Foreigner Killed In Bangkok Bar Fight

[garyk]

My Thai girlfriend bought me a small and easily hidden razor cutter, the kind kids have in their stationary bags to cut paper. No explanation but she DID think I should always carry it. I don't but I might start. Perhaps the Libyan didn't realize that Thailand is such a dangerous place and he should have been armed himself.

2 weeks ago I was in a new coffee shop in the new gas station and chatting with an old guy. His family was with him. He asked if I speak Thai and I said that I speak a little. Then, out of the blue, he said, "you know people around here don't like foreigners." His daughter/granddaughter understood and turned bright red. My response was quite Asian, I nodded and said, "I see," and then excused myself and left.

I run into it allot also. I do not drink, and have never been in a bar here in Thailand. And have lived here for a few years. I love photography and travel extensively all over Thailand. It is amazing how many Thais really dislike foreigners. Many times when shooting with other Thais I am confronted or treated with disrespect. I personally am tired of it. I look at it as a no win for me. Better to leave than fight IMO.

Oddly enough it is with the upper crust I have problems with. Mostly from the big city's.

[deecee10]

Thought Phuket was 'the last resort'.

[AdamRich]

2 things I do not really understand .

1. Every time there is a fight Thai men use a gun, does that mean every Thai man has a gun?! And carries it around

2. Every time there is a fight Thai men shoot in front of witnesses. Does that mean every time man is so stupid to shoot someone in front of witnesses to end up in jail

No. It just means that those are the ones YOU hear about.

[user82374298374]

The only Thai men in Spicy are either ladyboys or mafia/police which in some cases is the same. There are no 'normal' Thai men in Spicy - EVER. It would als make a lot more sense that a mafia/police would have a gun.

Some Thai guys/pimps frequent Spicy with their (very obviously) girlfriends/prostitutes, and these men are neither ladyboys nor police officers - hair and tattoos alone would disqualify them, in many cases. On several occasions, I've seen the girls, who're dressed appropriately for their vocation, dancing alone provocatively on the dance floor, whilst their shady-looking Thai boyfriends/pimps sit at tables against the wall, mainly on the left-hand side of the club as one comes in and turns left to face the elevated dance floor.

My guess is that the Thai men are too macho/untalented to dance themselves, and since their girlfriends/prostitutes want to dance, the girls dance alone, mainly keeping eye contact with the Thai men. The girls/prostitutes seem to get a bit of a thrill out of making their pimps/boyfriends jealous when men pay attention to them on the dance floor.

This is a formula for trouble, as there are some foreign men who come to Thailand and believe that it's A-OK to simply grope any attractive women they see, without first engaging in dialogue in order to find out if the women in question are amenable. While these rude, ill-mannered louts originate from many different countries, a solid majority of them tend to be from countries with cultures in which women are viewed as little more than animate property - i.e., Middle Eastern countries, Latin American countries, and African countries (this is also a prominent feature of Asian culture, but my guess is that Asian men aren't generally allowed into Spicy, except for the aforementioned boyfriends/prostitutes, as I've never seen any non-Thai Asian males in the place, which is open until 6AM and is a late-night magnet destination after other nightclubs close).

While I've never seen an actual fight in Spicy, I've seen some unfriendly words and glares exchanged between parties as a result of antics such as those described above. It isn't at all hard to imagine a fight breaking out, and when the normal Thai gang-up tactics fail to work, one or more of the pimps/boyfriends having a gun and using it without a second thought.

Edited May 29, 2013 by disambiguated

[AdamRich]

"The gunman, now in police custody, is said to have told authorities that he drew the gun only as a last resort as it became obvious that he and his pals were about to lose the fight"

Poor guy. Got into a fight and couldn't win it so he had to shoot. Let him go.

Yep, typical Thai, if they don't gang up on you like a pack of dogs, they bring a knife

to a fist fight and a gun to a knife fight,

Sometimes it's smarter to be the one with the gun at the knife fight:

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhKIv6S5bn3641i6db

[ricku]

2 things I do not really understand .

1. Every time there is a fight Thai men use a gun, does that mean every Thai man has a gun?! And carries it around

2. Every time there is a fight Thai men shoot in front of witnesses. Does that mean every time man is so stupid to shoot someone in front of witnesses to end up in jail

1. A surprising number of Thai men have a loaded gun with them, especially when out for the evening.

2. They don't care all that much what happens to them.

Most of Thailands cities and towns people are armed. Whether it is a gun or some sort of knife. Word has it that a lot of the youth gangs are now armed with cheap guns.

