Danish Businessman Attacked And Robbed In Pattaya

[GADK]

Too bad for the dude. I hope he recovers well and get his money back. There appears to be good evidences for the case.

The Thai police do work a lot harder when it comes to solving crime against farang especially when it has got a lot of media attention like this one.

I am a Thai who has lived in Denmark for 13 years and I can tell you that everything is pretty much "cashless" in Denmark.

You will find a credit card terminal everywhere in Denmark and bank transfer is the preferred method of payment for large transaction.

Now, back to Thailand. A lots of businesses in Thailand are still done with cash in hands even with large amount of money like millions of baht.

It is definitely the preferred method especially for private transactions.

BUT Thai people wouldn't bring 420k baht in cash to a stranger alone lol (especially to ones that appear to be "well connected" to mafia gangs)

Thais would have brought a lot of their brothers or male family members as "bodyguards" to a business meeting like this.

Doing businesses in Thailand is all about being "well-connected" and by that I don't mean having a lot of business partner connections...

it is more like knowing the right people (authorities and "powerful individuals" in the neighborhood) that will give you protection, so that people know they should not mess with you.

Edited March 20, 2013 by GADK

[gaucho]

My god, the armchair detectives and conspiracy theorists are going to have a field day with this one!!

agree totally ...i have known of similar happenings in business dealings ......if a thai is ...connected ...it is difficult to get attention let alone justice ......and yes hand wringers i know it happens in other countries ...i personally keep everything here low key and small change ....when will people here realise that there is little or no build up of goodwill here ....at the drop of a hat and for no reason ..............people get screwed over

[gaucho]

Good for you, Ive bought my cars with cash, my motorbikes with cash, pay my rent with cash, pay my utility bills once again, with cash. Infact everything I can I try to pay with cash.

By using cash there is a very minial digital footprint other than the withdrawal of said cash at my Kasikorn bank branch which updates my passbook for easy tracking.

It seems that you may have more to hide than I do.

The whole point of not using cash is because the bank transaction, be it a transfer or a crossed cashier's cheque, gives you some traceability if you get ripped off. This can only be to my benefit and there is no way I can possibly lose anything from it.

do you really believe the point of using cheques,credit cards,bank drafts etc is for our benefit ? ,........its just so our govts can trace everything we do and everywhere we go , that goes for cctv too, its not there for our benefit its for big brother !

get over yourself osiboy <deleted> ...osiboy u proba

bly believe that mamdouh and david r innocent

[kinmaew]

Another example of how welcoming Thais are to foreigners coming to their country. Of course, nothing will happen and this poor man will lose all his cash. For me, Thailand is a fantasy land where I will keep all my investments in my home country and if I live there one day only paying rent (Its cheap enough) and have absolutely nothing to do with Thais when it comes to doing business because the country is utterly corrupt, no recourse for foreigners and will stay that way. Thais only have themselves to blame for their largely austere lifestyles. If you want to improve your country, you need to welcome foreigners with open arms like we do to the rest of the world.

[lemoncake]

Another rather funny part, he claims he does not want to name the person but yet names the business they own, which is commonly known to everyone in Pattaya

This statement is factually incorrect.

He did name the person and the family that he believes tried to kill him.

It's in his facebook posting. He just didn't want the name published in the newpaper article.

Well that made a huge difference

[lemoncake]

Another example of how welcoming Thais are to foreigners coming to their country. Of course, nothing will happen and this poor man will lose all his cash. For me, Thailand is a fantasy land where I will keep all my investments in my home country and if I live there one day only paying rent (Its cheap enough) and have absolutely nothing to do with Thais when it comes to doing business because the country is utterly corrupt, no recourse for foreigners and will stay that way. Thais only have themselves to blame for their largely austere lifestyles. If you want to improve your country, you need to welcome foreigners with open arms like we do to the rest of the world.

Spoken like a true Internet warrior who has never done any business in Thailand. Edited March 20, 2013 by lemoncake

[fakename]

These post are too long, so I will just venture a guess, and say that he probably beat himself up, and blamed it on an important family. Some think the family is too important to steal money, so it has to be the Dan's fault!

[HD 446]

These post are too long, so I will just venture a guess, and say that he probably beat himself up, and blamed it on an important family. Some think the family is too important to steal money, so it has to be the Dan's fault!

