Liverpool F.c.

[carmine]

i don't want to steer this off topic but just to say that the premier league is or has already become its own worst enemy. All that seems to be discussed and argued about is the bloody obvious diving situation thats been going on for years but is the now favourite topic to bore on about ad nauseum. So i've just been watching an article on BBC sport featuring the Bundasliga and its all too interesting and obvious that they tend to take an interest in somewhat more important issues within the game and their league and with three sides still competing in the CL and their national team kicking our <deleted> everytime they play maybe the media FA and fans alike could just move on to important matters. Personally i don't give a toss if Suarez dives because so do the vast majority given the chance.

Sterling needs a rest btw

I'm sorry that the topic bores you but there is a reason why it is discussed so much in the UK and that is because people feel strongly about it (as i recall, you seemed to feel strongly about it when Nani was doing it, and the topic didn't seem to bore you then, not judging from the number of posts you made about him).

I am aware that it is not a new phenomenon and i appreciate that all players cheat to one degree or another, but that doesn't make it acceptable any more than the fact that all politicians are corrupt to one degree or another makes corruption acceptable (i guess i have to add that that was just an analogy and no, i don't think that diving is as bad as corruption). The moment people stop kicking up a fuss and talking about it, is the moment we encourage it to get ten times worse, the moment we go down the path of other nations in actually admiring those who cheat well. Some people might like us to go down that path, some people may feel that would somehow make us less hypocritical in their eyes, but that is not a view i share nor a view i think that is shared by the overwhelming majority of football supporters in the UK.

I also think that lumping each and every player into the exact same group, as is done with comments like "they all do it", is all well and good for the likes of the Ronaldos, the Nanis, the Suarez's, because it implies they are no worse than anyone else. That is simply not true. Some players are a lot worse than others. And there are some players who do try and stay on their feet, and don't take every opportunity that presents itself to cheat. I hate to say it, but Aguero is one such player. I think the way he plays the game should be recognised and applauded. For me he is a very similar player to Suarez, and has very similar skills, it is just that he is much less prone to the dirty stuff. That means something to me. Perhaps i'm old fashioned though... come to think of it, perhaps Brendan is too...

Luis Suarez diving: Liverpool boss Brendan Rodgers reveals anger

http://www.bbc.co.uk...otball/21064709

No need to be sorry, its not your fault. However, it is a done to death subject, same old same old repeated over and over. Thing is, its part of the game, like it or not. Its not a 'Suarez' issue, its a global issue in the game.

The premier league has an aweful lot more important issues to address. And to my mind, the fact that a young generation that love the game is being priced out of going to games nowadays is more important than repetative bickering about the projectory of Suarez's dive when there are fifty other culprits to analyse every weekend.

[StevieH]

No need to be sorry, its not your fault. However, it is a done to death subject, same old same old repeated over and over. Thing is, its part of the game, like it or not. Its not a 'Suarez' issue, its a global issue in the game.

The premier league has an aweful lot more important issues to address. And to my mind, the fact that a young generation that love the game is being priced out of going to games nowadays is more important than repetative bickering about the projectory of Suarez's dive when there are fifty other culprits to analyse every weekend.

excellent post.

[bartender100]

timestamp='[/color]1358422186' post='6028441']

timestamp='[/color]1358417249' post='6028148']

Starting from Saturday please against Norwich, he don't like us

he has had rather a fun time against you hasn't he? looking very possible it could be called off tomorrow btw. you'd be a bit gutted if you'd driven from norwich up to merseyside only for it to be postponed.

Looks like there will be a lot of postponements this weekend, luckily I am not in a position to drive there, long way from the warm sunshine of Pattaya

[rixalex]

No need to be sorry, its not your fault. However, it is a done to death subject, same old same old repeated over and over. Thing is, its part of the game, like it or not.

I don't like it and i don't think it has to a part of the game. It is up to supporters, up to players, up to the FA, up to the clubs, up to the mangers, up to everyone, whether it becomes more prevalent or less. No, it will never be totally eliminated, but that is not a reason to not try and keep it to a minimum, if there is a desire to do so. And I believe there is. If you don't share that desire, if you don't think it is important, fine, that's your opinion.

