Just How Restrictive Is It To Work In Thailand?

[globin]

As you can tell from the reply from the Phuket Provincial Employment, pretty restrictive....................

Try doing the same thing in Australia, it is ugly restrictive, even before you make any money the tax department will come along with a provisional number to pay

[Jasun]

Paint naked to music and you might be able to get a temporary WP as a performing artist.

[jamhar]

Can a foreigner just turn up and work legally for themselves without registering a company in your own country ?

just TRY to get a work permit in the US. Hell we don't even want to give out travel visas!

I'm just glad there's a work around for people that are really interested in working in TL.

And to be honest, TL could use an infusion of professionals to jump start its work base.

It will take time to develop the indigenous professional working class in TL.

The system in TL is much more workable than in the one in the US.

(and that's the way I like it)

just my 2 cents.

[Torrens54]

Very restrictive in terms of the salary you will earn! The average salary seems to be about 20 times lower than Norway, but unless you eat cheap Thai street food and live in a Thai-style basic room without air con or kitchen, your costs will definitely not be 20 times lower. My costs in Thailand are about the same as in Europe, because I like to eat Western food regularly, dine in nice restaurants and live in a swanky apartment.

Even so, I have chosen to live in Thailand with my wife and our daughter. I go along with the laws of my host country as I would expect Thais to abide by the laws of my home country (Australia) if they live there. Pretty simple, do it the Legal way in Thailand and if you don't, then just GO HOME!!! No one is forcing any of us to stay here.

[Robert2006]

Albert Einstein was a German immigrant to the USA. Nicolai Tesla came to the USA an immigrant from Serbia; at the end of his life he had over 700 patients. He
created so much business for the USA that his economic impact cannot be calculated and what he created still today drives the US economic activity long
after his death.

It’s a good thing he didn’t decide to immigrate to Thailand; the world could have lost so much. How many of these resourcefull types of non-nationals exist in Thailand unable to utilize their creativity, pursue implementing an idea or use their skills because of challenging Thai labor laws.

Open a business and only own 49%? Why would any talented motivated businessperson what to work in that type of environment. The ability to create a business quickly and operate without obstruction is what drives an economy to economic success. I don’t claim to understand everything but I think here is one of the reasons Thailand is and will likely stay a third world economy.

[winstonc]

try another couyntry my friend,,,youl get grassed up sooner or later,,,

[Soutpeel]

Couldn't the foreigner just get employment, working for a Thai doing a similar business? Guess there's always a hole in the fence, called Thailand.-

As long as the Thai employs five other Thais and is willing to go through the whole work permit procedure - yes! They don;t even bother doing that for a lot of the foreign teachers here and they need them a lot!

You need to employ 5 Thai's ?...since when, a new law nobody knows about ?....its 4 if you not married to a thai national and two if you are...

[Soutpeel]

just TRY to get a work permit in the US. Hell we don't even want to give out travel visas!

The system in TL is much more workable than in the one in the US.

(and that's the way I like it)

I have had one, and it takes a lot time a lot of running around and plenty of money to get it approved but your right in a lot of respects the Thai WP system is a lot easier, and cheaper than the US one...but at least with the US one, you dont have to do 90 day reports, annual renewal and your done for the year.

[sirchai]

Yes, you need to have a work permit. Whether your work is full time,

part time, paid, or unpaid, you need a work permit to do it.

Even if you want to exhibit your paintings in a gallery without selling them, you need a work permit.

Talk about a repressive, xenophobic society. The fact that one can not even do something for FREE in Thailand without a work permit shows you just how much they really hate foreigners. You can spin it anyway you want if it helps you sleep at night, but not allowing someone to do something they love (a hobby) for free is repressive and stems from pure hatred and fear that you may do it better than they can.

I remember reading that immigration in Phuket arrested some volunteers who came to help during the tsunami because they didn't have work permits to help in that time of desperate need. That is both unbelievable and shameful.

A great post! I've met my wife in Takua Pa and we used to live in Baan naam Khem. We were lucky and moved to Isaan three weeks before the Tsunami hit the Andaman sea and saw all on TV.......will never forget it.

They even tried to arrest some German guys from the BKA ( similar to the FBI) who were forensic experts.I couldn't believe that they weren't able to continue their professional work, as Thai authorities had told them that Thailand would have enough forensic experts. Even the 10 million Euros first Aid didn't help.The rich got richer, none of the cash arrived for the victims.

