Single Mothers

[roamer]

my stepdaughter who i call daughter except on here because it will confuse everyone is so content in Australia.

we do everything together, little girl is my cooking partner, my swimming partner, we play together endlessly, she is my muay thai student and probably my best one, we are together all the time.

would not trade her for anything, sure as hell did not want her at first, but she really is equal to our other daughter that came recently in my mind.

The freedom comment is confusing, as a family we dont really like to do anything or go out without each other anyway.

My wife's youngest of our two at 12 has been with us for five months. I was watering the garden when she was dropped off from our friends a few days ago, I saw her first coming into the driveway and ambushed her with the hose. After yelling "Daaaddddd" to indicate enough of the watering she wandered up to me and held her hands at my head level, with me going 'ehhh' not even with the slightest idea of what she was doing. She wandered off. Ten minutes later I was heading back in side when she appeared at the door where she proceeded to give me some light hearted banter. Sure enough as always with each other I bit and chased her inside. "Whack" as my head stopped in the first doorway and my feet kept going forward as she had aligned the two heavy duty clear tape strips across the door way at perfect height to my forehead and mouth. A few days later we are still bursting into fits of laughter with each other.

I know what you mean when you say I would not trade her for anything. Nor would I for this youngest of two, or her older sister who I have been Dad to since she came to live with us 5 years ago at 14. Now at just about 20 she is at varsity and she is my pride and joy as my daughter (step legally but dad morally) as am I to her as her Dad.

When I found their mum, children was not on my list as a want but as I had already been a dad and was at ease with 'family' it was an accepted for the right person. When I came to Thailand I followed the advice that thai women friends and the wise caring family orientated westerners were saying..."think with the brain in your head not the one in your pants; be prepared to lose only the money into Thailand that you can afford and also take your time". It took five years before I found their mum who at 36 with two little girls had been deserted by their birth father won me over the younger beauttiful single women with no children simply because she had the strong family values (oldest daughter calls us 'her beautiful old fashioned parents) of my oldest sister who raised me as my mum. When I found my wife (my second and having already been a father) I thought I was the luckiset guy in the world. Her (now our) oldest daughter (after having lost my own birth daughter tragically at 19) I can only describe as a gift from both my thai partners and my western gods. She chased out all the hurt and pain and showed me how to be a Dad all over again to a teenage daughter. I would not trade her love of me nor mine for her for alll the gold in Thailand.

I look around me here and see the same here with some falang who have accepted their thai partners children. Some of them I see the same love going both ways., and these falang dads are the same in that they would not trade them for the world. The whole concept of family and love and caring that all 3 of them have brought into this home I only look at with an awe and wonder how I could be so fortunate to be given. For thai children it seems so much easier to bond than the previous times I have tried in western relationships. I would not trade my family now for anything.

The call is still what you as an individual set as the priorities for your choice of partner. But as I and several other fathers I know have found that Thai seperated mums can deliver a hell of a lot more than some of the less life experienced younger single women. However I would only advise that route to those that know that they are confortable with the role of a Dad.

Wonderfully put, and I'm sure there are quite a few of us "stepfathers" out there who can understand your sentiments.

[bonobo]

My personal belief is that today most single mothers are single mothers by choice rather than being placed in that situation by circumstance. This pertains the world over, not only in Thailand.

It takes two to tango. A woman cannot have a child by choice without the willing cooperation of a man. If he is willing to have sex without birth control with someone whom he has no intention of marrying, then he is just as willing to "create" a single mother as the woman.

[GuestHouse]

My personal belief is that today most single mothers are single mothers by choice rather than being placed in that situation by circumstance. This pertains the world over, not only in Thailand.

It takes two to tango. A woman cannot have a child by choice without the willing cooperation of a man. If he is willing to have sex without birth control with someone whom he has no intention of marrying, then he is just as willing to "create" a single mother as the woman.

Its a very fair point Bonobo - though perhaps not one some wish to be reminded of.

[GuestHouse]

That said, for the birth rate to single women to be so high begs the question why?

Contraception is widely and cheaply available, contraception is taught in schools, there are no distinct taboos around the subject and of course there is no welfare to help out when a single woman falls pregnant, so why then the high birth rate amongst single mothers.

My personal opinion is that the person who normally would be laying down the 'law' on this with young women does not do so and does not do so because she herself stands to benefit.

I'm referring to the girl's mother, soon to be grandmother and benefactor of being locked into a secure place with income into old age.

I recall my mother lecturing me, my brothers and sisters on "you will not bring a child into the world out of wedlock and dump it on me to look after' - a life long instruction on personal responsibility. My own children get and have had to same lecture all their life.

Lectures don't work of course, but clear values and boundaries to behaviour do.

Here in Thailand a girl gets pregnant, hands to child to her mother and goes off to work sending regular cash back to grandmother.

The daughter on the treadmill, the grandmother now in clover.

[muythai2013]

If I was looking for a girlfriend or partner, I'd do my level best to avoid those with children. I don't mind a casual dalliance type of thing but set up home, joint accounts, school fees, iPhones etc??!!

Simply out of the question.

