An Education In Fear

[aTomsLife]

This post would seem destined for the Teaching in Thailand Forum, but I posted it here because I feel it's pertinent to Thai society in general. Is it not a result, after all, of Thailand's "Education System" that we find conditions here such as they are? Daily I witness students being trained, ahem,
I mean taught, to respect authority and the violence it can dish out, over critical thinking and lively discussion. I'm troubled to no end by this and just want to vent a bit.

A little background:

This is my third year in Thailand. The first year I taught at a technical college in Bangkok, and suffered many of the pitfalls of a new teacher. Ultimately, I placed the blame on myself, figuring any shortcomings were due to my inability to clearly explain the concepts I was

teaching. Consequently, the whole of last year I attended Thai language courses (6 hours a week in a class and 4 hours a week of private lessons -- 300 hours in total, and countless more hours of self-study). I can speak, read and write Thai at a basic, but communicable level. Furthermore, my BA is in English literature, and I have a genuine interest in the language. In other words, I'm as qualified as any to teach EFL here.

So it was thus with a fair amount of optimism I began teaching this semester at a government school in Central Thailand. After a month, however, I am sorely disappointed and am questioning my sanity for having ignored the accounts of those who tread this path before me.

The biggest failure, in my opinion, is the class sizes: 50-plus kids to a room, so that even if 75% of the students start out interested, I'm still stopping to reprimand a dozen others before I can get my initial points across. Occasionally things go smoothly and all is well. More often than not, though, a mob-mentality prevails among all but the very best students. At that point trying to teach feels like a waste of life.

Of course things are different when the teacher is Thai, because the student's don't want to get hit. They're taught to respect teachers, but given how little education seems to be valued here, I assume the "respect" they're taught is nothing more than an indoctrination to learning never to question authority, and for good reason to harbor a healthy fear of it as well.

I now see the students' behavior as a direct reflection of Thai values, or lack thereof. I find myself becoming jaded with the way of life here, even so far as to impact relations with my girlfriend.

It's too bad, because I love teaching and I really wanted to love Thailand. Now I am considering a return home to earn a M.Ed / teaching license

and then see where the wind blows me -- though it's doubtful it'll be back to Thailand.

Thailand may be advancing materially, but its education system is as undeveloped as possible, especially given the relative wealth here. Indeed, this place must truly be amazing -- as I see no other way of reconciling Thailand's economic success with the glaring indifference it demonstrates towards educating its society.

Perhaps this model always worked in the past, but in this age of information, it's only a matter of time before the have-nots evolve a perspective questioning why their kids can't get ahead in life. After this realization, maybe they'll use the same violence they were "educated" with to attempt to change things.

[Beetlejuice]

So what is wrong with teaching students to hold respect for authority? Far better than the free ultra permissive society back in my country, where respect is not held with any esteem and authority means nothing to them. In many cases there are youths who consider themselves above the law and can run riot. I would never want to return to that or want to see Thailand going in the same direction.

Perhaps your problems are, that you should be questioning your own teaching abilities and methods, rather than blaming your students, Thai society and the systems here.

If teaching is your only option for obtaining a living in Thailand, and you have become disgruntled with it, than possibly a return home for the purposes of gaining more teaching experience is a common sense course of action to take.

[aussiebebe]

I don't dispute that physical discipline is a fact of school life in Thailand, I just don't think you're aware of all the other things the Thai teachers are doing. Most of the kids jack around because they don't understand what you're saying and know you won't hit them, true, but you've got to remember that the Thai teachers are certified to teach, and you aren't.

You may have faced the same problems (even with smaller class sizes) back in your home country if you'd tried to teach without getting certified (not that you'd be allowed).

You should get certified to teach in your home country and learn classroom management and behavior management techniques. Then you can get a well paid job in an International school in Thailand with small class sizes.

[Kitsune]

Thank you ever so much I cannot agree more.

