Nsa Contractor Identifies Himself As Source

[F430murci]

Obama and the USA showing themselves to the world to be nothing more than a bunch mafia thugs,

First Hong Kong, Now Russia Refuses To Intervene On Snowden

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-24/first-hong-kong-now-russia-refuses-intervene-snowden

And you article states:

Hong Kong political analyst Johnny Lau said he believed that Chinese representatives “must have drained him in depth and exhausted him (for intelligence) before letting him go”.

I'd say this is pretty consistent with cutting him lose once his utility has expired. Why is it s difficult for some to see this for what it really is. He is not a patriotic hero just because you wish him to be, no matter how hard you wish him to be.

[Scott]

A post with an inflammatory statement has been deleted.

[F430murci]

Do you and JDGruen who said basically the same still believe this? Where is Snowden now? I guess he is still in that transit area Chuckd mentioned, but no one ever saw him in after he got into a car and sped off on the tarmac. Republic congressman from Texas just stated that the information Snowden is currently giving Russia and other governments are some of the most damaging acts espionage acts in our history. So you still believe Snowden is only exposing that patriotic stuff now . . .

do you really think he can give anything that wasn't known already? His action is to wake up the masses and bring awareness. Will that happen?

Otherwise the lame-stream-media wouldn't join in that bold. They have no way to cover that up in accordance with the mind control system now.

Apparently Russia did and so did China and also according to reports from everyone who would actually be in the know. You have nothing more than rank speculation or hope based on your preconceived notions. In other words your blinded by your prejudices.

[FDog]

Do you and JDGruen who said basically the same still believe this? Where is Snowden now? I guess he is still in that transit area Chuckd mentioned, but no one ever saw him in after he got into a car and sped off on the tarmac. Republic congressman from Texas just stated that the information Snowden is currently giving Russia and other governments are some of the most damaging acts espionage acts in our history. So you still believe Snowden is only exposing that patriotic stuff now . . .

do you really think he can give anything that wasn't known already? His action is to wake up the masses and bring awareness. Will that happen?

Otherwise the lame-stream-media wouldn't join in that bold. They have no way to cover that up in accordance with the mind control system now.

Apparently Russia did and so did China and also according to reports from everyone who would actually be in the know. You have nothing more than rank speculation or hope based on your preconceived notions. In other words your blinded by your prejudices.

And you aren't blinded by yours? Where is your proof he told them more info.

He could have sat down with them and told them exactly what they already knew, the same as he told the papers. So they decided he wasn't worth it and let him go on his merry way.

Edit: After everything that has happened I am more than surprised that people still believe what the US govt and their supporters spout without question. Some never learn.

Edited June 24, 2013 by FDog

[F430murci]

Do you and JDGruen who said basically the same still believe this? Where is Snowden now? I guess he is still in that transit area Chuckd mentioned, but no one ever saw him in after he got into a car and sped off on the tarmac. Republic congressman from Texas just stated that the information Snowden is currently giving Russia and other governments are some of the most damaging acts espionage acts in our history. So you still believe Snowden is only exposing that patriotic stuff now . . .

do you really think he can give anything that wasn't known already? His action is to wake up the masses and bring awareness. Will that happen?

Otherwise the lame-stream-media wouldn't join in that bold. They have no way to cover that up in accordance with the mind control system now.

Apparently Russia did and so did China and also according to reports from everyone who would actually be in the know. You have nothing more than rank speculation or hope based on your preconceived notions. In other words your blinded by your prejudices.

And you aren't blinded by yours? Where is your proof he told them more info.

He could have sat down with them and told them exactly what they already knew, the same as he told the papers. So they decided he wasn't worth it and let him go on his merry way.

Edit: After everything that has happened I am more than surprised that people still believe what the US govt and their supporters spout without question. Some never learn.

I am totally against eroding 4th and spoke out on that early in thread and blamed President.

How do I know? Common sense consistent with actions from a country like Russia and every single expert and person in the know saying so. The only naysayers seem to be people needing a hero and blinded by prejudice against Obama. This is much bigger than Obama.