Not just the men. Up here in Chiangmai go to most fireing ranges most days and you will see women traning to shoot a handgun. My sons good friend was shot in the head outside one these dance bars they have in Chiangmai by a gang of locals Thai teenagers. They were caught and turns out that it was an initiation to be allowed in the gang. It could have been my son that died that night. I guess my point is that for better or worse guns are a fact of life here.

Im very sad to hear that, but glad that the scumbags got caught!

[AdamRich]

One thing I dont understand : Why would anyone be in any bar , any club , where there are Thai males. Its common knowledge that they resent foreign males here. And especially in a club where they are drinking and there are Thai ladies.

Spicey is predominantly an after hours pick-up bar/disco for foreigners. I think your "common knowledge" is faulty.

I think your reading comprehension is faulty.: It may well be a pick up place for foreigners .But there was at least one Thai male in there. And my point is, that is one too many.

By your logic there should not be any discos in Thailand or at least one should not enter them. I have never been in a disco here that did not have a Thai male, whether patronizing the place or working. Maybe you meant to go to the other THAIland.

Edited May 29, 2013 by AdamRich

[oldsailor35]

"The gunman, now in police custody, is said to have told authorities that he drew the gun only as a last resort as it became obvious that he and his pals were about to lose the fight"

Poor guy. Got into a fight and couldn't win it so he had to shoot. Let him go.

Appears to be a typical male Thai reaction if they cannot muster a 10 to 1 ratio, pull out the gun !

[chrisinth]

My Thai girlfriend bought me a small and easily hidden razor cutter, the kind kids have in their stationary bags to cut paper. No explanation but she DID think I should always carry it. I don't but I might start. Perhaps the Libyan didn't realize that Thailand is such a dangerous place and he should have been armed himself.

2 weeks ago I was in a new coffee shop in the new gas station and chatting with an old guy. His family was with him. He asked if I speak Thai and I said that I speak a little. Then, out of the blue, he said, "you know people around here don't like foreigners." His daughter/granddaughter understood and turned bright red. My response was quite Asian, I nodded and said, "I see," and then excused myself and left.

The problem with the small and easily hidden razor cutter is that it doesn't compare well with a visible 2 foot long machete.

In other words, it will likely get you in more trouble than you would be in without it.

Pause for thought......................

[howzat]

I sometimes wonder why I stay reading how dangerous Thailand is. After 15 years haver never seen an inkling of a fight. Maybe am going to the wrong places and have the wrong sort of friends.

[Alwyn]

A tragic accident. The Arab was almost certainly lost and had stopped to ask directions. Everybody knows that Arabs do not frequent bars that serve alcohol and have scantily clad tarts everywhere.

>A Muslim in a bar.. a girly bar.. Nah can't be true. Unless of course he's like the millions of other hypocritical Muslims around the World. Maybe the Thai shooter had seen the news from the UK about the two folk from the religion of peace who hacked a young father to death and he was practicing good self-defence. Give him a few hundred thousand baht together with a big thank you and let him jog on.

First quote, I will say that was there even a mention that the guy was a muslim? Just because he is a Libyan national does not mean he is a muslim. There are Christians there and plenty of people who were born muslim but don't practice it... But the fact remains that there has been NO mention of his religious beliefs anywhere in this story. Ever been to Libya? I doubt it.

Second post is just a racist rant. I am from the UK and I am Christian, and I have an education and common sense not to blame all muslims for what a nutter did, who has been systematically radicalized by hateful people, much like yourself.

While I would love to see every radical muslim swinging from the branches of the nearest tree, I would never go around spouting hatred in public. For all you know, that dead guy might well have been a really decent chap. totally moderate to the point he will have a beer etc etc... Just like the rest of us. So why the hell are you so happy about this? Did you know him??

That's interesting you label my post as a racist rant. You obviously weren't listening when you went to school, if indeed you went school above the age of 5. A race relates to a race of people. Islam is not a race it's a religion you retard. People like you make me puke. You called the ''racist'' or ''fascist'' card when you read something you don't agree with. If the lad in Woolwich had been your son or friend, or if you had lost a family member to a savage attack, or bombing by these so called radicals - murderers are what I like to call them - you would probably be singing a different tune. Because I don't particularly like the middle age laws and spirit of Islam does not make me racist, it means I don't like the middle age laws or spirit of Islam. Sure there are nice Muslims, I lived and worked only with Muslims in Bangladesh for almost a year. I dislike the the fact that the so called decent Muslims stand by and do nothing except watch and speak empty words - a bit like the decent Germans did when Hitler was starting up.. Now THAT, was a rant.

