Thailand's Prostitution Image Is Embarrassing

[lockman]

It's not about prostitution, It's about money. Find something else that pays as well, and Thai's will be on it.

There are plenty of jobs that pay better than the average hooker gets, but it requires effort, brains and morals, all 3 lacking in most Thai prostitutes.

She dropped out of grade school to farm. She went to Pattaya at 18. She could not read or write or add or subtract. She was working in Pattaya making 50-,000 baht a month. Now you tell me what other jobs she could have gotten.

Or more often, a "very nice smooth talking Thai man has a village wedding with a young Thai Girl when she is 16-18. She takes care of him, gets pregnant and has a child. 2 months later he departs for parts unknown. So she stays with her rural family trying to care for her child as well as her parents. Eventually another smooth talker repeats the same as the first, or she goes to work in one of the cities as she cannot support her child or children and her parents on the farm Often can't even buy school clothes. So she works somewhere at a food stall for peanuts for awhile, but sees these other young girls, just like her, with a nice motorcycle, place to live, and plenty of money to support their children, as well as fix up the home area. I personally know Thai men who have 3-4-5 children and support none.

[HeavyDrinker]

Wow, concubism, prostitution, stut'ism, I am so glad there are many experts on tv to learn from.

Firstly, the sex-trade is entirely different in Thailand to elsewhere . Having a concubine, or second wife (mia noi), has been part of the Thai culture since forever. Accordingly, the Thais regard the sex-trade as an acceptable occupation and the ladies, themselves, refer to it merely as “working”.

I was hoping to hear/learn more from the 'other' experts : the usual prostitution clients...

Those who are struggling with the current Western relationship norms and the high incidence of divorce and loneliness in the west.

Those who all too often are lonely, inadequate, or find relating to women back home impossible.

Especially the older (experienced) men, who benefit from the oriental reverence for the elderly.

How is " the sex-trade [is] entirely different in Thailand to elsewhere" ?

How or since when has having a "mia noi" been a part of Thai Culture? Wouldn't you say it was more the preserve of the elite? I know of few rice farmers with a mia noi.

I think you're mistaking 'culturally acceptable" with what is actually a part of the culture. Why is it accepable? Because having a mia noi is (traditionally) the preserve of the elite who dictate what is culturally acceptable.

You seem unable to see that obtaining/selling sex by financial output/gain is still prostitution. You can give it all the terms you like, but prostitution it still remains...

The folks who think Westerners have higher morals than Asians are deeply deluded about the nature

of the human species. Stinks of white supremacy.

Even 50 or 60 years in Asia you won't learn much if your main focus is comparing your experiences

in Farangland with the sex tourist areas of Thailand. Common sense will tell you that.

The idea that Thailand has the most prostitutes in the world is a load of crap. At least 10 countries

(including several European countries) have higher numbers per 10,000 adult female population.

There are numerous surveys. Here is one: www.targetmap.com/viewer.aspx?reportId=10544

I don't think the moral high ground is under debate here. More the hypocrisy that Westerners seem to take all the flack for the sex trade in Thailand, is the real point at issue here.

[TommoPhysicist]

Please name a place where Reasonable looking girl, nothing special about 60-90k a month works. Night after night same girls are sat in same bars all night scarping by on monthly salary and drinks tips of 30-40 baht per drink. Many now getting cut for not hitting drinks and other targets. minimum estimated working 500,000 all getting 60-90k per month!!!

It's funny how white foreigners frequenting seedy Pattaya bars think they are seeing the high-end or even the mid-range of the working girls.

[SparklingCascades]

I don't understand why we have a 'prostitution image' - In Thailand regular bars offer an innocent drink with a bar-fine imposed for bad behavior; massage parlors offer regular massage with a tip for happy endings. Then we have go-go dancers wrapped round poles who offer private dance lessons for a learning fee or ping pong shows where the cast offer private tution for a coaching fee.

In case your still alone - caring Thai girls will bump into you or catch your eye : At airports, railway stations, shopping malls, restaurants, hotels, Uni's, street corners and even in hospitals & outside some schools. Sometimes parents will approach you to offer their girls or brothers to offer their sisters. I don't include everyone but just a noticeable chunk of our people. The gentle no-pawblem, can-do style will chase you everywhere. It leaves many men freaked-out and smiling at our Amazing Lieland.

