At Least 42 Killed In Suicide Bomb Attack At Syrian Mosque

[simple1]

@Exsexyman: Remember, it is unlikely this situation would be happening today if the Assad regime had not opened fire and killed civilians during the Arab Spring demonstrations in 2011 rather than a dialogue for addressing grievances. But that is the nature of dictatorships.

Yes the US has made a number of policy mistakes with it's engagement in the Arab world and I agree current policy is isolating Shiite groups in collaboration with Sunni dictatorships. I do not agree that Israel needs a compliant Syria as a prerequisite to attack Iranian nuclear facilities. Anti tank & anti aircraft missiles are needed to lessen the severity of attacks on civilian areas during urban warfare and of course casualties amongst rebel forces. The big issue is controlling access by Islamic extremist groups. So far this seems to have been successful after the end of the Afghan War with Russia.

In reference to Islamic extremists they have a totally separate agenda from the Syrian Free Army and actively disliked by other rebel forces. You will recall the same issue occurred in Iraq when they were turned upon by their previous supporters. From the articles you posted so far their have been 300 Syrian Free Army fighters trained in Jordan, a very different scenario that you are inferring that US is providing training to Islamic extremists. To quote yet another media organisation article below regards Syrian free Army and Islamic extremists;source:http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jan/17/syria-crisis-alqaida-fighters-true-colours

"We'll fight them on day two after Assad falls," a commander said. "Until then we will no longer work with them."

Edited March 24, 2013 by simple1

[Exsexyman]

@Exsexyman: Remember, it is unlikely this situation would be happening today if the Assad regime had not opened fire and killed civilians during the Arab Spring demonstrations in 2011 rather than a dialogue for addressing grievances. But that is the nature of dictatorships.

Yes the US has made a number of policy mistakes with it's engagement in the Arab world and I agree current policy is isolating Shiite groups in collaboration with Sunni dictatorships. I do not agree that Israel needs a compliant Syria as a prerequisite to attack Iranian nuclear facilities. Anti tank & anti aircraft missiles are needed to lessen the severity of attacks on civilian areas during urban warfare and of course casualties amongst rebel forces. The big issue is controlling access by Islamic extremist groups. So far this seems to have been successful after the end of the Afghan War with Russia.

In reference to Islamic extremists they have a totally separate agenda from the Syrian Free Army and actively disliked by other rebel forces. You will recall the same issue occurred in Iraq when they were turned upon by their previous supporters. From the articles you posted so far their have been 300 Syrian Free Army fighters trained in Jordan, a very different scenario that you are inferring that US is providing training to Islamic extremists. To quote yet another media organisation article below regards Syrian free Army and Islamic extremists;source:http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jan/17/syria-crisis-alqaida-fighters-true-colours

"We'll fight them on day two after Assad falls," a commander said. "Until then we will no longer work with them."

"But a senior rebel commander close to the process said US army and Intelligence Officers were training Syrian rebels and said most of the first batch of 300 fighters had finished their course". The most effective fighting forces in Syria are Islamic Fundamentalists, they are running amok, and the SFA have no chance of reigning them in, as is being witnessed in Libya. The genie is out of the bottle. As for Afghanistan, if you really think that we have been successful in controlling access to Islamic extremist groups there, i and i'm sure many others would have to disagree. Regarding your comments about Iraq, it is worth remembering that before the West invaded, Al Qaeda had no presence there at all, likewise suicide bombings were unheard of, never happened. Now they are occurring on an almost daily basis, and Al Qaeda are running amok terrorizing the country and its citizens. After destroying much of the country and it's infrastructure, Western forces have of course upped sticks and left, leaving the poor sods to their fate.

[Chicog]

Al Qaeda are out to get rid of the Shi'a.

You could argue that this isn't our fight, but in the meantime the Shi'a (lets not be under any illusion) government led by Assad have already eclipsed his dad's record of murdering or imprisoning dissidents.

Remember how this started - with Assad's cronies torturing and killing a few teenage graffiti artists in Dera'a - and look what it has snowballed into, once he realised he had free reign to execute anyone who represented a threat to his authority.

You're damn right the genie is out of the bottle; like most of the region, this is tribe against tribe and too many tribes now want Assad's head in revenge for him killing their family members. And they do not forgot sh*t like that in a hurry.

