Aircon, Why Cleaning And Paying For Useless Maintenance Twice A Year ?

[Fgis]

H,

I know the story about aircon maintenance that should be done every year and even twice a year but I am wondering if it is not the usual BS said to push us to spend, as many people often forget that it can be useful to think.

What happens if you do not clean your aircon compressor (outdoor unit) every year ?

Air won't be as cool ? Then just clean it when it happens ! Why having to do it when everything is fine ?

I might be wrong but at least I try to think instead of just listening to the usual BS.

Please explain.

Thanks.

[PoorSucker]

Tips On Saving Air Conditioning Units Electricity Bill

[Naam]

some inexperienced posters overrate maintenance and claim they experienced miracles after maintenance has been carried. having said so, certain maintenance should be carried out, e.g. cleaning condenser fins (outdoor unit) and evaporator fins (indoor unit) if they are partly blocked by dirt or whatever debris. topping up refrigerant is not really maintenance but falls under repairs because there's a leak. unfortunately lack of refrigerant is the problem in most cases because of shoddy installation.

[Tywais]

It's called preventative maintenance. Do you wait until something is wrong with your car before doing something? However having said that, a quick look at your indoor filters and your outdoor fins will give you an idea if it is time or not. Or if it is not cooling as well as it used to, though that is a bit after the fact and best to catch it before that happens. If you saw some of the photos in the CM forum of AC filters during the smoke season or live near a major roadway you will see what can happen.

[Pacificperson]

Slime moulds, mildew, and other assorted gunk building-up in the internal unit and being blown all over your living area.

[Fgis]

some inexperienced posters overrate maintenance and claim they experienced miracles after maintenance has been carried. having said so, certain maintenance should be carried out, e.g. cleaning condenser fins (outdoor unit) and evaporator fins (indoor unit) if they are partly blocked by dirt or whatever debris. topping up refrigerant is not really maintenance but falls under repairs because there's a leak. unfortunately lack of refrigerant is the problem in most cases because of shoddy installation.

Especially when knowing how good professional are people here...

They only know how to refill and even don't do it always well !

So I might not be totally wrong to think that on top of a 20 floors building without pollution around it is a bit useless to call the useless maintenance guy before having any problem.

[h90]

Very easy, if everything is neat and clean, you don't need to clean it.

If it is dirty it should be cleaned.

(may I apply for the Nobel price?)

Another thing is that the gas pressure should be checked. Specially as often aircons are installed with tinny leaks (purpose or not?)

[thunder30101]

Yes cleaning your outside condenser coil is a good thing once a year or so for max efficiency, but unless you are using a proper acid based cleaning solution you are just pissing in the wind. Inside unit cleaning is useful also due to the high amount of particulate matter present in the air in thailand, def helps to cut down on sinus problems if you use your air con alot.

[thunder30101]

An air con system is a sealed refrigerant unit, if you need refrigerant you got a leak period. I have a small one somewhere I cant find unless i tear the whole system apart, screw that, I bought a set of gauges and a tank of gas from do home for 2200 baht, add a little when the unit starts fading, should last me quite a few years if the system does.

[Naam]

Yes cleaning your outside condenser coil is a good thing once a year or so for max efficiency, but unless you are using a proper acid based cleaning solution you are just pissing in the wind. Inside unit cleaning is useful also due to the high amount of particulate matter present in the air in thailand, def helps to cut down on sinus problems if you use your air con alot.

all what you need is to know what to clean, clean water and good water pressure, preferably a pressure washer. it is also advisable to switch off the breaker off the unit before cleaning

[h90]

An air con system is a sealed refrigerant unit, if you need refrigerant you got a leak period. I have a small one somewhere I cant find unless i tear the whole system apart, screw that, I bought a set of gauges and a tank of gas from do home for 2200 baht, add a little when the unit starts fading, should last me quite a few years if the system does.

almost all leak somewhere these days.....unlike the 20 year old ones which are still full....

sometimes it is that valve for filling.

One guy told us that it was not fully screwed in, as it is a common trick to loose a little gas over time so you call the service again.....

[Naam]

some inexperienced posters overrate maintenance and claim they experienced miracles after maintenance has been carried. having said so, certain maintenance should be carried out, e.g. cleaning condenser fins (outdoor unit) and evaporator fins (indoor unit) if they are partly blocked by dirt or whatever debris. topping up refrigerant is not really maintenance but falls under repairs because there's a leak. unfortunately lack of refrigerant is the problem in most cases because of shoddy installation.