[lannarebirth]

There is absolutely zero evidence nor reason to believe thusfar, based on his actions, that Snowden is sharing specific intelligence with foreign governments. What he is clearly doing is exposing unlawful (or at least unconstitutional) practices of his own government.

Common sense is a reason. In addition, other governments likely would not get involved without something to gain.

Not just me, I heard no less than 3 staunch Republicans on Fox this morning saying the same as well as NSA chief. I have a belief that those on capital hill know a lot more about what was taken and what is going on than you or I.

Other governments really haven't gotten involved though have they? Beyond exercising some arbitrary discretion at airport immigration services. Sure, they don't mind embarassing the US by exposing their hypocrisy, but that's hardly indicative of receiving secrets in exchange for asylum.

\

Do you and JDGruen who said basically the same still believe this? Where is Snowden now? I guess he is still in that transit area Chuckd mentioned, but no one ever saw him in after he got into a car and sped off on the tarmac. Republic congressman from Texas just stated that the information Snowden is currently giving Russia and other governments are some of the most damaging acts espionage acts in our history. So you still believe Snowden is only exposing that patriotic stuff now . . .

I don't like to speculate about things that have not revealed themselves, such as the speculation that is rife here that Snowden is disseminating specific intelligence to the governments of China and Russia. It is my opinion that both China and Russia probably aren't even asking for any and are very content to only embarass the US and thwart their extradition request, but obviously I don't know, same as you. Just a little diplomatic brinksmanship, not unlike how the US pressured Thailand in the Victor Bout case to thwart Russian goals.

As for what the republican congressman is saying I don't know. My first instinct is to believe he's a liar, same like the NSA and CIA directors who blatantly lied to Congress and the American people these past few weeks.

[FDog]

Quite ironic that the US govt has been jumping up and down about China cyber attacks on the US whilst all the time they were doing the exact same thing.

Quite a bit of egg to be wiped off faces.

[F430murci]

Okay, therein lies the problem. It's either the way you guys want it or everyone is lying. Cannot reason with that.

[lannarebirth]

Okay, therein lies the problem. It's either the way you guys want it or everyone is lying. Cannot reason with that.

You have noticed that everyone has lied SO FAR, right? The NSA director, the CIA director, the President. Until that happened I took people at their word, especially if they were testifying under oath. It's taken anywhere from hours to days to show these people were lying. Why aren't THEY being charged?

You didn't see me on here screaming about these agencies or this administration before that did you? Credibility is a finite thing. Once you squander it, it is damn hard to regain.

[JDGRUEN]

@F430murci ...

None of us have anything but speculation and conjecture - including you. You are only speculating on what Snowden is doing and you have no greater insight that I do.

I believe all that Snowden wants in a platform to release more information to the public - information damning to obama and how he has allowed or pushed the NSA, DOJ, FBI, CIA and the rest of the government to serve a MAN not the constitution - not the country - not the people. And I believe Snowden will release more information harmful to obama if he can remain at bay...

Who is the lying culprit here? In my book it is obama. Snowden broke the law and he will pay sometime down the road. But by his courage the nation and the world will learn the truth .... After all we are now finding that even the mindless robotic mostly leftist news media does not like to be spied upon. And they are recoiling. Liberals are joining ranks with Conservatives these days in the aftermath of the Snowden disclosures. Nobody likes to be spied on willy nilly. I wish for a hundred more Snowdens to come forth from every government department and expose the tyrant obama who sees himself on the road to being a dictator.

And No - it is not Bush's fault. No one twisted obama's arm to push or allow the NSA to exceed the provisions of the Patriot Act or ignore the FISA courts... Personally - I don't like my rights under the 4th. Amendment being stripped away. Other people can be a sheep and let the government erode their rights - but I won't stand for it.

You believe what you want... Nice thing about being an American (at least for now) we can speak freely, think freely, believe freely and act freely ... What a great nation we used to have BOT ... before obama the thug.