Shame on them, as you couldn't even tell if it was a Caucasian, Thai, or African body. The BKA came with all their high tech equipment , just to get such a weird story. Freaking loosing face?-

Edited June 4, 2013 by sirchai

[sirchai]

just TRY to get a work permit in the US. Hell we don't even want to give out travel visas!

The system in TL is much more workable than in the one in the US.

(and that's the way I like it)

I have had one, and it takes a lot time a lot of running around and plenty of money to get it approved but your right in a lot of respects the Thai WP system is a lot easier, and cheaper than the US one...but at least with the US one, you dont have to do 90 day reports, annual renewal and your done for the year.

Plus the opportunity to get American citizenship.....-

[Loptr]

Even if you want to exhibit your paintings in a gallery without selling them, you need a work permit.

How ignorant can a government be? Never mind, it was a rhetorical statement.

Thailand will have to ease the work regulations if they want to continue their growth. With less than 1% unemployment (official) and not enough (willing) people to fill positions, the ASEAN agreement is blow the employment regulations out of the water.

[hellodolly]

It is just my opinion but this is one of the cases where Immigration oversteps common sense. If indeed it is just a hobby.

The need to do volunteer work also needing a work visa is ridicules. Here in Chiang Mai we have a Wat where you can go into a nice little area and talk to the monks about any thing. Part of their reason they make them selves available to talk with is so they can improve their English.

Should you have a work permit to talk with them?

[pete66]

It is just my opinion but this is one of the cases where Immigration oversteps common sense. If indeed it is just a hobby.

The need to do volunteer work also needing a work visa is ridicules. Here in Chiang Mai we have a Wat where you can go into a nice little area and talk to the monks about any thing. Part of their reason they make them selves available to talk with is so they can improve their English.

Should you have a work permit to talk with them?

The OP specifically asked about selling his paintings. It doesn't matter what label you stick on it. If you are selling goods and services, you are working. You would need a permit / license in nearly all countries to do that. Imagine if a tourist turned up in a western country and started selling paintings. That would be illegal as well.

Of course talking to monks doesn't require a work permit. That isn't work.

But you are correct about one thing, if you do volunteer work you do officially need a work permit. Which is kind of crazy. But it comes from a culture where people are paid in lots of different ways than straight cash, so I understand what it is trying to prevent.

[Sirius1935]

I planted a few fruit trees today and I am in the process of restoring and old ox cart. I have been retired for eight years and I have never worked so hard in my life.

Must go, I'm rather busy.

[bigbamboo]

If Lionel Messi came to Thailand for a holiday and started showing kids some football tricks on the beach some Thai official would probably arrest him!

[NeverSure]

How many English teachers do I know who teach without a WP? Is it because the school has connections? How many Teachers don't have degrees, so they work as "teacher's assistants" and do all of the work without a permit because they are the only NES in the area?

Every one of them is subject to being deported or worse and some of them are married to Thais. Maybe someone else has heard of one being deported but I haven't. Maybe if one made the wrong enemy it could happen.

I don't think that most English teachers in Isaan have WP's. Maybe I'm just blind.

When I was in Isaan in April I saw farang bar and restaurant owners working. They served food, cooked, cleared tables and took the money. Especially they handled the money.

I guess some people are just risk takers by nature.

[retell]

How many English teachers do I know who teach without a WP? Is it because the school has connections? How many Teachers don't have degrees, so they work as "teacher's assistants" and do all of the work without a permit because they are the only NES in the area?

Every one of them is subject to being deported or worse and some of them are married to Thais. Maybe someone else has heard of one being deported but I haven't. Maybe if one made the wrong enemy it could happen.

I don't think that most English teachers in Isaan have WP's. Maybe I'm just blind.

When I was in Isaan in April I saw farang bar and restaurant owners working. They served food, cooked, cleared tables and took the money. Especially they handled the money.

I guess some people are just risk takers by nature.

and they all wear a t-shirt that says " i do not have a workpermit - and i do not care !

[belg]

when will they change those retarted rules that you cannot even own a majority of your own company? you are good for caughing up 2 million baht, pay salaries for 4 people, socials security where you see NO benifits of at all, tax, etc...

JUST NOT WORTH IT

[samran]

when will they change those retarted rules that you cannot even own a majority of your own company? you are good for caughing up 2 million baht, pay salaries for 4 people, socials security where you see NO benifits of at all, tax, etc...

JUST NOT WORTH IT

They have. FTA's with Australia for instance allow majority Australian ownership in a range of sectors. The long standing treaty of Amilty with the US goes further.

Most importantly, BOI sponsored companies can be fully foreign owned.

None of this is going to help you of course if you wanted to open a bar, internet store however. But that likely isn't going to bother policy makers.

