Panthongtae Shinawatra: Amnesty ' For Red-Shirts, Not For Thaksin'

[webfact]

Amnesty 'for reds, not for Thaksin'

The Nation

Panthongtae says ousted PM wants Abhisit to stop stalling efforts for reconciliation

BANGKOK: -- Former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra is pushing for an amnesty bill for the sake of ordinary red shirts, and not for himself, his son said yesterday.

Panthongtae Shinawatra, son of the ousted and fugitive former PM, posted a message on his Facebook page that Thaksin's move would benefit all sides, particularly ordinary red-shirt protesters facing legal trouble for taking part in the 2010 political unrest.

newsjs

He said Thaksin urged opposition leader Abhisit Vejjajiva to stop stalling the move and to review his own conduct while considering the benefit to society as a whole by helping the push for an amnesty.

"Former prime minister Abhisit should stop worrying about [Thaksin] and focus on keeping his word about supporting amnesty for ordinary people," Panthongtae said in his Facebook message.

His father was still concerned about ordinary protesters affected by the political unrest and keen for them to be "healed", particularly relatives of those who had been killed and the thousands still facing charges related to the unrest.

"They deserve to be granted amnesty," Panthongtae stated.

He said Thaksin called for "sincerity" from Abhisit in handling the issue, adding that this would be a test of his character and prove he was not just good at talking.

Thaksin, who has been in self-exile overseas to avoid going to jail for abuse of power at home, yesterday phoned veteran politician Suwat Liptapanlop, who turned 58.

The ex-premier said that he hoped Suwat would be "lucky in all matters", according to a source familiar with the matter.

Suwat yesterday greeted many politicians from the government and opposition parties, including Abhisit and Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra, at his Bangkok home in Rajvithi.

In a related development, Pheu Thai deputy spokesperson Jirayu Huangsab said the party had yet to officially meet and discuss the issue of an amnesty bill.

There had been some informal discussions on how Thailand should proceed and achieve reconciliation. This, he said, would have to involve dialogue with all stakeholders.

He urged people to tolerate and listen to people with differing views.

Meanwhile, the opposition Democrats said the party was willing to endorse an amnesty bill that would cover those who had not committed criminal offences or corruption, but the court must proceed on those two types of offences and adjudicate.

Chavanond Intarakomalyasut, spokesperson of the Democrats, said at a press conference yesterday that in reaction to what first deputy House Speaker Charoen Jankomol had said earlier, the party was willing to seek a solution for the country with others and support an amnesty bill that would cover ordinary protesters. This should cover those who violated the emergency decree as well as the Internal Security Act.

But he said the party opposed granting amnesty to those accused and convicted of physical assault and corruption. He said those being granted amnesty should be educated and made to understand that they should not violate the emergency decree and the Internal Security Act again, otherwise the problem would resurface.

-- The Nation 2013-02-10

[tominbkk]

Throw and keep them all in jail.

[Locationthailand]

"... he said the party opposed granting amnesty to those accused and convicted of physical assault and corruption. He said those being granted amnesty should be educated and made to understand that they should not violate the emergency decree and the Internal Security Act again, otherwise the problem would resurface".

Excellent. Amnesty for either red or yellow who caused or feel they have the right to seize a city and hold it to ransom means it would send a clear message - go for it any time you like. The law is an ass. But I love the way Thaksin spins the 'self sacrifice' story. With more charges pending anytime he returns, his only hope is for a pardon from the top and that won't happen until there is a change but sadly then I think it will and we could all witness civil war.

Edited February 10, 2013 by Locationthailand

[jaidam]

It can only be a good thing that Panthongtae is getting regular media exposure these days. The transition of power to young Oak in this budding hereditary dictatorship will be smoother when his legend has been fully developed and propagated to the red faithful. I would like to see more made of him being grandson of princess Jantip na Chiangmai, this would make him a more "regal" figure with possibly a broader appeal.

[ginjag]

Pangthongtae, Do you think we have all fell off a number 9 bus-pull the other leg it's got bells on. A load of normal B/S from the family.

[Payboy]

"They deserve to be granted amnesty," Panthongtae stated.

Just like anyone else who makes honest mistakes.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,346289,00.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/2223690.stm

[mrtoad]

Scum

[Buchholz]

Panthongtae Shinawatra, son of the ousted and fugitive former PM, posted a message on his Facebook page that Thaksin's move would benefit all sides

Are we to take that Thaksin has his own version of an amnesty proposal to go along with the versions from the Nitirat Red Shirt Shirts, the Thida Red Shirts, Chalerm, the NLRC, etc. etc.?

If so, publish it.

If not, then perhaps Thaksin can explain the heel-dragging and "stalling" his sister Yingluck's government is doing with the amnesty proposal of Yingluck's own appointed NLRC version.