[Steely Dan]

But it is quite obvious that the West's way of "getting rid of Assad' is to fund, arm and train the "lunatic extremists' to do so. You know, the same lunatic extremists responsible for 9-11 and 7-7. I wonder how the relatives of the victims of those atrocities feel about this. " Help the Sunni population restore order and establish democracy'? What kind of democracy would this be then, the kind where a Texan is selected by the CIA and parachuted in? The Sheik who was murdered in this cowardly attack was a Sunni, a week ago he called on good Muslims to defend the country against armed gangs,(read rebels), who are ruining Syria. Such a call would obviously benefit Assad and be to the detriment of the terrorist rebels. Yet the SNC would have us believe that instead of thanking the Sheik and broadcasting his call nationwide, Assad responds by sending a suicide bomber to kill the man as well as at least 49 of his followers! Assad still enjoys support from large sections of the Sunni population,( in Damascus as well as in Aleppo), blowing a gaping hole in the "Alawi" sectarian narrative being peddled by the West and their mainstream media for the last two years.

Get rid of Assad and help the Sunni population restore order and establish democracy.

It's an infinitely preferable solution to the status quo and his inevitable fall to lunatic extremists.

Regarding the chemical attack, it is strange that as soon as it starts to become clear that the attack was the work of the armed terrorists we are supporting, all of a sudden the US decides there was no chemical attack, well no really bad proscribed chemicals anyway. They reached this conclusion immediately after the UN agreed to a request from the Syrian government for an independent investigation into the attack, in what looks like an attempt to stifle the investigation. Embarrassingly for them though the Israeli Justice Minister doesn't agree and is contradicting them.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/03/21/world/meast/syria-civil-war/?hpt=hp_t1

I believe that Governments should be judged by their actions. The terrorists let off a car bomb in Damascus a few weeks ago, murdering many innocent women and children. The US refused to condemn the attack, and vetoed, ie blocked, the UNSC from issuing a condemnation. They fund, train, support and politically protect terrorists in Syria, and suck up to terrorist supporting states such as Qatar and Saudi Arabia. Yet in other parts of the world they drop bombs to promote "Democracy".

Al Qaeda aligned terrorists are the enemy of Saudi Arabia & Qatar so cannot agree that the Saudi and Qatar government are providing support to them as an extension of policy in Syria, nor that the US administration is deliberately funding, training etc Al Qaeda aligned terrorists in Syria.

One of the main stumbling blocks to provide more sophisticated weapons to the Syrian Free Army is the deep concern that such weapons could be accessed by the allegedly most effective war fighting group who are an Al Qaeda affiliate.

I would question the ongoing support by sections of the Sunni community in Syria as the Assad government is supporting the Shabiha militia that has been carrying out sectarian massacres of Sunni civilians.

With respect, i think you are burying your head in the sand. The rebels / Terrorists do have access to ever increasing sophisticated weaponry, and are receiving the training to use them. It is no secret where these weapons and the training are coming from. The two links i am posting are just a small fraction of reports available. I realise it is unpalatable to face up to the fact that our Governments are behaving in such a duplicitous and reckless manner, with no thought to the possible future consequences to their citizens when the weapons and the teaching of the skills to use them by these "Rebels" return to haunt us in the future. I stand by my comments in an earlier post, the objective of the US and their allies is regime change, pure and simple, and they are now so brazen about this they simply do not care what people think. Assad is still there over two years later, do you really think if he was as reviled and hated as we are being led to believe that would be the case? Like it or not he does have plenty of support from Syrians including plenty of Sunnis. At the moment Syria is a secular society, people have total freedom to practice their religion of choice, likewise, women in Syria have equal rights and are not in any way oppressed, unlike their counterparts in Saudi and Qatar. How long do you think this would last if our governments get their way and Assad is replaced by an Islamic fundamentalist regime? There is increasing desperation at the fact that Assad is still there, hence the ramping up of the rhetoric regarding arming the 'rebels". This is all about the long game, ie, Iran. The US is coming under increasing pressure from Netanyahu to attack Iran, and they need a compliant Syria to do so. One would think lessons would have been learned from the debacle that has resulted in the Libya of today, but no. Just this week the Libyan human rights Minister, who was at the forefront of the NATO operation to remove Ghaddafi was forced to flee to London in fear of his life after assassination attempts by the Islamists who are now effectively in charge there, courtesy of NATO. There is a clear pattern here.