I am too frightened to see the money and power flowing into this country when the population is still so ignorant and perfect candidate to be a second China, an environmental, cultural, societal disaster in waiting

Edited June 4, 2013 by Kitsune

[aTomsLife]

So what is wrong with teaching students to hold respect for authority? Far better than the free ultra permissive society back in my country, where respect is not held with any esteem and authority means nothing to them. In many cases there are youths who consider themselves above the law and can run riot. I would never want to return to that or want to see Thailand going in the same direction.

Perhaps your problems are, that you should be questioning your own teaching abilities and methods, rather than blaming your students, Thai society and the systems here.

If teaching is your only option for obtaining a living in Thailand, and you have become disgruntled with it, than possibly a return home for the purposes of gaining more teaching experience is a common sense course of action to take.

Talk about a nonsequitur. I never said respect wasn't a good thing, and that respect for authority wasn't warranted. Stop bending my words to fit your perspective. I clearly stated that I don't believe their respect is genuine, it's based in fear, hence my title. Maybe you should return home and take some courses in reading comprehension.

I can indeed blame the majority of my students, because those who behave themselves follow my lessons just fine. I wrote that I can speak, read and write Thai. Thus I'm able to model what I'm teaching.

I shouldn't even respond to your comment about teaching being my only means to living in Thailand. Against my better judgement I will, and not make mention again of what I'm about to say. I have a passive income which exceeds my teaching salary; I didn't come here for the money. I quit a good job to come here, because I felt the call to teach -- as I said my major in school was English. I could easily reside here on a Student Visa, as I did last year (again, reading comprehension).

[aTomsLife]

I don't dispute that physical discipline is a fact of school life in Thailand, I just don't think you're aware of all the other things the Thai teachers are doing. Most of the kids jack around because they don't understand what you're saying and know you won't hit them, true, but you've got to remember that the Thai teachers are certified to teach, and you aren't.

You may have faced the same problems (even with smaller class sizes) back in your home country if you'd tried to teach without getting certified (not that you'd be allowed).

You should get certified to teach in your home country and learn classroom management and behavior management techniques. Then you can get a well paid job in an International school in Thailand with small class sizes.

The students understand me just fine, they just don't care.

True enough, the Thais are certified to teach. I wonder how many credits they earned in school for batton handling.

Edit: Moreover, the Thai teachers have textbooks to work with, whereas I must write my entire lesson out on the board, and then constantly ensure the students are diligently copying it. Some finish quickly, while others can't be bothered to start writing until 20 minutes into the class.

As for your points about getting certified at home I fully agree with. Of course I've room to grow, and I never claimed to be a perfect teacher; however I stand by my assertion that I'm qualified to teach basic grammar to those willing to learn. Frankly I disagree that I couldn't handle a group of 20 students, as I've done it before on many occasions my first year teaching. I taught at at technical college, and by that age the students are wise to the fact I have to pass them. By the end of the school year those with no interest in learning stopped coming and I'd have a group of 20 students. No behavioral problems, but back then I couldn't speak Thai, so there were other issues to deal with of course.

Edited June 4, 2013 by aTomsLife

[hookedondhamma]

I used to assist one of the the English teaching Thai teachers in Lopburi back in 2010; I never found the kids unruly but always found it a bit abnormal how they wouldn't be more active; the teacher told me they were just shy. Coming from a western country 'fun' was something not normally stressed in my school system. After getting rid of the glare and taking in a smile, things got a lot better. Then again, the class size was under 25 and I probably am way out of qual to suggest anything helpful to your situation.

I can say, though, if you know what you plan on pursuing in the future is something that is absolutely necessary, by all means take it up. You won't hear any 'if you don't like it then leave' crap from me - I think what you mentioned in your post could become even more magnified if you stay on the track you're currently on. it's great you can see the reality of how things are rather than how you would like them to be.

Good luck in whatever choice you make :-)

[aTomsLife]

I used to assist one of the the English teaching Thai teachers in Lopburi back in 2010; I never found the kids unruly but always found it a bit abnormal how they wouldn't be more active; the teacher told me they were just shy. Coming from a western country 'fun' was something not normally stressed in my school system. After getting rid of the glare and taking in a smile, things got a lot better. Then again, the class size was under 25 and I probably am way out of qual to suggest anything helpful to your situation.

