Who Wai's Who?

[TommoPhysicist]

Your government pension. Provided to you by all the people you disrespect - and them some others for a good measure of sociopathologic behavior.

While I would never do this mysrlf, I would like to point out something I saw yester in another mallI was in headed for BigC.

A young man under 30 walked out of a restaurant. He was wai'ed by the young, pretty greeter at the door. He returned the wai and itwas a fairly gracious as well. So, this goes against our farang common wisdom totally, mine as well.

Farang addressing Thai who does not understand English (well)

Farang yells louder. Loudness = better English comprehension.

Most of us earnt our pensions by our own hard work.

How polite would anyone consider a white guy who calls other white guys 'farang' and has an avatar "I screwed you all"?

[thaibeachlovers]

Do you care about everybody's feelings and wai everybody?Or do you wai only some people - not caring about the unwaied people's feelings?Let's keep it simple:Do you wai an older, but incompetent boss? Why/ why not?Do you wai a younger, but competent boss? Why/ why not?

Hmmm,a tricky one seeing as though I don't have a Thai boss. I would imagine that If I did have a Thai boss I would wai to an older one,regardless whether he/she was competent or not.A younger Thai boss I would wai to if it was expected of me......If he/she was a good boss then I would do it willingly.Older family members always get a wai from me and I always return the wai from younger family members but not the children.The children when they wai to me always get a big smile and a wink (and usually a snack). If introduce to someone by my family or friends and they are older than me,then I will wai them.Likewise if I am introduced to someone who is younger,a wai will be returned.Wai-ing to family and friends I only do on meeting them after a long period of not seeing and and on saying goodbye. Other people that wai me (younger people) will always be acknowledged with a nod and a big smile Hope that answers your questions.

My nickname - and my philosophy - is nidieunimaitre.That got me into trouble in Europe.I do not plan to change.And if that means I do not respect thai culture - ok - then it also means I do not respect farang culture.Living from my pension makes it of course easy to not care about other people's culture......

Your government pension. Provided to you by all the people you disrespect - and them some others for a good measure of sociopathologic behavior.

While I would never do this mysrlf, I would like to point out something I saw yester in another mallI was in headed for BigC.

A young man under 30 walked out of a restaurant. He was wai'ed by the young, pretty greeter at the door. He returned the wai and itwas a fairly gracious as well. So, this goes against our farang common wisdom totally, mine as well.

Farang addressing Thai who does not understand English (well)

Farang yells louder. Loudness = better English comprehension.

Assuming he paid his taxes, his pension is his RIGHT, not something to be given as a gift to "good" citizens.

I paid taxes which paid everyone elses's pension most of my life. I EXPECT that I will get the pension when I qualify. It's not up to some government apparatchik whether or not I get it.

BTW, perhaps the young man knew the girl, or perhaps he thought he might get lucky- who knows.

[FDog]

Wow you must come from a good country that pays out a pension with no questions.

If I don't live in my homeland for 2 years prior to qualifying for the old age pension then I don't get it.

So no, the pension is not an automatic rite, not for Australians anyway.

>snip<

Edited March 11, 2013 by Tywais
flame/profanity removed

[poanoi]

Few are those that paid their tax to cover both all expenses and then 30 years of retirement,

it was always based on the assumption that economy will grow 10%,

and that you will die anytime soon after 65.

[thaibeachlovers]

Wow you must come from a good country that pays out a pension with no questions.

If I don't live in my homeland for 2 years prior to qualifying for the old age pension then I don't get it.

So no, the pension is not an automatic rite, not for Australians anyway.

Hmmmmm I might have explained, but given your last sentence, I can't be bothered. You have no idea what I think about Thailand, and it's NOT MY COUNTRY. Unless you have residency, it's not your's either.

[thaibeachlovers]

Few are those that paid their tax to cover both all expenses and then 30 years of retirement,

it was always based on the assumption that economy will grow 10%,

and that you will die anytime soon after 65.

More to do with the fact that most used to die before 70 than the economy, IMO. When they invented the pension in my home country, I doubt they had a "growing" economy. Certainly, they never went on about it back then.

However, a purely tax based pension system is unsustainable in the modern world, but because of the incompetent politicians, nothing has been done to avert the coming calamity, and thousands will be left without any income ( as they haven't saved anything ). Will they all just go off and die quietly??????

