How Bad Is The Crime?

[tc101]

When I asked people to compare Costa Rica to Thailand for retirement, lots of people mentioned that there is less crime in Thailand. On the other hand I see lots of reports of crime when reading online Pataya City News at http://pattayacitynews.net/index.html, and the Lonely Planet Travel Forum at http://thorntree.lonelyplanet.com/categories.cfm?catid=51

So what is the story? Is crime much of a problem or not? What does the new arrival need to know to avoid being a crime victim?

[Thomas_Merton]

When I asked people to compare Costa Rica to Thailand for retirement, lots of people mentioned that there is less crime in Thailand. On the other hand I see lots of reports of crime when reading online Pataya City News at http://pattayacitynews.net/index.html, and the Lonely Planet Travel Forum at http://thorntree.lonelyplanet.com/categories.cfm?catid=51

So what is the story? Is crime much of a problem or not? What does the new arrival need to know to avoid being a crime victim?

It's a fact of life:

Men bite dogs whenever journalists walk the streets (or fall out of the bars).

To the point: unfortunately, if you are comparing Costa Rica with Thailand, then, IMHO, Thailand is not for you.

Learn Spanish.

[LaoPo]

When I asked people to compare Costa Rica to Thailand for retirement, lots of people mentioned that there is less crime in Thailand. On the other hand I see lots of reports of crime when reading online Pataya City News at http://pattayacitynews.net/index.html, and the Lonely Planet Travel Forum at http://thorntree.lonelyplanet.com/categories.cfm?catid=51

So what is the story? Is crime much of a problem or not? What does the new arrival need to know to avoid being a crime victim?

Look here:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_acq_percap

Especially for No. 20 and 23...........

and here for total crimes:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_tot_cri

Costa Rica is not that bad here; No. 46. Thailand is No. 17.

But of course you have to take the No. of people/country into consideration + the Tourist No's.

BUT...this is for robberies...wouldn't go for Costa Rica..... ...No. 3 on the list:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_rob_percap

LaoPo

Edited February 19, 2006 by LaoPo

[Tippaporn]

Newspapers, IMHO, tend to exaggerate any given situation and make it appear as though something is rampant when in fact it's not. Again IMHO, not a good source to evaluate a situation accurately. So . . . good that you ask it here.

After three plus years here I've personally experienced very little. Serious crime has been non-existent for me; hasn't happened to me, to anyone I know, or been witnessed by me. Petty crime has occured several times; a mobile phone stolen from my home after an unsupervised teenage party, my wallet and mobile lifted by a member of our circle of friends. That's about the extent of it.

I feel safe everywhere I go in Thailand. Check out this relative thread here. My wifey only cautions me to keep my wallet in my front pocket when we're out in public. Probably due to some paranoia she feels since I had it lifted by a supposed friend of ours.

My advice? Keep your wits about you as you would anywhere in the world, or even back home, and you'll be 99% trouble free.

Edited February 19, 2006 by Tippaporn

[alexth]

I feel safe everywhere I go in Thailand. Check out this relative thread here. My wifey only cautions me to keep my wallet in my front pocket when we're out in public. Probably due to some paranoia she feels since I had it lifted by a supposed friend of ours.

My advice? Keep your wits about you as you would anywhere in the world, or even back home, and you'll be 99% trouble free.

Somehow safe...I bet you don't have any gold chain or bracelet in the eyesight...if you don't...you're a smart man then...

[Tippaporn]

I feel safe everywhere I go in Thailand. Check out this relative thread here. My wifey only cautions me to keep my wallet in my front pocket when we're out in public. Probably due to some paranoia she feels since I had it lifted by a supposed friend of ours.

My advice? Keep your wits about you as you would anywhere in the world, or even back home, and you'll be 99% trouble free.

Somehow safe...I bet you don't have any gold chain or bracelet in the eyesight...if you don't...you're a smart man then...

It helps that I'm 6'8" (203cm) and 360lbs. (163kg.) of pure muscle.

I wear a single gold chain with a Buddha icon which is never exposed. Other than that I don't get into wearing money. My wifey, though, will not wear gold if she goes out alone (other than a small gold chain with pendant). I've heard the warnings but have never heard any personal stories.

[britmaveric]

Wearing Gold isnt a problem as long as you keep your senses about you. I wear 1bht chain w/buddah and two rings.

[GuestHouse]

It helps that I'm 6'8" (203cm) and 360lbs. (163kg.) of pure muscle

I've seen bigger men weeping at the loss of their life's savings to a 42kg girl they tried to save from a bar.

-------

As for Crime, well I don't have bars on my windows in the UK, nor here in Italy..So what's all that about?

