Tough Guy's In Thailand

[NoshowJones]

Not yet, knock on wood.

But its nice to see such levelheadedness, in one so young.

Nicely done my friend!

In Thailand, I'd never walk away from a fight, I would run, even from one person. You take on one Thai, then you take on about six more.

Why don't you read the OP, nothing to do with Thai guys.

This is Thailand isnt it? Being a person who is teetotal and never frequents any bars, I just assumed he was Thai. If the OP mentioned anything about any nationality, then I must have missed it.

[NoshowJones]

I am a very easy going mild mannered guy, but if any Farang who I do not know, even as much as threatens me with violence of any kind, I will hit him, and when he hits the ground I will hit him again to make sure he doesn't get back up. he may have a knife. I'm sorry if I sound angry here, but violence or threats of violence is something I will not tolerate.

So the solution is then to proceed with violence yourself?

Yes, that's right.

[londoedan]

I am a very easy going mild mannered guy, but if any Farang who I do not know, even as much as threatens me with violence of any kind, I will hit him, and when he hits the ground I will hit him again to make sure he doesn't get back up. he may have a knife. I'm sorry if I sound angry here, but violence or threats of violence is something I will not tolerate.

I'm sorry, but to me you DO NOT sound like a "very easy going mild mannered guy", you come across as an absolute nightmare and as bad as people that start these fights in the first place.

I'm 50, never had a fight, never even close, just smile and walk away <deleted>. There really is enough violence in the world as it is, without Thai expats and tourists kicking-off, left, right and centre.

[4737 Carlin]

Don't worry about it, we have all heard the Ex SAS / CIA / FBI / MI5 / MI6 jerks here in the bars.

Bet you he was an FBI = FAT,BALD AND IMPOTENT.

The bars are full of them.

Well done for walking away from the <deleted>.

Yep, agreed. Some of the FBI's don't seem like it when someone younger, and better looking, comes into a bar. The younger blokes will get more female attention and they don't like it. Simple as that.

[krisb]

Heres a possible reason for this type of behaviour that takes place in tropical areas of Australia. Usually adding alcohol into the mix can be a recipe for trouble. Now add in drunk tourists from colder climates and there it is!....This isnt the only reason, but its definately 1 of them. Those of us from Australia would be familiar with the following, those not well heres some info.

There is a common belief in northern Australia that (white) people become more aggressive or more suicidal around November. This period is called the Build-up. November is the warmest month in Darwin (top end of Australia), although the annual temperature swing is small. More important is the increase of relative humidity in advance of the wet season (the 'Wet'), which is in full swing from mid December till mid March. Therefore the atmosphere becomes very uncomfortable. With this discomfort comes increased irritability and aggression, an attitude known in Darwin as 'troppo'. (The same phrase is sometimes used to describe someone adopting a primitive lifestyle.) Another term is 'mango madness', because that fruit is harvested at the time.

One theory goes that the increasing humidity affects human comfort and hence behaviour. Alternatively, one could blame Seasonal Affective Disorder, a mood change at least in the northern hemisphere related to the annual change of daylength and solar radiation: the depression is relieved by artificial light. Also, a disturbance of sleep patterns may be implicated. Alternatively, aggression or suicide might be related to the anticipated loneliness of those to be left behind when others travel to cooler regions in the approaching holiday season.

Edited February 3, 2013 by krisb

[Lancelot]

I can never understand flying half way aorund the world- to look for a fight.

Why not stay home, fight and save the air fare?

[gaucho]

He could also be having a bad day.

You could have offered to buy him a beer and see what his troubles were.

Maybe he just gave up smoking ?

crap

just ignore them ...too much mollycoddling ...if he persists ...go hard ...too many fools around half the problem is where they come from very lenient sentences for loutish aggressive behaviour ....waiting to be flamed by the hand wringers

[gaucho]

Don't make the mistake of trying to pick a fight with me.

My wife will kick your ass for sure!