This is too complicated for outside comment to be any where near the mark . But interesting he goes on Facebook but wants to stay anonymous in the press.

Are you kidding me ??

Only the Investigators will get the complete picture but with the involvment of Important locals that doesn't mean the public will

[asiamaster]

So whats the point ? Another bad experience in Pattaya? The rich will not go to the monkey house, the bills will be paid by the Dutch man and life goes on in the land of smiles.

Yes the DUTCH are wonderful people - always prepared to pay bills for the DANISH.....

[monkeycountry]

All business is not done in cash here. Only the crooked business.

I bought my car via a bank transfer. I pay my rent via a bank transfer. I pay my utility bills via bank transfers and it was buying a property here it would be with a cashier's cheque made out to the vendor and crossed a/c payee. And if I couldn't do that then I wouldn't do it at all.

A cashier cheques here are not the same as in other countries !

I just tell you what is going on !

I also think it is total crazy, but even some of the real big companies do it that way !

Maybe a lot of it is tax fraud, but for sure most is because people don´t trust each other.

Most car companies does not accept cashier cheques, i seen that, i tried that, but i took the car salesman to the bank and gave him the money there, then i not have to go anywhere with them 5555 !

I agree with you KBAA, I have never seen any business here in Thailand done with anything but cash. Cars, houses, etc. and etc.

Reminds me of Mexico 40 - 50 years ago. I ran a business down there, all cash.. Same here 40 - 50 years later.

When Thai businesses pay other Thai businesses they either 1. Transfer payment from one account to another, 2. Send a cheque by post from one accounts department to the other, 3. Send a staff to deliver a cheque from one accounts department to another. Unless you are working in one of these accounts departments, then how do you expect to ever see any of this?

As mentioned several times before, the only "business" you, KBAA and others probably see, is when consumers (not businesses) go to buy a car, pay rent, buy goods in Tesco etc. And yes, much of that is done with cash, but all of it can be done with either cheques, cashiers cheques, transfers, credit cards etc. if one wants to.

[monkeycountry]

I wonder if we'll see any follow-up on this in the press - or is that a silly question?

Fortunately the story has already been picked up by the Danish news, who could not care less about intimidation by any Thai family, and who do tend to follow up on their stories!

[lemoncake]

I wonder if we'll see any follow-up on this in the press - or is that a silly question?

Fortunately the story has already been picked up by the Danish news, who could not care less about intimidation by any Thai family, and who do tend to follow up on their stories!

That's great, so we can read more one sided story , unless of course you believe Danish news would send out investigators to get full story

[monkeycountry]

I wonder if we'll see any follow-up on this in the press - or is that a silly question?

Fortunately the story has already been picked up by the Danish news, who could not care less about intimidation by any Thai family, and who do tend to follow up on their stories!

That's great, so we can read more one sided story , unless of course you believe Danish news would send out investigators to get full story

I believe the important issue is whether the story will "disappear" due to certain peoples influence, as many stories do in the Thai press, or whether the story will be kept alive.

I don't think people care if reports about the bus stop killer, the red bull guy, the guy who cut a girl in half with his porche, the teenager who managed to push a minibus off the expressway or Kamnan Poh are completely accurate or not, as long as the press follows up on them, and thereby make it harder for the police and courts to accept a bribe in exchange for an acquittal.

If any of the above mentioned people or the Pattaya family who alledgedly attacked the danish guy have another version of the story, I can pretty much guarantee that both danish and thai papers will be happy to report their side of the story, but interestingly they never do, as they prefer as little attention as possible - I wonder why?

As for Danish news, they do not send anyone out, but they already have partners such as Scandmedia who have reporters operating in Bangkok.

[Marlow999]

All business is not done in cash here. Only the crooked business.

All cash transactions are not crooked. Ridiculous statement to make.

Indeed. I wonder why you made it? I didn't.

Indeed you did. See post #78 also

[Marlow999]

Only fools do business with Thais.

So, by your logic, presumably you are doing a lot of business with Thais.

In my 47yrs visiting/living in thailand, never have, never will.

You miss my point.

[SparklingCascades]

Strange way of doing business esp. for a Thai family with some business experience even if its only in dodgy Pattaya.

