Thais And Emotional Suppression

[473geo]

Just got to say guys if you really think this thread is about who does the cooking and cleaning.........well.......

[TommoPhysicist]

It might also be worth pointing out, that while some westerners might admire those who are verbose and assume those who are quiet and reserved are a bit dull, there are indeed some cultures which may look down on the over communicator as foolishly revealing too much and the quit individual is viewed as somehow deeper and more profound.

Sure, even in western culture we admire the strong silent type. But, for example, if you were to ask your wife if she loved you and, although she smiled and shined the depths of her eyes at you, she was nonetheless unable to answer you, wouldn't that be strange? To a lesser extent, that would be like a lady unable to tell her boyfriend whether or not she think's he's handsome. I've encountered as much, and to me it's incredibly disconcerting, despite that the behavior of the lady in question is otherwise loveliness personified.

I've never had any trouble getting a Thai lady to tell me whatever she thinks I want to hear.

I'm happy to tell you how hansum you are .........

I tink you very hansum man and I love you (long time).

[villagefarang]

It might also be worth pointing out, that while some westerners might admire those who are verbose and assume those who are quiet and reserved are a bit dull, there are indeed some cultures which may look down on the over communicator as foolishly revealing too much and the quit individual is viewed as somehow deeper and more profound.

Sure, even in western culture we admire the strong, silent type. But, for example, if you were to ask your wife if she loved you and, although she smiled and shined the depths of her eyes at you, she was nonetheless unable to answer you, wouldn't that be strange? To a lesser extent, that would be like a lady unable to tell her boyfriend whether or not she think's he's handsome. I've encountered as much, and to me it's incredibly disconcerting, despite that the behavior of the lady in question is otherwise loveliness personified.

What was that movie? Maybe she is just not that into you?

I agree with you, actually, and if my wife and I were not able to

express ourselves equally in each others language as well as our own,

our relationship would be lacking in depth and understanding. I see

language shortcomings as being at the root of many problems in cross

cultural relationships.

[amykat]

On the other hand, what about a spouse who works at a good job, and pays for a maid, to clean your house, cook your food, or pays for restuarants, whatever, is that less a sign of love, or nothing to do with anything?

Do you know one that does that?

I don't.

As for cooking and cleaning ....... trivial ..... I don't need that done for me.

Yes, I do know one, and actually more than one (i.e. friends of mine). I have earned good money ...paid for a maid and food (not prepared by myself) for myself alone, for myself and a husband, and for myself and a daughter ...it really had nothing to do with who I was married to. I had the same standards, and sometimes did the work myself, and sometimes paid for the work to be done. It depends on how much money and time I have, as to what I decide to do.

Probably, most people don't need a cook and cleaner, but for some reason, MEN think that this is a sign of love from a female? It might be ...maybe if the woman is a total slob and changes her ways for her husband, that might take some work!

I am simply trying to point out, that especially in a traditional culture like Thailand, that this probably shouldn't be seen as a sign of deep love!

[dutchguest]

Quote from theop:

"I know about the link between Buddhism and emotional suppression"

As far as I have understood, Buddhism is not about suppression of
emotions but about not expressing every emotion, especially negative
ones as they tend to lead to a never ending stream of rubbish which
leads us nowhere or only brings us in a negative spiral (I think you
don't have to look very far to find examples of this). It is also
about trying to develop a certain equanimity and not living too
superficially, on the surface of the waves, crying when it rains and
smiling when the sun shines, as you have developed a certain
awareness and wisdom that everything is impermanent and that after
the rain the sun will shine again.

At the moment I am reading the books of Gurdjieff (and the books of
Ouspensky about Gurdjieff and his ideas) and i.m.o. his ideas are
more or less comparable with the ideas of the Buddha; he is also more
explicitly teaching that not to express negative emotions can be a
way to develop yourself, to become a master of yourself and not a
slave of your emotions. Not expressing every emotion does not
necessarily mean suppression of emotions, it can also be a way to
transform negative emotions into a positive energy. The idea is also
that negative emotions are unnatural, something learned during live
via conditioning, imitation of others etc., while our true nature is
overclouded by them. And that by reflection, meditation on negative
feelings and emotions you can come closer to your true nature.

Above are some of the reasons why I find the Thai way of dealing with
emotions more natural then the western, generally speaking. Western
behaviour I find more learned, artificial, fake. So I have no problem
with the Thai way, on the contrary.