Especially when knowing how good professional are people here...

They only know how to refill and even don't do it always well !

So I might not be totally wrong to think that on top of a 20 floors building without pollution around it is a bit useless to call the useless maintenance guy before having any problem.

i beg to differ. professional people who know how to clean do exist. the company i am using is doing an excellent job. i can judge that based on the colour of the "waste" water.

[thunder30101]

Yes being thailand I can expect leaking units but sorry not in my home country. The epa would be on you so fast for leaking refrigerant into the atmosphere your head would spin. You cant even buy refrigerant without a license now and they keep records of purchases.

[NoshowJones]

Tips On Saving Air Conditioning Units Electricity Bill

I have not had my AC unit cleaned or touched in any way for three years

[scotsman]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2155648/Legionnaires-disease-outbreak-2012-Is-penny-pinching-building-putting-risk.html Its also good to stop this from happening.

regards

Scotsman

[kriswillems]

We have about 35 air-conditioners. We clean them when:

- they look dirty (lot's of dust between the plates of the evaporator).

- they don't cool enough.

If you need to refill gass there's a leak. It's not useful to refill without fixing the leak.

The most important reason you really need to fix a leak is that the gass carries the oil that smears the compressor. If there's not enough gass in the system the compressor might burn.

In my opinion not cleaning your air conditioner every 6 month will not have a negative influence on its life expectation.

[giddyup]

I bought a brand new house with new aircon units in all the rooms. I've had the aircon in the lounge re-gassed three times now even though it gets very little use. The last time the guy told me one of the copper pipes had cracked causing the gas to leak (would have happened when installed I imagine), so he soldered the leak but told me that if it still leaked I would have to buy a new aircon unit! I would have to spend more than 30,000 baht because they can't fix a leak? Unbelievable.

[isawasnake]

I'm just going to throw my 2 cents in here. I worked on car air conditioners, but never a home one. I'm going to lay out what I think I know, as I kind of want to start working on my home unit myself if things go awry. Maybe typing it out will help me more than anybody

Air conditioners operate based on evaporation. It takes a lot of energy to evaporate a liquid, therefore, when it does evaporate, it takes a LOT of heat with it. "Evaporator" units will be inside the house, and they are the ones responsible for the actual cooling of the air. LIQUID coolant enters the inside of an evaporator from the high pressure side of the system. Sitting on the high surface area fins of the evaporator, the coolant then evaporates and cools the evaporator fins. Evaporators look kind of like radiators, in that they are high surface area units with "fins", and are usually easy to spot. Evaporators are probably one of the most important things to clean because air is blown directly over them and right into your home. Evaporators are cooled, and thus the air blown over the OUTSIDE of the evaporator and into your home is cooled. Since you have warm air blowing over a cooled evaporator, you will get condensation and other crap like mildew built up on the evaporator. I am actually not sure yet how the condensed water gets discarded, in cars it simply falls from the evaporators into a tube right onto the street. I have seen very nasty, mildewed evaporators though; not good for you or the AC efficiency.

That was the crash course on the "low pressure side". Evaporators will be the main unit on that side to consider in maintenance. The reason we need a "high pressure side" is to condense the coolant. Gaseous coolant, whose job it is to go from liquid to gas all day, then flows to the high pressure side (ie outside your home), where the compressor creates a lot of pressure. Liquids boil at higher temperatures when under a lot of pressure, that is why we need compressors - to condense the coolant. There will also be a fan, which helps cool the coolant. This is more to turn the coolant back into a liquid than it is to actually cool anything off. There is another high surface area things on the high pressure side called the condenser. This is where the coolant condenses, and the "fins" on the condenser are cooled by the fan. These fins are important to clean, because like a radiator, clean fins will cool better. Squirting water on those fins will be fine, as long as you get the dust and other crap out of there, you should be doing your job. Also, be careful not to damage any of the fins as they are very delicate. We need clean condenser fins in Thailand because it is so bloody hot that the condenser fan and compressor can get overworked. Clean condenser fins will be a huge plus in energy savings and efficiency because this is where the bulk of the work (ie your electric bill) takes place.