Now, I wonder why a 'land of smiles' would have a 'prostitution image' pawblem; especially when prostitution is illegal in our country.

[diddums]

I don't understand why we have a 'prostitution image' - In Thailand regular bars offer an innocent drink with a bar-fine imposed for bad behavior; massage parlors offer regular massage with a tip for happy endings. Then we have go-go dancers wrapped round poles who offer private dance lessons for a learning fee or ping pong shows where the cast offer private tution for a coaching fee.

In case your still alone - caring Thai girls will bump into you or catch your eye : At airports, railway stations, shopping malls, restaurants, hotels, Uni's, street corners and even in hospitals & outside some schools. Sometimes parents will approach you to offer their girls or brothers to offer their sisters. I don't include everyone but just a noticeable chunk of our people. The gentle no-pawblem, can-do style will chase you everywhere. It leaves many men freaked-out and smiling at our Amazing Lieland.

Now, I wonder why a 'land of smiles' would have a 'prostitution image' pawblem; especially when prostitution is illegal in our country.

You forgot the nannies.

[chiangmaikelly]

Vast majority of the girls working in the bars in Pattaya/ Phuket/ Samui can read, write, add subtract both English and Thai, at least the ones I have talked to in last 17 years. How many need 50,000 per month?, how many get 50,000 per month? Now go 30km East of Pattaya to Bowin and Pluak Dang and the the industrial estates, 100,000s of ladies earning 14-15k per month with the circumstances you describe, they prefer to work 10-12 hours per day rather than lay on their backs, or sit on their <deleted> on bars seeking out farangs. Working in factories on a production line requires speaking Thai that's about it, so simple 100,000s of non Thai speakers do it

Entry level jobs at Ford other auto companies and the Oil and Gas companies pay what? What is the minimum education level? How much does a go go dancer make?

[SparklingCascades]

Vast majority of the girls working in the bars in Pattaya/ Phuket/ Samui can read, write, add subtract both English and Thai, at least the ones I have talked to in last 17 years. How many need 50,000 per month?, how many get 50,000 per month? Now go 30km East of Pattaya to Bowin and Pluak Dang and the the industrial estates, 100,000s of ladies earning 14-15k per month with the circumstances you describe, they prefer to work 10-12 hours per day rather than lay on their backs, or sit on their <deleted> on bars seeking out farangs. Working in factories on a production line requires speaking Thai that's about it, so simple 100,000s of non Thai speakers do it

Entry level jobs at Ford other auto companies and the Oil and Gas companies pay what? What is the minimum education level? How much does a go go dancer make?

With this kind of logic well - lets keep Thailand the world's brothel since money is the ultimate decider, if education level does not work. Funny why large parts of Africa and Asia (outside of Thailand) don't apply this logic & get their names up in lights Thailand-style. I guess they pushed choices which the poor do have & where money is not the central theme - important as money is. Its a cultural shift many Thai people want for this country, no matter what farang feel.

[chiangmaikelly]

Vast majority of the girls working in the bars in Pattaya/ Phuket/ Samui can read, write, add subtract both English and Thai, at least the ones I have talked to in last 17 years. How many need 50,000 per month?, how many get 50,000 per month? Now go 30km East of Pattaya to Bowin and Pluak Dang and the the industrial estates, 100,000s of ladies earning 14-15k per month with the circumstances you describe, they prefer to work 10-12 hours per day rather than lay on their backs, or sit on their <deleted> on bars seeking out farangs. Working in factories on a production line requires speaking Thai that's about it, so simple 100,000s of non Thai speakers do it

Entry level jobs at Ford other auto companies and the Oil and Gas companies pay what? What is the minimum education level? How much does a go go dancer make?

With this kind of logic well - lets keep Thailand the world's brothel since money is the ultimate decider, if education level does not work. Funny why large parts of Africa and Asia (outside of Thailand) don't apply this logic & get their names up in lights Thailand-style. I guess they pushed choices which the poor do have & where money is not the central theme - important as money is. Its a cultural shift many Thai people want for this country, no matter what farang feel.

If the Thai people had less than 90% of the business your argument might hold water. The fact is you are taking it upon yourself to decide the morality of Thailand. 90/10 split Thai and Farang means Farang have little to do with the overall effect.

The reality of the situation is since Western people have visited Thailand in the 1600's the Thais have been offering this service. They don't want to change. You do. However you are not Thai or if you are you are not the majority of Thai people.