Edited June 24, 2013 by JDGRUEN

[wealth]

here comes another hammer

ROM JOSEPH FARAH'S G2 BULLETIN NSA HAS TOTAL ACCESS VIA MICROSOFT WINDOWS 'They can effectively compromise your entire operating system'

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2013/06/nsa-has-total-access-via-microsoft-windows/#xitMYXfBcc4h8bea.99

ADVAPI.DLL, NSAKEY ... confirmed!!! hmm, was downloading Linux already.

[JDGRUEN]

Pelosi Booed At Lib Conference For Saying Snowden 'Violated the Law'

House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi was booed by progressive activists at Netroots Nation Saturday for saying that leaker Edward Snowden broke the law...

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2013/06/23/Pelosi-Booed-For-Calling-Edward-Snowden-a-Criminal

[lannarebirth]

Okay, therein lies the problem. It's either the way you guys want it or everyone is lying. Cannot reason with that.

You have noticed that everyone has lied SO FAR, right? The NSA director, the CIA director, the President. Until that happened I took people at their word, especially if they were testifying under oath. It's taken anywhere from hours to days to show these people were lying. Why aren't THEY being charged?

You didn't see me on here screaming about these agencies or this administration before that did you? Credibility is a finite thing. Once you squander it, it is dam_n hard to regain.

Ok, add the FBI director to the list:

http://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-director-may-have-wrong-about-spying-2013-6

In an effort to be fair, let's give them all the benefit of the doubt , just theoretically, because they were all caught lying. Anyhow, maybe they parsed each question to such a limited degree that the answers they gave were technically true. It still shows an evident pattern of deception meant to shield the truth from ever being known. Both Congress and the citizenry should be outraged by that. Why are you focusing on Snowden and not these other bastards? Why isn't anyone calling for their heads?

Edited June 24, 2013 by lannarebirth

[Publicus]

Sounds like a traitor to me. Calculating and premeditated sabotage of vital classified US national security information, documents. The directors of NSA, FBI, CIA and the other national security agencies have testified before Congress that Snowden's disclosures have already done great harm to the US, both in foreign and domestic national security terms.

Every word Snowden has published in the Guardian, the Washington Post, the South China Morning Post is being closely examined in Beijing, Pyongyang, Moscow, Quito, Caracas and other capitals hostile to the United States. (Leftist pro-Beijing leaders and elites of Equador, Venezuela, Peru, Nicaragua and a few other countries down there know they are next, in due time. The US has already reactivated its 4th Naval Fleet, the South America area fleet of Teddy Roosevelt's fame.)

The second article documents what I'd posted Sunday, that Beijing wanted Snowden out of their hair and wanted him out of the PRC swiftly and decisively, which Beijing can easily do, and easily did do.

It also confirms my information that the population of Hong Kong didn't want anything to do with the fight between Snowden and the US government. Number one, the people of HKG saw this as a conflict between Snowden and the US government. Secondly, Snowden in HKG meant the direct involvement of Beijing in the matter - HKG people always want the least involvement of Beijing in HKG life as possible.

When I posted this information Sunday from my contacts in Hong Kong and on the Mainland some posters were clamoring for citations, documentation. I said at the time that Western news organizations surely would be publishing reports consistent with my information, either on Monday (yesterday) or Tuesday (today).

So now here it is.

Edward Snowden: 'China middleman told him to flee' A lawyer for Edward Snowden said the former US spy agency employee was told to flee Hong Kong by a middleman claiming to represent the government of the China-controlled territory, but was probably from Beijing.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/10138423/Edward-Snowden-China-middleman-told-him-to-flee.html

China feared Edward Snowden extradition fight with U.S., aided NSA leaker to leave Hong Kong

Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/jun/24/china-feared-edward-snowden-extradition-fight-us-a/#ixzz2XAOfee7e

Edward Snowden Fled Hong Kong After Learning His Computer Could Be Taken Away

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/why-edward-snowden-fled-hong-kong-2013-6#ixzz2XAIrkJfD

REPORT: Edward Snowden Took A Job With Booz Allen To Gather Evidence On NSA Surveillance Programs

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/edward-snowden-booz-allen-nsa-surveillance-evidence-job-2013-6#ixzz2XACafq7U

NSA leaker Snowden’s clearance had ‘problems’; firm that vetted him under probe

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/jun/21/nsa-leaker-ed-snowdens-clearance-had-problems-firm/

[FDog]

So someone from the HG govt said it best he leave.

