Thai Army Chief Urges The Public To Stop Criticizing Gt200 Fraud

[jayboy]

To stop the criticizing general Prayuth might want to mention that the original go-ahead was given by then PM Thaksin himself, ages ago in 2004.

You have evidence for this? It doesn't on the face of it make any sense because the PM, even a dubious one like Thaksin, would not be involved in a minor military procurement decision.I assume you are not lying so please provide supporting evidence for what you claim.

[Thereisnoif]

Other than here on ThaiVisa, are the "public" out there in Thailand criticising the Army over this?

They sure as heck ought to be. Could it be the Army is actually feeling some public heat over this?

Whenever they have tried in Thai history quite a few of them have ended up with bullets through their brains.

[Thereisnoif]

To stop the criticizing general Prayuth might want to mention that the original go-ahead was given by then PM Thaksin himself, ages ago in 2004.

You have evidence for this? It doesn't on the face of it make any sense because the PM, even a dubious one like Thaksin, would not be involved in a minor military procurement decision.I assume you are not lying so please provide supporting evidence for what you claim.

None whatsoever , but it doesn't hurt to try and put the blame on someone else . Typical diversion tactic from rubl .

[Dap]

Because ... he said so.

[Dr Wanchai]

The Thai public are blaming it on the wrong persons.

That unscrupulous, selfish and immoral British criminal must bear sole responsibility. Lock him up and throw the key away.

[Thai at Heart]

The Thai public are blaming it on the wrong persons.

That unscrupulous, selfish and immoral British criminal must bear sole responsibility. Lock him up and throw the key away.

I am so glad you take such a simple attitude to the spending of firstly, Thai taxpayers money, and more importantly, the lives of many Thai' who have been lost because of this.

After all, it's only money and life and death.......

[jbrain]

To stop the criticizing general Prayuth might want to mention that the original go-ahead was given by then PM Thaksin himself, ages ago in 2004.

You have evidence for this? It doesn't on the face of it make any sense because the PM, even a dubious one like Thaksin, would not be involved in a minor military procurement decision.I assume you are not lying so please provide supporting evidence for what you claim.

You call a 1.37 Billion purchase a minor decision?

[rubl]

Doesn't anyone here like to read some of the history of the 'great GT200 purchase" ?

Pity then PM Abhisit couldn't follow up on a renewed test and (temporary) purchase stop. But then, he was a bit busy with 'peaceful protesters', run-up to the election, etc., etc. still surely that means all this can be blamed on him, from the very first purchase in 2004. A PM is ultimately responsible for what his/her people do?

[Rimmer]

One inflammatory post removed

[ratcatcher]

A " responsible committee " approved the purchase of useless equipment and although proved fake and the fraudster who was selling them convicted they are still being used because there's nothing else. What complete nonsense, how can lives be put at risk using something known to be fake, must be a great comfort to those using them.

Little wonder the Army Chief is trying to deflect attention away from this story because if, and it's a massive if, it is actually investigated properly senior heads will roll for corruption and / or incompetence but is it likely to happen. i suppose as with other ongoing enquiries the DSI will take it's lead from the government.

Well, if the Thai courts and the DSI find against the military, then,as the old saying goes "The balloon really will go up".

Oh!,just realized it already has and then come down and gone up and come down again.

Maybe this will be another source of amusement for the population when General Blimp tries to explain that one with another lot of "hot air"?

[Thai at Heart]

A " responsible committee " approved the purchase of useless equipment and although proved fake and the fraudster who was selling them convicted they are still being used because there's nothing else. What complete nonsense, how can lives be put at risk using something known to be fake, must be a great comfort to those using them.

Little wonder the Army Chief is trying to deflect attention away from this story because if, and it's a massive if, it is actually investigated properly senior heads will roll for corruption and / or incompetence but is it likely to happen. i suppose as with other ongoing enquiries the DSI will take it's lead from the government.

Well, if the Thai courts and the DSI find against the military, then,as the old saying goes "The balloon really will go up".

Oh!,just realized it already has and then come down and gone up and come down again.

Maybe this will be another source of amusement for the population when General Blimp tries to explain that one with another lot of "hot air"?

Why do you have to complicate it all and bring the blimp into it. I mean all that gas, encapsulated in a small space, can be so volatile, should it be released under pressure, could at minimum create a big stink, but presumably not an explosion, if they haven't cheated on safety and filled it with hydrogen.

I just hope that when inevitably they parade down to the Cambodian border in a couple of months, that the poor soldiers that this chump commands, actually have bullets that fire, rockets that propel, and then amazingly the odd plane that stays in the air.

These guys have no concept of honour, respect or accountabilty. They demand everything and deliver absolutely nothing. They have no answers, no reason, and no compassion for their fellow soldiers, to a point that will actually put a piece of equipment in their hands that apparently be the difference between life and death, knowing that it is useless. That is in between the beatings that have been reported in the last week or so.

And should their lack of professional competence be exposed, the answer is not to talk about it?

