Embarrassment For Australia As German Criminal Escapes In Thailand

[malcoml]

Yes something is not right here.

I assume he had no money on him so how exactly did he get from the airport to anywhere?

[PoodMaiDai]

Ah, now no one is blaming the Thai police! Yesterdays posters were insistent in telling us how badly organized the Thai's were and how it just had to be their fault! A new day and a new back track! LOL

How to you suspect he got through immigration and out of the airport that is covered with CCTV cams?

[Bikkii]

Surely, the Thai Immigration Dept., and Police have a secure containment area at the airport, without unlocked exit doors to the outside world ?

If they dont have secure rooms, then they could have used some form of direct restraint during the detention period, e.g. 'handcuffs'

Remember though, Thai police were not informed of this vagrant being shifted through their shores!

[PoodMaiDai]

Surely, the Thai Immigration Dept., and Police have a secure containment area at the airport, without unlocked exit doors to the outside world ?

If they dont have secure rooms, then they could have used some form of direct restraint during the detention period, e.g. 'handcuffs'

Remember though, Thai police were not informed of this vagrant being shifted through their shores!

That is rubbish and only said to save face. No one just waltzes a prisoner through another country without the proper documents and prior notification to do so.

[surangw]

Ah, now no one is blaming the Thai police! Yesterdays posters were insistent in telling us how badly organized the Thai's were and how it just had to be their fault! A new day and a new back track! LOL

How to you suspect he got through immigration and out of the airport that is covered with CCTV cams?

having cctv cameras and actually using ( monitoring ) them are 2 different things in thailand

[chooka]

Surely, the Thai Immigration Dept., and Police have a secure containment area at the airport, without unlocked exit doors to the outside world ?

If they dont have secure rooms, then they could have used some form of direct restraint during the detention period, e.g. 'handcuffs'

He wasn't under arrest and only being escorted to Germany on deportation. The security gaurds were from a private British company and not government protective services officers or law enforcement. These sorts of things (deportation) were once done by immigration officers but are now outsourced to cut costs.

[chooka]

Surely, the Thai Immigration Dept., and Police have a secure containment area at the airport, without unlocked exit doors to the outside world ?

If they dont have secure rooms, then they could have used some form of direct restraint during the detention period, e.g. 'handcuffs'

Remember though, Thai police were not informed of this vagrant being shifted through their shores!

They weren't informed because there was no requirement. The guy had served his prison sentence and was a free man. This was not an extradition but a deportation and the role of the civilian security staff was to ensure that he got to germany and they would still be in possession of his travel documents. Do the Thai authorities have to be informed of every single person transiting through the Kingdom who may have served a day or more in jail? There would be thousands every week.

The Aussie government are redfaced yes and stuffed up by using civilians for this task but this wouldn't of even made a story if there wasn't an election in a couple of months. The parties are in full election mode at the moment and looking for every piece of dirt. Serco (security company) were already under fire for losing 9 ilegal immigrants last week and this one was just thrown onto the fire.

[chooka]

To have one guard fall asleep on the job may be considered unfortunate, to have two do so looks like carelessness.

Of course it could be that Wayne and Shane had been at the local amber nectar and being Aussies weren't used to strong beer.

Strong beer !! Are you serious ?? we're Aussies ! when we are born we're slapped on the arse and given a 'pint'

Aussie don't drink pints, a pot or a stubbie maybe but never a pint.

[IrishIvan]

To have one guard fall asleep on the job may be considered unfortunate, to have two do so looks like carelessness.

 

Of course it could be that Wayne and Shane had been at the local amber nectar and being Aussies weren't used to strong beer.

Strong beer !! Are you serious ?? we're Aussies !  when we are born we're slapped on the arse and given a 'pint'  

Aussie don't drink pints, a pot or a stubbie maybe but never a pint.

Shmiddies

[chooka]

I do not understand all this fuss about this incident.Petty criminal was deported from Australia after serving 3 yrs long sentence.

He is not wanted for war crimes against humanity,he did not kill anybody,he is just exconvict/small time thieve.He could enter Thailand anytime

for holidays;nobody would stop him,Germans have visa exemption.

Why have you made 3 or 4 threads about him,7 or 8 pages??

Do you think - he will come to your house and he will steal your precious personal stash of Singha beers in your fridge?

Carlo!- come to my fridge,help yourself,you are welcome!

Keep going!Mate!

You don't know much about him do you. He wasn't a petty thief. Aggrivated burglaries, armed robberies and drug dealing/manufacturing. Sure be my guest invite him over to raid your fridge. Make sure your fridge is bolted down because he may take that with him when he has finnished all your beers.