If my understanding is correct - Tenant turns up with approx USD 3k in Baht notes to sign pre-agreed contract. The tenant (a farang/Dane) is suddenly informed that the new price is USD 1,200- approx higher. He agrees to sudden rent rise and goes off to fetch added USD 1,200-, in Baht notes. I wish my family had more tenants like this who agree to a 30% rent rise on the spur of a moment - even after contracts are drawn up.

The home-owner (a Thai lady) has guards hanging around her office and a volatile husband - like a Thai gangster movie et a femme fatale. With trembling hands the lady starts to count the THB. The tenant has a sharp Nordic sixth sense and (like a good detective) spots her trembling hands. (He thinks: its the ol' trembling hands trick as Maxwell Smart once said). On impulse, the clever Dane interrupts to insist Thai lady first sign contract. Following an exchange of words the counting of notes resumes and the contract signing must wait till the cash is counted. The Dane/tenant is upset at this. He switches on his iphone to video the scene; making it clear that he trusts nobody and is having it all on video. At this tensions reach breaking point.

A couple of minutes with the video pass before the farang is punched for being rude, at a business meeting. He jumps to escape his attackers and injures himself. The guards and hubby land on top of him.

Now both sides feel that THB 420,000 is too little, considering all the grief its caused. Too late.

There's never any excuse for violence so on that score the farang wins. For the rest, it raises lots of questions for both sides.

Edited March 21, 2013 by SparklingCascades

[BlackPuddingBertha]

Indeed you did. See post #78 also

If you re-read what I wrote you may understand it as it was intended.

[Tolley]

Too bad for the dude. I hope he recovers well and get his money back. There appears to be good evidences for the case.

The Thai police do work a lot harder when it comes to solving crime against farang especially when it has got a lot of media attention like this one.

I am a Thai who has lived in Denmark for 13 years and I can tell you that everything is pretty much "cashless" in Denmark.

You will find a credit card terminal everywhere in Denmark and bank transfer is the preferred method of payment for large transaction.

Now, back to Thailand. A lots of businesses in Thailand are still done with cash in hands even with large amount of money like millions of baht.

It is definitely the preferred method especially for private transactions.

BUT Thai people wouldn't bring 420k baht in cash to a stranger alone lol (especially to ones that appear to be "well connected" to mafia gangs)

Thais would have brought a lot of their brothers or male family members as "bodyguards" to a business meeting like this.

Doing businesses in Thailand is all about being "well-connected" and by that I don't mean having a lot of business partner connections...

it is more like knowing the right people (authorities and "powerful individuals" in the neighborhood) that will give you protection, so that people know they should not mess with you.

Great post.

Dont do business in Thailand unless you are well connnected and even then be very careful.

Even if you dont do business in Thailand but live in Thailand it would be beneficial to have some important Thai you can call on should you ever get caught in some nasty situation otherwise you are fair game to any low life opportunist out for a quick buck.

Connections are everything.

[aguy30]

All business is not done in cash here. Only the crooked business.

I bought my car via a bank transfer. I pay my rent via a bank transfer. I pay my utility bills via bank transfers and it was buying a property here it would be with a cashier's cheque made out to the vendor and crossed a/c payee. And if I couldn't do that then I wouldn't do it at all.

A cashier cheques here are not the same as in other countries !

I just tell you what is going on !

I also think it is total crazy, but even some of the real big companies do it that way !

Maybe a lot of it is tax fraud, but for sure most is because people don´t trust each other.

Most car companies does not accept cashier cheques, i seen that, i tried that, but i took the car salesman to the bank and gave him the money there, then i not have to go anywhere with them 5555 !

I call bullsh!t KBAA. I just bought a new car and was TOLD to get a bank check payable to them.

Just curious how so many ThaiVisa members know so much about how everyday business is done by Thais. Most members have limited experience, usually consisting of 7-11, paying rent on their room, beer bars and Tesco Lotus. If you don't have facts then don't present it as fact. Just because you say it or think it, doesn't make it true.

If you don't have the facts then don't present it as fact. Just because you say it or think it, doesn't make it true. All cash transactions are not crooked.

Why are you now denigrating "most members" of TV in your next to last sentence? Do you think you are somehow better than them having to put up with the humiliation of going to 7-Eleven, Tesco's or a bar or living in a "room" while you swan around in a new car, accompanied by your vast experience?