My wife has a 38 S/W I don't argue with her. Jim

i thought u were going to say she has a38 set of tits

[gaucho]

I do recall my first days in Bangkok, back in the early '70's, before the era of cheap flights and sex tourism to Thailand. Patpong was just about the only place to go. You'd not find many tourists then - mostly, (apart from a few backpackers), everyone seemed to have a reason for being here. Vietnam was winding down, but there were plenty of US military and ex-military, spooks, 'construction and demolition' civilians, mercenaries, oil and gas workers, chopper jockeys, Air America pilots and so on. I remember being surprised by the lack of violence, given the multi-national mix of folk and professions, and asking an old hand, (probably in the Grand Prix, Butterfly, Flying Machine or Madrid), why this might be.

He maintained that it had to do with the fact that a) the booze was cheap, there were more than enough girls to go round and c) if someone bar-fined the girl you'd fancied, why, there were heaps more available so, what's to fight about?

That's changed rather, with the import of folk bringing their unsavoury jealousies and violent dispositions here. Becoming a tourist paradise is not always a step forward, in my opinion.

Agree with you about Patpong. Tony Po, Pat Landry, Jack Shirley et al were great fun, usually at Madrid. Those days are missed but some of the old guys are still around. We talk often and get together when I go down to Pattaya. Many of them moved there for the golf, as did I originally.

Talking about tough guys, I am reminded about a guy named Jimmy the Belgian. Ex- Foreign Legion, mercenary and advisor to the Thai army (true). A few years ago he opened a bar on Soi Post Office and called it The Legionaire. Jimmy was not one to be taken lightly, yet as the story goes, one night a young British hooligan came in looking for a fight. Jimmy asked the guy to leave and the guy asked Jimmy what he would do if he, the hooligan, wouldn't leave. Jimmy told him he would break his leg and throw him out on the street. The hooligan didn't....and Jimmy did.

I ran the Grand Prix for Rick when he went on vacation in the early 80's. Had a great time and free booze. Not one bit of trouble back then.

Things have changed

If I've got the right guy, the Belgian was a fixture in NEP, Cowboy and Patpong - he had an abrasive manner, usually had a younger Thai male in tow, and had a voice like gravel being thrown on a corrugated tin roof. Other than his loudness, I never saw him actually pick a fight, though he would go on angrily and at length about the people he hated - Germans particularly, but anyone else who could not claim to originate from Belgium. We avoided him like the plague and I wondered whatever became of him.

Then there was Tiger, holding out at Lucy's Tiger Den - remember him? I last saw him in Manila in his bar (Yellow Brick Road) and understand he lost his legs due to diabetes and died in the late '80's. Jack Shirley, who liked his corner stool in the Madrid, was the guy who insisted that teaching English to BG's was a simple matter of teaching them to say, "Good idea" to any suggestion that a punter might make.

No night market in Patpong in those days either.....

Sounds like you got him. The first time I ever met Jimmy was one day I was playing cards at Chicken Divine with Cliff and another when this Thai army jeep pulled up on Patpong 2 beside the floor to ceiling windows with a farang in uniform driving. He reached into the back seat, pulled out an automatic weapon and aimed it at us. I hit the floor but, of course, nothing happened. They were all long time friends. He didn't pick fights but wouldn't avoid one either. Jimmy died a few years ago in Pattaya from liver problems.

Udom Patpong used to come in Chicken Divine from time to time and regale us with his tales. A really interesting man and fun to talk to.

Shirley also died in Pattaya a few years ago.

Sure, I remember Tiger. He eventually sold his bar on Suriwong and moved back to the Philippines where he passed away. He was a legend, as were most of the other guys.

A different day, long since gone.

jimmy was not to be slighted saw him clean up some bovver boys a few times ..old tiger what a legend towards the end a sad life but a great guy ..would love to get a copy of his autobiography and i had a copy of the song lucy tiger den until a crazy white bitch smashed it cheers great times ps lou kessler took over yellow brick i wonder how he is going cheers

[SteeleJoe]

I do recall my first days in Bangkok, back in the early '70's, before the era of cheap flights and sex tourism to Thailand. Patpong was just about the only place to go. You'd not find many tourists then - mostly, (apart from a few backpackers), everyone seemed to have a reason for being here. Vietnam was winding down, but there were plenty of US military and ex-military, spooks, 'construction and demolition' civilians, mercenaries, oil and gas workers, chopper jockeys, Air America pilots and so on. I remember being surprised by the lack of violence, given the multi-national mix of folk and professions, and asking an old hand, (probably in the Grand Prix, Butterfly, Flying Machine or Madrid), why this might be.