[LaoPo]

It helps that I'm 6'8" (203cm) and 360lbs. (163kg.) of pure muscle

I've seen bigger men weeping at the loss of their life's savings to a 42kg girl they tried to save from a bar.

-------

As for Crime, well I don't have bars on my windows in the UK, nor here in Italy..So what's all that about?

Maybe this?

Stats > Crime > Murders

VIEW DATA: Totals

Rank Country Amount (top to bottom)

#1 India 37,170

#2 Russia 28,904

#3 Colombia 26,539

#4 South Africa 21,995

#5 Mexico 13,829

#6 United States 12,658

#7 Venezuela 8,022

#8 Thailand 5,140

#9 Ukraine 4,418

#10 Indonesia 2,204

#11 Poland 2,170

#12 France 1,051

#13 Belarus 1,013

#14 Germany 960

#15 Korea, South 955

#16 Zimbabwe 912

#17 Jamaica 887

#18 United Kingdom 850

#19 Zambia 797

#20 Italy 746

#21 Yemen 697

#22 Japan 637

#23 Romania 560

#24 Malaysia 551

#25 Spain 494

#26 Canada 489

#27 Papua New Guinea 465

#28 Kyrgyzstan 413

#29 Lithuania 370

#30 Moldova 348

#31 Bulgaria 332

#32 Australia 302

#33 Portugal 247

#34 Costa Rica 245

#35 Georgia 239

#36 Latvia 238

#37 Chile 235

#38 Azerbaijan 226

#39 Hungary 205

#40 Netherlands 183

#41 Czech Republic 174

#42 Uruguay 154

#43 Finland 148

#44 Estonia 143

#45 Slovakia 143

#46 Armenia 127

#47 Tunisia 113

#48 Saudi Arabia 105

#49 Greece 81

#50 Switzerland 69

#51 Denmark 58

#53 Norway 49

#54 Macedonia, The Former Yugoslav Republic of 47

#55 New Zealand 45

#56 Ireland 38

#57 Hong Kong 38

#58 Slovenia 36

#59 Mauritius 26

#60 Seychelles 6

#61 Iceland 5

#62 Dominica 2

#63 Qatar 1

Total: 180,304

Weighted average: 2,908.1

Source:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_mur

Quite interesting statistics there.

VIEW DATA: Per capita

Rank Country Amount (top to bottom)

