learned to obtain a Euro-driver-license (allowed weight, freight declaration signs etc...) you will probably be 80% less dangerous to others than the average Thai! Maybe it's because your parents already taught you common sense from day one?

[ericthai]

It's also just the lack of being logical while driving...many accidents could be avoided if people would keep at least 30 meters between each other.

Yesterday I had a few vans and buses drive at 5 meters from me...and I was going 110 km/h...

When buses or trucks sit on my bumper in heavy traffic I break a little, then speed up to make some room, if they continue to sit dangerously close I wait for a hill and slow to a complete stop to give them a few minutes to think about how to keep safe on the roads.

And you think this is safe driving? What you are doing is just increasing the chances for an accident.

[Felt 35]

I suppose at the rate the Thai's are giving out holiday days, next year the headline will read ' Ten dangerous Days '. Why not shorten the holiday ' dangerous ' days to three or four ? And, taking into consideration this isn't even Thailand's New Year why are they on holiday anyway ?

Yeah, and why do they drive cars, or bikes, drink beer, watch TV, use cellphones, computers, the internet, or condoms. Taking into consideration Thais didn't invent those things.

The thing is they do all of the above when driving

Btw, the Government have tried what finnomick1 suggest a few times without luck, 4 or 7 days dont matter, money to burn decide

[wolf5370]

Its not just Thailand.

Check out road deaths in Uk,so far over the festive season.

They have a stringent testing process in place.

Yes, UK in 2011 approx 2,000 road deaths and population of 62,641,000, compared to around 12,000 in Thailand with a population of 69,518,555. Huge difference.

You also have to remember that in the UK that mean icy roads and bad weather conditions which is a large added danger that does not exist here. Drink driving testing is heavily undertaken this time of the year in the UK and there is no chance of bribing the copper who pulls you - zero tolerence campaigns. Although the UK (London at least) lays on free tube (underground) and buses with extended running times, on new years eve to limit need to drive about town that night (the big party night).

Next doot to me is a traffic police station, across the road a 7-11 and an open-air restaurant. The road is a wide busy road (we would call an A road in the UK - one step down from a motorway/highway - it has a 3 digit number). The restaurant closes at 10pm most nights bvut will stay open if customers are in there - people drive there as it is noit an ideal place to walk to (I walk as I live just over the road) - I eat there a lot - and at any time of the day or night (that they are open) there are groups of people with bottles of 1000 Pipers and empty Chang bottles. Lorry drivers, local government workers and taxi/tuktuk drivers stop for food and beer (can see by their vehicles). They have a big TV with satelite and football matches attract a lot of mid-day drinkers - in cars. I have seen people so drunk that they drive on the grass taking out rubbish sacks - and it is a very wide road! I have never seen anyone arrested or even stopped by the BiBs next door.

They have set up a tent and signage for the new year peiod as they do every year. There are many more police there now. They sit at a table chatting all day and night and eating. I have only seen one car stopped, although I think it stopped to ask directions as there were no checks done and the driver drove away soon after stopping. The only action is when a call comes in and they rush off in a pick up.

There is a crash outside (right in front of the cop shop) at least once a month - often once a week. There is a cross roads formed by two moo bahns opposite and the main road. I talked to an old lady who is a business lady and was the one that built some of the moo bahn and roadside houses (like mine). She said they rtried for years to get crossing lights but was always turned down as she refused to pay a huge bribe (her words) - so the crashes go on, week after week. Latest one was day before yesterday - a car rear ened a pickup (car driver was on the phone - indeed he didn't get out of his car for another 5 minutes or so until he finished his call!) - the pickup was shunted off the road into the roadside ditch (a good 20 feet down). Car lost its bumper. Cops run out immediately as they always do (this they are good at - responding to crashes - lots of practise I guess).