He maintained that it had to do with the fact that a) the booze was cheap, there were more than enough girls to go round and c) if someone bar-fined the girl you'd fancied, why, there were heaps more available so, what's to fight about?

That's changed rather, with the import of folk bringing their unsavoury jealousies and violent dispositions here. Becoming a tourist paradise is not always a step forward, in my opinion.

Agree with you about Patpong. Tony Po, Pat Landry, Jack Shirley et al were great fun, usually at Madrid. Those days are missed but some of the old guys are still around. We talk often and get together when I go down to Pattaya. Many of them moved there for the golf, as did I originally.

Talking about tough guys, I am reminded about a guy named Jimmy the Belgian. Ex- Foreign Legion, mercenary and advisor to the Thai army (true). A few years ago he opened a bar on Soi Post Office and called it The Legionaire. Jimmy was not one to be taken lightly, yet as the story goes, one night a young British hooligan came in looking for a fight. Jimmy asked the guy to leave and the guy asked Jimmy what he would do if he, the hooligan, wouldn't leave. Jimmy told him he would break his leg and throw him out on the street. The hooligan didn't....and Jimmy did.

I ran the Grand Prix for Rick when he went on vacation in the early 80's. Had a great time and free booze. Not one bit of trouble back then.

Things have changed

Well, I'll be...we've met.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[SteeleJoe]

It is the alcohol. For some strange reason it affects some people differently. A perfectly sane, level headed person can turn into a raving imbecile when they've had too much to drink. My parents had an elderly friend who was always as nice a person as you would ever want to meet, but my father told me that he became ugly, obnoxious and mean when he drank... which fortunately, was seldom. I've had girl friends who turn into sobbing sisters when they drank. Another turned horny and wanted to sleep with any man who was nearby. I finally gave up trying to help her. She got into one mess after another, but only when she drank. Some people know that about themselves and try hard not to drink at all. Others just go for it and wind up with problems continually.

This is not an anti-alcohol screed - I drink on occasion (though these last 10 years only 2 or 3 times a year) and I've had plenty of good or great times drinking in clubs and bars - but as someone who has worked in bars etc for years it has long amazed me how alcohol is so often viewed as somehow a less malign drug than others and how'd use of it is not only condoned but often even approved of.

I often think of this when I hear people proudly announcing how drunk they were or will be on a given occasion, and I imagine if they were to similarly announce being wasted on some other drug how different the reaction would be (even a drug that was arguably less likely to have potential repercussions).

Anyway, there's a few reasons people start fights but there's no question that drink is a common one and almost certainly the most common. As someone who went through a period where I (stupidly) often used to welcome fights (trying to prove something to myself among other issues), I genuinely respect the OP and those like him who just walk away.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[bonobo]

Had to think of this thread today. I am not sure if in all the years I have been in Thailand that I have been face-to-face with this kind of aggression (I had it once in a car, though) but today, I did.

There is a guy who insists on parking his big SUV right in front of the door at my condo, blocking others in. Some mornings, there are four or five cars on both sides of the entry, so all of them have to be pushed in order to get out. This despite more than enough empty spots not 20 meters away.

Today, I had to go down to the parking lot to move the car so my friend could drive her car off. This parking area is like the stem of a T, and the head of the T has many, many empty spots. So instead of moving the car just 5 meters, i moved it 20 into the head of the T and into one of the empty spots there.

One of the condo engineers saw me move it, then rushed to find the owner to tell him what I had done. The engineer and an office worker came to my door to tell me I should not have moved the car and that I had damaged it. I denied any damage, then the car owner jumped out of the stairwell and started yelling at me. Although he has diplomatic tags on his car, he was Thai.

I asked him to show me the supposed damage. We went down, and of course, there was absolutely no damage to his car. He wanted to know why I moved it, and I asked him why he always blocks other people in and told him that I personally have had to move his car many times so different women could get out (it is too heavy for most women to move). He said he gets in late, and it is not fair that he has to park further away (like I said, maybe 20 meters away).