I can say, though, if you know what you plan on pursuing in the future is something that is absolutely necessary, by all means take it up. You won't hear any 'if you don't like it then leave' crap from me - I think what you mentioned in your post could become even more magnified if you stay on the track you're currently on. it's great you can see the reality of how things are rather than how you would like them to be.

Good luck in whatever choice you make :-)

Thanks for the even keeled response. A class of 25 with a Thai teacher -- that sounds like a good gig, and directly addresses the two variables I discussed: class size and difference in attitude with a Thai present.

I know many of my students are shy; I'm not complaining about them. Often they're some of my favorite students to interact with: I ask them if I sound funny when I speak Thai. Then I ask them if they can understand me. "Isn't that what's important?", I ask. I usually get a nod and increased participation. It feels good when that happens.

It's the ones who aren't shy and, conversely, don't seem to have any shame at all I've a problem with.

[simon43]

Being able to teach English grammar does not make you a teacher...

You need training and hands-on experience in classroom management, lesson planning etc etc etc. I am glad that you are considering returning to your home country to obtain a teaching licence and post-graduate educational degree.

In some of my primary classes in Myanmar, I was teaching more than 100 kids, aged from about 4 years - 12 years old. Being able to successfully manage a class of that size, and actually teach the kids the subject matter was possible because of my previous experience and academic training.

Simon

Edited June 4, 2013 by simon43

[Beetlejuice]

So what is wrong with teaching students to hold respect for authority? Far better than the free ultra permissive society back in my country, where respect is not held with any esteem and authority means nothing to them. In many cases there are youths who consider themselves above the law and can run riot. I would never want to return to that or want to see Thailand going in the same direction.

Perhaps your problems are, that you should be questioning your own teaching abilities and methods, rather than blaming your students, Thai society and the systems here.

If teaching is your only option for obtaining a living in Thailand, and you have become disgruntled with it, than possibly a return home for the purposes of gaining more teaching experience is a common sense course of action to take.

Talk about a nonsequitur. I never said respect wasn't a good thing, and that respect for authority wasn't warranted. Stop bending my words to fit your perspective. I clearly stated that I don't believe their respect is genuine, it's based in fear, hence my title. Maybe you should return home and take some courses in reading comprehension.

I can indeed blame the majority of my students, because those who behave themselves follow my lessons just fine. I wrote that I can speak, read and write Thai. Thus I'm able to model what I'm teaching.

I shouldn't even respond to your comment about teaching being my only means to living in Thailand. Against my better judgement I will, and not make mention again of what I'm about to say. I have a passive income which exceeds my teaching salary; I didn't come here for the money. I quit a good job to come here, because I felt the call to teach -- as I said my major in school was English. I could easily reside here on a Student Visa, as I did last year (again, reading comprehension).

I don`t think you are getting the point here.

All forms of persuading people to show veneration for authority is based on fear to some degrees and I’m not talking about the physical aspects. Even religion is based on fear, do as I say or God will punish you, the moral being; is getting the message across, that I am a really nice guy but there could be consequences for those who get on the wrong side of me, sort of approach to teaching.

Teaching in ways that can be pleasurable, holding the interest and showing the authoritative side is all part of the art of teaching. There is much more to the teaching profession than just standing in front of the class pointing to a blackboard or reading from a book and expecting the students to fall nicely in tow with your methods.

There are always going to be the disruptive and disorderly students within the class who will continually try to test your patience, this pertains worldwide and is not exclusive to Thai students. The trick is that you have to gain their admiration, something like a sergeant major in the army.

Sorry, but I do not have any other ways of explaining this or what you would prefer to hear?

[arthurwait]

As above you get disrespectful students in every country, but I agree with what you are saying while I'm not a teacher , but in society in general here.

Education is valued very highly by many here and they are the people who get on in life. You soon learn the real reasons why some people get on in life here and others don't. When economic immigrants take over a country you can't fail to realise who has the respect for education and work and who doesn't. Yes I'm using a very wide brush there.