Its not a 'Suarez' issue, its a global issue in the game.

Such a cop out response, IMHO.

The premier league has an aweful lot more important issues to address. And to my mind, the fact that a young generation that love the game is being priced out of going to games nowadays is more important than repetative bickering about the projectory of Suarez's dive when there are fifty other culprits to analyse every weekend.

For me, cheating is not the trivial matter you describe it as, as it has an affect, particularly on the younger generation you speak of, as getting them to understand the importance of sportsmanship, things like shaking hands with opponents, things like respect, is all part of a broader life lesson. The younger generation takes the lead from what the older generation is doing. The matter of ticket prices is very important too. I don't think we need to ignore one issue at the expense of the other though. The problem isn't that cheating gets exposure. The problem is that ticket prices doesn't.

Edited January 18, 2013 by rixalex

[BangrakBob]

i don't want to steer this off topic but just to say that the premier league is or has already become its own worst enemy. All that seems to be discussed and argued about is the bloody obvious diving situation thats been going on for years but is the now favourite topic to bore on about ad nauseum. So i've just been watching an article on BBC sport featuring the Bundasliga and its all too interesting and obvious that they tend to take an interest in somewhat more important issues within the game and their league and with three sides still competing in the CL and their national team kicking our <deleted> everytime they play maybe the media FA and fans alike could just move on to important matters. Personally i don't give a toss if Suarez dives because so do the vast majority given the chance.

Sterling needs a rest btw

I try to take a sympathetic approach to Mr Red's comments with his limited capacity and Suarez obsessing.....Mr. Red

Edited January 18, 2013 by BangrakBob

[MrRed]

i don't want to steer this off topic but just to say that the premier league is or has already become its own worst enemy. All that seems to be discussed and argued about is the bloody obvious diving situation thats been going on for years but is the now favourite topic to bore on about ad nauseum. So i've just been watching an article on BBC sport featuring the Bundasliga and its all too interesting and obvious that they tend to take an interest in somewhat more important issues within the game and their league and with three sides still competing in the CL and their national team kicking our <deleted> everytime they play maybe the media FA and fans alike could just move on to important matters. Personally i don't give a toss if Suarez dives because so do the vast majority given the chance.

Sterling needs a rest btw

I try to take a sympathetic approach to Mr Red's comments with his limited capacity and Suarez obsessing.....Mr. Red

Thanks Bob I see your manager agrees with me also.........just shows you how blind and obsessed the fans are including a few on this forum.....or do they actually agree with the manager?? ,but are just too bloody embarrassed to admit they all enjoy watching and supporting a cheating racist footballer!

Carmine is more concerned that the kids pay a lot less to watch cheats.maybe it is because Bale is as bad these days,...."come on son lets go and watch that great racist cheating diver at Anfield he is the best and it is reduced admission this week!.....or would you rather pay a bit more?"

[rixalex]

Funny how in all the numerous times i have read discussions on here about how terrible it is the way decisions always go in favour of United, how refs are always on United's side, how Fergie is such a bully, never once have i heard someone interject with a, "now come on lads, this subject is done to death, repeated over and over, and frankly very boring...this isn't just a problem with United or Fergie, this is a global problem... every time a bigger club plays a smaller club, there will always be a suspicion that decisions go in favour of the bigger club, and sometimes that suspicion will be justified, sometimes it will be imagined, but either way, the Premier League has a lot more important issues to address than this one, so can we please stop this witch-hunt against United and Fergie, and instead concentrate on the poor little kiddies that can't get in to watch games".

Selective moralising going on. When it is outside your own club, happy to winge and moan about it all day long, but when it is something on the inside, suddenly there are far more important things for us to be talking about. How convenient.

To an extent, we are all guilty of that, but there does come a time when you just have to put your hands up. Good to see that Brendan finally has.