Drink driving is out of control here - professional drivers have liquid lunches and get back in their vehicles, they know there is little risk of them being stopped. Has anyone ever seen a Tuk Tuk stopped at a checkpoint? If they want to stop it, they need to run more stop and checks and publish stats by area (in an effort to convince some BiBs to prosecute rather than "collect direct fines" - and to show they are serious about cracking down). However, with refusals to put up safety crossings where they are obviously needed, and the lack of real crackdown (a few tents and a big police jolly don't make a crackdown), makes me think its all lip service. After all, drink driving and vehicular death is as much a population control here as disease and starvation is in other Asian/African countries.

[wolf5370]

]It won't matter how hard the driving test is, to drive safely, you need a lot of common sense. That is one thing most Thais do not have, especially on the roads.

LOL. The common sense in your country is probably just the sense to not get booked. Take away all traffic law enforcement in your own country and let's see how much common sense most drivers display.

(or are you just Thai bashing?)

I've got to admit, you are talking a lot of sense here Tropo, but no, I am not Thai bashing, but in the seven years I have been here, I have noticed most of the Thais definitely do lack common sense, and not just on the roads.

Well, let's just stick to the roads for now. Back at home every single improvement in driver safety came on the back of expensive road safely campaigning and law enforcement. Common sense was not an issue.

Some good examples;

Safety belts. Common sense would suggest bucking up is a good idea. People didn't buckle up so they spent millions on road safety campaigns (including road signs) and started fining people for not wearing them.

Mobile phones. Common sense would suggest that it's safer not to use one when driving. They had to introduce penalties to stop this activity.

Fines alone wasn't doing the job, so they introduced a point deduction system and loss of licence.

That wasn't enough - so they put red light and speed cameras all over town.

Still not enough? People would still drink and drive so they need random breath testing, which often includes every main road out of town on weekends.

I'm suggesting that common sense has little to do with road safety in your own country.

Do you really think that 18 - 30 years olds in any country would exercise common sense in the absence of strict law enforcement.

Seat belts enforcement began with forcing car manufacturers to put them in cars (they were optional once) - this of course increased the number of people that wore them. I remember in the UK there was a lot of arguement about it when it was introduced, people said that it was great for head on collisions, but side impacts it could cause more injury (by causing twisting action and ramming heads into doors etc) and making it hard to get out of the way (I remember a guy on TV talking about how he scrambled over into the back from the driver's chair when he stalled at a crossing and was side hit by a truck, saving his life).

Before manufacturers put them in cars, then sense didn't come into it.

Mobile phone law always gets me. Whilst I totally agree with it, it was silly to limit it to phones. Cigarettes are just as bigger a factor - especially when out of town (motorway driving) - phones are most dangerous in built up areas where lack of concentration in traffic is the danger rather than driving one handed. Cigarettes means driving one handed (at least partly), but also has the danger of the thing breaking or being dropped while driving (a fairly major cause of motorway accidents is dropping a lit cigarette on your lap - only sleeping and sneezing beats the numbers I think). However, the Government at the time (and all successive) would not ban smoking while driving (although it is now technically illegal in comapny cars or for hire vehicles due to the smoking at work laws).

Most speed camaeras were used by local councils in the UK to make money - they were hid and put in areas that were not dangerous (they had to be within a diostance from a crash site, but not necessarily the same road and crash could include things like kids falling off their push bikes!). Some roads were flooded (like the M4) others were left. Many caused accidents - there is one that comes to mind, in London at an underpass (near New Billingsgate) - there is a camera as you exit. The road is wide and fast then tunnel well lit and one way - the camera is set a 30. This has the effect of drivers exiting the tunnel, seeing the yellow box (camera) and hooking up, cars just emerging from the tnnel suddenly have nowhere to go. Another, the road that runs along side the Thames, Victoria Road side, was set up with silly variable speed limits, all with cameras (some hidden under overpasses) - taking the road from 40 to 30 to 20 twice with gaps of less than 100 yards. The road has no schools, no houses, only businesses - but the road is lower than the walkway for much of it, so no people crossing - i.e. no reason for the speed change. This little camera (hidden under an over-road walkway at the 20 mph step down) earned the second best living in fines in London (only beat my Blackwall Tunnel camera - 70, 50, 30 step down on the back of an overpass - i.e. down hill). A lot of this changed with laws to force councils to reinvest the money made from speed traps into the roads and not to hide cameras.

