Health Insurance Vs. Self Insurance: Your Thoughts?

[jbrain]

One of the most important points always seems to get left out of these discussions. When you are sick, and broke, you have some of the best negotiating leverage you will ever have. Why do you think medical bills are so high? Because people with a 1 million baht bill paid 300k and are free and clear. If you want to "take the high road", fine, but realize all you are doing is just being a sucker. Putting your money into something like insurance that makes you feel secure is great, i'm not really trying to knock it, but the guy above is acting like 70k baht is nothing.... i mean, i want to use that money to actually do things and live life. I dont want to hand it over every year and line some insurance executive's pockets. To each their own, but don't forget about negotiating leverage is my only point. You simply can't squeeze blood out of a turnip. I prefer the credit card self insure method myself, I just don't see that it is even much of a question, at least for me.

I would suggest quite the opposite - you can be left outside the hospital until you can contact a few friends to come and bail you out (then you find out who your friends are)

CC : You are lucky, the BKK Bank would only give me a 100k Baht credit line on my CC

You beat me to it. It is a well known fact that hospitals in Thailand let you die outside on the alley if your unconsious when brought in and don't have money on you.

I think there was not so long ago a a topic in the Pattaya forum regarding such a situation.

If you need the 70.000 Baht a year, or less than 6000 Baht a month, to live your life I assume the life isn't much in itself.

You should realise how vulnerable you are to very high medical costs at an old age.

I have my home country credit cards, which I really dont use anymore. One of them has 20k dollars on it. One of them. I dont know, like I said, this isn't brain surgery, or is it?

The reference I made to being broke and sick would be AFTER treatment. You'd have great negotiating power at this point; think about it, take this or you are screwed. What can they say?

Why you don't give it a try and let us know how it turns out.

You don't even have to wait till you have serious issues. Just go to any private hospital and have some Xray's and MRI scans done. And when the bill comes you tell them that you will pay them only 30% of what they ask you for.

Can't wait to hear the result

Edited April 9, 2013 by jbrain

[isawasnake]

^Right. Be one of the uninformed. There are books written on this stuff. The gist is, once your debt goes to an agency, they have paid perhaps 10% of the debt. People like you think you have no leverage, but I know first hand that a full payment at that point is like a home run or slam dunk.... they dont often get it, and aren't even expecting it..... but they go for it. Anyway, enough free info, find the rest out for yourself if you have no respect for sound advice lol.

[JLCrab]

In other words, what you have to offer is a bunch of hearsay. Age, bottomless pit, or maybe falsified application data, or who knows for what in this one instance? Certainly you don't.

While negotiating a settlement after receiving treatment is always possible, a private hospital in Thailand might not admit you at all for non-emergency treatment and then transfer you to a government hospital once stable following emergency admission if they are not satisfied with your ability to pay in full.

[pinfold]

In other words, what you have to offer is a bunch of hearsay. Age, bottomless pit, or maybe falsified application data, or who knows for what in this one instance? Certainly you don't.

While negotiating a settlement after receiving treatment is always possible, a private hospital in Thailand might not admit you at all for non-emergency treatment and then transfer you to a government hospital once stable following emergency admission if they are not satisfied with your ability to pay in full.

Looking at a few health insurance possibilities for the " old ages" a maximum figure of 75000k was applied as a blanket,ie the maximum amount they would pay over the lifetime cover of any policy,it would just about pay for a sticking plaster in a year or two.

When I see the words "Thailand" attached to any official documentation/promise/wording,certainly I see a falsified manifest looming

[JLCrab]

The BUPA Thailand Platinum plan pays up to 5 million baht per incident with no lifetime limit. Again, if you apply before age 60 and make your annual premium payments, you cannot be denied renewal regardless of claims experience (Of course the lying sons-of-b--ches cannot be trusted as has been your first-hand experience I presume)

As per I see a falsified manifest looming maybe next time you are in Goa you should check in with a psychiatrist who might recommend psychoactive treatment for your obvious paranoid tendencies.