Somehow you translate that to your 'opinion' that it was from the Chinese govt, with no proof at all.

It is very likely he already had plans to leave as Wikileaks were assisting him, prior to being told that by a HK official.

Edited June 24, 2013 by FDog

[wealth]

the only thing that concerns me at the moment is the Katsa (Mossad handlers in a kind of company deities etc.) and if they have a lot of influence there.

Technically yes, there's a big chance they have influence since a big part of Israels Jews are Russians (Ashkenazim).

Just to bring in some more food for thoughts.

Or do you think they just hang on with "silence is golden?"

[Publicus]

So someone from the HG govt said it best he leave.

Somehow you translate that to your 'opinion' that it was from the Chinese govt, with no proof at all.

It is very likely he already had plans to leave as Wikileaks were assisting him, prior to being told that by a HK official.

For those who might not be very reading proficient, let me present the key material in its specific form:

"They (Beijing) used someone behind the scenes to get Snowden to leave. And the Hong Kong government didn't have much of a role. Its role was to receive instructions to not stop him at the airport," said Mr Ho, who is from the territory's Democratic Party, which opposes any meddling by Beijing in Hong Kong.

Mr Ho said: "From seeing the nervousness with which the Hong Kong government didn't even give me any details at all ... I have grounds to believe that the Hong Kong government had no authority over this case. That's to say the whole case was decided by Beijing."

The above is from the newspaper article presented in my post above (as I write this)

http://www.telegraph...im-to-flee.html

As I've reiterated several times, Beijing has a standing policy that it has the absolute authority to make any or all decisions that it deems to directly affect its defense or its foreign policy. Beijing overrode all the legal mechanisms and technicalities of Hong Kong law to dictate its policy decision in the Snowden-US matter to the government of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region of the PRC.

Snowden was in Hong Kong one day and was gone the next day. This is directly contrary to all of Snowden's many statements that he wanted to remain in Hong Kong to carry on his illegal disclosures of US national and global security information and documents, and to fight the US government in the courts of Hong Kong, in which he had absolute trust and confidence. Snowden is smart with computers, a dumb kid when it comes to maturity and how the world works.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Publicus

[Publicus]

the only thing that concerns me at the moment is the Katsa (Mossad handlers in a kind of company deities etc.) and if they have a lot of influence there.

Technically yes, there's a big chance they have influence since a big part of Israels Jews are Russians (Ashkenazim).

Just to bring in some more food for thoughts.

Or do you think they just hang on with "silence is golden?"

[Publicus]

We're going to be seeing all of it in Wikileaks, which readily said is paying Snowden's travel expenses and legal fees. I didn't accept Assange's statements of the recent past that Wikileaks was broke, I don't accept the statements now.

U.S. officials don't know how much secret material Snowden took

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/06/24/us-usa-security-material-idUSBRE95N1F820130624?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=992637

[wealth]

We're going to be seeing all of it in Wikileaks, which readily said is paying Snowden's travel expenses and legal fees. I didn't accept Assange's statements of the recent past that Wikileaks was broke, I don't accept the statements now.

U.S. officials don't know how much secret material Snowden took

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/06/24/us-usa-security-material-idUSBRE95N1F820130624?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=992637

the four notebooks are there for a reason and act like a four digit pin code to ACESS more sensitive data. This is a rough outline of the functioning.

Otherwise a couple of USB sticks would have done the trick.

Guess he's on a leash. But who is behind? HOMEWORK!!!

[Rust Never Sleeps]

This might be off topic in relation to the Snowden affair but many members have raised concerns about China's involvement in espionage and industrial espionage,but no countries are sqeaky clean.

www.globalresearch.ca/the-history-of-americas-secret-wars-corporate-espionage-and-the-outscoring-of national-security/5338982

I am not singling out the USA in this instance but i did come across this article which has relevance to many of the posts been written.