I suppose when you are a pupil in a government school your future options are very limited anyway. Many will think why bother or have never been taught any different by an absent or present alky father.

I don't want to tar all Thais with the same brush , far from it, but it seems a lot of people are only taught to consider themselves , their family and their friends and treat any sons or brothers like princes.

Just as any country young lads will try and act the tough guy, but here it will be to show how 'ard they are against the farang especially amongst the lower class.

With the above two points you will never get any respect from many as a farang in a government school.

Change to a middle class or upper class school and you may find a completly different level of respect for you.

As for the discipline, aggression does seem the only language to stop many of the **** takers here. Of course you then risk those losers losing face. Again no different to the morons back home.

[metisdead]

An off topic post and reply has been removed.

Another post has been removed as the reply was made within the quoted post, do not alter a quoted post by replying within the quoted post.

30) Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes, added emoticons, or altered wording.

[aTomsLife]

So what is wrong with teaching students to hold respect for authority? Far better than the free ultra permissive society back in my country, where respect is not held with any esteem and authority means nothing to them. In many cases there are youths who consider themselves above the law and can run riot. I would never want to return to that or want to see Thailand going in the same direction.

Perhaps your problems are, that you should be questioning your own teaching abilities and methods, rather than blaming your students, Thai society and the systems here.

If teaching is your only option for obtaining a living in Thailand, and you have become disgruntled with it, than possibly a return home for the purposes of gaining more teaching experience is a common sense course of action to take.

Talk about a nonsequitur. I never said respect wasn't a good thing, and that respect for authority wasn't warranted. Stop bending my words to fit your perspective. I clearly stated that I don't believe their respect is genuine, it's based in fear, hence my title. Maybe you should return home and take some courses in reading comprehension.

I can indeed blame the majority of my students, because those who behave themselves follow my lessons just fine. I wrote that I can speak, read and write Thai. Thus I'm able to model what I'm teaching.

I shouldn't even respond to your comment about teaching being my only means to living in Thailand. Against my better judgement I will, and not make mention again of what I'm about to say. I have a passive income which exceeds my teaching salary; I didn't come here for the money. I quit a good job to come here, because I felt the call to teach -- as I said my major in school was English. I could easily reside here on a Student Visa, as I did last year (again, reading comprehension).

I don`t think you are getting the point here.

All forms of persuading people to show veneration for authority is based on fear to some degrees and I’m not talking about the physical aspects. Even religion is based on fear, do as I say or God will punish you, the moral being; is getting the message across, that I am a really nice guy but there could be consequences for those who get on the wrong side of me, sort of approach to teaching.

Teaching in ways that can be pleasurable, holding the interest and showing the authoritative side is all part of the art of teaching. There is much more to the teaching profession than just standing in front of the class pointing to a blackboard or reading from a book and expecting the students to fall nicely in tow with your methods.

There are always going to be the disruptive and disorderly students within the class who will continually try to test your patience, this pertains worldwide and is not exclusive to Thai students. The trick is that you have to gain their admiration, something like a sergeant major in the army.

Sorry, but I do not have any other ways of explaining this or what you would prefer to hear?

I understand your point, but I am talking about the physical aspects.

Your other points are fair enough. I hope to master the art of teaching one day. If I came off as a know-it-all in the meantime, I apologize.

And for the record, I don't "prefer" to hear anything. I just don't want my words twisted. Cheers.

Edited June 4, 2013 by aTomsLife

[aTomsLife]

I'd still like to hear opinions about the topic. Many have attempted to make this thread about me personally, but I didn't post asking what people's opinions are regarding what my abilities might be.

This post concerns the role violence plays in the classrooms of Thai government schools, which is an indisputable fact. I believe this violence perpetuates many negative attitudes, mainly apathy towards corruption and other blatant abuses of power, for fear of stepping out of ones place and being punished accordingly.

I also mention in my last sentence that it would be no small irony if this same violent behavior, having been absorbed, festers long enough among the masses and comes back to haunt those who would look to maintain the status quo.