[TommoPhysicist]

On the other hand, what about a spouse who works at a good job, and pays for a maid, to clean your house, cook your food, or pays for restuarants, whatever, is that less a sign of love, or nothing to do with anything?

Do you know one that does that?

I don't.

As for cooking and cleaning ....... trivial ..... I don't need that done for me.

Yes, I do know one, and actually more than one (i.e. friends of mine). I have earned good money ...paid for a maid and food (not prepared by myself) for myself alone, for myself and a husband, and for myself and a daughter ...it really had nothing to do with who I was married to. I had the same standards, and sometimes did the work myself, and sometimes paid for the work to be done. It depends on how much money and time I have, as to what I decide to do.

Probably, most people don't need a cook and cleaner, but for some reason, MEN think that this is a sign of love from a female? It might be ...maybe if the woman is a total slob and changes her ways for her husband, that might take some work!

I am simply trying to point out, that especially in a traditional culture like Thailand, that this probably shouldn't be seen as a sign of deep love!

I'm a man, I don't consider cooking and cleaning an act of love, nor do I particularly want it done for me.

Women generally think men want that ..... not sure why, laziness I guess.

Sex and reproduction are all I'm after, and maybe a warm bed if it's a cold climate (not a requirement in Thailand).

Trouble is ....... most women forget the sex after a while, which essentially ends the relationship.

Edited February 23, 2013 by TommoPhysicist

[aTomsLife]

It might also be worth pointing out, that while some westerners might admire those who are verbose and assume those who are quiet and reserved are a bit dull, there are indeed some cultures which may look down on the over communicator as foolishly revealing too much and the quit individual is viewed as somehow deeper and more profound.

Sure, even in western culture we admire the strong, silent type. But, for example, if you were to ask your wife if she loved you and, although she smiled and shined the depths of her eyes at you, she was nonetheless unable to answer you, wouldn't that be strange? To a lesser extent, that would be like a lady unable to tell her boyfriend whether or not she think's he's handsome. I've encountered as much, and to me it's incredibly disconcerting, despite that the behavior of the lady in question is otherwise loveliness personified.

What was that movie? Maybe she is just not that into you?

I agree with you, actually, and if my wife and I were not able to

express ourselves equally in each others language as well as our own,

our relationship would be lacking in depth and understanding. I see

language shortcomings as being at the root of many problems in cross

cultural relationships.

hahaha Yes, of course perhaps the lady in question just isn't that into me. But what if she also doesn't verbalize her love to her parents. This is essentially the point of the thread for me. Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings, or -- in your opinion -- is this not a Thai thing at all, rather I'm just dating a peculiar lady who likes to use culture as a scapegoat for her/our shortcomings?

[amykat]

To Tommo ...I am curious as to WHAT it is you do need/ want from your Thai wife? Or wives is it now? I have read you posting about a sister and newer children might be coming along??

I don't mean this in a rude way, I almost always, or maybe do ALWAYS agree with your posts and way of thinking, but am curious as to what exactly you are getting from your lifestyle?? I think we may have had similar bad past experiences, however I have found the way to deal with it, is to stay single!

What is it that you DO NEED, that you are now getting in Thailand?

[473geo]

On the other hand, what about a spouse who works at a good job, and pays for a maid, to clean your house, cook your food, or pays for restuarants, whatever, is that less a sign of love, or nothing to do with anything?

Do you know one that does that?

I don't.

As for cooking and cleaning ....... trivial ..... I don't need that done for me.

Yes, I do know one, and actually more than one (i.e. friends of mine). I have earned good money ...paid for a maid and food (not prepared by myself) for myself alone, for myself and a husband, and for myself and a daughter ...it really had nothing to do with who I was married to. I had the same standards, and sometimes did the work myself, and sometimes paid for the work to be done. It depends on how much money and time I have, as to what I decide to do.

Probably, most people don't need a cook and cleaner, but for some reason, MEN think that this is a sign of love from a female? It might be ...maybe if the woman is a total slob and changes her ways for her husband, that might take some work!

I am simply trying to point out, that especially in a traditional culture like Thailand, that this probably shouldn't be seen as a sign of deep love!

Well I think showing a willingness to please in everyday life goes further than saying "I love you" in Thailand.....but as many here appear to miss this point and argue over who should do the dishes.....carry on......