Why should I bring up someone else's offspring? Regardless of how much of a "good, moral girl" she is, why deliberately put myself in a position where I will come further down the list of her priorities?

I understand if some blokes don't have a choice because women from that demographic may be all that are available to them but, until the time comes when I join their ranks, why seek out complications when there's an abundance of women without children?

like most people you stereotype other and put everyone in the same box.

IT was not a relationship created because she was all i could get, im young and i used to work as a model, my ex was a model.

I had other girls available who did not have children but i did not love them, years later i thank god everyday i took her and her daughter and i thank god i have her daughter now, she is my baby now not a hang up.

being a former model, not bragging but you made the thats all we can get statement, i was never struggling in the woman department, thats why i got such a good girl, daughter or not.

[muythai2013]

My personal belief is that today most single mothers are single mothers by choice rather than being placed in that situation by circumstance. This pertains the world over, not only in Thailand.

It takes two to tango. A woman cannot have a child by choice without the willing cooperation of a man. If he is willing to have sex without birth control with someone whom he has no intention of marrying, then he is just as willing to "create" a single mother as the woman.

most girls want the man for life, begin a family, the man runs away.

thai men run often, not the girls fault.

[rene123]

It's been a worthwhile topic with some interesting stories. Thank you all for that. I was never blessed with children and I have mixed feelings now. I enjoy OTHER peoples kids, but I also value my freedom which I would never have if I was a mother. Having children is a life long commitment... or it SHOULD be.

[rgs2001uk]

My personal belief is that today most single mothers are single mothers by choice rather than being placed in that situation by circumstance. This pertains the world over, not only in Thailand.

It takes two to tango. A woman cannot have a child by choice without the willing cooperation of a man. If he is willing to have sex without birth control with someone whom he has no intention of marrying, then he is just as willing to "create" a single mother as the woman.

most girls want the man for life, begin a family, the man runs away.

thai men run often, not the girls fault.

How many Thai men in this situation have you ever spoken to?

Dont believe everything Nok from the Hansum man bar tells you.

About 90% of the Thai men I know in this situation always say the same, its the girls mother and her incessant demands that cause the problems.

Why does Nok chose to keep the child and not give it to the father?

[HardenedSoul]

If I was looking for a girlfriend or partner, I'd do my level best to avoid those with children. I don't mind a casual dalliance type of thing but set up home, joint accounts, school fees, iPhones etc??!!

Simply out of the question.

Why should I bring up someone else's offspring? Regardless of how much of a "good, moral girl" she is, why deliberately put myself in a position where I will come further down the list of her priorities?

I understand if some blokes don't have a choice because women from that demographic may be all that are available to them but, until the time comes when I join their ranks, why seek out complications when there's an abundance of women without children?

like most people you stereotype other and put everyone in the same box.

IT was not a relationship created because she was all i could get, im young and i used to work as a model, my ex was a model.

I had other girls available who did not have children but i did not love them, years later i thank god everyday i took her and her daughter and i thank god i have her daughter now, she is my baby now not a hang up.

being a former model, not bragging but you made the thats all we can get statement, i was never struggling in the woman department, thats why i got such a good girl, daughter or not.

Well, as I said "some blokes don't have a choice".

I'm sure there are instances where unrequited love triumphs over the obstacles created by rearing someone else's child but, here in a country where it seems that a lot of the single mothers are from poorer backgrounds, I think it's wise to be on one's guard. A huge swathe of Thai men swerve women with children from another relationship because, amongst other "second-hand"-type considerations, they know that both she and the folks in the background will almost certainly make financial demands of them. Many foreign men don't have such hang-ups and that makes them a tempting target for women who would otherwise be shunned as potential partners by their own pool of suitors.

I'm happy for you if you've managed to find your experience with a single mother rewarding but I'm sure you'd agree that if things go bad between you, you're in for a world of hurt.

[Beetlejuice]

My personal belief is that today most single mothers are single mothers by choice rather than being placed in that situation by circumstance. This pertains the world over, not only in Thailand.

It takes two to tango. A woman cannot have a child by choice without the willing cooperation of a man. If he is willing to have sex without birth control with someone whom he has no intention of marrying, then he is just as willing to "create" a single mother as the woman.

Yes, also very true.

It`s a bit of this, a bit of that and a bit of the other, as someone once told me.

I just believe that a child should be brought up by both a mother and a father and that the child loses out by only being in the care of one parent. Some may agree, some may not, but as I said; I consider myself lucky by having 2 parents and as having a decent upbringing. My personal view is that I benefited and was a great advantage for me during my later life.

Sadly I lost my dear old Dad a couple of years ago, but the memories I have are priceless.

[muythai2013]

If I was looking for a girlfriend or partner, I'd do my level best to avoid those with children. I don't mind a casual dalliance type of thing but set up home, joint accounts, school fees, iPhones etc??!!

Simply out of the question.

Why should I bring up someone else's offspring? Regardless of how much of a "good, moral girl" she is, why deliberately put myself in a position where I will come further down the list of her priorities?

I understand if some blokes don't have a choice because women from that demographic may be all that are available to them but, until the time comes when I join their ranks, why seek out complications when there's an abundance of women without children?

like most people you stereotype other and put everyone in the same box.