Anyway, I said there is no damage, but as I am leaving, he demanded money. I asked him for what? Does he want 20 baht? Then he went off, calling me all sorts of foul names in Thai. I just turned away and started to walk away when he rushed me. Now, I am not some UFL world champion, but I was not too worried. I turned towards him and asked "really?" He stopped his rush, so I again started walking off, but then his pregnant wife rushed up and started jabbing me in the chest. All the time, I am honestly thinking of this thread, believe it or not. I let her jab me, watching the husband and the engineer, then turned again and walked off, laughing all the way. That seemed to get him angrier, but I still laughed.

Now, sitting in my condo 30 minutes later, I have to say my heart is still beating strongly. Part of me wishes I had let him reach me, then decked him. I know I did the right thing, though.

After my friend found out what had happened, she went to the office to complain as her car had actually been damaged in the same parking lot and nothing was done. She was told by the staff that the guy said he wanted to go to the police, but he was too important to waste his time that way.

[SteeleJoe]

I don't go to bars, pubs or clubs anymore ( except on the rare occasion I have a visitor from abroad) so I don't run into these tw-ts anymore but...

Just a week ago I was sitting quietly on a Sunday afternoon in front of a shop in Chiang Mai while my wife and mother were inside shopping. I become aware that some Farang, probably around my age (50), has stopped on the sidewalk and for no reason at all is addressing me. I swivel my gaze to him and he starts with the "you looking at me?" bit. I confess that for a flash my instinct was to stand up and tell him to go and perform an anatomical impossibility, but then I thought I didn't want my son - sitting next to me - to see anything like that (and I know that even had my son not been there sanity would probably have prevailed anyway - I'm not as stupid as I used to be). So I just sort of looked at him with a half smile while he continued to make an attempt to rile me. As I did I became aware that not only was he VERY drunk and anybody could of knocked him over with one push to the chest but he had an arm in a sling and one leg was injured and barely supporting him!

A Thai woman with him didn't seem to find it strange or alarming that he was ready to start a fight on the street for no reason at all in the middle of the day and as she helped him limp away I suspected his injuries were the result of someone being less patient than I.

People can be pretty odd and ugly. (And alcohol often makes them more so.)

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[HeijoshinCool]

Ah, well, my 2 cents.

Even though I was law enforcement for many years, outside of the Job, I never was once in an altercation until I got here. Then there was more than one on Koh Chang. Lots of drunks.

I'd gotten dressed nicely for a meeting. It was a week past Songkran. Driving the motorbike along, I passed right of a large parked truck. At the last second, out jumps this fat westerner (I won't name the nationality but for some reason they think they make the world's best wine and talk with a lot of phlegm) from the front of the truck with a full bucket of water.

Almost lost control, because the entire bucket hit me in the face.

I turned and went back. Thought better of it, but the group thought it was the funniest thing they'd ever seen, no remorse. All were drunk. I wondered if others would not be so lucky as I was. Maybe the next victim would have a small child on the motorbike.

Their bar girls started taking photos with their phones. Got close to the fat SOB, but politely, calmly engaged him in a discussion of the dangers of throwing things at bike riders. He sneered, started poking me in the chest. Hard. I struck him once in the nerve plexus in his armpit and he went down. His buddy, who looked like a young Keith Richards, ran over and, holding his cigarette that funny way they do, poked it within a few inches of my face and said, "I keeel you and put out my ceegerette in your eye, blah, blah, blah."

He didn't.

I took the phones when I left.

I do think I did the right thing. Someone could have been killed.

But I moved from KC a month later.

[impulse]

Probably more reading than the casual thread surfer is interested in, but I first heard of this study in one of Malcolm Gladwell's books...I forget which one.

About the USA, but explains regional differences in tendency toward, and acceptance of violence...

Link

[JLCrab]

I have only had a few near encounters and veiled threats via traffic altercations and with some neighbors. This has all been very edifying. 'Helps me to enjoy my life in Thailand as a near-recluse saving a few Thai acquaintances who don't speak English.

[HeijoshinCool]

Probably more reading than the casual thread surfer is interested in, but I first heard of this study in one of Malcolm Gladwell's books...I forget which one.

About the USA, but explains regional differences in tendency toward, and acceptance of violence...

Link

Quite interesting, actually. I printed it out, gonna read it tonight.