[Thorgal]

Wow, concubism, prostitution, stut'ism, I am so glad there are many experts on tv to learn from.

Firstly, the sex-trade is entirely different in Thailand to elsewhere. Having a concubine, or second wife (mia noi), has been part of the Thai culture since forever. Accordingly, the Thais regard the sex-trade as an acceptable occupation and the ladies, themselves, refer to it merely as “working”.

I was hoping to hear/learn more from the 'other' experts : the usual prostitution clients...

Those who are struggling with the current Western relationship norms and the high incidence of divorce and loneliness in the west.

Those who all too often are lonely, inadequate, or find relating to women back home impossible.

Especially the older (experienced) men, who benefit from the oriental reverence for the elderly.

It's amazing how many TV posters have grandiose visions of being authorities on Thailand.

Aren't they aware that their utter lack of knowledge is readily apparent? Especially to those

whose academic (and career) area of expertise is Asian history, culture and languages.

Reminds me of the hill-billy shade tree mechanic who makes a complete fool of himself by

pretending to be a mechanical expert in front of the chief mechanic of an F1 pit crew.

Let's be honest.

The average cultural input from the average farang visiting/living in Thailand is mostly concentrated around his own hips.

I don't fool myself if I've used my brain instead to explain a true social and historical Thai mindset.

[wolfmanjack]

Embarrasing?

Who's embarrased? The sellers? Not apparently. The buyers? Not apparently.

Maybe it is those who are in denial, and do absolutely nothing to change the reality of the state of Thailand who are embarrased.

prostitution is not only for foreigners! a thai friend of mine took me to a thai cat house! the price was cheaper and was good for all the time you stayed. but if you left and returned. you had to pay again! I believe it cost 600 baht for all day!

Is that just to sit and look at the girls all day? Surely they don't let you screw as much as you want for 600 baht in a cat house, do they?

[dalsobrook]

If the country is so embarrassed then uphold the law. It isn't America's or any other country's fault that the country is known for it's huge sex industry. One 2 minute skit on SNL isn't the reason prostitution is so well known in Thailand and to portray it as such is equally embarrassing for the country. The Thais should consider cleaning up their side of the street before they condemn anyone else for prostitution.

[Potosi]

Were I come from, the saying 'working like a Siamese port whore' means utter diligence. I'm from Germany, with a people taking pride in working hard, and efficient as well. Maybe the Thais should reconsider that the reputation of their prostitutes is an asset, not a liability. Nothing to be ashamed off in the global business community.

[MRFortuner]

change government -> reduce corruption -> increase productivity -> the thais have life standard -> reduce prostitution and many more social problems

simple common sense right ? don't blame the farangs - don't blame the russians / chinese

u should have had voted a better life rather than that cheapo THB 100,000 rebate on cars, tablet for patum 1 students

[Thorgal]

If the country is so embarrassed then uphold the law. It isn't America's or any other country's fault that the country is known for it's huge sex industry. One 2 minute skit on SNL isn't the reason prostitution is so well known in Thailand and to portray it as such is equally embarrassing for the country. The Thais should consider cleaning up their side of the street before they condemn anyone else for prostitution.

It's not to Westeners to tell how the Thais should run their society/economy and to advise other implementations into their judicial system.

Even so, it's not to Westeners to associate in public all Thai citizens to prostitution and create to them any embarrassement.

[HeavyDrinker]

If the country is so embarrassed then uphold the law. It isn't America's or any other country's fault that the country is known for it's huge sex industry. One 2 minute skit on SNL isn't the reason prostitution is so well known in Thailand and to portray it as such is equally embarrassing for the country. The Thais should consider cleaning up their side of the street before they condemn anyone else for prostitution.

It's not to Westeners to tell how the Thais should run their society/economy and to advise other implementations into their judicial system.

Even so, it's not to Westeners to associate in public all Thai citizens to prostitution and create to them any embarrassement.

Are you for real? If I so choose to walk down the street with a half naked lass who is in full agreement with me doing do, then I will.

It is not for you to tell me (Farang) nor my friend (Thai) what to do you prat.

[simple1]

Please name a place where Reasonable looking girl, nothing special about 60-90k a month works. Night after night same girls are sat in same bars all night scarping by on monthly salary and drinks tips of 30-40 baht per drink. Many now getting cut for not hit drinks and other targets. minimum estimated working 500,000 all getting 60-90k per month!!!