Maybe we can debate later after you increase your reading skills.

[Almera]

Just another daily story that makes me thankful for not trying to run a business here.

[KBAA]

The Dane explains that the attack was ordered by the owner of a property

that he was leasing from her and carried out by her staff and her

husband. The money was brought into the meeting to pay for a renewal of

the lease.

Sorry, he deserved to get robbed. Pay in advance! Pay in cash! Pay 40% more! No thanks, here is a security deposit. Give me your bank account and I will transfer my payments to your bank. Pay in advance (please give me a 10% discount).

Well I know what I would do after I was healthy.

That exactly show that you never had done any business in Thailand !

The 420.000 was the agreed price after discount for 1 year, payment up front etc.

So please do not waste our time with your ideas !!!

The problem here is that she did not sign the contract and tried to cheat him out of it, it is seen many times in Thailand, therefore never come alone to such things etc.

She comes from a rich family, but how did they become rich ?? Many families are rich the criminal way !

As i wrote very early in this thread, 2 of the richest families on Phuket have members sitting in for murder, Bayshore family and the thaworn family, some of the biggest hotel owners on the island, killed some because of greed !!

But they did not get away with it as they had expected !!!!!

So the Dane shall of course fight them in court, get compensation of several millions etc.

But it is riscky !!

Yes please, I agree to a discount of 40% increase? And I have to pay in cash so you can then avoid taxes. And you want me to pay you where? Yes I am dumb let me carry it with me, in a clear plastic bag for all the world to see.

I have never done business in Thailand, like this, but I would not do business, like this, anywhere. This is the silly Thai mentailty. "Oh this is how it is don,e in Thailand" ... "Who gives a F how it is done in Thailand, there are other places to rent. Bye bye."

We have a saying. "A fool and his money are soon parted."

I can say so much that i had done business in Asia the last 27 years, lived in Thailand the last 17, been a director in a Thai company for 15 years !

Yes i know something about what is going on !

I hat seen it, tried it etc.

Thailand is the most dis-honest place to do business in Asia PERIOD !!!

[monkeycountry]

I can say so much that i had done business in Asia the last 27 years, lived in Thailand the last 17, been a director in a Thai company for 15 years !

Yes i know something about what is going on !

I hat seen it, tried it etc.

Thailand is the most dis-honest place to do business in Asia PERIOD !!!

And yet you still believe that most/all business transactions are made by cash :-)

Most farang bar or house owners in Thailand are directors in a Thai company, so that in itself does not say alot about one's business experience. (Not saying that you own a bar or house, just an example)

I do agree there is a lot of dishonesty, but it seems to be concentrated mainly in the small business sector - and more so in certain grey area sectors. Many medium and most large businesses such as those listed on the MAI or SET) are run by professional management, everything is done according to contract and transactions are not done by cash in shady rooms full of family members and guards.

[KBAA]

I can say so much that i had done business in Asia the last 27 years, lived in Thailand the last 17, been a director in a Thai company for 15 years !

Yes i know something about what is going on !

I hat seen it, tried it etc.

Thailand is the most dis-honest place to do business in Asia PERIOD !!!

And yet you still believe that most/all business transactions are made by cash :-)

Most farang bar or house owners in Thailand are directors in a Thai company, so that in itself does not say alot about one's business experience. (Not saying that you own a bar or house, just an example)

I do agree there is a lot of dishonesty, but it seems to be concentrated mainly in the small business sector - and more so in certain grey area sectors. Many medium and most large businesses such as those listed on the MAI or SET) are run by professional management, everything is done according to contract and transactions are not done by cash in shady rooms full of family members and guards.

Very much are !

Just today i whent to 3BB to get an upgrade to 30 MB fiber, when i was waiting on the right people to talk to, and waiting on they found out of if there was fiber available in my area, at lest 20 business´s paid their TT&T bill with cash !

Makro does only accpt cash !

Same with several other wholesale companies, pay with cash or 1 specified debit/credit card !!

Remember 20 Million people in Thailand is registered as "bad payers"! so they can not own a credit card, i also think it will be difficult for them to get a cheque book !

But of course Monkeycountry you are so clever, so no one can even get close to you !