Nice name for this thread, by the way, that you have!

[sydneyjed]

Any sign of trouble or <deleted> dirty on the world and I just walk now...fortunately never had any incident involving violence here but witnessed an Irish backpacker a few years back at a bar in Chewang do a runner on his cheque bin one night with his friends while I had gone to the toilet.The bar owner was a Lady Boy and luckily I had been playing pool with the LB's brother who explained to him that I wasn't with these guys.Anyhow what do you know the night after I am in the same bar again and this trollop is walking past the bar with his mates and a monkey howl comes out from the thais' around there...this LadyBoy jumps out and smacks this guy over the head with a stilletto and his head just opened up like a water melon...he then proceeded to kick the guy in the face...What a mess and all over a 600 baht bar bill!There's no doubt alcohol is a factor in many of these situations and time of night..you also never know what weapon these people may pull on you now!Jed.

[diddums]

He could also be having a bad day.

You could have offered to buy him a beer and see what his troubles were.

Maybe he just gave up smoking ?

crap

just ignore them ...too much mollycoddling ...if he persists ...go hard ...too many fools around half the problem is where they come from very lenient sentences for loutish aggressive behaviour ....waiting to be flamed by the hand wringers

Really...it turns you on that much ?

[longstebe]

I had a european guy try so hard to wind me up, I don't know what his problem was but he had it in for me.

I was with my muay thai instructor and my Brazilian jujitsu instructor, he had no idea who we were, we went and drank elswhere.

He was quite old to,

This is just it, you just never know who your picking a fight with.

I've never had any problems in Thailand though I've seen 1 or 2.

My idea of a drink is to end up on the floor in fits of laughter rather than in a pool of blood.

[MrWorldwide]

Guys, seriously - would anyone here behave the way many young Farang do in Thailand (not to mention a few of the older expats who should know better) ? Who would act like that in a bar in London or Croatia or Moscow and expect there to be 'no consequences' ? I dont know what a schoolyard fight looks like in Oz these days, but in Thailand I doubt that it is 'one-on-one' : for a Farang, fight one and you had better be prepared to fight the village. I believe the same holds true in other parts of SE Asia - how many of us would confront a local in Jakarta or Manila ? Running out on a bar bill (be it 600 baht or 6000) is the equivalent of taking food straight out of their mouths and laughing at the bar staff into the bargain - a major loss of face - cant imagine why they might react violently ....

I'm not condoning the actions of the ladyboy, or anyone else involved in the infamous '15 Thais on one Farang' attacks that are standard fare in Stickman's emails each week, but if young Aussies behave stupidly in any of our capital cities, they know what the outcome can be. I think many guys get off the plane at Swampy, go straight to 'Disneyland' and think there are zero rules - clueless. The silly bastards mistake the Thai smile for weakness, completely failing to see the fist in that velvet glove until it hits them in the side of the head.

The last time I was in KL, a city I still consider to be safer than Sydney or Melbourne (bag snatchers aside), our cab driver stopped in the middle of the road to watch his colleagues beating the living shit out of another cabbie who had crashed into the median strip - presumably drunk or drugged. It was horrific - blood everywhere - and I told our cabbie to keep driving. About 500 metres down the road, we saw a badly damaged cab and another group of (clearly irate) cabbies huddled around it. No sign of the Police, 11pm at night and plenty of onlookers - it was clear that the cabbies had their own form of 'justice' and were prepared to mete it out to one of their own. Despite the horror of that night, I dont judge Malaysians by the actions of some of their lowest paid workers, and I try to take the same view in Thailand.

I'll leave it there lest I am accused of being an apologist. I'm happy to detail my misadventures at the hands of various Thai women for those who revel in such things, but in terms of unprovoked, overt violence toward Farang, I simply havent had the same experience as many here. Even in Jakarta, with some wannabe 'gangsta' mouthing off some crap about 'Yankee go home !' to impress his mates, I was able to walk away without saying a word : in Sydney, I wouldnt have had that option, and it saddens me that Oz has sunk to that level.

MrWorldwide

[MrWorldwide]

Almost forgot this - doesn't matter how big and tough you are, or how many people you have actually killed in combat, there is always a 'bigger dog' - in this case, someone seemingly out to make a name for themselves:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/most-lethal-sniper-in-us-history-chris-kyle-shot-dead-on-texas-gun-range-8478695.html

A famous American marksman and author was shot dead yesterday on a Texas rifle range.