Let's not use the great minds of this world to counter opposition but to co-operate together for the benefit mankind.

[mania]

It still shows an evident pattern of deception meant to shield the truth from ever being known. Both Congress and the citizenry should be outraged by that. Why are you focusing on Snowden and not these other bastards? Why isn't anyone calling for their heads?

It seems a Patriot is redefined these days

Originally, a patriot was someone who loves their country and supports it, but won't blindly follow whatever their country's government does.

These days, it is synonymous with Nationalist, which is someone who blindly follows whatever his country's government does, and lacks his own ability to think and reason for himself.

I have only ever heard about the exposure of the NSA Prism program.

I also find it ironic that they chose the name prism for their project.

But it is sad to me that millions are now targeted to lose their privacy for no apparent reason

with this blanket called National security & more sad that so many cheer it onwards.

What happened to innocent with rights until proven guilty? Or at least suspected?

Are we all suspects now?

If this is all based & justified by the so called war on terror then we have already completely lost

the plot & I fear are at risk of all becoming useful idiots

Edited June 25, 2013 by mania

[lannarebirth]

It still shows an evident pattern of deception meant to shield the truth from ever being known. Both Congress and the citizenry should be outraged by that. Why are you focusing on Snowden and not these other bastards? Why isn't anyone calling for their heads?

It seems a Patriot is redefined these days

Originally, a patriot was someone who loves their country and supports it, but won't blindly follow whatever their country's government does.

These days, it is synonymous with Nationalist, which is someone who blindly follows whatever his country's government does, and lacks his own ability to think and reason for himself.

I have only ever heard about the exposure of the NSA Prism program.

I also find it ironic that they chose the name prism for their project.

But it is sad to me that millions are now targeted to lose their privacy for no apparent reason

with this blanket called National security & more sad that so many cheer it onwards.

What happened to innocent with rights until proven guilty? Or at least suspected?

Are we all suspects now?

If this is all based & justified by the so called war on terror then we have already completely lost

the plot & I fear are at risk of all becoming useful idiots

You could become a suspect, if some new, arbitrary policy comes into affect redefining what a lawbreaker is. What you will become is catologed. The massive new "data fusion" center will take every scrap of information that can me gleaned about you, and me, such as our correspondences, credit card bils, travel records, medical history and "fuse" it to create an identity. They can include or leave out whatever they like to suit their purposes. Every database in which information about you appears will de fused. Maybe they'll delete that which doesn't suit the portrait of you they'd like to draw. don't worry, they say you can trust them. I mean, what could go wrong?

[mania]

don't worry, they say you can trust them. I mean, what could go wrong?

You know it is surreal & sad at the same time.

I wince when I think that a long time ago, so many Americans gave their lives

to create & uphold freedoms that are today freely given up.

[midas]

don't worry, they say you can trust them. I mean, what could go wrong?

You know it is surreal & sad at the same time.

I wince when I think that a long time ago, so many Americans gave their lives

to create & uphold freedoms that are today freely given up.

" Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

Benjamin Franklin

[mania]

" Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

Benjamin Franklin

Someone will be along shortly to tell you what a different world this is & why we do not need such

things & how even the Constitution & Bill Of Rights is dated for another time.

Yet none will move to legally change it.

Easier to use the pen of fear

Edited June 25, 2013 by mania

[Publicus]

It still shows an evident pattern of deception meant to shield the truth from ever being known. Both Congress and the citizenry should be outraged by that. Why are you focusing on Snowden and not these other bastards? Why isn't anyone calling for their heads?

It seems a Patriot is redefined these days

Originally, a patriot was someone who loves their country and supports it, but won't blindly follow whatever their country's government does.

These days, it is synonymous with Nationalist, which is someone who blindly follows whatever his country's government does, and lacks his own ability to think and reason for himself.

I have only ever heard about the exposure of the NSA Prism program.

I also find it ironic that they chose the name prism for their project.