[Time Traveller]

Can a foreigner just turn up and work legally for themselves without registering a company in your own country ?

just TRY to get a work permit in the US. Hell we don't even want to give out travel visas!

I'm just glad there's a work around for people that are really interested in working in TL.

And to be honest, TL could use an infusion of professionals to jump start its work base.

It will take time to develop the indigenous professional working class in TL.

The system in TL is much more workable than in the one in the US.

(and that's the way I like it)

just my 2 cents.

Well 2 cents is worthless. But for an opinion from someone that has actually received work permits in both Thailand and US, I can say the US is far easier, less fearful of the evil foreigners, and frankly the officials are more pleasant to deal with. Which probably explains why Thailand is not known for being a world leader in business or skilled workers.

Edited June 5, 2013 by Time Traveller

[Soutpeel]

just TRY to get a work permit in the US. Hell we don't even want to give out travel visas!

The system in TL is much more workable than in the one in the US.

(and that's the way I like it)

I have had one, and it takes a lot time a lot of running around and plenty of money to get it approved but your right in a lot of respects the Thai WP system is a lot easier, and cheaper than the US one...but at least with the US one, you dont have to do 90 day reports, annual renewal and your done for the year.

Plus the opportunity to get American citizenship.....-

Not for me not really intrested...already a dual national and dont need a 3rd PP......besides find the way the IRS work quite offensive and didnt want to endup in that tax system...

[bunnydrops]

I work on the farm without one, The Aw baw daw (sp) knows I do it, Its a small Moo Baan, and I live two doors down from their office. A friend of mine up near NongKai goes out with the village folk to fix the roads when the head man asks for volunteers . I guess its just about where you live and what you are doing. Because I also know someone that got nailed because he was seen changing the CD behind the counter at his wife's restaurant.

[Arkady]

I think the art exhibition example is a very poor one. I went to an exhibition where they were selling Rembrandt prints. Rembrandt might have been there in spirit but he wasn't there in person and certainly doesn't have a Thai work permit. You can't be prevented from painting in private any more than you need a work permit to play the guitar at home or to play golf with your friends. Working as a commercial artist at an ad agency would clearly be a different matter. Exhibiting the paintings yourself would clearly be work but most exhibitions are put on by gallery owners. Private sales of assets that don't amount to a business, e.g. selling your car, don't require a work permit. Regularly selling paintings to a gallery could be construed as a business but how would the Labour Ministry know whether the artist had painted the pictures in Thailand or elsewhere. Even if they were of Thai scenes they could have been painted from memory in another country. In that case the issue might be avoidance of import duty and/or conducting a trading business without a WP and non payment of income tax, rather than the act of painting without a WP.

Some of these answers given in the Phuket Gazette are rather flaky. For example look at the advise on applying for Thai nationality.

[Arkady]

I work on the farm without one, The Aw baw daw (sp) knows I do it, Its a small Moo Baan, and I live two doors down from their office. A friend of mine up near NongKai goes out with the village folk to fix the roads when the head man asks for volunteers . I guess its just about where you live and what you are doing. Because I also know someone that got nailed because he was seen changing the CD behind the counter at his wife's restaurant.

Even if you have a Thai company that meets the requirements and 4 Thai employees, you can't get a WP for working on a farm or fixing roads. Labouring is a restricted occupation under the Annex to the 1979 Working of Aliens Act and that annex is still in force, since no list of restricted occupations have ever been issued for the 2008 Act. These restrictions were originally issued long before 1979 to protect jobs from Chinese coolies who were considered more hard working and reliable than Thai workers. Who would have predicted that farangs would willingly be doing labouring jobs in Thailand decades later or that the Chinese would control all political power as well as own everything?

[TerryLH]

"...socials security where you see NO benifits of at all..."

That sounds like it's coming from a position of ignorance of what the benefits are.

Not surprising, really.

The health benefit alone is well worth it. And as you get older or start having health issues, it becomes even more so.

[Arkady]

"...socials security where you see NO benifits of at all..."

That sounds like it's coming from a position of ignorance of what the benefits are.

Not surprising, really.

The health benefit alone is well worth it. And as you get older or start having health issues, it becomes even more so.

Compared to the contributions the pension isn't bad either. Some one with 15 years contributions who earned 15k a month will get the current maximum of 6k a month and that includes foreigners who stay on in Thailand. The SSO will go bust as more and more pensions are claimed and the black holes in their investment portfolio are revealed. However, the government will be forced to bail it out as it has the gold card health care scheme.