Edited April 10, 2013 by JLCrab

[poanoi]

I know a girl who at the age of 40 had an accident,

her Kasikorn bank insurance refused to pay,

her AIA insurance paid half

[pinfold]

The BUPA Thailand Platinum plan pays up to 5 million baht per incident with no lifetime limit. Again, if you apply before age 60 and make your annual premium payments, you cannot be denied renewal regardless of claims experience (Of course the lying sons-of-b--ches cannot be trusted as has been your first-hand experience I presume)

As per I see a falsified manifest looming maybe next time you are in Goa you should check in with a psychiatrist who might recommend psychoactive treatment for your obvious paranoid tendencies.

Sure they will LOL

[pinfold]

Sure they will LOL You mean the Goa psychiatrist will not recommend pharmaceutical treatment for someone who in his own words is displaying paranoid symptoms?

BTW I have my own experience of surgery equal to my first 3 years premium which was paid in full except for 2 Coca Colas from the mini-bar so I really don't care how many anecdotes of partial or misinformation you can conjure.

For something written in stone (in Thailand) and not only assured by whoever,but given full backing by the OIC no less,now that is something to ponder and wonder on.

I can stride out assuredly in the full and satisfying knowledge that whatever befalls me in in Thailand,care is there,the finest that an unlimited 5 million bahts worth can provide at each and every event....now where is the Mickey Mouse movie being shown?

[JLCrab]

What you're demonstrating here is that the case against covering oneself with insurance while here in Thailand, as opposed to one's home country if in fact such coverage is available due to prior medical history or age of applicant,is being made by a couple of paranoid nut cases and little else.

[pinfold]

What you're demonstrating here is that the case against covering oneself with insurance while here in Thailand, as opposed to one's home country if in fact such coverage is available due to prior medical history or age of applicant,is being made by a couple of paranoid nut cases and little else.

Rubbish,you have no clue what your rattling on about. I have a better care package in place than you,is non-contributory,and starts in Thailand,not finishing here though (Thank God) All private. i have no clue about anyone else s health plans are in Thailand ,but as for you and your expectations, Mickey Mouse does apply

Preventive medicine is why I travel, you covered by preventative medicine? ,meaning scanning anything and everything,plus eye surgery for distance.Easy and manageable only 3 hours away rather than 12,now wheres the rattle?

Yes I did spend $700 of my own money getting leg fixed up in Goa,easiest and quickest option available at the time

Edited April 10, 2013 by pinfold

[JLCrab]

We're talking about healthcare here in Thailand or coverages that would be available to one who is residing long-term in Thailand. You have not added one iota of verifiable fact to this conversation. Just they'll do this or they'll do that, or you'll be sorry ....

[pinfold]

Banging the drum of just how much better your provision supposedly is ,I'm not sorry,nor should you be ...yet

My past employment carries full benefits

Anyway enough of this,going outside to get hit by a car, and comps playing up

Edited April 10, 2013 by pinfold

[JLCrab]

There are (mostly) guys who come onto this forum to decide whether as long-term resident in Thailand they should buy health insurance for themselves and maybe their family. If they were covered by their current or previous employment while here in Thailand, then that question would be moot.

Your coming on here and saying even companies that are joint ventures with foreign based insurers are corrupt or Mickey Mouse operations in Thailand without any information capable of corroboration doesn't add to that decision. It just helps describe your state-of-mind and your looming bottomless pits.

[Rimmer]

Inflammatory post removed also a quoted reply, if you have a point then please make it without using profanities as this is against forum rules

[craigt3365]

^Right. Be one of the uninformed. There are books written on this stuff. The gist is, once your debt goes to an agency, they have paid perhaps 10% of the debt. People like you think you have no leverage, but I know first hand that a full payment at that point is like a home run or slam dunk.... they dont often get it, and aren't even expecting it..... but they go for it. Anyway, enough free info, find the rest out for yourself if you have no respect for sound advice lol.

I'll try to find the post, but a guy was in the hospital in CM for 6 months due to a major scooter accident. Couldn't pay the bill, so the police put him in jail.

This is Thailand, not back home. They can do pretty much what they want. Please don't advise anybody to take this approach.