[rattler]

Was making run to supermarket yesterday. Passed down corridor. MK restaurant, big glass window. Young woman 19 perhaps gave a wai thru the window to her young co workers as she left her shift change.

Really amusing to what lengths people go to NOT fit in.

If you want to make a political or cultural statement, go back home.You are a guest on at best a one year visa or visa extension.

This crappy attitude is the same one that the latin "gringo" resentment and akiebation derive from.

This is Thailand. If you do not want to.participate in its culture, why are you here? Really. Why? If not the people, culture, foid, religion why in the hell are you here?

Im here solely for my Wife something MANY including yourself fail to understand, a culture so vile ( my opinion) I want no part of it, is that so hard to understand?

[thaibeachlovers]

Was making run to supermarket yesterday. Passed down corridor. MK restaurant, big glass window. Young woman 19 perhaps gave a wai thru the window to her young co workers as she left her shift change.

Really amusing to what lengths people go to NOT fit in.

If you want to make a political or cultural statement, go back home.You are a guest on at best a one year visa or visa extension.

This crappy attitude is the same one that the latin "gringo" resentment and akiebation derive from.

This is Thailand. If you do not want to.participate in its culture, why are you here? Really. Why? If not the people, culture, foid, religion why in the hell are you here?

Im here solely for my Wife something MANY including yourself fail to understand, a culture so vile ( my opinion) I want no part of it, is that so hard to understand?

[muythai2013]

the culture is not at all vile, it's the thai people that don't correctly follow their cultural traditions that are vile.

I think your confused, If the cultural ways were followed all the people would be fine upstanding citizens therefore the culture is fantastic but somewhat lost.

[NanLaew]

... The ridiculous myth that westerners should automatically wai all and sundry has been propagated by Thais and books such as Lonely Planet. ...

Really... and there was me thinking it was something that the TEFL'ers developed all on their own to spice up their after-hours prowls through certain avenues of entertainment.

Back OT... I am one of the reluctant wai-ers. I acknowledge the wai's from family and friends but seldom return them with the exception being the few local weddings and wakes that I have attended; seems quite appropriate and respectful in these instances. Since father and mother in-law are both younger than me, they don't get wai'd either and by the same token, they don't wai me. Status quo. I wai the Immigration lady that handles my paperwork when I sit down and once again when I leave... but that is only once a year.

I did wai the Director General of the Department of Mineral Fuels when he fronted up at work one Friday morning in a rice paddy in northern Bang Yai a few years back. He was ultimately responsible for my WP so it was the least I could do. But I thought it was very good of him to come out and see exactly what we were doing so it was respect for his action that motivated my wai rather than just sucking up to the puyai. I was going to buy him some 'famous' fish ball noodle soup for lunch (now THAT is sucking up) but the Governor from Thawi Watthana was dining at the same shop on Putthamonthon 4 and beat me to it. Didn't wai the Governor either as I wasn't introduced and didn't know him from Adam anyway. But there was a huge succession of amazing deep and high wai's being traded between tables so it would have been a total nightmare or disaster for any foreigner inclined to pretend to know who wai's who.

Edited March 11, 2013 by NanLaew

[thaibeachlovers]

the culture is not at all vile, it's the thai people that don't correctly follow their cultural traditions that are vile.

I think your confused, If the cultural ways were followed all the people would be fine upstanding citizens therefore the culture is fantastic but somewhat lost.

Excuse me, but the PEOPLE make culture. It's not something carved in stone.

I started to go off the "culture" when I saw how badly they treat animals. Seeing a live fish being cooked was a definite "turn off" moment.

[rattler]

the culture is not at all vile, it's the thai people that don't correctly follow their cultural traditions that are vile.

I think your confused, If the cultural ways were followed all the people would be fine upstanding citizens therefore the culture is fantastic but somewhat lost.

Thanks you id say thats correct, but the end result is not at all pleasant.

[FDog]

Was making run to supermarket yesterday. Passed down corridor. MK restaurant, big glass window. Young woman 19 perhaps gave a wai thru the window to her young co workers as she left her shift change.

Really amusing to what lengths people go to NOT fit in.

If you want to make a political or cultural statement, go back home.You are a guest on at best a one year visa or visa extension.