[sharecropper]

Funny how in all the numerous times i have read discussions on here about how terrible it is the way decisions always go in favour of United, how refs are always on United's side, how Fergie is such a bully, never once have i heard someone interject with a, "now come on lads, this subject is done to death, repeated over and over, and frankly very boring...this isn't just a problem with United or Fergie, this is a global problem... every time a bigger club plays a smaller club, there will always be a suspicion that decisions go in favour of the bigger club, and sometimes that suspicion will be justified, sometimes it will be imagined, but either way, the Premier League has a lot more important issues to address than this one, so can we please stop this witch-hunt against United and Fergie, and instead concentrate on the poor little kiddies that can't get in to watch games".

Selective moralising going on. When it is outside your own club, happy to winge and moan about it all day long, but when it is something on the inside, suddenly there are far more important things for us to be talking about. How convenient.

To an extent, we are all guilty of that, but there does come a time when you just have to put your hands up. Good to see that Brendan finally has.

Yeah hats off to Brendan for shaming the rest of the one-eyed Suarez-diving apologists on this board and elsewhere. When he unfairly gets the bullet, I'll remember his manful stance on this issue.

Does anyone think our Luis might have been attempting to drive a wedge with the club (no pun intended) with his recent comments? I noted how he was stressing how hard it was for a 'South American' to play in England.

[StevieH]

Funny how in all the numerous times i have read discussions on here about how terrible it is the way decisions always go in favour of United, how refs are always on United's side, how Fergie is such a bully, never once have i heard someone interject with a, "now come on lads, this subject is done to death, repeated over and over, and frankly very boring...this isn't just a problem with United or Fergie, this is a global problem... every time a bigger club plays a smaller club, there will always be a suspicion that decisions go in favour of the bigger club, and sometimes that suspicion will be justified, sometimes it will be imagined, but either way, the Premier League has a lot more important issues to address than this one, so can we please stop this witch-hunt against United and Fergie, and instead concentrate on the poor little kiddies that can't get in to watch games".

Selective moralising going on. When it is outside your own club, happy to winge and moan about it all day long, but when it is something on the inside, suddenly there are far more important things for us to be talking about. How convenient.

To an extent, we are all guilty of that, but there does come a time when you just have to put your hands up. Good to see that Brendan finally has.

there certainly is some selective moralising going on. about some cheating being worse than others. a foul is a foul is a foul and they're all ways of trying to con and beat opponents. all in the game.

brendan should have kept his gob shut by the way. that stuff stays in house.

and oh look:

Sky Sports News‏@SkySportsNews

Sky Sources: FA will take no action over Luis Suarez's admission to 'falling' during a match against Stoke in an attempt to earn a penalty.

[StevieH]

Does anyone think our Luis might have been attempting to drive a wedge with the club (no pun intended) with his recent comments? I noted how he was stressing how hard it was for a 'South American' to play in England.

well it's certainly the second time the club has hung him out to dry in public. so i wouldn't be remotely surprised to see him leave in the summer. i'm sure we'll be getting big bids from plenty of significant clubs.

[rixalex]

there certainly is some selective moralising going on. about some cheating being worse than others. a foul is a foul is a foul and they're all ways of trying to con and beat opponents. all in the game.

Some cheating is worse than others. Some fouls are worse than others. If a foul is a foul is a foul, why do some fouls get penalised with free kicks, some with yellow cards, and some with red cards? Why, because some fouls are less serious than others. Just like some forms of cheating are less serious than other forms of cheating. Doesn't mean anybody is arguing that some sorts of fouls or some sorts of forms of cheating are acceptable. Were anybody arguing that, your accusation of selective moralising would hold some water. It doesn't. Not a drop.

[rixalex]

and oh look:

Sky Sports News‏@SkySportsNews

Sky Sources: FA will take no action over Luis Suarez's admission to 'falling' during a match against Stoke in an attempt to earn a penalty.

Does the opinion of the FA now mean something to you?

[rixalex]

Yeah hats off to Brendan for shaming the rest of the one-eyed Suarez-diving apologists on this board and elsewhere. When he unfairly gets the bullet, I'll remember his manful stance on this issue.

He took his time arriving at his "manful stance", but i guess at least he never printed up any T-Shirts.