[TommoPhysicist]

To Tommo ...I am curious as to WHAT it is you do need/ want from your Thai wife? Or wives is it now? I have read you posting about a sister and newer children might be coming along??

I don't mean this in a rude way, I almost always, or maybe do ALWAYS agree with your posts and way of thinking, but am curious as to what exactly you are getting from your lifestyle?? I think we may have had similar bad past experiences, however I have found the way to deal with it, is to stay single!

What is it that you DO NEED, that you are now getting in Thailand?

Sex and reproduction facilities.

I put the reproduction facilities as the most important, as sex is easily available in Thailand.

[aTomsLife]

Quote from theop:

"I know about the link between Buddhism and emotional suppression"

As far as I have understood, Buddhism is not about suppression of

emotions but about not expressing every emotion, especially negative

ones as they tend to lead to a never ending stream of rubbish which

leads us nowhere or only brings us in a negative spiral (I think you

don't have to look very far to find examples of this). It is also

about trying to develop a certain equanimity and not living too

superficially, on the surface of the waves, crying when it rains and

smiling when the sun shines, as you have developed a certain

awareness and wisdom that everything is impermanent and that after

the rain the sun will shine again.

At the moment I am reading the books of Gurdjieff (and the books of

Ouspensky about Gurdjieff and his ideas) and i.m.o. his ideas are

more or less comparable with the ideas of the Buddha; he is also more

explicitly teaching that not to express negative emotions can be a

way to develop yourself, to become a master of yourself and not a

slave of your emotions. Not expressing every emotion does not

necessarily mean suppression of emotions, it can also be a way to

transform negative emotions into a positive energy. The idea is also

that negative emotions are unnatural, something learned during live

via conditioning, imitation of others etc., while our true nature is

overclouded by them. And that by reflection, meditation on negative

feelings and emotions you can come closer to your true nature.

Above are some of the reasons why I find the Thai way of dealing with

emotions more natural then the western, generally speaking. Western

behaviour I find more learned, artificial, fake. So I have no problem

with the Thai way, on the contrary.

Thank you for bringing Buddhism into the conversation. This is the most interesting aspect of it all for me. Even if the person in question isn't a devout Buddhist, as a Thai s/he has certainly been influenced by the Dharma. In fact, I came to Thailand with the hope of growing a closer understanding of Buddhism. And your comment about not being a slave to our negative feelings is truly profound. Thanks.

[rgs2001uk]

hahaha Yes, of course perhaps the lady in question just isn't that into me. But what if she also doesn't verbalize her love to her parents. This is essentially the point of the thread for me. Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings, or -- in your opinion -- is this not a Thai thing at all, rather I'm just dating a peculiar lady who likes to use culture as a scapegoat for her/our shortcomings?

Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings

No Thais express their feelings in many ways.

Maybe you are an insecure tpye who needs reassuring everyday, maybe not.

Would you rather be with a woman who doesnt love you but says she does every day, or be with a woman who loves you but doesnt tell you everyday?

[aTomsLife]

hahaha Yes, of course perhaps the lady in question just isn't that into me. But what if she also doesn't verbalize her love to her parents. This is essentially the point of the thread for me. Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings, or -- in your opinion -- is this not a Thai thing at all, rather I'm just dating a peculiar lady who likes to use culture as a scapegoat for her/our shortcomings?

Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings

No Thais express their feelings in many ways.

Maybe you are an insecure tpye who needs reassuring everyday, maybe not.

Would you rather be with a woman who doesnt love you but says she does every day, or be with a woman who loves you but doesnt tell you everyday?

Am I insecure? ...as much as the average person, I suppose. I like to be complemented from time to time, sure. No one's talking about every day, but rather in general -- in general does your S.O. express her affection for you, to you. Of course I'd prefer a sincere woman over an insincere one who showered me with compliments nonstop.

I've had girlfriends -- both western and Thai -- who couldn't stop talking about how much they adored me; that is the opposite extreme, to be sure (and is often far more irritating).

[rgs2001uk]

hahaha Yes, of course perhaps the lady in question just isn't that into me. But what if she also doesn't verbalize her love to her parents. This is essentially the point of the thread for me. Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings, or -- in your opinion -- is this not a Thai thing at all, rather I'm just dating a peculiar lady who likes to use culture as a scapegoat for her/our shortcomings?

Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings

No Thais express their feelings in many ways.