[benalibina]

This teacher comes across as a guy sincerely tries to do his utmost in the classroom. The point he made about fear is apparant in the whole of thai society and does start on a way at the schools. Everybody who has kids at thai schools is on 1 way or the other surprised by the way how it goes. Obedyence and road learning is more important than critical thinking and questioning. The parents trust the schools to teach the children on manners, politeness and learning. As a big part does not have the knowledge or interest to correct and teach their own kids, it will not change quickly in the average thai school.

You will get there though because of your desire to learn and your passion.

Chok dee !!

[Phronesis]

Why are you trying to teach well. If you show up drunk to every class and fail in every other way imaginable, you will be treated the same by the Thai education system. Just stay out late partying and barfining and to hell with doing a good job. It seems that most of your anxiety is entirely self imposed.

Edited June 4, 2013 by Phronesis

[benalibina]

Why are you trying to teach well. If you show up drunk to every class and fail in every other way imaginable, you will be treated the same by the Thai education system. Just stay out late partying and barfining and to hell with doing a good job. It seems that most of your anxiety is entirely self imposed.

Silly reply.

[Beetlejuice]

I'd still like to hear opinions about the topic. Many have attempted to make this thread about me personally, but I didn't post asking what people's opinions are regarding what my abilities might be.

This post concerns the role violence plays in the classrooms of Thai government schools, which is an indisputable fact. I believe this violence perpetuates many negative attitudes, mainly apathy towards corruption and other blatant abuses of power, for fear of stepping out of ones place and being punished accordingly.

I also mention in my last sentence that it would be no small irony if this same violent behavior, having been absorbed, festers long enough among the masses and comes back to haunt those who would look to maintain the status quo.

Who`s fact? Yours?

You are making a statement here and not everyone will agree, including me. You are tarring all Thai students and the education system with the same brush. I have lived in Thailand for 30 years, all my kids went to school here and I can say that your judgement of Thailand`s education system is completely unfounded.

Just like schools anywhere else in the the world, the types of students and education standards can vary according to the schools and areas of location.

Why not just get on with the job or teach in another school?

[benalibina]

I'd still like to hear opinions about the topic. Many have attempted to make this thread about me personally, but I didn't post asking what people's opinions are regarding what my abilities might be. This post concerns the role violence plays in the classrooms of Thai government schools, which is an indisputable fact. I believe this violence perpetuates many negative attitudes, mainly apathy towards corruption and other blatant abuses of power, for fear of stepping out of ones place and being punished accordingly. I also mention in my last sentence that it would be no small irony if this same violent behavior, having been absorbed, festers long enough among the masses and comes back to haunt those who would look to maintain the status quo.

Who`s fact? Yours? You are making a statement here and not everyone will agree, including me. You are tarring all Thai students and the education system with the same brush. I have lived in Thailand for 30 years, all my kids went to school here and I can say that your judgement of Thailand`s education system is completely unfounded. Just like schools anywhere else in the the world, the types of students and education standards can vary according to the schools and areas of location.Why not just get on with the job or teach in another school?

You and your kids must have been lucky, or you ..........

[aTomsLife]

I'd still like to hear opinions about the topic.  Many have attempted to make this thread about me personally, but I didn't post asking what people's opinions are regarding what my abilities might be.  

 

This post concerns the role violence plays in the classrooms of Thai government schools, which is an indisputable fact.  I believe this violence perpetuates many negative attitudes, mainly apathy towards corruption and other blatant abuses of power, for fear of stepping out of ones place and being punished accordingly.  

 

I also mention in my last sentence that it would be no small irony if this same violent behavior, having been absorbed, festers long enough among the masses and comes back to haunt those who would look to maintain the status quo.   

Who`s fact? Yours?

 

You are making a statement here and not everyone will agree, including me. You are tarring all Thai students and the education system with the same brush. I have lived in Thailand for 30 years, all my kids went to school here and I can say that your judgement of Thailand`s education system is completely unfounded.

 

Just like schools anywhere else in the the world, the types of students and education standards can vary according to the schools and areas of location.