Back to the guy in question.. I did not know him. But based on the fact he was in a girly bar getting into fights with Thais I'm probably taking a wild guess.. but my gut feeling is he wasn't a decent Muslim. Good riddance to him.

[oldsailor35]

One thing I dont understand : Why would anyone be in any bar , any club , where there are Thai males. Its common knowledge that they resent foreign males here. And especially in a club where they are drinking and there are Thai ladies.

Spicey is predominantly an after hours pick-up bar/disco for foreigners. I think your "common knowledge" is faulty.

I think your reading comprehension is faulty.: It may well be a pick up place for foreigners .But there was at least one Thai male in there. And my point is, that is one too many.

So you think foreigners should avoid all bars and discos in Thailand as there will be Thai males in all of them? If you came to Thailand you would find that most Thai males are perfectly decent people, even those that frequent or work in bars.

Then why is it that any time i have a traffic scare and want to berate the Thai driver, my Thai partner says no! no! no! forget it. Thai man carry gun, he might shoot you ?

[AdamRich]

2 things I do not really understand .

1. Every time there is a fight Thai men use a gun, does that mean every Thai man has a gun?! And carries it around

2. Every time there is a fight Thai men shoot in front of witnesses. Does that mean every time man is so stupid to shoot someone in front of witnesses to end up in jail

1. A surprising number of Thai men have a loaded gun with them, especially when out for the evening.

2. They don't care all that much what happens to them.

all true. I have seen a few guns pulled by Thais. Never seen them fire one. and have a few Thai friends - one is a very successful architect, sweetheart of a person, gentleman. he owns a gun.

The bad guys have them, so why shouldn't the good guys?

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshh2V6G9mTJ3J3f2viU

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhDZY5nKr7lRaLbGxz

[supashot]

"he drew the gun only as a last resort as it became obvious that he and his pals were about to lose the fight" Thai style?

Alcohol and guns= redneck combo

[oldsailor35]

Ah, yes, just one more reason I'm glad that about 20 years ago I stopped drinking and going to bars.

Good idea, fink i might consider doing that..........one day

[simple1]

A Muslim in a bar.. a girly bar.. Nah can't be true. Unless of course he's like the millions of other hypocritical Muslims around the World. Maybe the Thai shooter had seen the news from the UK about the two folk from the religion of peace who hacked a young father to death and he was practicing good self-defence. Give him a few hundred thousand baht together with a big thank you and let him jog on.

You congratulate a murder by a Thai in a bar, just because he is a Muslim? You're a sick individual

Obviously your culture has never heard of the term "sarcasm".

You did read the post? "Give him a few hundred thousand baht together with a big thank you and let him jog" on is sarcasm? Take a look at post#73 as the guy said "my gut feeling is he wasn't a decent Muslim. Good riddance to him". So without any knowledge of the individual is pleased that he was murdered. What a decent man he is...

Edited May 29, 2013 by simple1

[ricku]

For the second time, I tell you foreigners: arm yourself! Get as many weapons as you can so when you get these crazy <deleted> without education and judgement who wants to deliver a fatal blow because they are losing, you will be able to defend yourself. Guns, knuckles and paralyzing gaz are a need in this far West country.

Problem is that weapons are illegal to farangs.

[AdamRich]

My Thai girlfriend bought me a small and easily hidden razor cutter, the kind kids have in their stationary bags to cut paper. No explanation but she DID think I should always carry it. I don't but I might start. Perhaps the Libyan didn't realize that Thailand is such a dangerous place and he should have been armed himself.

2 weeks ago I was in a new coffee shop in the new gas station and chatting with an old guy. His family was with him. He asked if I speak Thai and I said that I speak a little. Then, out of the blue, he said, "you know people around here don't like foreigners." His daughter/granddaughter understood and turned bright red. My response was quite Asian, I nodded and said, "I see," and then excused myself and left.

I run into it allot also. I do not drink, and have never been in a bar here in Thailand. And have lived here for a few years. I love photography and travel extensively all over Thailand. It is amazing how many Thais really dislike foreigners. Many times when shooting with other Thais I am confronted or treated with disrespect. I personally am tired of it. I look at it as a no win for me. Better to leave than fight IMO.

There is good reason for that. History teaches that two of the most undesirable things have come in the wake of farang: Imperialism and Ethnocentrism. Any guess why Thailand did not succumb?

[Angeledge777]

For the second time, I tell you foreigners: arm yourself! Get as many weapons as you can so when you get these crazy <deleted> without education and judgement who wants to deliver a fatal blow because they are losing, you will be able to defend yourself. Guns, knuckles and paralyzing gaz are a need in this far West country.