[StevieH]

there certainly is some selective moralising going on. about some cheating being worse than others. a foul is a foul is a foul and they're all ways of trying to con and beat opponents. all in the game.

Some cheating is worse than others. Some fouls are worse than others. If a foul is a foul is a foul, why do some fouls get penalised with free kicks, some with yellow cards, and some with red cards? Why, because some fouls are less serious than others. Just like some forms of cheating are less serious than other forms of cheating. Doesn't mean anybody is arguing that some sorts of fouls or some sorts of forms of cheating are acceptable. Were anybody arguing that, your accusation of selective moralising would hold some water. It doesn't. Not a drop.

yes it does though. because diving and feigning are part of the game in the rest of the world. it only seems to be in britain that there is this selective moralising over it being somehow 'worse' than any other kinds of fouling and cheating. when players get caught diving they get a yellow card. same as when they get caught for a bad foul on a player. everything else is horse-trading or selective moralising from some perceived position of superiority. sorry.

[StevieH]

and oh look:

Sky Sports News‏@SkySportsNews

Sky Sources: FA will take no action over Luis Suarez's admission to 'falling' during a match against Stoke in an attempt to earn a penalty.

Does the opinion of the FA now mean something to you?

generally, no. that they're the law-enforcers of the game and they've made the right call in this instance? yeah ok i'll take it. anyway, back to those ticket prices and how they're forcing kids and normal people out of the game. you know, stuff that actually matters.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/jan/17/high-ticket-prices-premier-league

[MrRed]

Normal people!

[MrRed]

[rixalex]

anyway, back to those ticket prices and how they're forcing kids and normal people out of the game. you know, stuff that actually matters.

Yeah cos all that stuff that happens on the pitch, who really cares about that? Do we really even need it?

[BangrakBob]

i don't want to steer this off topic but just to say that the premier league is or has already become its own worst enemy. All that seems to be discussed and argued about is the bloody obvious diving situation thats been going on for years but is the now favourite topic to bore on about ad nauseum. So i've just been watching an article on BBC sport featuring the Bundasliga and its all too interesting and obvious that they tend to take an interest in somewhat more important issues within the game and their league and with three sides still competing in the CL and their national team kicking our <deleted> everytime they play maybe the media FA and fans alike could just move on to important matters. Personally i don't give a toss if Suarez dives because so do the vast majority given the chance.

Sterling needs a rest btw

I try to take a sympathetic approach to Mr Red's comments with his limited capacity and Suarez obsessing.....Mr. Red

Thanks Bob I see your manager agrees with me also.........just shows you how blind and obsessed the fans are including a few on this forum.....or do they actually agree with the manager?? ,but are just too bloody embarrassed to admit they all enjoy watching and supporting a cheating racist footballer!

Carmine is more concerned that the kids pay a lot less to watch cheats.maybe it is because Bale is as bad these days,...."come on son lets go and watch that great racist cheating diver at Anfield he is the best and it is reduced admission this week!.....or would you rather pay a bit more?"

My pleasure

All I would say is the manager shouldn't have said anything, all this "how we do things here" "behind closed doors" that door was wide open and flapping in the wind.

[BangrakBob]

[sharecropper]

My hope is that 'Ugly Betty' signs for Man City or Man U and goes down every time in the Liverpool area. Then I will be combing back through these posts to see how tolerant Liverpool fans are about cheating.

[BangrakBob]

My hope is that 'Ugly Betty' signs for Man City or Man U and goes down every time in the Liverpool area. Then I will be combing back through these posts to see how tolerant Liverpool fans are about cheating.

Total constant lack of signings for your own club will do that to you

[sharecropper]

My hope is that 'Ugly Betty' signs for Man City or Man U and goes down every time in the Liverpool area. Then I will be combing back through these posts to see how tolerant Liverpool fans are about cheating.

Total constant lack of signings for your own club will do that to you

Yeah. I really wish we'd bought Torres off you now. Or that we'd beaten you to Aquilani, Poulsen, Henderson, Konchesky, Keane, Cole, Carroll - to name but a few. Money well spent.

OK you got Torres, but even a bust clock is right twice a day.