[chooka]

Carlo Konstantin Kohl, 25, was being deported.

Department secretary Martin Bowles denied reports in a Thai newspaper that
the two escorts, hired by the government's detention provider Serco, were asleep
in the airport lounge.

He said Kohl and the escorts had been met by Thai Airways security staff and
were taken to a transit hotel within the airport.

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/national-news/nsw-act/bungling-german-crook-carlo-konstantin-kohl-was-too-smart-for-aussie-guards/story-fnii5s3x-1226652574349#ixzz2Ud2bA4Cg

Edited May 28, 2013 by chooka

[gaucho]

more to this than meets the eye ...though he obviously would have connections here in thailand ...i dont care as long as the scum is out of australia.

[simple1]

more to this than meets the eye ...though he obviously would have connections here in thailand ...i dont care as long as the scum is out of australia.

You live in Thailand and you don't care? More than likely any criminal activity in Thailand will be focussed on Westeners.

[geriatrickid]

Perhaps a recap of the reported facts of the case will help clarify matters;

1. Mr. Kohl was being taken from Brisbane to Frankfurt via Bangkok on Thai Airways International flights.

2. The flight routing was as follows;

Thai Airways Intl TG474

Departure: 14:00 Brisbane, Australia

Arrival: 20:20 Bangkok, Thailand - Suvarnabhumi International

He was to connect to Thai Airways Intl TG920
Departure: 23:45 Bangkok, Thailand - Suvarnabhumi International

Arrival: 06:00 +1 day(s) Frankfurt, Germany - Frankfurt International

There is usually a transit and waiting period of 3 1/2 .

3. The flight was delayed because of "weather" and rescheduled for the next morning (reported as 08:00)

4. The prisoner and escorts then went to a transit lounge to wait for approx. 10 hours.
While there the prisoner exited the transit lounge by way of a fire exit.

There are 2 issues; 1- Did the Thai authorities know of the transfer. The Thais say no. However, the escorting agency would have been obliged to advise Thai Airways that it was escorting a criminal. This is an obligation and the group would have been noted on the passenger manifest. At the very least Thai Airways and its security department was aware of the passenger. It would have been expected that Thai Airways would have communicated with the Thai agency responsible for air security that it was carrying this passenger. It is also expected that TG would have arranged an expedited transfer as it would be unusual for an escorted criminal to mingle with the general public. The question needs to be asked if TG reported this passenger to the Thai authorities and if the expedited process was followed. If there was an expedited transfer, airport security would have known as the prisoner and escorts would have received priority screening at the checkpoint. (Edited to note Chooka has confirmed TG security was aware. Chooka also says that the prisoner was taken to transit hotel which is that awful Louis Tavern place.)

2. The prisoner escaped by a fire exit. These exits are supposed to be alarmed and there is supposed to be CCTV coverage of all exits to ensure that the premises are secure. Basically, the prisoner simply walked out the fire exit and made his way off the airport premises. What does this say about airport security? Surely, if an alarm sounded and there was surveillance and if there was a security presence at the airport, the escapee would have been seen and quickly detained. This did not happen. It is a serious breach of security at the airport and indicates that the airport is not a secure area.

Now, if I was a terrorist, this deficiency would be interesting. This aspect of the event alone is enough to raise a red flag. So far, no statement on this aspect of the case from the AOT, or the RTP. Something is very, very wrong at the airport and this will have recriminations far and wide. Foreign governments that pay attention to security at foreign airports may not let this pass.

Edited May 29, 2013 by geriatrickid

[GrantSmith]

To have one guard fall asleep on the job may be considered unfortunate, to have two do so looks like carelessness.

Of course it could be that Wayne and Shane had been at the local amber nectar and being Aussies weren't used to strong beer.

Strong beer !! Are you serious ?? we're Aussies ! when we are born we're slapped on the arse and given a 'pint'

Aussie don't drink pints, a pot or a stubbie maybe but never a pint.

If you're from South Australia you drink Pints, unless you're a big girls blouse and drink pots and schooners...

Yes they do things a little different in SA...

[Buckeye21]

Not a bad country to escape too.

[IrishIvan]

Not a bad country to escape too.

He wouldnt be the first

[IrishIvan]

To have one guard fall asleep on the job may be considered unfortunate, to have two do so looks like carelessness.

 

Of course it could be that Wayne and Shane had been at the local amber nectar and being Aussies weren't used to strong beer.

Strong beer !! Are you serious ?? we're Aussies !  when we are born we're slapped on the arse and given a 'pint'  

Aussie don't drink pints, a pot or a stubbie maybe but never a pint.

If you're from South Australia you drink Pints, unless you're a big girls blouse and drink pots and schooners...