How can anyone respect these people? They are the ultimate anti-soldiers, who's greatest success in the last 50 years has been to shoot their own people. How they have become the saviours of the country, god only knows, maybe that is why, in some people's eyes, the population would rather side with the devil(their description not mine), instead of supporting the status quo.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[ratcatcher]

The Thai public are blaming it on the wrong persons.

That unscrupulous, selfish and immoral British criminal must bear sole responsibility. Lock him up and throw the key away.

I am so glad you take such a simple attitude to the spending of firstly, Thai taxpayers money, and more importantly, the lives of many Thai' who have been lost because of this.

After all, it's only money and life and death.......

I do believe good Dr.Wanchai was delivering a small dose of the drug "Sar Casum"

[p_brownstone]

Cute, but misleading as a PM might only be responsable when successes need to be allocated, mistakes and faults are the prerogative of underlings.

"(note: the first Thai purchases of the GT200 occurred by the Thai Air Force in 2004, when Thaksin Shinawatra was PM)"

http://thaicables.wordpress.com/2011/06/24/10bangkok478-thailand-gt200-bomb-detector-failure-ignites-discussion-on-civil-mil-relations-human-rights-procurement/

A repeat of most posts here can be found in a topic from a year ago:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/571172-thailands-dsi-to-file-case-over-useless-bomb-detectors/

Do you genuinely think ANY Prime Minister of Thailand gets involved in the procurement process for the Thai army?

In fact, it's probable that his squeezing of their budget contributed to them slavishly chasing the opportunity to buy these products. Or was the instanteous increase in their budget post coup not real?

Of course no PM gets involved in the actual purchase of any specific equipment or service:

It works like this :

PM

"OK, I will approve a Budget of xxxx million Baht for your Military Command (or Ministry) but I want a personal return of 15% - how you as the person in charge spend the Budget I have approved is entirely up to you - just make sure I get my 15% or you will be replaced"

Military Commander (or Minister)

"Yes Sir - Guaranteed, thank you sir"

Military Commander (or Minister) to 50+ individuals under his authority :

"I have talked to the PM and received approval for a Budget of xxx Million Baht for your Department - I don't care how you spend the Budget, just make sure I get a personal return of 20%. or you will be replaced"

50+ individuals

"Yes Sir, I value my position, and absolutely guarantee I will make sure I give you the payback you demand: please don't replace me"

And so on all the way down the line.

Patrick

[aguy30]

First of all the UK court has NOT convicted the fraudsters. They have been found guilty and sentencing is to come.

CONVICTED - Verb

Declare (someone) to be guilty of a criminal offense by the verdict of a jury or the decision of a judge in a court of law.

(he has been convicted but not sentenced yet)

And what the hack. 32000 Euro for a scanner that was originally developed to collect golf ball. "

I read in a wiki that this "detector" had no circuitry or working parts. It was basically a divining rod.

The GT200 consists of three main components—a swivelling antenna mounted via a hinge to a plastic handgrip, into which sensor cards can be inserted.It requires no battery or other power source and is said to be powered solely by the user's static electricity. The device becomes active when the operator starts moving and detects various substances via "DIA/PARA magnetism".^[

^{A BBC Newsnight investigation of the GT200 in January 2010 found that the "sensor card" consisted only of two sheets of card between which was sandwiched a sheet of paper, white on one side and black on the other, that had been cut off from a larger sheet with a knife or scissors. It contained no electronic components whatsoever. When the device's case was dismantled, it too was found to contain no electronic components.}

^{Main users included Thailand (800 units) and Mexico (700+ units).}

Edited April 25, 2013 by aguy30

[MikeOboe57]

As the good General is apparently unable to recognize a scammer, even if he kicked him in the groin, I might have an interesting business proposal for him:

Dear Sir,

My name is Col. David Freeman, a US Army serving in the 3rd Infantry Division in Iraq. I want you to read this mail carefully and understand it.

In 2003, my men and I found over $900 million in Saddam Hussein's hideout in Baghdad, we sent some back to the Iraq government after counting it in a classified location, but we also kept some behind for ourselves.

Some of the money we shared among ourselves worth over $200million, I kept mine for a while in a secured place. I need someone to help me, I found a secured way of getting the package out of Iraq for you to pick up through the help of a Diplomatic Company .

The total amount of money is $10million.

If you can handle this deal let me know immediately, you will receive 35% of the money , all you need to do is to find a safe place where you can keep the box till i leave Iraq.

If you are interested please PM me. I will get you in contact with an honest citizen from Nigeria.

[itchybum]

I've got a fake bomb scanner scanner in the pipeworks.

[Thai at Heart]

Cute, but misleading as a PM might only be responsable when successes need to be allocated, mistakes and faults are the prerogative of underlings.

"(note: the first Thai purchases of the GT200 occurred by the Thai Air Force in 2004, when Thaksin Shinawatra was PM)"

http://thaicables.wordpress.com/2011/06/24/10bangkok478-thailand-gt200-bomb-detector-failure-ignites-discussion-on-civil-mil-relations-human-rights-procurement/

A repeat of most posts here can be found in a topic from a year ago:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/571172-thailands-dsi-to-file-case-over-useless-bomb-detectors/

Do you genuinely think ANY Prime Minister of Thailand gets involved in the procurement process for the Thai army?