This crappy attitude is the same one that the latin "gringo" resentment and akiebation derive from.

This is Thailand. If you do not want to.participate in its culture, why are you here? Really. Why? If not the people, culture, foid, religion why in the hell are you here?

Im here solely for my Wife something MANY including yourself fail to understand, a culture so vile ( my opinion) I want no part of it, is that so hard to understand?

Very easy to understand. You made very bad choices in life which means you have to live in a country that you hate and so have become bitter and twisted.

Must be very sad to be you.

[canuckamuck]

the culture is not at all vile, it's the thai people that don't correctly follow their cultural traditions that are vile.

I think your confused, If the cultural ways were followed all the people would be fine upstanding citizens therefore the culture is fantastic but somewhat lost.

The difference between reality and ideology (or propaganda)

Edited March 11, 2013 by canuckamuck

[rattler]

Was making run to supermarket yesterday. Passed down corridor. MK restaurant, big glass window. Young woman 19 perhaps gave a wai thru the window to her young co workers as she left her shift change.

Really amusing to what lengths people go to NOT fit in.

If you want to make a political or cultural statement, go back home.You are a guest on at best a one year visa or visa extension.

This crappy attitude is the same one that the latin "gringo" resentment and akiebation derive from.

This is Thailand. If you do not want to.participate in its culture, why are you here? Really. Why? If not the people, culture, foid, religion why in the hell are you here?

Im here solely for my Wife something MANY including yourself fail to understand, a culture so vile ( my opinion) I want no part of it, is that so hard to understand?

Very easy to understand. You made very bad choices in life which means you have to live in a country that you hate and so have become bitter and twisted.

Must be very sad to be you.

Again someone else trying to read my mind, NOPE I like the country side.whats left of it, but you carry on making your assumptions.

The bad choices meant I retired in my 40's, the same bad choices let me marry someone who earns more than 250k baht a month who is 10 years younger than me.

Your right Im so f****ed up.

ps I never said I hated the country I hate the culture but dont let that get in the way of your assumptions

Edited March 11, 2013 by rattler

[thaibeachlovers]

Was making run to supermarket yesterday. Passed down corridor. MK restaurant, big glass window. Young woman 19 perhaps gave a wai thru the window to her young co workers as she left her shift change.

Really amusing to what lengths people go to NOT fit in.

If you want to make a political or cultural statement, go back home.You are a guest on at best a one year visa or visa extension.

This crappy attitude is the same one that the latin "gringo" resentment and akiebation derive from.

This is Thailand. If you do not want to.participate in its culture, why are you here? Really. Why? If not the people, culture, foid, religion why in the hell are you here?

Im here solely for my Wife something MANY including yourself fail to understand, a culture so vile ( my opinion) I want no part of it, is that so hard to understand?

Very easy to understand. You made very bad choices in life which means you have to live in a country that you hate and so have become bitter and twisted.

Must be very sad to be you.

I don't see that in his post at all. Where does he say he hates LOS? It's just the people that he has a problem with. I can exist quite happily in my small world of wife, house and internet cafe. It's only when I have to actually interact with the locals ( not all, but some, like her family ) that I become PO.

I prefer the weather here, and it's cheaper to live here, plus "back home" is way, way to PC and expensive for me to enjoy being there.

[NanLaew]

Excuse me, but the PEOPLE make culture. It's not something carved in stone.

I started to go off the "culture" when I saw how badly they treat animals. Seeing a live fish being cooked was a definite "turn off" moment.

Meanwhile, in the civilised west, thousands, maybe millions of crab and lobsters are boiled alive daily. More news at ten. Edited March 11, 2013 by NanLaew

[NanLaew]

... The bad choices meant I retired in my 40's, the same bad choices let me marry someone who earns more than 250k baht a month who is 10 years younger than me.

Your right Im so f****ed up.

ps I never said I hated the country I hate the culture but dont let that get in the way of your assumptions

OMG.... if retiring at 40 was a bad choice, all these munters claiming retirement in their 30's and even younger must be in for a hellish time here. I only hope that their girlfriends or wives are different like yours.

I think unless you become a hermit and inhabit a real bahn nawk in the real back of beyond, then it will be very hard to ignore the culture for very long here. That is a sad and undeniable fact about progress in LOS.