#1 Colombia 0.617847 per 1,000 people

#2 South Africa 0.496008 per 1,000 people

#3 Jamaica 0.324196 per 1,000 people

#4 Venezuela 0.316138 per 1,000 people

#5 Russia 0.201534 per 1,000 people

#6 Mexico 0.130213 per 1,000 people

#7 Estonia 0.107277 per 1,000 people

#8 Latvia 0.10393 per 1,000 people

#9 Lithuania 0.102863 per 1,000 people

#10 Belarus 0.0983495 per 1,000 people

#11 Ukraine 0.094006 per 1,000 people

#12 Papua New Guinea 0.0838593 per 1,000 people

#13 Kyrgyzstan 0.0802565 per 1,000 people

#14 Thailand 0.0800798 per 1,000 people

#15 Moldova 0.0781145 per 1,000 people

#16 Zimbabwe 0.0749938 per 1,000 people

#17 Seychelles 0.0739025 per 1,000 people

#18 Zambia 0.070769 per 1,000 people

#19 Costa Rica 0.061006 per 1,000 people

#20 Poland 0.0562789 per 1,000 people

#21 Georgia 0.0511011 per 1,000 people

#22 Uruguay 0.045082 per 1,000 people

#23 Bulgaria 0.0445638 per 1,000 people

#24 United States 0.042802 per 1,000 people

#25 Armenia 0.0425746 per 1,000 people

#26 India 0.0344083 per 1,000 people

#27 Yemen 0.0336276 per 1,000 people

#28 Dominica 0.0289733 per 1,000 people

#29 Azerbaijan 0.0285642 per 1,000 people

#30 Finland 0.0283362 per 1,000 people

#31 Slovakia 0.0263303 per 1,000 people

#32 Romania 0.0250784 per 1,000 people

#33 Portugal 0.0233769 per 1,000 people

#34 Malaysia 0.0230034 per 1,000 people

#35 Macedonia, The Former Yugoslav Republic of 0.0229829 per 1,000 people

#36 Mauritius 0.021121 per 1,000 people

#37 Hungary 0.0204857 per 1,000 people

#38 Korea, South 0.0196336 per 1,000 people

#39 Slovenia 0.0179015 per 1,000 people

#40 France 0.0173272 per 1,000 people

#41 Czech Republic 0.0169905 per 1,000 people

#42 Iceland 0.0168499 per 1,000 people

#43 Australia 0.0150324 per 1,000 people

#44 Canada 0.0149063 per 1,000 people

#45 Chile 0.014705 per 1,000 people

#46 United Kingdom 0.0140633 per 1,000 people

#47 Italy 0.0128393 per 1,000 people

#48 Spain 0.0122456 per 1,000 people

#49 Germany 0.0116461 per 1,000 people

#50 Tunisia 0.0112159 per 1,000 people

#51 Netherlands 0.0111538 per 1,000 people

#52 New Zealand 0.0111524 per 1,000 people

#53 Denmark 0.0106775 per 1,000 people

#54 Norway 0.0106684 per 1,000 people

#55 Ireland 0.00946215 per 1,000 people

#56 Switzerland 0.00921351 per 1,000 people

#57 Indonesia 0.00910842 per 1,000 people

#58 Greece 0.0075928 per 1,000 people

#59 Hong Kong 0.00550804 per 1,000 people

#60 Japan 0.00499933 per 1,000 people

#61 Saudi Arabia 0.00397456 per 1,000 people

#62 Qatar 0.00115868 per 1,000 people

Weighted average: 0.1 per 1,000 people

SO: the actual number of murders in Thailand is much higher, but the number 'per capita' Thailand(0.080/1000)-versus-Costa Rica(0.061/1000), isn't that much of a difference, especially if you take the (much) higher number of tourists to Thailand into consideration.

BUT: you could always go to Qatar...

LaoPo

Edited February 19, 2006 by LaoPo

[zoltannyc]

Please be very careful when comparing crime statistics from one country to statistics from another country. You may compare apples and oranges.

The problem is the differences in justice systems and classification methodologies of crimes.

In Thailand a fair share (more then 90%) of crime falls under victimless crimes for example gambling which is not a crime in other countries, as well as possession of drugs.

http://www.police.go.th/stat43.htm

[LaoPo]

Please be very careful when comparing crime statistics from one country to statistics from another country. You may compare apples and oranges.

The problem is the differences in justice systems and classification methodologies of crimes.

In Thailand a fair share (more then 90%) of crime falls under victimless crimes for example gambling which is not a crime in other countries, as well as possession of drugs.

http://www.police.go.th/stat43.htm

Of course; but in my post #9 it was about 'murders' and the numbers of your statitic are about the same as the ones used by me. (see above)

However, statistics are statistics but the amount of numbers (of murders) are fixed, more or less.

LaoPo

[zoltannyc]

I was answering your prev. posting ....regarding murders yes you have a point per 100,000 population it looks high, however in order to make a more meaningful assessment one would need the detailed statistics instead of per population numbers. Geographical distribution and demographic as well as I don’t if the victims of the violence in the south are included or not…

[GuestHouse]

Not scientific but....

When I lived in Pattaya I watched the local Thai TV news, I reckon that there were at least three murders a week. OK Pattaya is noway typical of Thailand, but tell me a town in the US/UK/Europe with a similar population where so many murders are taking place.

Likewise my wife's Amphur (Rural Nakhon Sawan) has had five people murdered since I have know her (Six years). My home town in the UK, which has a considerably larger population has had one murder in my life time (over forty years).

It's not just murders. Thais I know remove all their jewelry before they take a cab as a precaution against being mugged by the taxi driver.

We must also understand that because you 'feel safe' does not mean you 'are safe'. The test of this is to ask the honest advice of Thais. I'm quite sure I'm not the only person here who's Thai wife or friends have warned against some risk that we have brushed off as not worth worrying about.

The point is, they see the risks that a foreigner unable to read the situation doesn'e see.

It works the other way around too. My wife visiting the UK suggests she migh walk out of town to an Asian food centre located in a local industrial estate, and then wonders why I think her walking alone down the dual carriage way is not a good idea.

We can't say judging oranges with apples and then make statements about feeling safe without realising the missunderstanding of risks that we are all subject to when in another country/culture.

One thing is for sure. You can be as big and muscley as you like, but you are making a mistake to think that a Thai guy half your size can't floor you or worse. (When he can't his friends can).

[zoltannyc]

GuestHouse:

You make some very good points…once someone told me that statistics are like the miniskirt it shows lot’s of things but it hides the most important…

[OldAsiaHand]

We must also understand that because you 'feel safe' does not mean you 'are safe'....

Thanks for getting that out on the table. After (yet another) bombardment of oh-how-warm-and-lovely-these-smiling-Thais-are from all the experts out there, a bit of fresh air is most welcome.

[kasi]

I suppose one might want to differentiate between violent crime and petty crime.

To me it seems like petty crime in Thailand is very low.

Thai people while normally quite easy going do indeed have very volatile streaks. When tempers flare here things turn very ugly very fast.