You had shown you know nothing, so please keep all the bullshit for yourself !

[ableguy]

I can see you guysw does not know anything about business in Thailand !

Why is there so many ATM machines ? More then in any other country in the World (based on machines per capital) !

It is because all business are done in cash, not all, but most, go one day to the land office and sit down there, then you will se more cash then you ever had seen in your life, properties for many Mill. are paid for in cash.

Had a friend who just sold 7 shophouses lately, more then nhalf of them was paif in cash, avg. 5 Mill. each.

I had seen big European tour operators, they had to pay the airport in cash, Millions each week.

Do you think any want to take Bank cheques here ??? No one trust Thai banks !!

The system here in Thailand is so old, it is like in Europe 30-40 years ago.

No one trust anyone, they all think the other part steal, and with good reason, been living here 17 years, i always say to my friends home, they should be glad for having all these honest Polish chaps around

Have done some business here in the past around this guys figure of 400.000 always did it in the bank with the second party seeing the transfer from my account to theirs, just common sense in this violent lawless country.

[lemoncake]

I can see you guysw does not know anything about business in Thailand !

Why is there so many ATM machines ? More then in any other country in the World (based on machines per capital) !

It is because all business are done in cash, not all, but most, go one day to the land office and sit down there, then you will se more cash then you ever had seen in your life, properties for many Mill. are paid for in cash.

Had a friend who just sold 7 shophouses lately, more then nhalf of them was paif in cash, avg. 5 Mill. each.

I had seen big European tour operators, they had to pay the airport in cash, Millions each week.

Do you think any want to take Bank cheques here ??? No one trust Thai banks !!

The system here in Thailand is so old, it is like in Europe 30-40 years ago.

No one trust anyone, they all think the other part steal, and with good reason, been living here 17 years, i always say to my friends home, they should be glad for having all these honest Polish chaps around

Have done some business here in the past around this guys figure of 400.000 always did it in the bank with the second party seeing the transfer from my account to theirs, just common sense in this violent lawless country.

Call me crazy but internet banking transfers have only being available for a few months, prior to that you could not transfer funds via Internet.

So you saying the second party and yourself went into the branch to watch the transfer, or how exactly did you do something which was not available?

I have been doing every day business and have not found this country to be violent or lawless, but i guess i also can not do the impossible

[fasteddie]

Only fools do business with Thais.

So, by your logic, presumably you are doing a lot of business with Thais.

In my 47yrs visiting/living in Thailand, never have, never will.

You miss my point.

I assumed you were calling me a fool, thus I must have done lots of business with Thais.

[Woody1]

I can see you guysw does not know anything about business in Thailand !

Why is there so many ATM machines ? More then in any other country in the World (based on machines per capital) !

It is because all business are done in cash, not all, but most, go one day to the land office and sit down there, then you will se more cash then you ever had seen in your life, properties for many Mill. are paid for in cash.

Had a friend who just sold 7 shophouses lately, more then nhalf of them was paif in cash, avg. 5 Mill. each.

I had seen big European tour operators, they had to pay the airport in cash, Millions each week.

Do you think any want to take Bank cheques here ??? No one trust Thai banks !!

The system here in Thailand is so old, it is like in Europe 30-40 years ago.

No one trust anyone, they all think the other part steal, and with good reason, been living here 17 years, i always say to my friends home, they should be glad for having all these honest Polish chaps around

Have done some business here in the past around this guys figure of 400.000 always did it in the bank with the second party seeing the transfer from my account to theirs, just common sense in this violent lawless country.

Call me crazy but internet banking transfers have only being available for a few months, prior to that you could not transfer funds via Internet.

So you saying the second party and yourself went into the branch to watch the transfer, or how exactly did you do something which was not available?

I have been doing every day business and have not found this country to be violent or lawless, but i guess i also can not do the impossible

(Fruitcake), apologies Lemoncake I meant, until the above post you had actually made some sense, which I won't mention is the norm or not! After reading through all the previous posts (painfully!!), it doesn't take any form of detective to work out that the Dane is telling the truth! I won't go into the cash versus bank transaction, why are you paying so much, why tolerate such an increase in rent arguments, as anyone who has the slightest knowledge of this country know, things change without your prior knowledge or agreement. The difference is how you deal with these unexpected changes!!!!! Very, very, very easy sat behind a keyboard, never had to deal with it personally, and never done any kind of business here!!!!Get off the guys back!!!!!! It could be you someday, or perhaps, maybe you couldn't afford to do what he was doing.