IT was not a relationship created because she was all i could get, im young and i used to work as a model, my ex was a model.

I had other girls available who did not have children but i did not love them, years later i thank god everyday i took her and her daughter and i thank god i have her daughter now, she is my baby now not a hang up.

being a former model, not bragging but you made the thats all we can get statement, i was never struggling in the woman department, thats why i got such a good girl, daughter or not.

Well, as I said "some blokes don't have a choice".

I'm sure there are instances where unrequited love triumphs over the obstacles created by rearing someone else's child but, here in a country where it seems that a lot of the single mothers are from poorer backgrounds, I think it's wise to be on one's guard. A huge swathe of Thai men swerve women with children from another relationship because, amongst other "second-hand"-type considerations, they know that both she and the folks in the background will almost certainly make financial demands of them. Many foreign men don't have such hang-ups and that makes them a tempting target for women who would otherwise be shunned as potential partners by their own pool of suitors.

I'm happy for you if you've managed to find your experience with a single mother rewarding but I'm sure you'd agree that if things go bad between you, you're in for a world of hurt.

true, my mistake you did say some.

all relationships that end have pain, ours would be no different or worse then others.

so far so go and its been a while, yet to even have a real fight in years.

taking another kid does not always turn out like our situation though, you are right about that absolutly.

[Kilgore Trout]

I had a gf back in Germany with 2 kids. been with her for 6 years...then it went downhill for various matters. Never regretted it, though.

Had 2 gf's here in Thailand with kids. Both lasted 2 years, but didn't work out in the end.

Now I have a gf without a child of her own...and constant discussions about when we will have one....

I guess, what I am saying is: there just is no golden rule.

Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesen't.

There are good and bad out there...like everywhere!

But when the child is yours, you just can' t say "it didn't work out". And pack your bags..

So how is that discussion going? I can relate...

"Pack up your bag an leave": Thai man do it all the time and just disappear.

They will re-surface after the wife has won the lottery, or the wife was lucky and someone else (FARANG?) has put her children through university and are adults now, with money-earning capabilities.

It is then, when the "husbands and fathers" of the children re-surface. The "spiel" will sound like this: "I am your father and I gave you life" you owe me something. (To give live, like parents do, is sacred in Thailand, and will apply as long as the offspring is alive, no matter how good or bad the "patenthood" was performed.)

If the child is not willing to yield to such demands, the long lost father, can call the employer of the child and denounce her/him as "a bad child, that does not respect the fact that I gave her life". As a result of this, the "bad child" will be questioned by the employer and has to explain her reasons, why she is not willing to support her "long lost father", that never paid a singe Baht to the mother and the children during the last 15 years or so.

Is this a fairytale out of Europe some 500 years ago? No. Happened just 2 years ago in Thailand and I was a first hand witness to all of this.

Cheers.

Mr. Swissie, do not forget Farang do this as well.

Packing up and leave is not my thing and i think it is not ethical.

Very insightful post you made. I guess you formulated your post in order to justify this reasoning is acceptable or do you think like this?

Not sure what you mean by "farang" do this as well???

Try this in US (whether married legally or not) and you will find out what happens. Never, ever heard of an American father who abandoned their child come back 15 years later and demand money. They would be laughed out of the room by everyone!

[The Dude]

The Dude's wife has no kids nor brothers and sisters. This is cool for the dude and he digs it. life is much more simpler than b4 when the dude had the gf with kids, brothers, sisters, cousins and Issan craziness. The Dude digs simplicity

this could overlap to 2 other recent threads. yes falongs and thais leer and try and flirt with the dude's hot wife however the dude doesnt care b/c he knows his wife is loyal. the dude pays zero to his hot wife but places her in charge of all spending because he loves her and trusts her. i say merge these threads. can dig

[Kilgore Trout]

The Dude's wife has no kids nor brothers and sisters. This is cool for the dude and he digs it. life is much more simpler than b4 when the dude had the gf with kids, brothers, sisters, cousins and Issan craziness. The Dude digs simplicity

this could overlap to 2 other recent threads. yes falongs and thais leer and try and flirt with the dude's hot wife however the dude doesnt care b/c he knows his wife is loyal. the dude pays zero to his hot wife but places her in charge of all spending because he loves her and trusts her. i say merge these threads. can dig

Thats just like.....your opinion...man

[rct99q]

My sister in law has two kids from three different fathers and each as happy as can be.......

[muythai2013]

My sister in law has two kids from three different fathers and each as happy as can be.......

so one kid has 2 dads, quite an achievement

[StreetCowboy]

My sister in law has two kids from three different fathers and each as happy as can be.......

so one kid has 2 dads, quite an achievement

Pearls before swine.

King Canute showed the dangers of allusion, allegory and irony, and went down in history as a stupid Canute for it.

It's worth pointing out here that some things which are posted are not meant to be taken literally.

SC

[Terry Newman]

I got to know briefly a few yummie mummies back in the day before I coughed up a wedding ring and blew some swimmers that made the wife to balloon, twice....

I tell you what, never a void them, they were great.