Generally if you avoid pushing the more obvious danger buttons you are more secure here than in a city in the western cultures where violent crime can occur quite randomly.

Rule of thumb: Avoid pissing off thai men.

After that things are very even handed for the most part. Places like Pattaya are the exceptions due to the high levels substance abuse and desperate poverty. Still if you avoid wandering along beach road at 3AM drunk as a skunk you should be alright.

[tc101]

I started this thread back in Feb, thinking I would soon be on my way to Thailand and better know what to be careful of. My life got complicated and I am still here in the USA but hope to be on my way over there soon.

So what should I be careful of? Espically the first few days, when I am exhausted from a long flight and don't know anything and am staying in a hotel in Bangkok before heading to a mellower destination. What does the new guy in town need to be careful of?

[Arsenal]

So what should I be careful of? Espically the first few days, when I am exhausted from a long flight and don't know anything and am staying in a hotel in Bangkok before heading to a mellower destination. What does the new guy in town need to be careful of?

Taking seriously views of deadbeat "expatriates" (actually locally based visa runners and former sex tourists) who have as much sense of Thailand outside their narrow and debased interests as a worm does of its place in evolution.

[Sing_Sling]

I started this thread back in Feb, thinking I would soon be on my way to Thailand and better know what to be careful of. My life got complicated and I am still here in the USA but hope to be on my way over there soon.

So what should I be careful of? Espically the first few days, when I am exhausted from a long flight and don't know anything and am staying in a hotel in Bangkok before heading to a mellower destination. What does the new guy in town need to be careful of?

Good grief, this sounds a bit sad.

Get out at the airport, either have the hotel pick you up or take a taxi from the taxi rank. Check in, have a shower and go for a rest at the pool or sleep a while.

The next day have a look at some of the tours available - take one.

Plan for your next destination and get in with your ife without the anic you seem to be exhibiting.

or:

Get out at the airport, take a chance to save ( ) a couple of baht with a guy touting limos or taxis.

Stay in a cheap hotel near bars and head for the nearest hooker-infested sleaze-joint with money hanging out your pockets and tell everyone how rich you are and how you're looking for someone to trust.

Wow, easy choice, really.

[wolf5370]

Seems to me that crime in LoS used to be non-confrontational. Cons, opportunist thefts and pick-pocketing abound (well, you know what I mean) but mugging was almost unheard of a while back. Now it seems the press seems to have rapes, murders and gangs hunting farangs to mug at night.

Of course it could be that reporting is better now, or that I'm just getting old and grumpy

[a2396]

I thought it was pretty tame here in Khon Kaen until last night, when at around 7 PM, we heard 5 gunshots. A negihbor 3 houses from me was shot while sitting in his car by a motorcycle gunman who fled. Rumor has it that it was over some sort of gambling fued. Anyone know any other information? This is in a security guarded upper level neighborhood.

[tc101]

Good grief, this sounds a bit sad.

Get out at the airport, either have the hotel pick you up or take a taxi from the taxi rank. Check in, have a shower and go for a rest at the pool or sleep a while.

The next day have a look at some of the tours available - take one.

Plan for your next destination and get in with your ife without the anic you seem to be exhibiting.

or:

Get out at the airport, take a chance to save ( ) a couple of baht with a guy touting limos or taxis.

Stay in a cheap hotel near bars and head for the nearest hooker-infested sleaze-joint with money hanging out your pockets and tell everyone how rich you are and how you're looking for someone to trust.

Wow, easy choice, really.

Thanks for the good advice. Not sure why I seem sad to you. I guess I am the cautious type, which is just me.

[Donz]

first trip, dont worry about the crime, just make sure you carry toilet paper with you, especially if your going on a tour.

[LaoPo]

Thanks for the good advice. Not sure why I seem sad to you. I guess I am the cautious type, which is just me.

You're right; be cautious and nothing will happen. Avoid the darker parts of BKK after midnight. Talk to 'Farang' in your hotel and...ask, ask, ask, ask...couldn't harm you, especially if it's your first time.

Take your time to 'acclimatize' and take it 'very easy' the first 3 to 4 days!!!

Statistically Thailand is #47 out of 60 with total crimes/1000 people, so not that bad

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_tot_cri_percap

Good luck!

LaoPo

[Maigo6]

Taking seriously views of deadbeat "expatriates" (actually locally based visa runners and former sex tourists) who have as much sense of Thailand outside their narrow and debased interests as a worm does of its place in evolution.

Arsenal does have a point actually.

You are much more likely to be ripped off by some friendly Farang than a Thai guy.

Many Farangs are on the breadline in Thailand and would not hesitate to rip another farang off to prolong their stay in the Kingdom.