Spouse Visa Granted !

[wayner]

My wife attended the embassy today and was finally granted her spouse visa. We were married in the UK whilst she was on a V – visa last January, just before they changed the rules.

In her short interview the officer had a bit of a go at her saying “You couldn’t possibly have gotten married on a tourist visa” my wife found herself explaining to the officer the changes that took place and when, regarding getting married in the UK. Bearing in mind that the visa was already issued. It seemed that it was given with some unnecessary grumpiness.

Nevertheless we are as happy as can be with the result and look forward to being together.

Many thanks to all that helped with my queries on this site. Especially Scouse.

I’d also like to wish everyone going through any of these procedures the very best of luck in obtaining some sort of normality regarding relationship and location.

Cheers people

Wayner

[GU22]

Congrats, and best of luck in the future.

[vinny]

Congratulations too! When you get back and are relaxed in the UK, read the form SET(M) so that you know what will be required in two years' time.

[silomfan]

My wife attended the embassy today and was finally granted her spouse visa. We were married in the UK whilst she was on a V – visa last January, just before they changed the rules.

In her short interview the officer had a bit of a go at her saying “You couldn’t possibly have gotten married on a tourist visa” my wife found herself explaining to the officer the changes that took place and when, regarding getting married in the UK. Bearing in mind that the visa was already issued. It seemed that it was given with some unnecessary grumpiness.

Nevertheless we are as happy as can be with the result and look forward to being together.

Many thanks to all that helped with my queries on this site. Especially Scouse.

I’d also like to wish everyone going through any of these procedures the very best of luck in obtaining some sort of normality regarding relationship and location.

Cheers people

Wayner

Yet another example of the British Embassy staff begrudgingly giving something that you are ENTITLED to . The ECO compounded the nastyness of it all by making such a simple error. How difficult is it for an ECO (who should know this like the back of his hand) to check the dates they were married and see it was before the present (more obstructive) changes were made ? mmmm ??How difficult ? A basic error that shows again how a visa could have been refused un justly if the girl in question hadn't been so savvy and up with the latest info. Any comments on this one GU22?? I see you limited your post to mere congratulations and chose not to get into the Embassy's potential error ..

I hope the original poster Wayner finds the time to take the Embassy to task over this . They don't hesitate to come down like a ton of bricks when the applicant forgets to "dot an i" so why let them off the hook.

Well done anyway , hope you are both happy together

SILOMFAN

[GU22]

Yet another example of the British Embassy staff begrudgingly giving something that you are ENTITLED to . The ECO compounded the nastyness of it all by making such a simple error. How difficult is it for an ECO (who should know this like the back of his hand) to check the dates they were married and see it was before the present (more obstructive) changes were made ? mmmm ??How difficult ? A basic error that shows again how a visa could have been refused un justly if the girl in question hadn't been so savvy and up with the latest info. Any comments on this one GU22?? I see you limited your post to mere congratulations and chose not to get into the Embassy's potential error ..

"Yet another"? First one you've come up with! I have always acknowledged that being human ECOs are capable of error. In this case the error was pointed out and the visa issued.

Anyway, let's confine our argument to the one thread instead of spreading it over several. Less boring for everyone else that way!

[coldcrush]

Congrats Wayner, forget about the grumpy people and enjoy your life together!

Goodluck.

Edited February 22, 2006 by lopburiguy

[the scouser]

In her short interview the officer had a bit of a go at her saying “You couldn’t possibly have gotten married on a tourist visa” my wife found herself explaining to the officer the changes that took place and when, regarding getting married in the UK.

This is reminiscent of Vulture's wife's case a year back, except that her application was refused. However, a bit of arse-kicking later (not to mention one very dodgy letter written by Vulture), and the visa was issued.

No doubt Silomfan will maintain that the error shouldn't have occurred in the first place, but mistakes do happen and there is a system in place for having them addressed and rectified. If a visa naif were to read SF's posts in isolation, their alarmist nature would perhaps deter even the most worthy of visa applicants. The reality is that the overwhelming majority of applications meet with success and, of course, we don't hear from those people on fora such as these.

It galls me to say this, but the gent hit the nail on the head when he stated that the UK is replete with people who stated one thing to the visa officer and then did another, and that that is why the regime can be seen as "tough".

Anyway, well done, Wayner.

Scouse.

[chareehusbee]

Congrats! Just be happy you got the thing!