Yes they do things a little different in SA...

I drink pots because I dont like warm beer. Pint is an english term. Pots is unique to Australia

[attento]

Surely, the Thai Immigration Dept., and Police have a secure containment area at the airport, without unlocked exit doors to the outside world ?

If they dont have secure rooms, then they could have used some form of direct restraint during the detention period, e.g. 'handcuffs'

Remember though, Thai police were not informed of this vagrant being shifted through their shores!

They weren't informed because there was no requirement. The guy had served his prison sentence and was a free man. This was not an extradition but a deportation and the role of the civilian security staff was to ensure that he got to germany and they would still be in possession of his travel documents. Do the Thai authorities have to be informed of every single person transiting through the Kingdom who may have served a day or more in jail? There would be thousands every week.

The Aussie government are redfaced yes and stuffed up by using civilians for this task but this wouldn't of even made a story if there wasn't an election in a couple of months. The parties are in full election mode at the moment and looking for every piece of dirt. Serco (security company) were already under fire for losing 9 ilegal immigrants last week and this one was just thrown onto the fire.

Serco . . enough said

[dickyknee]

Aussie don't drink pints, a pot or a stubbie maybe but never a pint.

If you're from South Australia you drink Pints, unless you're a big girls blouse and drink pots and schooners...

Yes they do things a little different in SA...

I drink pots because I dont like warm beer. Pint is an english term. Pots is unique to Australia

except if you ask for a pot in most states of Australia, you'd get a "yor not from aroun ere ar'ya" same if you asked for a middy or a handle. I've also asked for a pint and been handed a schooner <deleted> SA blouses trying to pass small beers off as big ones.

or you could just go north across the border and order an NT stubby.

anyways, check the wiki for the correct terminology per state:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer_in_Australia#Beer_glasses

Edited May 29, 2013 by dickyknee

[SaintLouisBlues]

I thought having a criminal past was a prerequisite for migration to Australia. Why was he being deported?

[Buckeye21]

Not a bad country to escape too.

[chooka]

I thought having a criminal past was a prerequisite for migration to Australia. Why was he being deported?

because we're full.

[bigbamboo]

Perhaps a recap of the reported facts of the case will help clarify matters;

1. Mr. Kohl was being taken from Brisbane to Frankfurt via Bangkok on Thai Airways International flights.

2. The flight routing was as follows;

Thai Airways Intl TG474

Departure: 14:00 Brisbane, Australia

Arrival: 20:20 Bangkok, Thailand - Suvarnabhumi International

He was to connect to Thai Airways Intl TG920

Departure: 23:45 Bangkok, Thailand - Suvarnabhumi International

Arrival: 06:00 +1 day(s) Frankfurt, Germany - Frankfurt International

There is usually a transit and waiting period of 3 1/2 .

3. The flight was delayed because of "weather" and rescheduled for the next morning (reported as 08:00)

4. The prisoner and escorts then went to a transit lounge to wait for approx. 10 hours.

While there the prisoner exited the transit lounge by way of a fire exit.

There are 2 issues; 1- Did the Thai authorities know of the transfer. The Thais say no. However, the escorting agency would have been obliged to advise Thai Airways that it was escorting a criminal. This is an obligation and the group would have been noted on the passenger manifest. At the very least Thai Airways and its security department was aware of the passenger. It would have been expected that Thai Airways would have communicated with the Thai agency responsible for air security that it was carrying this passenger. It is also expected that TG would have arranged an expedited transfer as it would be unusual for an escorted criminal to mingle with the general public. The question needs to be asked if TG reported this passenger to the Thai authorities and if the expedited process was followed. If there was an expedited transfer, airport security would have known as the prisoner and escorts would have received priority screening at the checkpoint. (Edited to note Chooka has confirmed TG security was aware. Chooka also says that the prisoner was taken to transit hotel which is that awful Louis Tavern place.)

2. The prisoner escaped by a fire exit. These exits are supposed to be alarmed and there is supposed to be CCTV coverage of all exits to ensure that the premises are secure. Basically, the prisoner simply walked out the fire exit and made his way off the airport premises. What does this say about airport security? Surely, if an alarm sounded and there was surveillance and if there was a security presence at the airport, the escapee would have been seen and quickly detained. This did not happen. It is a serious breach of security at the airport and indicates that the airport is not a secure area.

Now, if I was a terrorist, this deficiency would be interesting. This aspect of the event alone is enough to raise a red flag. So far, no statement on this aspect of the case from the AOT, or the RTP. Something is very, very wrong at the airport and this will have recriminations far and wide. Foreign governments that pay attention to security at foreign airports may not let this pass.