[sharecropper]

My hope is that 'Ugly Betty' signs for Man City or Man U and goes down every time in the Liverpool area. Then I will be combing back through these posts to see how tolerant Liverpool fans are about cheating.

Total constant lack of signings for your own club will do that to you

Yeah. I really wish we'd bought Torres off you now. Or that we'd beaten you to Aquilani, Poulsen, Henderson, Konchesky, Keane, Cole, Carroll - to name but a few. Money well spent.

OK you got Torres, but even a bust clock is right twice a day.

Sorry Freudian slip - I meant Suarez, of course.

[carmine]

Funny how in all the numerous times i have read discussions on here about how terrible it is the way decisions always go in favour of United, how refs are always on United's side, how Fergie is such a bully, never once have i heard someone interject with a, "now come on lads, this subject is done to death, repeated over and over, and frankly very boring...this isn't just a problem with United or Fergie, this is a global problem... every time a bigger club plays a smaller club, there will always be a suspicion that decisions go in favour of the bigger club, and sometimes that suspicion will be justified, sometimes it will be imagined, but either way, the Premier League has a lot more important issues to address than this one, so can we please stop this witch-hunt against United and Fergie, and instead concentrate on the poor little kiddies that can't get in to watch games".

Selective moralising going on. When it is outside your own club, happy to winge and moan about it all day long, but when it is something on the inside, suddenly there are far more important things for us to be talking about. How convenient.

To an extent, we are all guilty of that, but there does come a time when you just have to put your hands up. Good to see that Brendan finally has.

The ferguson thing and the Utd favouratism business has continued because its such a standout anomoly whereas diving is not mate, its across the board.

For the record, i do not take lightly cheating btw, i just don't see the rationale of making a 5' 6 uraguayan its global figurehead because he plays for my teams biggest rivals as utd fans seem to have done. Its quite pathetic really and incredibly narrow minded

[MrRed]

Funny how in all the numerous times i have read discussions on here about how terrible it is the way decisions always go in favour of United, how refs are always on United's side, how Fergie is such a bully, never once have i heard someone interject with a, "now come on lads, this subject is done to death, repeated over and over, and frankly very boring...this isn't just a problem with United or Fergie, this is a global problem... every time a bigger club plays a smaller club, there will always be a suspicion that decisions go in favour of the bigger club, and sometimes that suspicion will be justified, sometimes it will be imagined, but either way, the Premier League has a lot more important issues to address than this one, so can we please stop this witch-hunt against United and Fergie, and instead concentrate on the poor little kiddies that can't get in to watch games".

Selective moralising going on. When it is outside your own club, happy to winge and moan about it all day long, but when it is something on the inside, suddenly there are far more important things for us to be talking about. How convenient.

To an extent, we are all guilty of that, but there does come a time when you just have to put your hands up. Good to see that Brendan finally has.

The ferguson thing and the Utd favouratism business has continued because its such a standout anomoly whereas diving is not mate, its across the board.

For the record, i do not take lightly cheating btw, i just don't see the rationale of making a 5' 6 uraguayan its global figurehead because he plays for my teams biggest rivals as utd fans seem to have done. Its quite pathetic really and incredibly narrow minded

Much the same then about your standout anomaly(sp).........very narrow minded and quite pathetic.But carry on anyway because we Reds enjoy your jealousy

Edited January 19, 2013 by MrRed

[rixalex]

The ferguson thing and the Utd favouratism business has continued because its such a standout anomoly whereas diving is not mate, its across the board.

The Fergie / Utd favouritism It is not a stand-out anomaly, it just happens to be the highest profile case of favouritism at the top of the heap. Whenever bigger clubs play smaller clubs, there is always the possibility of the ref getting swayed or pressurised in the decision making process in favour of the bigger club. Sometimes it actually does happen, sometimes it is imagined, but to suggest it only ever happens with regards United, is a complete nonsense.

Favouritism absolutely is across the board, it is just that United is the highest profile club and allegedly the biggest beneficiary, so United get all the attention with regards this issue. I don't think that is necessarily fair, but i do understand why United is under the spotlight more than other clubs, and don't have a problem with that in itself.