With that being said, if you are having an elective procedure done, you can negotiate. If you're coming in on a stretcher and unconscious, your ability to negotiate is lessened a bit. And the fees can be sky high.

[THAIPHUKET]

I will say that as one gets older, 'hopping on a plane' in even the best of circumstances is considerable wear-and-tear on one's physical well being. Regardless of the non-emergency conditions described above, your doctor here in Thailand might also tell you that you are not fit to travel to Bangkok let alone to your home country.

Also, there are many procedures wherein the doctors at home will tell you not to travel post-procedure for up to several months.

If you are covered by insurance here in Thailand for emergency conditions such as heart attack, stroke, aneurysm, trauma, etc. you probably will be covered for anything else that you might go home for anyway.

Very valid points, in particular

Regardless of the non-emergency conditions described above, your doctor

here in Thailand might also tell you that you are not fit to travel to

Bangkok let alone to your home country.

1.Assume, the patient is not fit to travel by normal means, are there ambulance flights / insurance for such flight available?

2. Don´t trust that travel insurance will cover, if you are staying longer than x days you are not traveling.

Bet , they will verify your length of stay.

[TexasRanger]

The wife was in hospital recently, costs went way above what we expected but the insurance company guaranteed everything, the last thing I need is to worry about costs when someone is in hospital.

[metisdead]

A post using overly large and bold font to emphasize or highlights of a post has been removed. Learn to use the Insert quotation feature instead.

[JLCrab]

Like you say, I'm all set:

[stevenl]

@ pinfold: if you want to quote, please give the complete reference (link) so people can see the full quote for themselves.

[pinfold]

@ pinfold: if you want to quote, please give the complete reference (link) so people can see the full quote for themselves.

Its on Thaivisa,do a search or put BUPA Thailand in search box

[JLCrab]

If it's on ThaiVisa, then it must be true.

[stevenl]

@ pinfold: if you want to quote, please give the complete reference (link) so people can see the full quote for themselves.

Its on Thaivisa,do a search or put BUPA Thailand in search box

No manners

Edited April 25, 2013 by stevenl

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post containing overly derogatory comments toward Thailand has been removed.

[exeter]

Insurance companies are not there for your benefit thats how they make money. Age is the important factor, when you reach 60+ your risk is increasing as far as they are concerned, its does not matter how long you have been a client, it does not matter what they have said, the premiums start to go up sharply and you will not be able to afford the new fees. Self insure from 60+ is your best option you know where you stand but be honest with yourself and make sure the money is there if you require it.

Insurance companies will look for any wriggle room not to pay you out remember that, do you want that sort of hassle?

[JLCrab]

Thank you for that well-reasoned and well documented analysis. I guess self-insurance is not an option for me because I have never been honest with myself.

[Ace of Pop]

Thank you for that well-reasoned and well documented analysis. I guess self-insurance is not an option for me because I have never been honest with myself.

My friend has paid from 12K to 17K P.A. for the 22 years hes been living here. Not one Claim, now hes had to cancel it at the age of 66 just when he may need it due to lack of funds. As Exeter says ,they are their for their benefit, not yours despite the We Care Rot. All that Money down the Tube, hes not a Happy Bunnie.

[nong38]

The hard part is putting the money on one side regularly. I would try and put it in one of those 6 month investment plans, have 6 of them, so there is always one maturing if you need the money that way you will be adding to your funds. If you croak in the night someone you know will end up with the money.

Self Insure and go enjoy the days.

[stevenl]

Thank you for that well-reasoned and well documented analysis. I guess self-insurance is not an option for me because I have never been honest with myself.

My friend has paid from 12K to 17K P.A. for the 22 years hes been living here. Not one Claim, now hes had to cancel it at the age of 66 just when he may need it due to lack of funds. As Exeter says ,they are their for their benefit, not yours despite the We Care Rot. All that Money down the Tube, hes not a Happy Bunnie.

Money down the tube? So he has not been insured all those years? Or wait, he wanted to get a serious illness so he could recoup some of his premiums, that must be it.

[JLCrab]

Self Insure and go enjoy the days.

Gee thanks! I was wondering why I wasn't enjoying my days.