It's funny how white foreigners frequenting seedy Pattaya bars think they are seeing the high-end or even the mid-range of the working girls.

Yep, my Thai stepson (21) came to Pattaya from Australia on holiday and cashed up a few months back. Told me about an upmarket venue that he was invited to, Thai only, costing about 15k baht with drinks. Bastard would not invite me to join him next time he went

[IsaanAndy]

Exactly the point, the reason nothing is done is that all the money being made is going to hi-so Thai business men/women and members of the forces (Army/Police). The ordinary tourist wouldn't see any sign of prostitution in the vast majority of Thailand it is only obvious in the main tourist resorts.

I live in a small town in the NE and there are several places here that just cater for Thai travellers (we have no farang touirists) and the locals.

[JLCrab]

Apropos to IsaanAndy above, a Thai girl at one of the up-country catering-to-Thai places once said to me: Where else would a (non-English speaking) girl like me get to meet the Governor?

[dighambara]

This is the most stupid biased and uninformed article i have read in awhile

To the author; wake up moron!!

That is the narrow view. I suspect the author is doing his best within cultural constraints to tell the Thai Cultural Morons that Thailand has a poor image, because Thailand earned it.

However, all too often people in ThaiVisa forums profess the same idiotic attitude - that all Thai women are prostitutes.

A friend recently asked - How do I find a good Thai woman, one who will be loyal..?? I said - don't look in bars to find such women - talk to the bank clerk, the sales girl, or the receptionist, even a college student...

[Thorgal]

If the country is so embarrassed then uphold the law. It isn't America's or any other country's fault that the country is known for it's huge sex industry. One 2 minute skit on SNL isn't the reason prostitution is so well known in Thailand and to portray it as such is equally embarrassing for the country. The Thais should consider cleaning up their side of the street before they condemn anyone else for prostitution.

It's not to Westeners to tell how the Thais should run their society/economy and to advise other implementations into their judicial system.

Even so, it's not to Westeners to associate in public all Thai citizens to prostitution and create to them any embarrassement.

Are you for real? If I so choose to walk down the street with a half naked lass who is in full agreement with me doing do, then I will.

It is not for you to tell me (Farang) nor my friend (Thai) what to do you prat.

Why doing things in other countries that you wouldn't do in your own country ?

By this you only save your own embarrassement, but this doesn't put you in a position with a free ticket to embarrasse others.

Although you can live like a rockstar in Thailand, you're 'freedom' is still limited...and sadly reduced to blind hypocresie...

Thais are well aware of that.

[SparklingCascades]

Vast majority of the girls working in the bars in Pattaya/ Phuket/ Samui can read, write, add subtract both English and Thai, at least the ones I have talked to in last 17 years. How many need 50,000 per month?, how many get 50,000 per month? Now go 30km East of Pattaya to Bowin and Pluak Dang and the the industrial estates, 100,000s of ladies earning 14-15k per month with the circumstances you describe, they prefer to work 10-12 hours per day rather than lay on their backs, or sit on their <deleted> on bars seeking out farangs. Working in factories on a production line requires speaking Thai that's about it, so simple 100,000s of non Thai speakers do it

Entry level jobs at Ford other auto companies and the Oil and Gas companies pay what? What is the minimum education level? How much does a go go dancer make?

With this kind of logic well - lets keep Thailand the world's brothel since money is the ultimate decider, if education level does not work. Funny why large parts of Africa and Asia (outside of Thailand) don't apply this logic & get their names up in lights Thailand-style. I guess they pushed choices which the poor do have & where money is not the central theme - important as money is. Its a cultural shift many Thai people want for this country, no matter what farang feel.

If the Thai people had less than 90% of the business your argument might hold water. The fact is you are taking it upon yourself to decide the morality of Thailand. 90/10 split Thai and Farang means Farang have little to do with the overall effect.

The reality of the situation is since Western people have visited Thailand in the 1600's the Thais have been offering this service. They don't want to change. You do. However you are not Thai or if you are you are not the majority of Thai people.

People are allowed to have aspirations even if it rocks the status quo and old mindsets around what is "service". And yes, lots of things pulled off in T/land are without a "majority".

[TommoPhysicist]

This is the most stupid biased and uninformed article i have read in awhile

To the author; wake up moron!!