Why not just get on with the job or teach in another school?

Completely unfounded, huh? You must be trolling.

Corporal punishment exists in schools throughout Thailand. That you would argue otherwise is absurd, especially after living here 30 years. I can go online and find any number of videos of students getting threatened and/or hit.

If your children were spared this reality, that's great, but don't turn a blind eye to things as a whole because you and yours made out alright.

Sent from my GT-S5360B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Sigurris]

I noticed a couple of posts where it was mentioned that Thais are certified (trained) to teach. As far as I am aware the only qualification required in Thailand to teach is a Batchelors Degree. I am unaware of any teacher training college in the whole of the country. I may be wrong but, having taught for a year, this information was given to me on several ocassions by Thai teachers. I have also met 2 Thai teachers of English in Kanchanaburi who were unable to hold a conversation with me in English.

I have no advice to offer the OP other than move to a better school. If he gets a UK teachers certificate or MEd. he can work in a private school where things change enormously. My friend earns 135,000 baht pcm as a teacher plus benefits and teaches to classes of 15.

[chonabot]

I recently taught for a year at a Government High School( M3-M6) and found the class size rather challenging to say the least.

I tried many different methods and in the end I decided the best method was as follows:

• Split them into groups of 5 or 6
• Each group to choose a name and logo
• Make each lesson into a competition, whilst still following a specific teaching plan ( using the given material and integrating your own)
• At the end of each lesson there is a winning group
• Use handouts and whiteboard interaction
• Each group to make a presentation at the end of the lesson - this is for the points
• A small prize each month for the winning group
• Create a leaderboard and stick this on the wall, update each week - they love the visible aspect.

I had a lot of success for this and some of the students actually learned some English.

Regarding what Simon said about learning how to manage classrooms back in the Western World, I think that is a non-starter.

You have to adapt and see where you can use their strengths and weaknesses, a UK trained teacher would have just as much, if not more, difficulty in dealing with a 50 plus classroom. Not least because of the pre-conceived ideas and baggage.

Regarding the groups, I selected the members myself and made sure there was an even mix,

The Thai teachers were slightly interested in the method I used but couldn't really give a toss.

If you make it fun, they will be interested.

I also ran a talent competition for the second semester and each group performed an English Language song, it went really well until right at the end. After months and hundreds of performances we ended u with 7 really good little bands.

We asked to do a small show for the school, the Director said 'no'

I regarded this as part of the 'training' - dealing with arse holes ( Teachers not students)

The only limitation that I found was my own energy in that heat

Edited June 5, 2013 by chonabot

[sunlong]

Thais sincerely believe it is healthy for children to fear violence from their teachers and their parents, the old "spare the rod spoil the child". Like some have expressed here their whole definition of concepts like "respect" and "authority" are based on blind obedience, Skinnerian assumptions rather than recognition of virtue, talent, wisdom or integrity.

This is caused by and reflected by the other related beliefs in social hierarchy, the concept of a senior/higher-level person communicating with a junior/lower-level person as an equal, treating them as we consider every human deserves, is completely foreign, and no matter what the educated western-familiar Thais may give lip-service to sound good for westerners, deep inside they believe our ways are incorrect, to some extent even subversive or evil.

Changing such deep-seated cultural paradigms is very difficult, and of course could never be accepted coming from outsiders. would need to be supported by those at the top of the social hierarchy. Don't hold your breath. . .

Edited June 5, 2013 by sunlong

[aTomsLife]

The students are constantly hitting each other too, often quite hard; they've been taught it's acceptable behavior.

I accept it's a difference of culture; that's why at times I feel I'm at a loss trying to reason with them. My reasoning has little if any place in their world. That's also why going home to pursue a M.Ed wouldn't necessarily change my experience upon returning to teach here. Much of the western literature dealing with child psychology is grounded in Judeo-Christian ethics, even if the information itself seems secular.