Iraq, attacked to remove one 'Tyrant' - result, country in a total mess.

Afghanistan, attacked to capture one 'Tyrant' - result, country in a total mess.

Libya, attacked to remove one 'Tyrant' - result, country in a total mess.

Syria,----------? It's not too hard to join the dots.

I agree with most of your analysis, except Netanyahu has little option but to be very worried about Iran, if he could deal with Iran alone I'm sure he would, but Syria are in effect a satellite state of Iran, military speaking of course, even though the regime allows religious freedom. Indeed they are between a rock and a hard place, likely having to fight against a Shiite or Sunni power block - The fact the U.S and Europe seem to be behind the latter makes it difficult indeed for Israel to stay on the sidelines, even if that's where they would be best staying.

In other words I think it's gulf oil money driving this charade with UK,France and the U.S manipulated into doing the dirty work. Israel imho is an unwilling traveler certainly as far as Syria is concerned.

[Chicog]

Oh grow up the lot of you. For politicians and the senior businessmen who hire them, it's about who can they replace one earner with another.

For the rest of us, it's about dealing with the consequences of their actions.

[chuckd]

Oh grow up the lot of you. For politicians and the senior businessmen who hire them, it's about who can they replace one earner with another.

For the rest of us, it's about dealing with the consequences of their actions.

I repeat myself...

[simple1]

@Exsexyman: Remember, it is unlikely this situation would be happening today if the Assad regime had not opened fire and killed civilians during the Arab Spring demonstrations in 2011 rather than a dialogue for addressing grievances. But that is the nature of dictatorships.

Yes the US has made a number of policy mistakes with it's engagement in the Arab world and I agree current policy is isolating Shiite groups in collaboration with Sunni dictatorships. I do not agree that Israel needs a compliant Syria as a prerequisite to attack Iranian nuclear facilities. Anti tank & anti aircraft missiles are needed to lessen the severity of attacks on civilian areas during urban warfare and of course casualties amongst rebel forces. The big issue is controlling access by Islamic extremist groups. So far this seems to have been successful after the end of the Afghan War with Russia.

In reference to Islamic extremists they have a totally separate agenda from the Syrian Free Army and actively disliked by other rebel forces. You will recall the same issue occurred in Iraq when they were turned upon by their previous supporters. From the articles you posted so far their have been 300 Syrian Free Army fighters trained in Jordan, a very different scenario that you are inferring that US is providing training to Islamic extremists. To quote yet another media organisation article below regards Syrian free Army and Islamic extremists;source:http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jan/17/syria-crisis-alqaida-fighters-true-colours

"We'll fight them on day two after Assad falls," a commander said. "Until then we will no longer work with them."

"But a senior rebel commander close to the process said US army and Intelligence Officers were training Syrian rebels and said most of the first batch of 300 fighters had finished their course". The most effective fighting forces in Syria are Islamic Fundamentalists, they are running amok, and the SFA have no chance of reigning them in, as is being witnessed in Libya. The genie is out of the bottle. As for Afghanistan, if you really think that we have been successful in controlling access to Islamic extremist groups there, i and i'm sure many others would have to disagree. Regarding your comments about Iraq, it is worth remembering that before the West invaded, Al Qaeda had no presence there at all, likewise suicide bombings were unheard of, never happened. Now they are occurring on an almost daily basis, and Al Qaeda are running amok terrorizing the country and its citizens. After destroying much of the country and it's infrastructure, Western forces have of course upped sticks and left, leaving the poor sods to their fate.

I suggest you have misread some of my comments. To clarify, in the aftermath of the Afghan war against the Russian invasion, it appears their was little, if any, leakage of anti aircraft missiles to Islamic extremist terrorist organisations outside of the country. I do not know of a zero presence of Al Qaeda prior to Gulf War 2 in Iraq. After the invasion, very rapidly ramped up recruitment (probably more than a few ex Iraqi military/intelligence) or infiltrated into Iraq after the Gulf War 2. What I was saying that after a few years many Iraqi tribal Sunni leaders, who had a first supported the Al Qaeda operatives, turned against them due to the large volume of indiscriminate killings of civilians in an effort to further destabalise Iraq.