In fact, it's probable that his squeezing of their budget contributed to them slavishly chasing the opportunity to buy these products. Or was the instanteous increase in their budget post coup not real?

Of course no PM gets involved in the actual purchase of any specific equipment or service:

It works like this :

PM

"OK, I will approve a Budget of xxxx million Baht for your Military Command (or Ministry) but I want a personal return of 15% - how you as the person in charge spend the Budget I have approved is entirely up to you - just make sure I get my 15% or you will be replaced"

Military Commander (or Minister)

"Yes Sir - Guaranteed, thank you sir"

Military Commander (or Minister) to 50+ individuals under his authority :

"I have talked to the PM and received approval for a Budget of xxx Million Baht for your Department - I don't care how you spend the Budget, just make sure I get a personal return of 20%. or you will be replaced"

50+ individuals

"Yes Sir, I value my position, and absolutely guarantee I will make sure I give you the payback you demand: please don't replace me"

And so on all the way down the line.

Patrick

I think you over estimate the Thai PMS influence over the Thai military budget.

Thaksin was busy cutting it. That is their baby and they don't ask permission from anyone about how it is spent

Edited April 25, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[hellodolly]

A " responsible committee " approved the purchase of useless equipment and although proved fake and the fraudster who was selling them convicted they are still being used because there's nothing else. What complete nonsense, how can lives be put at risk using something known to be fake, must be a great comfort to those using them.

Little wonder the Army Chief is trying to deflect attention away from this story because if, and it's a massive if, it is actually investigated properly senior heads will roll for corruption and / or incompetence but is it likely to happen. i suppose as with other ongoing enquiries the DSI will take it's lead from the government.

Well being as it was in Thaksins term in office I would imagine they would do every thing possible to get people to forget it.

Approved by a committee. Who made the decisions who would be on it and then check his house for unaccountable amounts of money.

We know Thaksin has moved his to where the government can not retrieve any of the money he received for authorizing it.

Now that I think of it did the committee in fact say it was a good deal?

[EyesWideOpen]

The Thai public are blaming it on the wrong persons.

That unscrupulous, selfish and immoral British criminal must bear sole responsibility. Lock him up and throw the key away.

I am so glad you take such a simple attitude to the spending of firstly, Thai taxpayers money, and more importantly, the lives of many Thai' who have been lost because of this.

After all, it's only money and life and death.......

I do believe good Dr.Wanchai was delivering a small dose of the drug "Sar Casum"

Uhhhh believe it or not, I think that actually is his opinion... No drugs involved. Sarcasm generally does not work well on these forums, as the response to it can be quite varied.. :-) Edited April 25, 2013 by EyesWideOpen

[visionchaser45]

He stated that they are still using it because there is no alternative??? One equally effective alternative would be to go cut a forked branch from the nearest tree. Perhaps a more "technical" alternative would be to use an old transistor radio with some lights and dials added to the face for effect.

Edited April 26, 2013 by metisdead
Font

[ricklev]

I haven't read the whole thread, so someone might have said this before. The GT 200 might be useless for detecting bombs, however it is an excellent detector of morons and liars. It is sometimes not quite possible to distinguish between the two though.

Edited April 25, 2013 by ricklev

[candypants]

certainly thailand are not the only fools out there who bought, and continue to buy into the GT 200 myth.

at 22k a pop for an empty plastic casing and some paper and plastic sensor cards, admitting the machine doesn't work may be too painful for many countries to accept

there are NO electronic parts in the device, and it is ,powered by static electricity generated by the user

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GT200

read it. it is a laugh.

Edited April 25, 2013 by candypants

[reiltin]

The truth always hurts!!!!!

In this case the truth not only hurts..it'll blow you to smithereens.These guys bought a lemon for a share of the pie.To them it's just TCB, to the poor men that have to use them well-it's just business.....

[TackyToo]

The truth always hurts!!!!!

One can only sweep a certain amount of trash under the carpet. One fine day you may walk on it with your head hitting the fan. If that happens you may lose a little more than face.

[TackyToo]

This is the real sound of Dictatorship !!

Time for a new anthem? How about "silent night"?

[Langsuan Man]

Thailand's army chief general Prayuth Chan-ocha has asked the public to stop making comments or criticisms about the controversial bomb detector GT200 procurement.

Look at the source, this is the same free speech advocate that complained that the Thai Public Broadcasting Service should not even be talking about lese majeste

[Secondmouse]

"He added that the army has already stopped using the devices for 2-3 years. However, he admitted that some military personnel still use them since there is no other alternative instrument".

This reminds me of a story 'mummy' used to read to me at bedtime about an Emperor that had new clothes....didn't want to take them off in case he caught a cold........

[corkythecat]

The truth always hurts!!!!!

One can only sweep a certain amount of trash under the carpet. One fine day you may walk on it with your head hitting the fan. If that happens you may lose a little more than face.

One fine day ? When the sun becomes a red dwarf perhaps.

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed.

[ableguy]

The army stopped using the product 3 years ago except for those soldiers still useing it, he sounds like he should be in the government.