[rattler]

... The bad choices meant I retired in my 40's, the same bad choices let me marry someone who earns more than 250k baht a month who is 10 years younger than me.

Your right Im so f****ed up.

ps I never said I hated the country I hate the culture but dont let that get in the way of your assumptions

OMG.... if retiring at 40 was a bad choice, all these munters claiming retirement in their 30's and even younger must be in for a hellish time here. I only hope that their girlfriends or wives are different like yours.

I think unless you become a hermit and inhabit a real bahn nawk in the real back of beyond, then it will be very hard to ignore the culture for very long here. That is a sad and undeniable fact about progress in LOS.

I detect a note of sarcasm there but if it doesnt upset your sensitivities she isnt a white skinned Thai Chinese Hi , yes I live remotely out of choice, I dont ignore the culture I DONT LIKE IT.

[rattler]

Excuse me, but the PEOPLE make culture. It's not something carved in stone.

I started to go off the "culture" when I saw how badly they treat animals. Seeing a live fish being cooked was a definite "turn off" moment.

Meanwhile, in the civilised west, thousands, maybe millions of crab and lobsters are boiled alive daily. More news at ten.

And equally abhorrent.

[NanLaew]

... The bad choices meant I retired in my 40's, the same bad choices let me marry someone who earns more than 250k baht a month who is 10 years younger than me.

Your right Im so f****ed up.

ps I never said I hated the country I hate the culture but dont let that get in the way of your assumptions

OMG.... if retiring at 40 was a bad choice, all these munters claiming retirement in their 30's and even younger must be in for a hellish time here. I only hope that their girlfriends or wives are different like yours.

I think unless you become a hermit and inhabit a real bahn nawk in the real back of beyond, then it will be very hard to ignore the culture for very long here. That is a sad and undeniable fact about progress in LOS.

I detect a note of sarcasm there but if it doesnt upset your sensitivities she isnt a white skinned Thai Chinese Hi , yes I live remotely out of choice, I dont ignore the culture I DONT LIKE IT.

Sorry, a bad choice of words on my part. I would say it is impossible to ignore the culture unless you are a true 5-7 day tourist who never googled Thailand before opting to come for a holiday. However, with regard to 'resident tourists' like you and I, how can you hope to avoid the culture that you dislike so much if you are married and living here? I am not being critical or argumentative (or sarcastic) here but maybe sharing how you handle these uniquely Thai '&lt;deleted&gt;?' moments that are so often handily attributed to the culture may help me and others when we come up against &lt;deleted&gt; that Thais, including our Thai partners cannot explain other than 'it is the culture'.

[muythai2013]

nothing bothers me in thailand, just do your own thing and stop thinking about what eveyone around you is doing.

there are plenty of wonderful people in Thailand who dont cook fish alive,lol.

Honestly you are married to a Thai woman, do you think she is the only nice person in this vast land of 60 odd million people.

If she is so wonderful, and she is one of the only people you know in Thailand, being so great her nice nature should have made you love Thai people.

you know roses really do smell like crap, someone had the brains to perfume them, Bangkok is like that, look through the crap and you will find the sweetest place but its all about attitude.

[TommoPhysicist]

Very easy to understand. You made very bad choices in life which means you have to live in a country that you hate and so have become bitter and twisted.

Must be very sad to be you.

I was born in a country I learned to hate.

Now I live in a country with some silly cultural left-overs from the past that I can pretty much ignore.

Big difference!

............ "bitter and twisted" always a weird insult thrown by those without real discussion points to make.

PS

Quite a lot of the local culture is in face vile.

Rape is common, domestic violence is the normal way of life for most Thai couples.

Throwing boiling water over little girls, dragging policeman under your car until dead ...... all accepted, no jail time there.

The government and all officialdom is almost entirely corrupt.

Greed is blatant and worshipped.

Doesn't affect me in a negative way all that much, but you can't deny it is the norm.

Edited March 11, 2013 by TommoPhysicist

[TommoPhysicist]

Wow you must come from a good country that pays out a pension with no questions.

If I don't live in my homeland for 2 years prior to qualifying for the old age pension then I don't get it.

So no, the pension is not an automatic rite, not for Australians anyway.

If I don't pay my pension contributions for 30 years (20% of my salary) on top of tax, I don't get it either.

So no, the pension is not an automatic right, not for British anyway.