His father was still concerned about ordinary protesters affected by the political unrest and keen for them to be "healed"

as exemplified by Panthongtae's concern for the ordinary

[LuckyLew]

What a great idea .... let them all go free

Then let all the other criminals go free

Wild wild west all over again

Ideas like this is why Thailand will remain a 3rd world

[StefanBBK]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[muttley]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

[AleG]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Which is what the Democrats are proposing, you know, a sensible, concise solution, while PTP/UDD/Thaksin waste time with ridiculous proposals, trial balloons and smoke and mirrors over the issue.

Yep, it's all the fault of the opposition.

They could pass an amnesty to those, and only those, that may be imprisoned for only violating the SOE tomorrow. But they don't want to lose the political capital of these "political prisoners" because they need it as leverage for their own self serving schemes.

[Buchholz]

Panthongtae Shinawatra, son of the ousted and fugitive former PM, posted a message on his Facebook page that Thaksin's move would... blah blah blah

Aren't we due for the periodic claim of an assassination attempt from that ever reliable news media source, Panthongtae's Facebook account?

.

[muttley]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Which is what the Democrats are proposing, you know, a sensible, concise solution, while PTP/UDD/Thaksin waste time with ridiculous proposals, trial balloons and smoke and mirrors over the issue.

Yep, it's all the fault of the opposition.

They could pass an amnesty to those, and only those, that may be imprisoned for only violating the SOE tomorrow. But they don't want to lose the political capital of these "political prisoners" because they need it as leverage for their own self serving schemes.

Really - What have they proposed? They have only poured scorn on any idea without coming up with anything of their own.

[Ricardo]

Panthongtae Shinawatra, son of the ousted and fugitive former PM, posted a message on his Facebook page that Thaksin's move would... blah blah blah

Aren't we due for the periodic claim of an assassination attempt from that ever reliable news media source, Panthongtae's Facebook account?

.

As opposed to coup-rumours from Big-Mac Man, who has 'sources' (or is that 'sauces' ?) in American-intelligence ?

[AleG]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Which is what the Democrats are proposing, you know, a sensible, concise solution, while PTP/UDD/Thaksin waste time with ridiculous proposals, trial balloons and smoke and mirrors over the issue.

Yep, it's all the fault of the opposition.

They could pass an amnesty to those, and only those, that may be imprisoned for only violating the SOE tomorrow. But they don't want to lose the political capital of these "political prisoners" because they need it as leverage for their own self serving schemes.

Really - What have they proposed? They have only poured scorn on any idea without coming up with anything of their own.

Can't read?

Meanwhile, the opposition Democrats said the party was willing to endorse an amnesty bill that would cover those who had not committed criminal offences or corruption, but the court must proceed on those two types of offences and adjudicate.

Chavanond Intarakomalyasut, spokesperson of the Democrats, said at a press conference yesterday that in reaction to what first deputy House Speaker Charoen Jankomol had said earlier, the party was willing to seek a solution for the country with others and support an amnesty bill that would cover ordinary protesters. This should cover those who violated the emergency decree as well as the Internal Security Act.

[OzMick]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

DOH! "On bail" does not equate to "actually in prison". In fact it is the exact opposite. On bail means NOT in prison.

[muttley]

Really - What have they proposed? They have only poured scorn on any idea without coming up with anything of their own.

Can't read?

Meanwhile, the opposition Democrats said the party was willing to endorse an amnesty bill that would cover those who had not committed criminal offences or corruption, but the court must proceed on those two types of offences and adjudicate.

Chavanond Intarakomalyasut, spokesperson of the Democrats, said at a press conference yesterday that in reaction to what first deputy House Speaker Charoen Jankomol had said earlier, the party was willing to seek a solution for the country with others and support an amnesty bill that would cover ordinary protesters. This should cover those who violated the emergency decree as well as the Internal Security Act.

Yes I can thank you, its you that has the comprehension problems. The above only states it is "willing to endorse" - i.e someone elses idea and only up to a point.

As I said the democrats have produced nothing. Only good at talking.

[muttley]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

DOH! "On bail" does not equate to "actually in prison". In fact it is the exact opposite. On bail means NOT in prison.

DOH! Bail is granted before the trial - the trial has two outcomes guilty or not guilty. The guilty ones will go to prison and by definition will be subject to the amnesty. The non guilty ones are not guilty therefore have no need of an amnesty. In other words all the yellow shirts will go free.

What does it matter they're yellow shirts - they will not go to jail. You know that. I know that. Sondhi is the perfect example of yellow shirt "justice". The non paid fine is another example. Red shirts different - red shirts jailed almost immediately.

[AleG]

Really - What have they proposed? They have only poured scorn on any idea without coming up with anything of their own.

Can't read?

Meanwhile, the opposition Democrats said the party was willing to endorse an amnesty bill that would cover those who had not committed criminal offences or corruption, but the court must proceed on those two types of offences and adjudicate.

Chavanond Intarakomalyasut, spokesperson of the Democrats, said at a press conference yesterday that in reaction to what first deputy House Speaker Charoen Jankomol had said earlier, the party was willing to seek a solution for the country with others and support an amnesty bill that would cover ordinary protesters. This should cover those who violated the emergency decree as well as the Internal Security Act.