Maybe you are an insecure tpye who needs reassuring everyday, maybe not.

Would you rather be with a woman who doesnt love you but says she does every day, or be with a woman who loves you but doesnt tell you everyday?

Am I insecure? ...as much as the average person, I suppose. I like to be complemented from time to time, sure. No one's talking about every day, but rather in general -- in general does your S.O. express her affection for you, to you. Of course I'd prefer a sincere woman over an insincere one who showered me with compliments nonstop.

I've had girlfriends -- both western and Thai -- who couldn't stop talking about how much they adored me; that is the opposite extreme, to be sure (and is often far more irritating).

in general does your S.O. express her affection for you, to you

Yes, and from what I see around me so do most other Thais.

If you aint getting what you feel you need or deserve from this relationship, express it to your other half, if things dont improve, move on.

As for using culture as a scapegoat, thats just a cop out.

Edited February 23, 2013 by rgs2001uk

[villagefarang]

It might also be worth pointing out, that while some westerners might admire those who are verbose and assume those who are quiet and reserved are a bit dull, there are indeed some cultures which may look down on the over communicator as foolishly revealing too much and the quit individual is viewed as somehow deeper and more profound.

Sure, even in western culture we admire the strong, silent type. But, for example, if you were to ask your wife if she loved you and, although she smiled and shined the depths of her eyes at you, she was nonetheless unable to answer you, wouldn't that be strange? To a lesser extent, that would be like a lady unable to tell her boyfriend whether or not she think's he's handsome. I've encountered as much, and to me it's incredibly disconcerting, despite that the behavior of the lady in question is otherwise loveliness personified.

What was that movie? Maybe she is just not that into you?

I agree with you, actually, and if my wife and I were not able to

express ourselves equally in each others language as well as our own,

our relationship would be lacking in depth and understanding. I see

language shortcomings as being at the root of many problems in cross

cultural relationships.

hahaha Yes, of course perhaps the lady in question just isn't that into me. But what if she also doesn't verbalize her love to her parents. This is essentially the point of the thread for me. Do Thai's verbally suppress their feelings, or -- in your opinion -- is this not a Thai thing at all, rather I'm just dating a peculiar lady who likes to use culture as a scapegoat for her/our shortcomings?

Sometimes people like to lay things onto culture, religion, class, education, money or whatever, when really it is just a personal thing.

Even after 15 years together we still make an effort to make each other feel special everyday, in both word and deed.

Edited February 23, 2013 by villagefarang

[PaullyW]

<snip>

How to deal with it ............. not care much about them either.

Bingo. That's what some've done.

There are exceptions, of course. But, generally, as they do to you, use them in a way that benefits you. Some use them for cheap sex, pretty good, inexpensive food and exploit their poor education and various lacking abilities for financial gain so they can live a pretty easy, unchallenged life here.

[NeverSure]

I'm going off on a tangent. Sorry, can't help it.

I think most Thai women would rather be with a Thai man.

I think many would like to have children with a farang because he's white and taller and might pass those genes into the family.

I think many would marry a farang for money, even if it isn't big money by Western standards.

I think she hopes the farang will be kinder, more sober and more faithful than a Thai.

I think that in being with the farang, she has sold a large part of herself for the futures of her children and family.

I am not shocked if her feelings for the farang aren't overwhelming. I think many times she is simply pragmatic.

[eek]

Ever see the way Thai women carry their children even when quite large?

on the hip? is this not more loving,close and caring for their children

than putting them in a mechanical device to push them along

Havent read all the thread, just this last two pages, so apologies if ive lost some of the "gist".

But i did note this quoted text..and felt that i wished to respond to it..

(Im not a mother, so maybe not "qualified"..but have some thoughts)

..

I think many Thai people may not actually have the money for buggies etc..but this is not the main reason i can see for them not having a buggy..

In general i really dont see Thai people walking much (for pleasure etc) so removes the need for a buggy if you only go from one short walking distance to another.

Even if Thai did enjoy walking, the paths/sidewalks are also not good for even walking on your own, let alone pushing a pram/buggy. Really could be awkward..and possibly dangerious. So no point having one in that case too!

Westerners take kids in buggies for strolls in western countries. Its safer and more practical than possibly stumbling with a kid on your hip, let alone exhausing. Mothers in the west have kids on their hips most other times that i can see..but just not when going for walks/strolls.