Problem is that weapons are illegal to farangs.

Weapons are legal. Guns are quite complicated to get but it is possible to get one legally as a farang.

[Alwyn]

A Muslim in a bar.. a girly bar.. Nah can't be true. Unless of course he's like the millions of other hypocritical Muslims around the World. Maybe the Thai shooter had seen the news from the UK about the two folk from the religion of peace who hacked a young father to death and he was practicing good self-defence. Give him a few hundred thousand baht together with a big thank you and let him jog on.

here we go again...... banal comments regarding religion. Just because somebody is born in a 'muslim country' does not necessarily mean they are a practicing muslim..... shall we take the conversation further and talk about all the Christian hypocrites. the same Christian soldiers that dropped nuclear bombs and napalm........religion was hijacked by the politicians a long time ago...

Take the conversation one step further and how about all religious hypocrites. But I think you're wrong, religion was not hijacked by governments but governments are being hijacked by Islam. It might all banal to you but it probably isn't banal to drummer Lee Rigby's wife, son and family. Probably not banal to the families of the 7000 plus people's families in the south of Thailand that have been murdered by Muslims - oh sorry I don't want to generalise, so ''radical Muslims'' - in the last 5 years or so. I understand there are good and bad people. There must be good people in Islam right.. So why do they not step up to the mark and do something about the ''radical Muslims'' within their religion.

[oldsailor35]

Muslim = A person who peacefully follows a certain religion.

Muslimism = Practice of radical muslims who are usually incited to terrorism by radical muslim cleric.

Edited May 29, 2013 by oldsailor35

[Globeman]

2 things I do not really understand .

1. Every time there is a fight Thai men use a gun, does that mean every Thai man has a gun?! And carries it around

2. Every time there is a fight Thai men shoot in front of witnesses. Does that mean every time man is so stupid to shoot someone in front of witnesses to end up in jail

Yes and yes.

Yes and No - if you are Chalerm Yubamrung's darling son.

[Alwyn]

A Muslim in a bar.. a girly bar.. Nah can't be true. Unless of course he's like the millions of other hypocritical Muslims around the World. Maybe the Thai shooter had seen the news from the UK about the two folk from the religion of peace who hacked a young father to death and he was practicing good self-defence. Give him a few hundred thousand baht together with a big thank you and let him jog on.

You congratulate a murder by a Thai in a bar, just because he is a Muslim? You're a sick individual

Obviously your culture has never heard of the term "sarcasm".

You did read the post? "Give him a few hundred thousand baht together with a big thank you and let him jog" on is sarcasm? Take a look at post#73 as the guy said "my gut feeling is he wasn't a decent Muslim. Good riddance to him". So without any knowledge of the individual is pleased that he was murdered. What a decent man he is...

''great death'' you say.. must be a Freudian slip.. Not pleased the guy was murdered, just don't really care. If someone frequents places like that and gets into fights with Thais then what do I care. But what does amuse me is people like you taking offence to my post which was a bit of banter to begin with. I've lived here for 12 years and never even had an argument with a Thai.. Nor a Farang either come to that. Why.. Because I understand that I'm a foreigner in a foreign country and would not disrespect the country I'm living in nor the people, so when I see something like this, I think to myself, he probably was a wrong 'un if he's getting into fights with locals in a local bar.

[simple1]

A tragic accident. The Arab was almost certainly lost and had stopped to ask directions. Everybody knows that Arabs do not frequent bars that serve alcohol and have scantily clad tarts everywhere.

>A Muslim in a bar.. a girly bar.. Nah can't be true. Unless of course he's like the millions of other hypocritical Muslims around the World. Maybe the Thai shooter had seen the news from the UK about the two folk from the religion of peace who hacked a young father to death and he was practicing good self-defence. Give him a few hundred thousand baht together with a big thank you and let him j

og on.

First quote, I will say that was there even a mention that the guy was a muslim? Just because he is a Libyan national does not mean he is a muslim. There are Christians there and plenty of people who were born muslim but don't practice it... But the fact remains that there has been NO mention of his religious beliefs anywhere in this story. Ever been to Libya? I doubt it.

Second post is just a racist rant. I am from the UK and I am Christian, and I have an education and common sense not to blame all muslims for what a nutter did, who has been systematically radicalized by hateful people, much like yourself.

