Thais And Emotional Suppression

[aTomsLife]

I've really enjoyed living in Thailand the last two years, but there are still some things I'm not used to, and perhaps will never get used to. One thing in particular is the cultural taboo of saying exactly how you feel and then explaining why you feel the way you do. I'm not necessarily just talking about 'saving face' here.

I know about the link between Buddhism and emotional suppression, and I've been told by many Thais that they don't even tell their parents they love them. I've even had a friend explain to me that things like that are left to 'common sense', one should just know how another feels; there's no need to have to say it. Of course, anyone who has listened to Thai music knows they are quite capable of expressing themselves; I just find it odd that this doesn't carry over into their most personal relationships. So any insight is much appreciated.

My question, then, concerns how others have dealt with this in their own relationships here in the LOS, particularly with their girlfriends and wives (and perhaps even their children). Are the Thais in your life emotionally available? And if so, how long did you know them before they became more open with you?

Edited February 23, 2013 by aTomsLife

[OxfordWill]

Your question is wrong. It's a matter of culture. All Thais have the ability to classify experiences, encode these classifications linguistically and express such to others (children, for example). Same goes for all humans regardless of nationality and culture. What you call "emotionally available" is an abstract concept that exists only in your and some similar other cultures. It loses its meaning when applied to a culture like Thai.

You might as well ask "Are the Thais in your life Western?" or "To what degree are the Thais in your life Western with their self expression?" etc

Edited February 23, 2013 by OxfordWill

[aTomsLife]

Can a question per se be wrong? I think not, professor.

I'm aware it's a matter of culture, hence my primary question of how other westerners have dealt with this difference in their personal relationships.

I'm not interested in the definition of emotional availability. If you're able to explain how -- as you so astutely put -- Thais classify experiences, encode them symbolically and express such to others, please do. Otherwise, you're ignoring the intention of the post.

[mauGR1]

Although i think that expressing one's emotions regularly may avoid a sudden burst, doing it often can be impolite too, as the listener might not care at all.

That's what friends are for, in every culture of the world they listen to our complaints, and we listen to their' s.

I find the Thai way most gracious, possibly in the whole world.

[aTomsLife]

Thank you for your reply, mauGR1. I, too, often find Thais to be gracious in their personal dealings. However, at times their unwillingness to share their true thoughts also perplexes me. I would like to understand them better, but perhaps that can only come with time.

[theblether]

I think the OP has a fair point.

It appears to me ( in my limited experience ) that many Thai women subsume their emotions for the greater good of their family. That's laudable in some ways but it must be damaging in others.

[Banzai99]

I asked a group of Thai people to be honest and express their true feelings.

They told me they hate all Farangs, every single one of them, you know that cute little Thai dog you bought, he hates you too, and as for your wife and kids, well, it goes without saying, they detest the ground you walk on, any relationship in Thailand is purely a financial one, other than that, it's absolute hatred.

That goes for all Thais, no exceptions.

ThaiVisa members were right all along.

[FritsSikkink]

Your question is wrong. It's a matter of culture. All Thais have the ability to classify experiences, encode these classifications linguistically and express such to others (children, for example). Same goes for all humans regardless of nationality and culture. What you call "emotionally available" is an abstract concept that exists only in your and some similar other cultures. It loses its meaning when applied to a culture like Thai.

You might as well ask "Are the Thais in your life Western?" or "To what degree are the Thais in your life Western with their self expression?" etc

A questoin can't be wrong.

An reply can.

Edited February 23, 2013 by FritsSikkink

[TommoPhysicist]

I don't think they care all that much for anyone except themselves and their parents.

Not so much about hiding emotions, more like not having them.

How to deal with it ............. not care much about them either.

Edited February 23, 2013 by TommoPhysicist

[Dancealot]

Your question is wrong. It's a matter of culture. All Thais have the ability to classify experiences, encode these classifications linguistically and express such to others (children, for example). Same goes for all humans regardless of nationality and culture. What you call "emotionally available" is an abstract concept that exists only in your and some similar other cultures. It loses its meaning when applied to a culture like Thai.

You might as well ask "Are the Thais in your life Western?" or "To what degree are the Thais in your life Western with their self expression?" etc

Very, very well put. Mr. Oxfordwill.But i have to stay with the OP on this 1.