[Chicog]

It's in the West's and the Gulf's interest to restore a natural buffer between Iran and the rest that existed before Bush handed Iraq over to the Shi'a.

However, it's not in Russia's interest, and that of course has stopped this reaching a natural conclusion.

If Russia wasn't arming and protecting Assad, he would most likely be gone by now, living in a nice villa in Isfahan.

[chuckd]

It's in the West's and the Gulf's interest to restore a natural buffer between Iran and the rest that existed before Bush handed Iraq over to the Shi'a.

However, it's not in Russia's interest, and that of course has stopped this reaching a natural conclusion.

If Russia wasn't arming and protecting Assad, he would most likely be gone by now, living in a nice villa in Isfahan.

Isfahan is a nice city. Ever spent any time there?

[Chicog]

It's in the West's and the Gulf's interest to restore a natural buffer between Iran and the rest that existed before Bush handed Iraq over to the Shi'a.

However, it's not in Russia's interest, and that of course has stopped this reaching a natural conclusion.

If Russia wasn't arming and protecting Assad, he would most likely be gone by now, living in a nice villa in Isfahan.

Isfahan is a nice city. Ever spent any time there?

No I haven't, but a lot of my colleagues rave about it.

[chuckd]

It's in the West's and the Gulf's interest to restore a natural buffer between Iran and the rest that existed before Bush handed Iraq over to the Shi'a.

However, it's not in Russia's interest, and that of course has stopped this reaching a natural conclusion.

If Russia wasn't arming and protecting Assad, he would most likely be gone by now, living in a nice villa in Isfahan.

Isfahan is a nice city. Ever spent any time there?

No I haven't, but a lot of my colleagues rave about it.

It was great before I got run out following the 1978 revolution.

Edited March 25, 2013 by chuckd

[Chicog]

It's in the West's and the Gulf's interest to restore a natural buffer between Iran and the rest that existed before Bush handed Iraq over to the Shi'a.

However, it's not in Russia's interest, and that of course has stopped this reaching a natural conclusion.

If Russia wasn't arming and protecting Assad, he would most likely be gone by now, living in a nice villa in Isfahan.

Isfahan is a nice city. Ever spent any time there?

No I haven't, but a lot of my colleagues rave about it.

It was great before I got run out following the 1978 revolution.

I think the same could be (and has been to me many times!) said to be true of most of Iran.

Edited March 25, 2013 by Chicog

[folium]

I think you will find the gas attacks were carried out by the terrorists and not the Assad regime

But Assad is a terrorist. By almost any definition, he and his regime are terrorists.

*Deleted quote edited out*

All good teenage level analysis and commentary, and if you prefer Assad's regime to the US that's obviously your business.

A few quick facts. The "150 countries" where US troops are stationed overlooks the unhelpful fact that in about 90 of these countries the " stationed" US troops are either USMC guards for US embassies and/ or military attaches working in the same US embassies.

Wars allegedly or actually about regime change are hardly a feature unique to a single time period or locale; they have been a key driver of history for millennia.

Saudi, Bahrain and Kuwait as "some of the most wicked regimes around" demonstrates a stunning if alarming level of understanding of geopolitics today. Go to Syria and express your opinions, and you will discover that that is a luxury few there have enjoyed in the last 50 years..

Trite sound bites are all fine & dandy but excuse me if they fail the test of credibility.....

[folium]

Eddie

last time I looked 150-90 = 60, but heck why let facts and figures get in the way of melodrama?

Also suggest a touch of homework re the Syrian occupation of Lebanon and Assad family MO in terms of domestic quelling of unrest eg Hama in 1982 and countrywide since 2010.

International law needs international enforcement or you have a Rwandan or DRC scenario. Total deaths to date (and still rising), possibly in excess of 4 million. Few wars have ever been sanctioned under international law, and while it's a nice idea, international law tends to fall foul of nasty people with nasty intentions, and at best international law occasionally gets a look in after the event.

Your mention of those able to express their opinions in Assad-ruled Syria "those few have been Christian, Jewish, Kurds, Women", is just laughable were it not so sad. Tolerance was only ever extended to those who were compliant to or of service to the regime. Kurds and Jews never had a look in under either Assad.

If you wish to advance the role of appeasement and isolationism so be it....some people might think otherwise.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies deleted.