[DragonLad]

Funny!!! He's worried about the person issuing the visa being grumpy??

[caledonia]

Congratulations - brillaint result although worrying the ECO didn't realise the time line - even I know you could get married that way before Feb last year 9an dno not because I did!)

[cuddleypete]

Congratulations all the best for the future

[silomfan]

OK seems i can't get this paste and copy quote thing working so i will have to reply the old normal way.

Rather than take every point of GU22's posts and reply to each, which would make a mammoth post that would sedate everyone, i think the best way is to put my feelings about the system and how i think it could be more fairly improved .

GU22 keeps saying that i never say how the system can be made more fair, yet i have said it many times. He doesn't seem to get it , so for the zillionth time here it is again.

1) Whatever type of visa you are applying for the rules and , more particularly,what is required to satisfy them , should be crystal clear. For example the visitors visa. You are told that you need to show when you are going, for how long , where and (if applicable) with whom you are staying, and how you are going to finance it without sponging off the state. Also you must show "reason to return to Thailand" . Ignoring for the moment the last bit, all the rest are factual and not subjective. It is quite easy to provide written documentary evidence (flight tickets, reserved hotel accomodation , bank account in Thailand ) to satisfy the above. If staying with a boy/girl friend settled in the UK then again easy to show written proof of where they live, their status in that property, and their bank account details if they happen to be sponsering the applicant. The Home Office should decide what levels of savings they require as guidelines for meeting the financial side and what accomodation they feel is the minimum standard acceptable to them .

Now if this was stated clearly, on their websites, then no-one should be applying for the vv until they can satisfy these criteria. However , my guess is that most people will find a way to meet these requirements so it shouldn't be a problem .

So what i am saying is that there should be like a checklist of things required and the Home Office websites should be updated to give minimum acceptable levels that have to be met. Now this is all factual so not open to interpretation thus not open to abuse or misinterpretation by an ECO. Its a little like 100 people wanting to go to Tesco's to buy a chicken . If Tesco says the price is £3.99 and in order to buy it applicants must present themselves at a store within opening hours and also be in possession of the means to pay for it then precise criteria is established that is CLEAR to all. It is reasonable to say to applicants don't apply until you can reach this criteria , but that if the 100 people who wish to buy the chicken them go to Tesco's , they must be allowed to buy it , not have an ECO take a few aside and say they don't find their hairstyle credible so they will refuse . Get the point ??

The "reason to return" bit is the little safeguard the Home Office build in to allow ECO's who, for whatever reason don't want to grant the visa , a lifeline to refuse. Because it is subjective and open to different interpretations by different ECO's. So 2 identical cases can be presented and 1 allowed and 1 refused. Can't be right can it ?? Certainly in first time applications i feel this rule should be removed completely . No-one can prove reason to return . First time applicants should not have to satisfy this as they have no negative history to suggest they are anything other than trustworthy.

This "CLEAR RULES" policy can be similarly adapted to other visas like student, settlement , fiancee etc. So if someone can prove everything on the checklist then they MUST be given the visa , and the ECO cannot request an interview because, if they do satify the criteria , why should they have to endure an interview?? Also if they cannot complete the checklist then don't apply until you can . I can't see a set of circumstances where someone wanting to visit the UK cannot meet the requiremnets anyway. Most posts here are from boy friends who want to bring their girlfriends to the UK for a few weeks . Hardly ever do you get a post from someone who has no assets and so couldn't prove the requirements. So in practise it doesn't appear to be a problem . Most of the problem cases here are only problem cases because they fall foul of the "reason to return" clause.

This way only those who met the criteria would apply and , ergo, if they meet the criteria then they will get the visa . That way there will be less appeals and less work for the ECO's all round

2) Second point i would like to make is that several of the key posters on this excellent site constantly say to those refused words to the effect of " well never mind you can always appeal..." or "...procedures are in place to rectify any injustice by review or appeal ..."

This angers me immensely. The review refferred to is the bit where if you aren't satisfied you can ask the ECM to look at it again. Do you really think that , except in the most obvious cases of injustice, that the ECM spends anytime at all looking at these refusals? Of course not . They are rubber stamped through and the bog standard appeal if you want letter is sent out which begins "having carefully reviewed your case i regret...." what a laugh . Carefully reviewed ?? I don't think so. The old boys act where they stick up for their staff is prevalent, as in most other companies come to that. THATS NOT JUSTICE IS IT ??