/quoteMy question, then, concerns how others have dealt with this in their own

relationships here in the LOS, particularly with their girlfriends and

wives (and perhaps even their children). Are the Thais in your life

emotionally available? And if so, how long did you know them before

they became more open with you? /endquote.

In some... relations i learned emotional availability is avoided at ALL times(even after being together for years).

Within the more 'substantial' relations i have had they seem let it go and spill their beans.

I am still not sure now as we are speaking.. Very good question Mr. aTomslife

[theblether]

I asked a group of Thai people to be honest and express their true feelings.

They told me they hate all Farangs, every single one of them, you know that cute little Thai dog you bought, he hates you too, and as for your wife and kids, well, it goes without saying, they detest the ground you walk on, any relationship in Thailand is purely a financial one, other than that, it's absolute hatred.

That goes for all Thais, no exceptions.

ThaiVisa members were right all along.

[aTomsLife]

I don't think they care all that much for anyone except themselves and their parents.

Not so much about hiding emotions, more like not having them.

How to deal with it ............. not care much about them either.

To a degree this, admittedly, is a fear of mine. But at this point, if I'm to stay here and have a family, I'm still adamant about finding someone who cares. I'd be hard pressed to ever view a lady as wife-material who couldn't fully express herself to me. I don't think I could share a home, much less raise a child, with someone who wasn't all there, so to speak. Best to stay in the slow lane for a while, I guess.

[TommoPhysicist]

I don't think they care all that much for anyone except themselves and their parents.

Not so much about hiding emotions, more like not having them.

How to deal with it ............. not care much about them either.

To a degree this, admittedly, is a fear of mine. But at this point, if I'm to stay here and have a family, I'm still adamant about finding someone who cares. I'd be hard pressed to ever view a lady as wife-material who couldn't fully express herself to me. I don't think I could share a home, much less raise a child, with someone who wasn't all there, so to speak. Best to stay in the slow lane for a while, I guess.

No problems with getting the children to love you, even the ones you inherit.

I have found it worthwhile.

[aTomsLife]

In some... relations i learned emotional availability is avoided at ALL times(even after being together for years).

Within the more 'substantial' relations i have had they seem let it go and spill their beans.

I am still not sure now as we are speaking.. Very good question Mr. aTomslife

Thanks for the details, Mr. Dancealot

So with those who avoided emotional availability, even after years, did you find relations with them difficult? Or did you acclimate to the Thai way, and perhaps become less available yourself?

[Dancealot]

In some... relations i learned emotional availability is avoided at ALL times(even after being together for years).

Within the more 'substantial' relations i have had they seem let it go and spill their beans.

I am still not sure now as we are speaking.. Very good question Mr. aTomslife

Thanks for the details, Mr. Dancealot

So with those who avoided emotional availability, even after years, did you find relations with them difficult? Or did you acclimate to the Thai way, and perhaps become less available yourself?

I'll spill my beans for you because i am grateful for your question in the OP.

Consciously i allowed myself to live the 'facade' ...and you know what? When i reflect on those 'bad' years; now as we are speaking i was a happy man with a smile on my face all the time

[Dancealot]

:EDIT I do not have a turn on/off switch to block emotions. Never had and never will have..

The summary of my claim is it all depends on how you cope and handle with your personal feelings and emotions.

For myself: i choose to open my heart to the people i love. And keep it closed to others..

[Dancealot]

My conclusion is for Thais and feelings in general for everyone is that In the end the paranoia and self esteem always gets the better of you.

I am not afraid nor reluctant to discuss this and i hope more readers will be.

Isn't emotional suppression a Buddhist way to justify non-ethical behaviour?

Edited February 23, 2013 by Dancealot

[aTomsLife]

:EDIT I do not have a turn on/off switch to block emotions. Never had and never will have..

The summary of my claim is it all depends on how you cope and handle with your personal feelings and emotions.

For myself: i choose to open my heart to the people i love. And keep it closed to others..

I'm the same way. Though an American, my mother is an Italian immigrant, and growing up around her (rather loud) family we learned to share everything we were feeling, for better or worse. Consequently, when I share my feelings I expect something in return. But I'm discovering I may be in the wrong country for that!