But it is sad to me that millions are now targeted to lose their privacy for no apparent reason

with this blanket called National security & more sad that so many cheer it onwards.

What happened to innocent with rights until proven guilty? Or at least suspected?

Are we all suspects now?

If this is all based & justified by the so called war on terror then we have already completely lost

the plot & I fear are at risk of all becoming useful idiots

How many innocent citizens have been individually and/or personally harmed by the NSA phone surveillance program, as created and authorized by the Congress?

What is the incidence per 1000 citizens of innocent Americans being wrongfully arrested and/or charged under the NSA phone surveillance program? Indicted? Tried in a court of law? Wrongly convicted.

Nevermind the long train of possible horrors that can happen in paranoid minds.

What are the extant data pertaining to wrongful or just wrong use of the program. This is not the IRS project concerning political swindlers seeking tax exemptions, where the IRS admitted bad judgement and apologized to the American people. This is a national security program, as is the PRISM program, for which no one has apologized because apologies are not necessary or required.

What's the extant data of harm or injury specifically, to how many US citizens?

Nevermind the paranoia. What are the extant data???

[mania]

Nevermind the paranoia. What are the extant data???

So basically your stance on our Constitutional Rights & Bill Of Rights is no harm no foul?

Yet your same question turned on itself would be

How has the good citizens of America being told they have a Peeping Tom/ Employee in their midst

harmed National Security?

I have no problem with the NSA wanting something. Except when it is our rights.

If they need those sorry they will not be given freely by me.

If they pass a law or amend the Constitution or Bill Of Rights

So be it. That is how America rolls....or did

Edited June 25, 2013 by mania

[lannarebirth]

It still shows an evident pattern of deception meant to shield the truth from ever being known. Both Congress and the citizenry should be outraged by that. Why are you focusing on Snowden and not these other bastards? Why isn't anyone calling for their heads?

It seems a Patriot is redefined these days

Originally, a patriot was someone who loves their country and supports it, but won't blindly follow whatever their country's government does.

These days, it is synonymous with Nationalist, which is someone who blindly follows whatever his country's government does, and lacks his own ability to think and reason for himself.

I have only ever heard about the exposure of the NSA Prism program.

I also find it ironic that they chose the name prism for their project.

But it is sad to me that millions are now targeted to lose their privacy for no apparent reason

with this blanket called National security & more sad that so many cheer it onwards.

What happened to innocent with rights until proven guilty? Or at least suspected?

Are we all suspects now?

If this is all based & justified by the so called war on terror then we have already completely lost

the plot & I fear are at risk of all becoming useful idiots

How many innocent citizens have been individually and/or personally harmed by the NSA phone surveillance program, as created and authorized by the Congress?

What is the incidence per 1000 citizens of innocent Americans being wrongfully arrested and/or charged under the NSA phone surveillance program? Indicted? Tried in a court of law? Wrongly convicted.

Nevermind the long train of possible horrors that can happen in paranoid minds.

What are the extant data pertaining to wrongful or just wrong use of the program. This is not the IRS project concerning political swindlers seeking tax exemptions, where the IRS admitted bad judgement and apologized to the American people. This is a national security program, as is the PRISM program, for which no one has apologized because apologies are not necessary or required.

What's the extant data of harm or injury specifically, to how many US citizens?

Nevermind the paranoia. What are the extant data???

What's the cost benefit anaysis of taking some of the world's most gifted mathematicians, internet architects and engineers, 10's of billions of dollars and using it stop the occasional terrorist attack? How many more lives could be saved per year utilizing those same resources. How much more commercial innovation? Add to that the loss of faith in leadership for so wantonly "making concession" on privacy, which is a guaranteed right of every American.

http://thinkbynumbers.org/government-spending/anti-terrorism-spending-disproportionate-to-threat/

Edited June 25, 2013 by lannarebirth

[Credo]

The question is how many 10's of billions of dollars will have to be wasted because a spy has spilled a huge amount of information all over the globe.

I am worried about my rights, but I am also worried that suddenly everybody else in the world has access to the information we don't even want the gov't having.