Chris Kyle, the former Navy SEAL who claimed to have been the most prolific sniper in American history, had a bounty put on his head by insurgents in Iraq, who dubbed him "The Devil of Ramadi."

He was at Rough Creek Lodge's shooting range near Forth Worth, Texas, with another man. Both were fatally shot.

[Terry Newman]

Nothing to do with Thailand, really, where there's drink, they'll be fighting wherever in the world that may be. If you hang around bars...what do you expect?

Not like there are alcoholism problems in Thailand or anything eh !!!

[SteeleJoe]

Almost forgot this - doesn't matter how big and tough you are, or how many people you have actually killed in combat, there is always a 'bigger dog' - in this case, someone seemingly out to make a name for themselves:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/most-lethal-sniper-in-us-history-chris-kyle-shot-dead-on-texas-gun-range-8478695.html

A famous American marksman and author was shot dead yesterday on a Texas rifle range.

Chris Kyle, the former Navy SEAL who claimed to have been the most prolific sniper in American history, had a bounty put on his head by insurgents in Iraq, who dubbed him "The Devil of Ramadi."

He was at Rough Creek Lodge's shooting range near Forth Worth, Texas, with another man. Both were fatally shot.

Absurd comparison.

BTW the OP wasn't about Thais beating up foriegners.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[MrWorldwide]

Almost forgot this - doesn't matter how big and tough you are, or how many people you have actually killed in combat, there is always a 'bigger dog' - in this case, someone seemingly out to make a name for themselves:

http://www.independe...ge-8478695.html

A famous American marksman and author was shot dead yesterday on a Texas rifle range.

Chris Kyle, the former Navy SEAL who claimed to have been the most prolific sniper in American history, had a bounty put on his head by insurgents in Iraq, who dubbed him "The Devil of Ramadi."

He was at Rough Creek Lodge's shooting range near Forth Worth, Texas, with another man. Both were fatally shot.

Absurd comparison.

BTW the OP wasn't about Thais beating up foriegners.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

No, the OP wasnt about Thais beating up Farang, but the post shortly before mine was about a Katoey attacking a Farang with a stiletto. I guess I should have quoted it, but assumed that anyone following the thread was reading each post. Lesson learnt.

[SteeleJoe]

Almost forgot this - doesn't matter how big and tough you are, or how many people you have actually killed in combat, there is always a 'bigger dog' - in this case, someone seemingly out to make a name for themselves:

http://www.independe...ge-8478695.html

A famous American marksman and author was shot dead yesterday on a Texas rifle range.

Chris Kyle, the former Navy SEAL who claimed to have been the most prolific sniper in American history, had a bounty put on his head by insurgents in Iraq, who dubbed him "The Devil of Ramadi."

He was at Rough Creek Lodge's shooting range near Forth Worth, Texas, with another man. Both were fatally shot.

Absurd comparison.

BTW the OP wasn't about Thais beating up foriegners.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

No, the OP wasnt about Thais beating up Farang, but the post shortly before mine was about a Katoey attacking a Farang with a stiletto. I guess I should have quoted it, but assumed that anyone following the thread was reading each post. Lesson learnt.

Fair enough.

But as for the SEAL who was shot to death at a gun range that doesn't really relate to people getting into bar fights, does it? Never mind. Monday morning mood maybe - I should have kept my opinion to myself.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[somtampet]

I can never understand these people,who gives some one a warning,that will certainly put the opposition on guard

That's what I thought. I was also thinking "Go outside where?" This is a busy area with many bars and a mall across the street.

I was very polite to the guy, but after I left he kept on staring at me while I was sitting with my friends?

Everyone else was having a good time anyway.

always a few idiots mate

[somtampet]

Ah, well, my 2 cents.

Even though I was law enforcement for many years, outside of the Job, I never was once in an altercation until I got here. Then there was more than one on Koh Chang. Lots of drunks.

I'd gotten dressed nicely for a meeting. It was a week past Songkran. Driving the motorbike along, I passed right of a large parked truck. At the last second, out jumps this fat westerner (I won't name the nationality but for some reason they think they make the world's best wine and talk with a lot of phlegm) from the front of the truck with a full bucket of water.