It will take a great deal more maturing on my part to express myself freely without expecting a return on my emotional investment -- at least in the form of words. I'm just not built that way. But I suppose anything is possible. And, like you, most days I am happy anyway. Cheers

Edited February 23, 2013 by aTomsLife

[aTomsLife]

My conclusion is for Thais and feelings in general for everyone is that In the end the paranoia and self esteem always gets the better of you.

I am not afraid nor reluctant to discuss this and i hope more readers will be.

Isn't emotional suppression a Buddhist way to justify non-ethical behaviour?

My understanding of Buddhism is that emotional suppression involves all aspects of life -- as the only true path to enlightenment is to detach from all things worldly, including our attachments to other people.

Edited February 23, 2013 by aTomsLife

[Dancealot]

It will take a great deal more maturing on my part to express myself freely without expecting a return on my emotional investment.

Well done! I would almost say grasshopper.. . But you seem more experienced then me.

[OxfordWill]

aTomsLife, on 23 Feb 2013 - 13:04, said:

Can a question per se be wrong? I think not, professor.

I'm aware it's a matter of culture, hence my primary question of how other westerners have dealt with this difference in their personal relationships.

I'm not interested in the definition of emotional availability. If you're able to explain how -- as you so astutely put -- Thais classify experiences, encode them symbolically and express such to others, please do. Otherwise, you're ignoring the intention of the post.

ํ

Lol.

Questions most definitely can be wrong, as yours is. Most arguments, disagreements, ignorance, miscommunication, misunderstanding and so on come from well-intentioned "wrong" questions. Sorry if you don't like it but this entire line of question is bad from the get go. You're now discussing how oranges cannot seem to turn into pears as if this was a useful or relevant or realistic thing to consider. I know I sound arrogant pointing it out to you (only trying to be helpful anyway). Nobody can answer your question without obfuscating the non-issue further, because the line of questioning is rank. I did suggest what a more clarified version of your question might be to show how it is not really a question worth much.. again, apologies but that's how I see it until someone shows me why Im wrong.

If youre not interested in the definition of your own question then im even more confused, and if your post had intentions other than the one you wrote then please make them known.. if we're just going to have a whine about how Thais arent like us then sorry, but Ive done that this week.

Edited February 23, 2013 by OxfordWill

[alobar]

I actually broached this very topic recently with my S.O.

She admitted and defended the practice saying it was a good thing and kept everything sabai.

I made a counter argument against 'emotional suppression', saying that the pressure of keeping true feelings bottled up and maintaining a facade often resulted in catastrophic endings. The old tale about how Thais will smile and smile and smile, and then eventually kill you.

She made a curious and not unreasonable couter argument, saying essentially that; if you kill someone after 5 years of Thai 'harmony', it is better than the slow death of a thousand cuts that Westerners suffer with the drip drip drip of angst. Who's to say?!

As to how we have learned to compromise on expressing emotions....i have begun taking big breaths and just smiling more. She has learned to say; 'oh go F%#^ yourself'. How proud i am:)

[Dancealot]

aTomsLife, on 23 Feb 2013 - 13:04, said:

Can a question per se be wrong? I think not, professor.

I'm aware it's a matter of culture, hence my primary question of how other westerners have dealt with this difference in their personal relationships.

I'm not interested in the definition of emotional availability. If you're able to explain how -- as you so astutely put -- Thais classify experiences, encode them symbolically and express such to others, please do. Otherwise, you're ignoring the intention of the post.

ํ

Lol.

Questions most definitely can be wrong, as yours is. Most arguments, disagreements, ignorance, miscommunication, misunderstanding and so on come from well-intentioned "wrong" questions. Sorry if you don't like it but this entire line of question is bad from the get go. You're now discussing how oranges cannot seem to turn into pears as if this was a useful or relevant or realistic thing to consider. I know I sound arrogant but when you're right you're right and I dont apologise for that or for pointing it out to you (only trying to be helpful anyway). I cant answer your question without obfuscating the non-issue further, because the line of questioning is rank. I did suggest what a more clarified version of your question might be to show how it is not really a question worth much.. again, apologies but that's how I see it until someone shows me why Im wrong.