I don't think fine will ever work - people just don't think they are going to get caught, so they continue to drive and ignore any deterents.

The only way (and this is not fool proof either!) is to do the same as seat belts - use technology and enforce it. Over 20 years ago a device was built that connected to a car's ignition system. A small tube needed to be blown into and a digital alcohol tester would not allow the car to start if the person failed the test. Of course there is no way of stopping someone else blowing the tube for you - but how likely is it the car has a sober passanger and that person is not driving? - it has to be blown, it can tell the difference between a plunger or other mechanical device and a person. At the same time, wire in the seat belt for the driver - no seat belt, no start (alrweady on some cars, but not compulsary). If the main countries do this - Eaurope and the States, then Japan will follow and cars will be built with the devices, just as seat belts are standard in all cars now even in countries where there are no seat belt laws.

[tropo]

Seat belts enforcement began with forcing car manufacturers to put them in cars (they were optional once) - this of course increased the number of people that wore them. I remember in the UK there was a lot of arguement about it when it was introduced, people said that it was great for head on collisions, but side impacts it could cause more injury (by causing twisting action and ramming heads into doors etc) and making it hard to get out of the way (I remember a guy on TV talking about how he scrambled over into the back from the driver's chair when he stalled at a crossing and was side hit by a truck, saving his life).

Before manufacturers put them in cars, then sense didn't come into it.

Mobile phone law always gets me. Whilst I totally agree with it, it was silly to limit it to phones. Cigarettes are just as bigger a factor - especially when out of town (motorway driving) - phones are most dangerous in built up areas where lack of concentration in traffic is the danger rather than driving one handed. Cigarettes means driving one handed (at least partly), but also has the danger of the thing breaking or being dropped while driving (a fairly major cause of motorway accidents is dropping a lit cigarette on your lap - only sleeping and sneezing beats the numbers I think). However, the Government at the time (and all successive) would not ban smoking while driving (although it is now technically illegal in comapny cars or for hire vehicles due to the smoking at work laws).

Most speed camaeras were used by local councils in the UK to make money - they were hid and put in areas that were not dangerous (they had to be within a diostance from a crash site, but not necessarily the same road and crash could include things like kids falling off their push bikes!). Some roads were flooded (like the M4) others were left. Many caused accidents - there is one that comes to mind, in London at an underpass (near New Billingsgate) - there is a camera as you exit. The road is wide and fast then tunnel well lit and one way - the camera is set a 30. This has the effect of drivers exiting the tunnel, seeing the yellow box (camera) and hooking up, cars just emerging from the tnnel suddenly have nowhere to go. Another, the road that runs along side the Thames, Victoria Road side, was set up with silly variable speed limits, all with cameras (some hidden under overpasses) - taking the road from 40 to 30 to 20 twice with gaps of less than 100 yards. The road has no schools, no houses, only businesses - but the road is lower than the walkway for much of it, so no people crossing - i.e. no reason for the speed change. This little camera (hidden under an over-road walkway at the 20 mph step down) earned the second best living in fines in London (only beat my Blackwall Tunnel camera - 70, 50, 30 step down on the back of an overpass - i.e. down hill). A lot of this changed with laws to force councils to reinvest the money made from speed traps into the roads and not to hide cameras.

I don't think fine will ever work - people just don't think they are going to get caught, so they continue to drive and ignore any deterents.