[lemoncake]

I can see you guysw does not know anything about business in Thailand !

Why is there so many ATM machines ? More then in any other country in the World (based on machines per capital) !

It is because all business are done in cash, not all, but most, go one day to the land office and sit down there, then you will se more cash then you ever had seen in your life, properties for many Mill. are paid for in cash.

Had a friend who just sold 7 shophouses lately, more then nhalf of them was paif in cash, avg. 5 Mill. each.

I had seen big European tour operators, they had to pay the airport in cash, Millions each week.

Do you think any want to take Bank cheques here ??? No one trust Thai banks !!

The system here in Thailand is so old, it is like in Europe 30-40 years ago.

No one trust anyone, they all think the other part steal, and with good reason, been living here 17 years, i always say to my friends home, they should be glad for having all these honest Polish chaps around

Have done some business here in the past around this guys figure of 400.000 always did it in the bank with the second party seeing the transfer from my account to theirs, just common sense in this violent lawless country.

Call me crazy but internet banking transfers have only being available for a few months, prior to that you could not transfer funds via Internet.

So you saying the second party and yourself went into the branch to watch the transfer, or how exactly did you do something which was not available?

I have been doing every day business and have not found this country to be violent or lawless, but i guess i also can not do the impossible:thumbsup:

(Fruitcake), apologies Lemoncake I meant, until the above post you had actually made some sense, which I won't mention is the norm or not! After reading through all the previous posts (painfully!!), it doesn't take any form of detective to work out that the Dane is telling the truth! I won't go into the cash versus bank transaction, why are you paying so much, why tolerate such an increase in rent arguments, as anyone who has the slightest knowledge of this country know, things change without your prior knowledge or agreement. The difference is how you deal with these unexpected changes!!!!! Very, very, very easy sat behind a keyboard, never had to deal with it personally, and never done any kind of business here!!!!Get off the guys back!!!!!! It could be you someday, or perhaps, maybe you couldn't afford to do what he was doing.

Well I guess NOW that you made your post , which mind you is nothing short of utter drivel it must be so.

Seeing the drivel it's even more clear that you have never done any business in Thailand and any business at all in your life and do not have a clue.

I also seriously doubt you read anything because if you did you would have understood that I own a few business here and clearly know a lot more than you, especially in regards to this family.

But please do not make me stop you from continuing to troll.

Edited March 22, 2013 by lemoncake

[retell]

So whats the point ? Another bad experience in Pattaya? The rich will not go to the monkey house, the bills will be paid by the Dutch man and life goes on in the land of smiles.

danish man not dutch please read first

[monkeycountry]

I can see you guysw does not know anything about business in Thailand !

Why is there so many ATM machines ? More then in any other country in the World (based on machines per capital) !

It is because all business are done in cash, not all, but most, go one day to the land office and sit down there, then you will se more cash then you ever had seen in your life, properties for many Mill. are paid for in cash.

Had a friend who just sold 7 shophouses lately, more then nhalf of them was paif in cash, avg. 5 Mill. each.

I had seen big European tour operators, they had to pay the airport in cash, Millions each week.

Do you think any want to take Bank cheques here ??? No one trust Thai banks !!

The system here in Thailand is so old, it is like in Europe 30-40 years ago.

No one trust anyone, they all think the other part steal, and with good reason, been living here 17 years, i always say to my friends home, they should be glad for having all these honest Polish chaps around

Have done some business here in the past around this guys figure of 400.000 always did it in the bank with the second party seeing the transfer from my account to theirs, just common sense in this violent lawless country.

Call me crazy but internet banking transfers have only being available for a few months, prior to that you could not transfer funds via Internet.

So you saying the second party and yourself went into the branch to watch the transfer, or how exactly did you do something which was not available?

I have been doing every day business and have not found this country to be violent or lawless, but i guess i also can not do the impossible

That is indeed strange. I and many others have used Thai internet banking for transfers etc. for years. Cannot even remember how many years. I googled it, and according to google, it was first introduced by Siam Commercial Bank in 1999, so around 14 years a go!