To me it seems the OP has got his oranges all sorted out.

Your poor attempt to trample this subject by throwing in psychological babble is not very constructive IMHO.

So i am curious about your personal opinion on the side- issue I raised Mr. Oxforawill

[Dancealot]

I actually broached this very topic recently with my S.O.

She admitted and defended the practice saying it was a good thing and kept everything sabai.

I made a counter argument against 'emotional suppression', saying that the pressure of keeping true feelings bottled up and maintaining a facade often resulted in catastrophic endings. The old tale about how Thais will smile and smile and smile, and then eventually kill you.

She made a curious and not unreasonable couter argument, saying essentially that; if you kill someone after 5 years of Thai 'harmony', it is better than the slow death of a thousand cuts that Westerners suffer with the drip drip drip of angst. Who's to say?!

As to how we have learned to compromise on expressing emotions....i have begun taking big breaths and just smiling more. She has learned to say; 'oh go F%#^ yourself'. How proud i am:)

What did she literally tell you?

[OxfordWill]

Thais do express themselves and if you don't think they do you simply don't understand what you are witnessing. Do they express themselves in the same way westerners do? No, they don't. The exceptions are those who have absorbed western culture for a long time. I'm being constructive in saying that this line of questioning should be questioned because you're not asking the right question if the object here is to connect with your loved one or significant other who is Thai.

[aTomsLife]

aTomsLife, on 23 Feb 2013 - 13:04, said:

Can a question per se be wrong? I think not, professor.

I'm aware it's a matter of culture, hence my primary question of how other westerners have dealt with this difference in their personal relationships.

I'm not interested in the definition of emotional availability. If you're able to explain how -- as you so astutely put -- Thais classify experiences, encode them symbolically and express such to others, please do. Otherwise, you're ignoring the intention of the post.

ํ

Lol.

Questions most definitely can be wrong, as yours is. Most arguments, disagreements, ignorance, miscommunication, misunderstanding and so on come from well-intentioned "wrong" questions. Sorry if you don't like it but this entire line of question is bad from the get go. You're now discussing how oranges cannot seem to turn into pears as if this was a useful or relevant or realistic thing to consider. I know I sound arrogant pointing it out to you (only trying to be helpful anyway). Nobody can answer your question without obfuscating the non-issue further, because the line of questioning is rank. I did suggest what a more clarified version of your question might be to show how it is not really a question worth much.. again, apologies but that's how I see it until someone shows me why Im wrong.

If youre not interested in the definition of your own question then im even more confused, and if your post had intentions other than the one you wrote then please make them known.. if we're just going to have a whine about how Thais arent like us then sorry, but Ive done that this week.

If you tell me it's noisy outside and I ask you what color the noise is, sure, I suppose that's a wrong question... but seriously, you're making me laugh, too. Take your help elsewhere. From your opening sentence you've been tactless, and your ideas are ripe with pseudo-intellectualism.

You've accused me of muddying the water by applying the western notion of emotional availability to Thais. So Thais don't have emotions? I'm whining about how they're different from us? Really? Despite that the OP seeks advice so I might better understand their way of things. I could go on, but seriously, your posts are so full of drivel, I really can't be bothered with you after this response.

Edited February 23, 2013 by aTomsLife

[His Masters Voice]

Your question is wrong.

Maybe you should seek not to know the answers, but to understand the questions.

[Dancealot]

Thais do express themselves and if you don't think they do you simply don't understand what you are witnessing. Do they express themselves in the same way westerners do? No, they don't. The exceptions are those who have absorbed western culture for a long time. I'm being constructive in saying that this line of questioning should be questioned because you're not asking the right question if the object here is to connect with your loved one or significant other who is Thai.

You are being too subjective. And this is the opposite of constructive because your view derails the focus of the subject matter at hand.

In other words: I don't think you understand. Psych 101

Edited February 23, 2013 by Dancealot

[OxfordWill]

Quite possible! Carry on and ignore my drivel.

[Dancealot]

So back to the OP, please...

Does anyone sense this feeling of being 'conned' in their Thai-farang relation because the better half appears to suppress hers?