That is the narrow view. I suspect the author is doing his best within cultural constraints to tell the Thai Cultural Morons that Thailand has a poor image, because Thailand earned it.

However, all too often people in ThaiVisa forums profess the same idiotic attitude - that all Thai women are prostitutes.

A friend recently asked - How do I find a good Thai woman, one who will be loyal..?? I said - don't look in bars to find such women - talk to the bank clerk, the sales girl, or the receptionist, even a college student...

I don't think any poster has suggested that "all Thai women are prostitutes", but I am surprised that so many seem prepared to sell their bodies in a straight cash transaction. As for your "college student" comment, most of the 300 short-time hotels in Chiang Mai (and the Nimmanhymen soapy) appear to be mostly powered by college students.

[manarak]

What is really funny is that some bigoted morons of all nationalities are more worried about Thailand's "prostitution image" than about being famous for racketting honest businessmen or for gang rape:

Same as for porn being banned from TV, but graphic murder is okay.

Some most people need their head examined.

[MaxYakov]

Maybe the prostitutes need to learn a bit of "sufficiency economy" theory and be happy just being poor.

For those who don't know what the He!! he's referring to:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Localism_in_Thailand

Whether it has an application to prostitution, as he proposes, is another matter ....

[chooka]

What is really funny is that some bigoted morons of all nationalities are more worried about Thailand's "prostitution image" than about being famous for racketting honest businessmen or for gang rape:

http://www.thaivisa....cher-in-nakhon/

Same as for porn being banned from TV, but graphic murder is okay.

Some most people need their head examined.

Thailand built up it's reputation as the the sleaze and prostitution capital of the world decades ago. It has been been the brunt of jokes in movies, comedy shows and local pubs around the world for decades but this hasn't effected tourism. Every year T.A.T release figures showing record numbers of tourists arriving and records being smashed.

The only threat to thier Title of Sex, Sleaze and Prostitution Capital of the World, is the increase in assaults, rapes, robberies and deaths of farangs in the country. This could have a serious impact on the prostitution industry.

[manarak]

What is really funny is that some bigoted morons of all nationalities are more worried about Thailand's "prostitution image" than about being famous for racketting honest businessmen or for gang rape:

http://www.thaivisa....cher-in-nakhon/

Same as for porn being banned from TV, but graphic murder is okay.

Some most people need their head examined.

Thailand built up it's reputation as the the sleaze and prostitution capital of the world decades ago. It has been been the brunt of jokes in movies, comedy shows and local pubs around the world for decades but this hasn't effected tourism. Every year T.A.T release figures showing record numbers of tourists arriving and records being smashed.

The only threat to thier Title of Sex, Sleaze and Prostitution Capital of the World, is the increase in assaults, rapes, robberies and deaths of farangs in the country. This could have a serious impact on the prostitution industry.

agree, so it is really a priority to crackdown on assaults, rapes, robberies and deaths of farangs"

[MaxYakov]

It's not about prostitution, It's about money. Find something else that pays as well, and Thai's will be on it.

There are plenty of jobs that pay better than the average hooker gets, but it requires effort, brains and morals, all 3 lacking in most Thai prostitutes.

Very true, but a skilled Thai hooker has the chance of landing a 'customer' (or maybe several) who will invest big money in her (NPI) for that house in Issan or the car and condo in Bangkok (which he will lose all rights to, of course). Oops, forgot to mention the gold jewelry, the motorbike, kid's education, vacation trips, mother/father hospital bills, etc.,etc.,etc).

[sfbandung]

Good weather + great culture = tourists. Poor people + pretty girls + tourists = prostitution.

Why be embarrassed about prostitution? I'm not embarrassed to be a programmer, it's what I do for a living. I don't like it. It's boring. But it's what I can make the most money doing. So I do something I dont like to make money.

There is very little difference.

[Mosha]

Thailand's Prostitution Image Is Embarrassing, but not murders, scams, muggings and rapes by Thais on tourists?

[richard_smith237]

Good weather + great culture = tourists. Poor people + pretty girls + tourists = prostitution.

Why be embarrassed about prostitution? I'm not embarrassed to be a programmer, it's what I do for a living. I don't like it. It's boring. But it's what I can make the most money doing. So I do something I dont like to make money.

There is very little difference.

There is a World of difference... If you could make more money being a male prostitute, sleeping with older, perhaps fat and ugly women... Would you ????