Myanmar to begin nationality verification of Rohingyas in Thailand

[webfact]

Myanmar to begin nationality verification of Rohingyas in Thailand
By Digital Media



BALI, June 13 – Myanmar authorities will start their nationality verification process for ethnic Rohingya Muslims in Thailand next week, according to Thai Deputy Prime Minister/Foreign Minister Surapong Tovichakchaikul.

The minister said Thailand acknowledged concerns expressed by the European Union (EU) regarding the 2,000 Rohingyas who have fled Myanmar to Thailand since early this year, adding that the issue was raised in bilateral talks with his Myanmar counterpart.

Mr Surapong said he was informed by the Myanmar foreign minister that a working group headed by the Myanmar ambassador to Thailand will begin working on national verification of those Rohingyas next week.

He also stated that Thailand provided full humanitarian assistance to the displaced Rohingyas. However, Thailand is not a rich country, he said, and therefore the EU should also help take care of those people instead of letting Thailand solely shoulder the burden alone.

The minister commented after bilateral talks with his Myanmar counterpart U Wunna Maung Lwin on the sidelines of the Forum for East Asia and Latin American Cooperation (FEALAC) in Bali.

He also said next year will mark the 65th anniversary of the two countries’ diplomatic relations.

He asked his Myanmar counterpart about a white elephant loan from Myanmar to be an ambassador to stay at Chiang Mai Zoo for six months, similar to China’s panda ambassadors.

The Myanmar minister said he will discuss the issue with his government. (MCOT online news)


-- TNA 2013-06-13

[lee b]

Is this the reason i always get checked when traveling?

[clockman]

Thailand is not a rich country? Then why are so many super cars appearing!

[OzMick]

What percentage of Rohingyas will be found to be of Myanmar origin rather than Indian illegal immigrants? I'm guessing less than 10%.

I can understand why Surapong identifies with white elephants.

[Scott]

I am curious why Thailand things that the EU should help take care of the Rohingyas. Why not the UN? It seems to be more an UN type problem rather than an EU problem.

I might also add that many of the Rohingyas have been denied Burmese citizenship, so there might not be many of these folks that will meet the test for return.

[bigbamboo]

Thailand may not be a rich country but at least nobody starves here.

More rice anyone?

[hellodolly]

Thailand may not be a rich country but at least nobody starves here.

More rice anyone?

[OzMick]

I am curious why Thailand things that the EU should help take care of the Rohingyas. Why not the UN? It seems to be more an UN type problem rather than an EU problem.

I might also add that many of the Rohingyas have been denied Burmese citizenship, so there might not be many of these folks that will meet the test for return.

It's not a UN or EU problem, it's a Burmese problem, and the sooner they are forced to take care of their own problem the better.

[crazygreg44]

this is some whitewash operation and will result in nothing but hot air. Actually, the Rohingyas are denied Burmese citizenship, so whoever is right in his/her head expects the Burmese administration to claim they are burmese citizens? I think the operation is too ensure that Myanmar can reject responsibility for the 2000 fugitives, which in return is the 1st step to get the UN involved (whoever said EU instead of UN must have had a momentary blackout of synapses).

It does not look good for the fugitives, with Thai officials stating that Thailand is a poor country (so they can deny them food??). When in Asia such statements are made, there always is a reason behind. I keep my fingers crossed for these poor Rohingya fugitives and hope a muslim country will grant them exile and a new home . .

[NongKhaiKid]

As usual officials don't think before they speak and suddenly Thailand is poor which must reflect a failure of government but he didn't consider that before sounding off.

[Bellweather]

Come on then Yingluck your own deputy has said it, you are PM of a poor country. Time to drop all the expensive populist policies and projects, stop all your overseas trips at the national expense and admit that tourists aren't fighting in the immigration queues to get in and spend their money.

Give this verbal blunder to your new PR committee and it's cast of thousands and see if they can sell an explanation.

[waza]

"He also stated that Thailand provided full humanitarian assistance to the displaced Rohingyas."

"Rohingya Muslim refugees from Myanmar say they were beaten and tortured by Thai Navy authorities who then sold them to people traffickers..... Earlier this year the ABC revealed eyewitness accusations that the Thai military had been involved in the shooting of Rohingya, who had arrived on the shores of Thailand by boat...... Back in March, Thai prime minister Yingluck Shinawatra promised an investigation into the treatment of Rohingya by the Thai navy. To the ABC's knowledge, no detailed investigation has ever taken place."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-06-13/thai-navy-allegedly-involved-in-the-human/4752742

Edited June 13, 2013 by waza

[Tomtomtom69]

"However, Thailand is not a rich country, he said, and therefore the EU should also help take care of those people instead of letting Thailand solely shoulder the burden alone."