[Ministry of Som Tam]

Was making run to supermarket yesterday. Passed down corridor. MK restaurant, big glass window. Young woman 19 perhaps gave a wai thru the window to her young co workers as she left her shift change.

Really amusing to what lengths people go to NOT fit in.

If you want to make a political or cultural statement, go back home.You are a guest on at best a one year visa or visa extension.

This crappy attitude is the same one that the latin "gringo" resentment and akiebation derive from.

This is Thailand. If you do not want to.participate in its culture, why are you here? Really. Why? If not the people, culture, foid, religion why in the hell are you here?

Im here solely for my Wife something MANY including yourself fail to understand, a culture so vile ( my opinion) I want no part of it, is that so hard to understand?

Very easy to understand. You made very bad choices in life which means you have to live in a country that you hate and so have become bitter and twisted.

Must be very sad to be you.

Again someone else trying to read my mind, NOPE I like the country side.whats left of it, but you carry on making your assumptions.

The bad choices meant I retired in my 40's, the same bad choices let me marry someone who earns more than 250k baht a month who is 10 years younger than me.

Your right Im so f****ed up.

ps I never said I hated the country I hate the culture but dont let that get in the way of your assumptions

Unfortunately happiness isn't something that you can justify by how much money your wife earns,is it?

[rattler]

Im not justifying anything including the ridiculous assumptions being made about me, you think i cant be happy because I dont like Thai culture.

Fdog assumes I am unhappy no doubt he assumes many other things wrongly by the implied wording in his post.

[muythai2013]

Im not justifying anything including the ridiculous assumptions being made about me, you think i cant be happy because I dont like Thai culture.

Fdog assumes I am unhappy no doubt he assumes many other things wrongly by the implied wording in his post.

I can absolutly see where your going, your reasons for being angered with the peoples behaviour is well justified.

It is however the people due to their failure to follow their culture thats the problem, if they followed their true traditional cultures you would think they were wonderful.

saying that no one is perfect enough to not do wrong, but there are many many thais that are good people and time with them may turn you around.

[NanLaew]

Im not justifying anything including the ridiculous assumptions being made about me, you think i cant be happy because I dont like Thai culture.

Fdog assumes I am unhappy no doubt he assumes many other things wrongly by the implied wording in his post.

OK, apart from the early retirement and well paid spouse, how and where do you handle the 'cultural deficiency' of your chosen abode and stay so obviously, superbly unruffled and incredibly happy?

[barky]

Why are there those that have been living here for some time and still dont know the "rules" ? After all it's not that difficult a custom to understand and follow.

If you are older, you don't initiate the wai. If someone wais you then depending on their age and status you reciprocate with either a "nod and a smile" , a wai at chest level, a wai at chin level, (A wai higher than this is absolutely unnecessary unless you have just met your God.

The ridiculous myth that westerners should automatically wai all and sundry has been propagated by Thais and books such as Lonely Planet. ( I cringe every time I witness some westerner initiating a wai to the 7-11 staff or Tuk Tuk driver)

Perhaps these people you laugh at just want to show the natives that they are not one of the xxxxxxx influx, and are making an effort eh.

This is utter tripe but great PC though. You'd be a great polly. I didnt say laugh, I said cringe..look it up in a dictionary. Just observe the Thais themselves. Maybe you just don't know what you're talking about.

Edited March 12, 2013 by barky

[barky]

Why are there those that have been living here for some time and still dont know the "rules" ? After all it's not that difficult a custom to understand and follow.

If you are older, you don't initiate the wai. If someone wais you then depending on their age and status you reciprocate with either a "nod and a smile" , a wai at chest level, a wai at chin level, (A wai higher than this is absolutely unnecessary unless you have just met your God.

The ridiculous myth that westerners should automatically wai all and sundry has been propagated by Thais and books such as Lonely Planet. ( I cringe every time I witness some westerner initiating a wai to the 7-11 staff or Tuk Tuk driver)

A higher wai does in fact apply to some,Royalty or Monks.

Why are there those that have been living here for some time and still dont know the "rules" ? After all it's not that difficult a custom to understand and follow, isn't that what you just wrote.

My God you are thick aren't you! I indicated clearly for the non-foggy minded that there IS a higher wai But instead of God a perceptive mind would have inserted Royal/Monk.