Almost lost control, because the entire bucket hit me in the face.

I turned and went back. Thought better of it, but the group thought it was the funniest thing they'd ever seen, no remorse. All were drunk. I wondered if others would not be so lucky as I was. Maybe the next victim would have a small child on the motorbike.

Their bar girls started taking photos with their phones. Got close to the fat SOB, but politely, calmly engaged him in a discussion of the dangers of throwing things at bike riders. He sneered, started poking me in the chest. Hard. I struck him once in the nerve plexus in his armpit and he went down. His buddy, who looked like a young Keith Richards, ran over and, holding his cigarette that funny way they do, poked it within a few inches of my face and said, "I keeel you and put out my ceegerette in your eye, blah, blah, blah."

He didn't.

I took the phones when I left.

I do think I did the right thing. Someone could have been killed.

But I moved from KC a month later.

nice one thats agony been hit there

[diddums]

I like Sharky

[chuckd]

Agree with you about Patpong. Tony Po, Pat Landry, Jack Shirley et al were great fun, usually at Madrid. Those days are missed but some of the old guys are still around. We talk often and get together when I go down to Pattaya. Many of them moved there for the golf, as did I originally.

Talking about tough guys, I am reminded about a guy named Jimmy the Belgian. Ex- Foreign Legion, mercenary and advisor to the Thai army (true). A few years ago he opened a bar on Soi Post Office and called it The Legionaire. Jimmy was not one to be taken lightly, yet as the story goes, one night a young British hooligan came in looking for a fight. Jimmy asked the guy to leave and the guy asked Jimmy what he would do if he, the hooligan, wouldn't leave. Jimmy told him he would break his leg and throw him out on the street. The hooligan didn't....and Jimmy did.

I ran the Grand Prix for Rick when he went on vacation in the early 80's. Had a great time and free booze. Not one bit of trouble back then.

Things have changed

If I've got the right guy, the Belgian was a fixture in NEP, Cowboy and Patpong - he had an abrasive manner, usually had a younger Thai male in tow, and had a voice like gravel being thrown on a corrugated tin roof. Other than his loudness, I never saw him actually pick a fight, though he would go on angrily and at length about the people he hated - Germans particularly, but anyone else who could not claim to originate from Belgium. We avoided him like the plague and I wondered whatever became of him.

Then there was Tiger, holding out at Lucy's Tiger Den - remember him? I last saw him in Manila in his bar (Yellow Brick Road) and understand he lost his legs due to diabetes and died in the late '80's. Jack Shirley, who liked his corner stool in the Madrid, was the guy who insisted that teaching English to BG's was a simple matter of teaching them to say, "Good idea" to any suggestion that a punter might make.

No night market in Patpong in those days either.....

Sounds like you got him. The first time I ever met Jimmy was one day I was playing cards at Chicken Divine with Cliff and another when this Thai army jeep pulled up on Patpong 2 beside the floor to ceiling windows with a farang in uniform driving. He reached into the back seat, pulled out an automatic weapon and aimed it at us. I hit the floor but, of course, nothing happened. They were all long time friends. He didn't pick fights but wouldn't avoid one either. Jimmy died a few years ago in Pattaya from liver problems.

Udom Patpong used to come in Chicken Divine from time to time and regale us with his tales. A really interesting man and fun to talk to.

Shirley also died in Pattaya a few years ago.

Sure, I remember Tiger. He eventually sold his bar on Suriwong and moved back to the Philippines where he passed away. He was a legend, as were most of the other guys.

A different day, long since gone.

jimmy was not to be slighted saw him clean up some bovver boys a few times ..old tiger what a legend towards the end a sad life but a great guy ..would love to get a copy of his autobiography and i had a copy of the song lucy tiger den until a crazy white bitch smashed it cheers great times ps lou kessler took over yellow brick i wonder how he is going cheers

Lou had the Cloud 9 on Patpong 2 before moving to the Philippines and running the Yellow Brick Road. I haven't found anybody that knows what happened to him yet, but a couple of my old buddies aren't available now. Maybe in a day or so I will find out something and post it here.