While I would love to see every radical muslim swinging from the branches of the nearest tree, I would never go around spouting hatred in public. For all you know, that dead guy might well have been a really decent chap. totally moderate to the point he will have a beer etc etc... Just like the rest of us. So why the hell are you so happy about this? Did you know him??

That's interesting you label my post as a racist rant. You obviously weren't listening when you went to school, if indeed you went school above the age of 5. A race relates to a race of people. Islam is not a race it's a religion you retard. People like you make me puke. You called the ''racist'' or ''fascist'' card when you read something you don't agree with. If the lad in Woolwich had been your son or friend, or if you had lost a family member to a savage attack, or bombing by these so called radicals - murderers are what I like to call them - you would probably be singing a different tune. Because I don't particularly like the middle age laws and spirit of Islam does not make me racist, it means I don't like the middle age laws or spirit of Islam. Sure there are nice Muslims, I lived and worked only with Muslims in Bangladesh for almost a year. I dislike the the fact that the so called decent Muslims stand by and do nothing except watch and speak empty words - a bit like the decent Germans did when Hitler was starting up.. Now THAT, was a rant.

Back to the guy in question.. I did not know him. But based on the fact he was in a girly bar getting into fights with Thais I'm probably taking a wild guess.. but my gut feeling is he wasn't a decent Muslim. Good riddance to him.

With your last sentence, would you use the same words for a Christian or Buddhist? You are using the same justification as a radical Islamist.

[ricku]

Muslim = A person who peacefully follows a certain religion.

Muslimism = Practice of radical muslims who are usually incited to terrorism by radical muslim cleric.

It's called "islamism" actually.

But oh well, it is all the same shit. Adults who think there is an invisible man in the sky, and that the invisible man is the creator of everything.

Oh humans..

[MaxYakov]

2 things I do not really understand .

1. Every time there is a fight Thai men use a gun, does that mean every Thai man has a gun?! And carries it around

2. Every time there is a fight Thai men shoot in front of witnesses. Does that mean every time man is so stupid to shoot someone in front of witnesses to end up in jail

1. A surprising number of Thai men have a loaded gun with them, especially when out for the evening.

2. They don't care all that much what happens to them.

If 2.) is true, then why is 1.) also true? I'm sure we get your point, but I'd still like to see a source for 1.). It probably depends on the Thai man and the venue.

[Thai at Heart]

A few months ago I was introduced to a Thai bloke and we and his family became friends. The odd beer on a Sunday etc etc. He was an articulate, smart, very calm, nice bloke. Then one afternoon after more than a few Leo's he produced from his baggyish jeans and backpack (he rides a bike, 3 were in the backpack) 4 pistols and regaled us at the table with them. All were licensed.

To say I was shocked was a bit of an understatement, and when asked why, he claimed he needed them for "protection". He didn't say from who he needed protection. Never underestimate the fact that many Thai's are carrying guns on them or in their vehicles.

[MaxYakov]

For the second time, I tell you foreigners: arm yourself! Get as many weapons as you can so when you get these crazy <deleted> without education and judgement who wants to deliver a fatal blow because they are losing, you will be able to defend yourself. Guns, knuckles and paralyzing gaz are a need in this far West country.

Problem is that weapons are illegal to farangs.

Weapons are legal. Guns are quite complicated to get but it is possible to get one legally as a farang.

For those of you considering loading and locking for real (legally or illegally) in Thailand (and possibly don't know how to use Google) there is this article, for starters, from the Thailand Law Forum:

http://www.thailawforum.com/database1/thailand-gun-law.html

Edited May 29, 2013 by MaxYakov

[biplanebluey]

"The gunman, now in police custody, is said to have told authorities that he drew the gun only as a last resort as it became obvious that he and his pals were about to lose the fight"

Poor guy. Got into a fight and couldn't win it so he had to shoot. Let him go.

Yup don't get into fights with Thais, you can't win.

They will either gang up or pulling knifes/guns or whatever they can find.

Better loose face and walk away and live another day.

As Kenny Rogers would put it I promised you pa I wouldn't do the things you done

I\d walk away from trouble if I can

But sometimes ya gotta fight to be a man Don't really agree with this though!!

[HarryMilton]

2 things I do not really understand .

1. Every time there is a fight Thai men use a gun, does that mean every Thai man has a gun?! And carries it around

2. Every time there is a fight Thai men shoot in front of witnesses. Does that mean every time man is so stupid to shoot someone in front of witnesses to end up in jail

Let's try to help you:-

1. Guns are not used every time Thai men fight. That is your exaggeration.

2. Thai men do not shoot in front of witnesses every time there is a fight because guns are not used every time Thai men fight.