Yes I can thank you, its you that has the comprehension problems. The above only states it is "willing to endorse" - i.e someone elses idea and only up to a point.

As I said the democrats have produced nothing. Only good at talking.

sigh...

Tell us then why Thaksin (let's not beat around the bush), who cares so very much about the plight of the poor imprisoned Red Shirts doesn't take that endorsement and pass this amnesty law tomorrow?

[rixalex]

The above only states it is "willing to endorse" - i.e someone elses idea and only up to a point.

Not sure why you think that "willing to endorse" equates to someone else's idea, but even if it does, surely having people outside of the conflict, people without their own vested interests, come up with ideas, is better than having people who stand to benefit drawing up proposals to help themselves, which is exactly what the red shirts and the PTP have been doing, and exactly why everyone is suspicious of everything they say on this matter.

[smedly]

I interpret this as an attemp to smooth over an ever increasing rift between the government/Thaksin and the redshirts

[bigbamboo]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

Anyone found guilty by the courts should not get amnesty regardless of political affiliations.

To make things completely fair all should really be allowed the opportunity to skip the country too but then this is Thailand and that option is only available for the elite.

[thaicbr]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

DOH! "On bail" does not equate to "actually in prison". In fact it is the exact opposite. On bail means NOT in prison.

DOH! Bail is granted before the trial - the trial has two outcomes guilty or not guilty. The guilty ones will go to prison and by definition will be subject to the amnesty. The non guilty ones are not guilty therefore have no need of an amnesty. In other words all the yellow shirts will go free.

What does it matter they're yellow shirts - they will not go to jail. You know that. I know that. Sondhi is the perfect example of yellow shirt "justice". The non paid fine is another example. Red shirts different - red shirts jailed almost immediately.

The Red shirts are in jail for one reason. Their paymaster Thaksin had used them and discarded them.

If he had wanted to he could have paid bail. He didn't.

In fact didn't the present government try and use public funds for the bail payment.

[FarangTalk]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

If they had punished and dealt with the Yellows in the first place there would have been no reds.

Reaping what they sow.

[OzMick]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

DOH! "On bail" does not equate to "actually in prison". In fact it is the exact opposite. On bail means NOT in prison.

DOH! Bail is granted before the trial - the trial has two outcomes guilty or not guilty. The guilty ones will go to prison and by definition will be subject to the amnesty. The non guilty ones are not guilty therefore have no need of an amnesty. In other words all the yellow shirts will go free.

What does it matter they're yellow shirts - they will not go to jail. You know that. I know that. Sondhi is the perfect example of yellow shirt "justice". The non paid fine is another example. Red shirts different - red shirts jailed almost immediately.

Forget the bloody yellow shirts and explain to me how you are granted bail and yet are "actually in prison" as per the post you quoted.

[thaicbr]

I think it would be ok to pardon those who did petty things, like violating curfews, blocking roads, airports etc. However no amnesty should be granted to thiefs, arsonists and the like.

Only those who are actually in prison should be pardoned, and only if the admit their wrongdoing.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Got to hand it to you. One of those "petty things", as you describe them, such as "blocking airports etc" cost the Thai Economy $8.5 Billion US.

In addition your idea that only "those who are actually in prison should be pardoned" whether they "admit their wrongdoing" or not, would allow all of those yellow shirts to go free - they're "on bail". Not only that what would happen to the $17 Million US fine the 13 yellow shirt leaders were ordered to pay back in May 2011. Oh, they haven't paid that yet and Sondhi is broke (so he says) - must be the legal bills for all 5 of the bail arrangements he is under, the latest for a 20 year fraud sentence.

Yes, that sounds fair and well thought through.

If they had punished and dealt with the Yellows in the first place there would have been no reds.

Reaping what they sow.

<deleted>. The Reds were invented and bankrolled to get the paymaster his frozen funds back.

But I agree that there should be more done to speed up ALL trials. Red and Yellow.

[Artisi]

Who gives a rats a_rse what the little cretin has posted on facebook, anyone with intelligence knows that if you have nothing to say put it on facebook - he keeps proving the point.

[chainarong]

On a side topic to this,its interesting to see that the majority of opposition to the Shinawatra family and friends on Thaivisa ,including myself , maybe come from a back ground of good real democracy, fair play, honesty and integrity ,sadly ,never the twain shall meet in Thailand.

[muttley]

Forget the bloody yellow shirts and explain to me how you are granted bail and yet are "actually in prison" as per the post you quoted.

How can I forget the yellow shirts - he explicitly mentioned them in the post!

No need to do a Bangkok Governor just because you don't understand. Read this again slowly, it might eventually sink in.

Bail is granted before the trial - the trial has two outcomes, guilty or not guilty. The guilty ones will go to prison and by definition will be subject to the amnesty. (The non guilty ones are not guilty therefore have no need of an amnesty)

It's purely a matter of timing, eventually they will be subject to an amnesty and freed.