As for the appeal process, it can take up to a year although i admit this is now finally coming down to half that or even less. The problem here is that why should you have to wait at all for injustice to be corrected ? You are not given compensation at the end so why should you endure the suffering ?Also the appeal time starts to tick from when the British Embassy sends off the papers and they are received in the UK. Now the Embassy is given (i think this is still the same now) 19 weeks to reply and send off the papers. In my case they took ...have a guess how long to send them??...tick tock tick tock...times up ....yes you guessed it ...19 weeks to the day !!! Now is that co-incidence that they dragged it out to the last hour or is it spitefullness ?? I know which i think . And they are allowed to do this because they kn ow they can . They are a law unto themselves accountable only to beurocrats and not to the people directly . Anyone here think thats fair ??

Other points i would like to raise....

3) why are the British Embassy staff at Bangkok so bloody rude ?? (not all but some and thats unacceptable)

4) why are people on this forum so grateful and relieved that they get given what they are entitled to anyway ? Answer is because they know that the staff at the Embassy are peppered with b*st*rds and they realise they were lucky enough to avoid them .

5) Ask yourself why someone would want to do the job of ECO in the first place.. as bit like why does someone chose to be a traffic warden ?? You have to be a certain type of person do you not ?

6) I can't avoid laughing in disbelief when people post here saying that they have managed to get a visa for their wife to come and live in the UK with them and how pleased they are . You are entitled to it , after all you are married so why be so grateful ?? I can understand people posting to give their good news , its the often excessive gratitude that i don't understand .

7) Sometimes you see a post where the originator is contemplating moving to another country to get married because of problems with getting their intended to the UK or even , and this one made me scream , someone who was being advised to take a holiday in a Euroland country so they could meet their Thai friend there because they were worried the Thai person may not get a visitors visa to visit the UK. I mean how insane is that ?? They only want a holiday in the UK but are thinking seriously of meeting instead in a third ,neutral country. All because of worries about not getting a vv !! I practically choked !!

8) Why is it that , having coped very easily for years , the British Embassy in Bangkok now cites overcrowding as a reason to refuse entry to anyone other than the applicant ? They are sitting on a huge plot of land and they say they are overcrowded... rubbish !! In all the times i have been there i have never seen anything even resembling overcrowding. Of course it is a good way of ensuring that UK sponsers can't be witness to what is happening and also are thus denied the previous right to see the ECO concerned directly after any refusal to discuss it .

9) Why don't they break down the statistics for each category of visa application . What are the figures for visitors visas for the last year and previous years ? The percentage refused of those would make more interesting reading i think.

All these points are of course my own opinions but i feel sure that some points raised are worthy of answering . To keep saying that each case is different (in fact they are similar .. Thai person wants vv.. whats different about that ?) is a way used to justify giving ECO's the power to make subjective judgements when none is needed . To blather on about our phone boxes being riddled with calling cards ...who cares ?? So an handful of Thais come here and go on the game .. big deal !! If you don't like it don't phone them ..easy. You can't assume the majority will do what a minority do.

Sorry for the length of this post but it is mainly for the benefit of my critics who have put in considerable effort to reply to me so i felt i should do the same .

Finally one fact remains . Can anyone doubt that getting a visa is very very stressful , that very many people feel the staff are arrogant and rude (see recent poll initiated by GU22 when only 25% were happy with the ECO's ) , that you have to provide phonebook sized folders loaded with documents because you are fearful that to do any less could put your application at risk, ... that basically getting a visa is far far harder than the websites lead you to believe . And that this situation IS therefore unacceptable ........

SILOMFAN

[tony123]

Have to agree with everything Silom has written and it if wasn't for the help I received from Scouse my wife would still be in Bangkok waiting for the ECO to return the appeal papers.

[GU22]

Anyway, let's confine our argument to the one thread instead of spreading it over several. Less boring for everyone else that way!

In an effort to stop various threads wandering off topic and being clogged up by Silomfan's and my debate, I am going to start a new thread.

Hopefully we can confine our argument to that thread and so prevent terminal boredom in the rest of you!

[rockwellrob]

Congratulations Wayner,

i hope you will both be very happy, i will be going to Thailand to get my wife in 3 weeks, now she has her visa, and it cant come soon enough!

Good luck.