One poster mentioned his training helped him instruct a class of a 100 students in Myanmar. I'm sure it did, but still... perhaps I'm mistaken, but after all they've been through there, I'm inclined to believe the students are eager to better themselves. The same is true in China; it's not uncommon to have a class of 100 students there, either. But even in the poorest schools, the students see the opportunity to study as a blessing.

Education is not nearly as valued in Thai society, I don't care what anyone says. So when trying to motivate 50 kids to sit down and pay attention long enough to compose a grammatically correct sentence, after awhile it just seems pointless. What they ultimately respect is someone who will intimidate them enough to get them to go through the motions of appearing to study. It's a waste of life, my own, especially when considering the world is ripe with students who'd love nothing more than to study English with an educated, native speaker.

Edited June 5, 2013 by aTomsLife

[benalibina]

I do not understand following; what is the reason that there are many foreign teachers working in thailand if i they almost want to keep things as it has been for many years ?

It should not be difficult to make a national program to push thai students to become english language teachers later on. That would save money and prevent foreign influences.

[aTomsLife]

I do not understand following; what is the reason that there are many foreign teachers working in thailand if i they almost want to keep things as it has been for many years ?

It should not be difficult to make a national program to push thai students to become english language teachers later on. That would save money and prevent foreign influences.

I think in theory Thais aren't opposed to having westerners in their schools, but in practice our cultures mixing in the workplace is like oil and water. That we have the audacity to advise our Thai supervisors -- who at best usually have but a pre-intermediate grasp of the language -- is often perceived as disrespectful and arrogant.

To bring it back on topic, it amuses me that foreigners are forbidden from disciplining the students (not that I'd ever raise my hand to a child). It's like they know it's wrong, but if they do it then it's acceptable. Perhaps, for better or worse, there is just no place in Thai society that allows for fear of, or learning from, western authority (even though they'd like to be on par with western societies economically).

Edited June 5, 2013 by aTomsLife

[sunlong]

Thais are very happy to have as many foreigners around as possible as long as they are properly respectful of Thai culture, which means putting up with all the working conditions that Thais willingly suffer, doing what they're told without argument, never making suggestions that would imply management aren't omniscient etc etc.

They're definitely not looking to improve their system, they want NES that will conform to it.

In many industries, or even private households, wealthy Thai employers are often proud of their "pet farang", trot them out to increase their status when needed. Just don't give them any lip or you're out on your ear. . .

Edited June 5, 2013 by sunlong

[benalibina]

Still it does not answer my question of - why do they not make a program to get qualified thai people to teach english at the schools ?

[sunlong]

Still it does not answer my question of - why do they not make a program to get qualified thai people to teach english at the schools ?

-

1 Those that run the system wouldn't be capable of creating such a program, don't have the ability to judge who's actually qualified and who isn't, and don't really care enough to bother trying anyway

2 It would cost a lot of money, so less available for making corrupt officials rich

3 Those in power don't want common people to have the ability to compete with their kids, who are sent to international schools and overseas

5 Doing so would be admitting that the current system doesn't work, cause powerful people to lose face

================

Edit - sorry, didn't see the *Thai people* part of it.

There simply aren't enough Thai people with the necessary English language skills, even if teaching qualifications were set aside. Put a thousand well-educated Thais in a room and ask those that have good English to raise their hands. Then give an objective standardized test of that language ability and look at the results.

They're trying to solve the problem by hiring Filipinos and Indians etc, willing to accept lower standards to keep costs down.

But most schools don't give students more than an hour or two a week with the foreign teacher anyway, with 50 kids in the classroom. They often teach more than a dozen subjects per week, so to rationalize things would require giving up a lot of the all-important "Thai culture" and religion classes, speeches and ceremonies and marching around drills etc that are considered all-important.

Edited June 5, 2013 by sunlong

[chonabot]

Still it does not answer my question of - why do they not make a program to get qualified thai people to teach english at the schools ?

Define 'Qualified'

There are many Thai teachers who majored and mastered in English.

I was asked to write more than a few MA theses ( plural) for these fine folk.

As far as they and the Thai Education system are concerned, they ARE qualified.

But boy do they suck ass at teaching/reading/writing/listening/speaking