So, the coolant will be flowing from the outside of your house as a liquid, to the inside where it is evaporated. If you feel your problem is being low on coolant, even I may bring a Thai man in to do the job, because you need a ton of tools to detect leaks, add more coolant and evacuate the system and all sorts of complicated stuff. The key to good AC systems though is a well sealed system, along with having NO WATER on the inside of the system, done via evacuation. Take home point, if you clean your condenser and evaporator and your unit seems to be working poorly still, it may be a leak, and you need to find somebody to take care of it, and man do I wish you luck here in Thailand.

So, that is it. Clean the evaporator and condenser, maybe make sure the big fan has a little oil on it. First try IDing these things may be the hard part. Images online should help you there. I highly suggest people do this themselves though, maintaining them isn't rocket science, and I personally HATE Thai maintenance men. If you have a leak you probably need professional help. I hope this helped, as I think it helped me just talking through it; I will jump into my new unit one day soon enough. And please, anybody please feel free to correct or add to anything I said

[Tywais]

-because you need a ton of tools to detect leaks, add more coolant and evacuate the system and all sorts of complicated stuff.

Dish washing detergent and a sponge - that's about it in Thailand and has served many ac techs well.

[JAS21]

Household units, although of course work basically the same as car units, only have one connection for the pressure gauge. So you run the unit for a while and then check the pressure. The correct pressure actually varies with the ambient temperature but Thai workman appear to ignore this fact somewhat.

Actually I mainly clean my own. The external bit I wash with a hose quite frequently, well the ones at ground level anyway ... turn it off first! This year I acid cleaned both bits, do read the instructions on the bottle before you dissolve all of the element! and do make sure that you don't splash about when flushing the acid out as it will <deleted>> your wallpaper and the PU10 or whatever that is on your floor. And do wear goggles!!

The condensate drains to the outside via a pipe ... a good idea to flush this line well as there could be a few nasty things growing there.

Of course it's not that simple to wash them. There are few basic things to do ... isolate it first ... take the cover off ... remove the vanes etc.... either cover the motor or remove it ... cover the electrics, especially the PCB ... then make arrangements to collect ALL the washwater....madam will not be happy if you miss some!! That's the inside bit. Outside bit is easy ... spray through the side and back but don't allow the fan to spin.

Let it all dry for an hour or so and then test run ... if no bang when you switch on the odds are that all will be OK.

May I suggest that you employ someone to wash at least one and watch what he does and ask why why why.

[isawasnake]

-because you need a ton of tools to detect leaks, add more coolant and evacuate the system and all sorts of complicated stuff.

Dish washing detergent and a sponge - that's about it in Thailand and has served many ac techs well.

So, you can evacuate the system and set the proper pressure with dish washing detergent?

[Tywais]

-because you need a ton of tools to detect leaks, add more coolant and evacuate the system and all sorts of complicated stuff.

Dish washing detergent and a sponge - that's about it in Thailand and has served many ac techs well.

So, you can evacuate the system and set the proper pressure with dish washing detergent?

It was a bit of tongue in cheek regarding the 'leak detector'. Every Thai AC tech I've seen have at least the below basic equipment. Just so happened my air failed last week and been suffering the heat in my office. Main issue was both servers are in there so have to shut them down over the weekends. The compressor had to be ordered from Bangkok and just arrived today. Our technician at the lab is doing the compressor install and here is his kit. Vacuum pump for purging the system, not visible in the photo but a clamp on ammeter for checking start & run currents. The standard dual gauge for pressure checks, canister of refrigerant and a gas welder for the copper tubing.

[kriswillems]

I bought a brand new house with new aircon units in all the rooms. I've had the aircon in the lounge re-gassed three times now even though it gets very little use. The last time the guy told me one of the copper pipes had cracked causing the gas to leak (would have happened when installed I imagine), so he soldered the leak but told me that if it still leaked I would have to buy a new aircon unit! I would have to spend more than 30,000 baht because they can't fix a leak? Unbelievable.

They can fix leaks.

- The first thing they normally do is change the copper piping. The piping causes most leaks. Soldering is a bad fix. Changing the piping is much better.

- If that doesn't help they have to take both units (inside and outside) out and fill them with very high pressure nitrogen gass. They put the machines in water and check if they leak (air bubbles coming up in the water).

About 80% of all all leaks can be fixed this way. For the remaining 20% you probably need to replace the whole (inside or outside) unit.

A big leak (airco not cooling anymore within 1 day) can sometimes be found with water and detergent (checking for bubbles).

If your airco leaks very slowly (not cooling anymore after more than 3 days) this method will almost never work. In this case you need to follow the steps above.

Edited April 13, 2013 by kriswillems