Diving absolutely is across the board, it is just that Suarez is the highest profile player and allegedly the worst offender. I don't think that is necessarily fair, but i do understand why, right now, he is under the spotlight more than other players.

For the record, i do not take lightly cheating btw, i just don't see the rationale of making a 5' 6 uraguayan its global figurehead because he plays for my teams biggest rivals as utd fans seem to have done. Its quite pathetic really and incredibly narrow minded

The reason Suarez has become the centre of attention with regards this matter, has nothing to do with nationality, and nothing to do with the club he plays for, it has to do with the way he conducts himself. For a long time we had all the denials of "he only ever goes down when he is touched, he never cheats", now those denials have finally petered out, and even the man himself admits he dives, the excuses have turned to "ah, but they all do it" and "what's so bad about diving?". This is what is pathetic, all the excuses and justifications. If you want to embrace diving as a part of the game, if you think that because it happens a lot, we should just accept it and turn our attention to other matters, if you want English football to adapt the European approach of actually admiring divers, that's fine, that's your choice. Please don't try and force your choice on others.

I look forward to reading your comments after all future occasions when your team is robbed of three points by some cheating <deleted>, and expect your reaction then to reflect the same c'est la vie type sentiments you have expressed here.

[smokie36]

I really hope Suarez moves on and we have a scouse thread again.

[rixalex]

I really hope Suarez moves on and we have a scouse thread again.

If he moves on away from the Premiership, then you can look forward to hearing all about how he was so unfairly hounded out of the league.

[carmine]

The ferguson thing and the Utd favouratism business has continued because its such a standout anomoly whereas diving is not mate, its across the board.

The Fergie / Utd favouritism It is not a stand-out anomaly, it just happens to be the highest profile case of favouritism at the top of the heap. Whenever bigger clubs play smaller clubs, there is always the possibility of the ref getting swayed or pressurised in the decision making process in favour of the bigger club. Sometimes it actually does happen, sometimes it is imagined, but to suggest it only ever happens with regards United, is a complete nonsense.

Favouritism absolutely is across the board, it is just that United is the highest profile club and allegedly the biggest beneficiary, so United get all the attention with regards this issue. I don't think that is necessarily fair, but i do understand why United is under the spotlight more than other clubs, and don't have a problem with that in itself.

Diving absolutely is across the board, it is just that Suarez is the highest profile player and allegedly the worst offender. I don't think that is necessarily fair, but i do understand why, right now, he is under the spotlight more than other players.

For the record, i do not take lightly cheating btw, i just don't see the rationale of making a 5' 6 uraguayan its global figurehead because he plays for my teams biggest rivals as utd fans seem to have done. Its quite pathetic really and incredibly narrow minded

The reason Suarez has become the centre of attention with regards this matter, has nothing to do with nationality, and nothing to do with the club he plays for, it has to do with the way he conducts himself. For a long time we had all the denials of "he only ever goes down when he is touched, he never cheats", now those denials have finally petered out, and even the man himself admits he dives, the excuses have turned to "ah, but they all do it" and "what's so bad about diving?". This is what is pathetic, all the excuses and justifications. If you want to embrace diving as a part of the game, if you think that because it happens a lot, we should just accept it and turn our attention to other matters, if you want English football to adapt the European approach of actually admiring divers, that's fine, that's your choice. Please don't try and force your choice on others.

I look forward to reading your comments after all future occasions when your team is robbed of three points by some cheating <deleted>, and expect your reaction then to reflect the same c'est la vie type sentiments you have expressed here.

I didn't realise how you would so massively miss my point about diving but lets just settle on " i l don't care in the least about diving" if that suits.

On a side issue i also think its a problem in the game that certain characters are seemingly allowed to bully berate and abuse officials from the touchline with little or no punishment and i'm surprised Utd fans have such a c'est la vie attitude towards it whilst others find humour in it. Such hypocrasy that some managers show class and others vile vitriol. Thats something i care about just as much, seeing that foul mouthed vulgarian bullying officials to gain unfair advantage.

Edited January 19, 2013 by carmine