The only way (and this is not fool proof either!) is to do the same as seat belts - use technology and enforce it. Over 20 years ago a device was built that connected to a car's ignition system. A small tube needed to be blown into and a digital alcohol tester would not allow the car to start if the person failed the test. Of course there is no way of stopping someone else blowing the tube for you - but how likely is it the car has a sober passanger and that person is not driving? - it has to be blown, it can tell the difference between a plunger or other mechanical device and a person. At the same time, wire in the seat belt for the driver - no seat belt, no start (alrweady on some cars, but not compulsary). If the main countries do this - Eaurope and the States, then Japan will follow and cars will be built with the devices, just as seat belts are standard in all cars now even in countries where there are no seat belt laws.

All I can say is that driving in Australia is a totally different experience these days compared to 10, 20 and 30 years ago. The difference is incredible. It was particularly noticeable in Sydney, where driving used to be absolutely crazy in the 80's (I was one of those crazy drivers back then). Perhaps it works better in Australia than in England, but it definitely works.

NZ is another good example. It's incredible how well behaved traffic is over there.

[marchawkes]

If norms of the road and accidents are anything to go by - Life is cheap in Thailand and police ohhh so CORRUPT !!

[masaomi]

It's also just the lack of being logical while driving...many accidents could be avoided if people would keep at least 30 meters between each other.

Yesterday I had a few vans and buses drive at 5 meters from me...and I was going 110 km/h...

Are you kidding? That's pretty far for them "by their standards"! You should see when they get up close & personal with you! Less than 1 metre & travelling at approximately 120 km/h! Ha.ha.

[masaomi]

It's time everyone has their amulets hanging on the rear view mirror and around their neck. Oh, be sure to include a flower arrangement too!

hahahaha.... Bloody good one!! I love it!

[NoshowJones]

I've got to admit Tropo, everything you have said here is true.

There might be another factor in gauging common sense on Thailand loads. Apart from very lax traffic law enforcement, Thai people may not have the same fear of death that many Westerners have.

I'll have to say that after a nearly 10 absence from driving in Australia, that when I drove there again recently I was driving more slowly than I used to.

This wasn't because I gained common sense. It was because there were more speed cameras around and the fines had gone up considerably.

Same here,, and I really didn't like the experience....having to constantly check your speed and the fact that speed limits could change every km depending on where you were. In a way, I'm more relaxed driving in LoS, I can watch what's going on around me, rather than my speedo all the time. I've done over 250K kms on roads in Thailand and really don't notice the nutters anymore...maybe I've become one - at least according to my Aunt from the UK who recorded 5 moving traffic violations taking her to my place from the airport

Strange thing is that you can get a new fast car cheaply in Australia, where you can't drive it fast - but in LoS you can drive fast, but most can't afford the exorbitant price of a fast car....like the new nissan gtr I passed in traffic this morning:)

Good point, but I don't know how you really don't notice the nutters. There are that many of them.

[Banzai99]

Biggest hazard on Thai roads are Farangs who think they are driving in a different country.

I have driven here for 22 years with no problem, but I wasn't old when I came here, so I could adapt easily.

[edwinchester]

Biggest hazard on Thai roads are Farangs who think they are driving in a different country.

I have driven here for 22 years with no problem, but I wasn't old when I came here, so I could adapt easily.

Interesting. So most accidents and deaths are caused by farangs, I didn't know that.

[Banzai99]

Biggest hazard on Thai roads are Farangs who think they are driving in a different country.

I have driven here for 22 years with no problem, but I wasn't old when I came here, so I could adapt easily.

Interesting. So most accidents and deaths are caused by farangs, I didn't know that.

Not in Thailand, but in USA I would say Thai drivers have very little input into the carnage that claims 40,000 deaths a year.

What Farangs have to remember is, you ain't in your home country and adapt, it would stop the whining and complaining maybe, most are too old to adapt and should be in an old peoples facility in their own country instead of on a motorcycle on the streets of Asia putting everyone elses life at risk.

[simple1]

Biggest hazard on Thai roads are Farangs who think they are driving in a different country.

I have driven here for 22 years with no problem, but I wasn't old when I came here, so I could adapt easily.