GK seems to be the one in full possession of the facts.

Now maybe we should all retire to the TV drawing room where our very own Hercule will reveal the real culprits in this case.

[Scott]

According to the OP: ".....Carlo Konstantin Kohl, 25, was being extradited to Germany via Thailand..."

According to the article it was an extradition. I don't know that being extradited to one country and being deported from another are mutually exclusive.

[chooka]

According to the OP: ".....Carlo Konstantin Kohl, 25, was being extradited to Germany via Thailand..."

According to the article it was an extradition. I don't know that being extradited to one country and being deported from another are mutually exclusive.

immigration doesn't do extraditions and private civilians certainly do not do extradition escorts.

If a person is being extradited the country who requires him would send thier own law enforcement people. Alternatively Australian Federal Police can do it on thier behalf. 1st the application has to be granted by the courts then the judge will place the defendant into the care of say german police. If the Federal Police are going to do the extradition on behalf of germany then they are required to attend the german embassy where they will be made officers of the german court (Judicial System) for a specific period of time. This is required to take legal custody of the prisoner from the courts on germany's behalf. A security officer would not get custody because he is not part of either countries judicial system.

The Australian senate inquiry has confirmed it was a deportation and not an extradition as reported by Thai media. Lets say for the exercise it was an extradition, wouldn't the german authorities be jumping up and down and screaming from the heavens about thier prisoner being lost. German has said nothing as if they know nothing about it

[IrishIvan]

According to the OP:   ".....Carlo Konstantin Kohl, 25, was being extradited to Germany via Thailand..."  

 

According to the article it was an extradition.   I don't know that being extradited to one country and being deported from another are mutually exclusive.  

immigration doesn't do extraditions and private civilians certainly do not do extradition escorts. 

 

If a person is being extradited the country who requires him would send thier own law enforcement people.  Alternatively Australian Federal Police can do it on thier behalf.  1st the application has to be granted by the courts then the judge will place the defendant into the care of say german police.  If the Federal Police are going to do the extradition on behalf of germany then they are required to attend the german embassy where they will be made officers of the german court (Judicial System) for a specific period of time.  This is required to take legal custody of the prisoner from the courts on germany's behalf.  A security officer would not get custody because he is not part of either countries judicial system.

 

The Australian senate inquiry has confirmed it was a deportation and not an extradition as reported by Thai media.  Lets say for the exercise it was an extradition, wouldn't the german authorities be jumping up and down and screaming from the heavens about thier prisoner being lost.  German has said nothing as if they know nothing about it

He did his time and got deported. Simple. It wasnt ASIO agents getting him out of the country. Nor was it police. Numpty security guards stuffed up

[Scott]

I am not arguing the point, just posting what the OP said. If someone comes across a link about the actual circumstances, it might be a good idea to post it, just to clear things up.

He was wanted in Germany for jumping bail, I believe.

But again, deporting someone is not mutually exclusive if someone is being extradited--they can do both, most likely. Which country is going to do which probably depends on how badly one country wants him tossed out and how badly the other one wants him caught.

In this case, it seems that Thailand is the winner--they've got him now.

[Bikkii]

Well good on him!!!!

He hasn't killed anybody, shot anyone, stabbed anyone or raped anyone. Yet he has made three countries look the fool. They be Germany, Thailand and Australia. Go Bro, run your scene, enjoy your new life here in Thailand! Could be far worse places in the world to try and pick up????

[Bikkii]

Surely, the Thai Immigration Dept., and Police have a secure containment area at the airport, without unlocked exit doors to the outside world ?

If they dont have secure rooms, then they could have used some form of direct restraint during the detention period, e.g. 'handcuffs'

Remember though, Thai police were not informed of this vagrant being shifted through their shores!

They weren't informed because there was no requirement. The guy had served his prison sentence and was a free man. This was not an extradition but a deportation and the role of the civilian security staff was to ensure that he got to germany and they would still be in possession of his travel documents. Do the Thai authorities have to be informed of every single person transiting through the Kingdom who may have served a day or more in jail? There would be thousands every week.

The Aussie government are redfaced yes and stuffed up by using civilians for this task but this wouldn't of even made a story if there wasn't an election in a couple of months. The parties are in full election mode at the moment and looking for every piece of dirt. Serco (security company) were already under fire for losing 9 ilegal immigrants last week and this one was just thrown onto the fire.

So your whole spiel here agrees with everything my one sentence wrote???

Who gives a f@@k about an election, 3 countries f@@ked up. He is free !

As we know, we may be s@it at deporting people (Labour), God damn we are the strictest border if any clown wants to import anything illegal. Makes the States look like a kindegarden.