Interesting. So most accidents and deaths are caused by farangs, I didn't know that.

Not in Thailand, but in USA I would say Thai drivers have very little input into the carnage that claims 40,000 deaths a year.

What Farangs have to remember is, you ain't in your home country and adapt, it would stop the whining and complaining maybe, most are too old to adapt and should be in an old peoples facility in their own country instead of on a motorcycle on the streets of Asia putting everyone elses life at risk.

The large majority of Westerners who are killed or injured on the roads in Thailand are the younger people who drink/speed and think they are immortal and delude themselves with their perceived superior driving skills. Us older guys do know we are not immortal and usually not deluded, unless we are suffering dementia.

Edited December 31, 2012 by simple1

[apetley]

Biggest hazard on Thai roads are Farangs who think they are driving in a different country.

I have driven here for 22 years with no problem, but I wasn't old when I came here, so I could adapt easily.

Interesting. So most accidents and deaths are caused by farangs, I didn't know that.

Not in Thailand, but in USA I would say Thai drivers have very little input into the carnage that claims 40,000 deaths a year.

What Farangs have to remember is, you ain't in your home country and adapt, it would stop the whining and complaining maybe, most are too old to adapt and should be in an old peoples facility in their own country instead of on a motorcycle on the streets of Asia putting everyone elses life at risk.

I would say that in US Thais have little impact on the accident figures simply because they are a small minority and vastly outnumbered by US citizens.

As for farangs 'whining' maybe you should tell my Thai MIL to stop whining too. Her son was killed by a drunk driver who paid off the police to avoid the consequences. He didn't die straight away but clung onto life for a week in hospital. Doubt if he ever appeared in the official road death statistics.

Edited December 31, 2012 by apetley

[BlackJack]

what are these 7 days anyway?

[webfact]

RT @191Thailand:

There has been 202 deaths on roads so far during the new year holiday in Thailand: Day 1 (33), Day 2 (38), Day 3 (77) & Day 4 (54).

[BlackJack]

RT @191Thailand:

There has been 202 deaths on roads so far during the new year holiday in Thailand: Day 1 (33), Day 2 (38), Day 3 (77) & Day 4 (54).

what date did it start?

28 29 30 31?

thanks

[tropo]

RT @191Thailand:

There has been 202 deaths on roads so far during the new year holiday in Thailand: Day 1 (33), Day 2 (38), Day 3 (77) & Day 4 (54).

Does anyone get killed on the road on the other days of the year?

[mancub]

RT @191Thailand:

There has been 202 deaths on roads so far during the new year holiday in Thailand: Day 1 (33), Day 2 (38), Day 3 (77) & Day 4 (54).

Does anyone get killed on the road on the other days of the year?

And sadly , publishing these figures neither shocks nor does anything to improve road safety . People are more inclined to buy lottery tickets based on them , than to heed the message .

[tropo]

Its not just Thailand.

Check out road deaths in Uk,so far over the festive season.

They have a stringent testing process in place.

low comparing death per citizen, mile or registered vehicle.

Yes, there's a big difference, but there's also a huge gap in quality of emergency services and medical treatment. I'm sure if Thailand had the same ambulance service, on-the-scene medical expertise and emergency treatment at hospitals the gap wouldn't be as large.

Here in Pattaya they just pick the injured up and literally throw them into the back of a pick-up truck.

If the bike accident I had when I was young happened here I would have been another statistic. There is no way I would have survived.

[tropo]

Its not just Thailand.

Check out road deaths in Uk,so far over the festive season.

They have a stringent testing process in place.

Yes, UK in 2011 approx 2,000 road deaths and population of 62,641,000, compared to around 12,000 in Thailand with a population of 69,518,555. Huge difference.

12000/365 = 32.87. Seems 33 is about average for the daily carnage.

These are the figures we need to see. These other figures are just nonsense that the media tout to fill up their pages.