Thailand is not shouldering any burden. It is passing the buck. Rohingyas may be a Burmese problem although I don't think the conditions are right for most Rohingyas to return to Myanmar, but for Thailand to suggest that the EU should take care of this sounds like a typical racist response by a country that suddenly cries poor on this kind of issue but presents a "modern and developed infrastructure" story to investors who would generally rather go elsewhere in the region with more political stability. The Rohingyas would be much better off in Thailand than the EU, especially if they end up in a majority Muslim region like the far south. Who said that Europeans want more people from a religion and part of the world that they have trouble integrating? Thailand can integrate these people much better...just saying.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Tomtomtom69

[Naam]

Thailand is not a rich country? Then why are so many super cars appearing!

Thailand does not buy "supercars". rich Thai citizens buy supercars.

[stickylies]

myanmar has *never* taken care of its problems since independence. if's a failed state, even today, no matter what these Happy Harries are trying to make you believe. this rohingyas issue/matter will not be solved soon unless they get ALL placed in foreign western countries and who wants them (even the rich gulf states don't want them as slaves)? when it comes to this issue, the UN is full of shit, thailand is full of shit and myanmar is utterly shit. just face it and admit that there is no solution. i've visited rakhine state numerous times: utterly poor, below-middle age conditions and some large "open bills" (think WWII, rakhiners & japanese vs muslims). we ain't seen nothing yet.

ps. mind you: i'm nowhere saying the rohingyas are the good fellas and the rest are the bad. there are only losers in that very part of the world. the main source of evil is religious radicalism, both buddhism and islam. and don't give me that buddhism is not a religion-crap. cheers!

Edited June 14, 2013 by stickylies

[Tomtomtom69]

myanmar has *never* taken care of its problems since independence. if's a failed state, even today, no matter what these Happy Harries are trying to make you believe. this rohingyas issue/matter will not be solved soon unless they get ALL placed in foreign western countries and who wants them (even the rich gulf states don't want them as slaves)? when it comes to this issue, the UN is full of shit, thailand is full of shit and myanmar is utterly shit. just face it and admit that there is no solution. i've visited rakhine state numerous times: utterly poor, below-middle age conditions and some large "open bills" (think WWII, rakhiners & japanese vs muslims). we ain't seen nothing yet.

ps. mind you: i'm nowhere saying the rohingyas are the good fellas and the rest are the bad. there are only losers in that very part of the world. the main source of evil is religious radicalism, both buddhism and islam. and don't give me that buddhism is not a religion-crap. cheers!

Yes but regional countries need to accept this burden. Although tons of refugees have fled into Thailand from Myanmar over the years (mostly Kayins, Kayah and Shan residents not Rohingyas) the Thai authorities need to be compassionate and give these people residency. Look at this way - they could be used to fill labor shortages in agriculture and other low-skilled professions. Moreover, with all the hype of AEC 2015 (more like AEC 2016 given the Dec 31st, 2015 implementation date) and a fellow member of ASEAN, Thailand should be obligated to help its poor neighbor.

I didn't mention UN obligations on the part of Thailand because I believe Thailand is not a signatory state to the convention on refugee rights but Thailand should seriously consider changing its position on these matters. I don't believe the Rohingyas should all be repatriated to the west just because we're compassionate. Many European countries are in a debt crisis right now and wouldn't have the resources to absorb these people - it's time for regional Asian countries to play their part.

[stickylies]

myanmar has *never* taken care of its problems since independence. if's a failed state, even today, no matter what these Happy Harries are trying to make you believe. this rohingyas issue/matter will not be solved soon unless they get ALL placed in foreign western countries and who wants them (even the rich gulf states don't want them as slaves)? when it comes to this issue, the UN is full of shit, thailand is full of shit and myanmar is utterly shit. just face it and admit that there is no solution. i've visited rakhine state numerous times: utterly poor, below-middle age conditions and some large "open bills" (think WWII, rakhiners & japanese vs muslims). we ain't seen nothing yet.

ps. mind you: i'm nowhere saying the rohingyas are the good fellas and the rest are the bad. there are only losers in that very part of the world. the main source of evil is religious radicalism, both buddhism and islam. and don't give me that buddhism is not a religion-crap. cheers!

Yes but regional countries need to accept this burden. Although tons of refugees have fled into Thailand from Myanmar over the years (mostly Kayins, Kayah and Shan residents not Rohingyas) the Thai authorities need to be compassionate and give these people residency. Look at this way - they could be used to fill labor shortages in agriculture and other low-skilled professions. Moreover, with all the hype of AEC 2015 (more like AEC 2016 given the Dec 31st, 2015 implementation date) and a fellow member of ASEAN, Thailand should be obligated to help its poor neighbor.

hi ttt69, i appreciate your reaction, allow me to add this:

regional countries will not take the burden. the many (mainly christian) refugees u are refering to have been resettled in the west, not in thailand. in thailand they live like cattle in camps and the thai wanna get rid of them ASAP (no matter that at least 75% of the myanmar thai border is infested with mines). thailand is definitely NOT interested in hosting muslims, not at all. nor is laos, india, china.

the main problem is that powerful regional countries should have taken actions against myanmar ages ago, which they didn't (china being the biggest opportunist as usual). what is happening now is exactly what many people (including myself) have been predicting longtime ago. thailand and co should have boycotted myanmar BIGTIME forcing it to get its internal affairs in order. but they didn't for their own sake/interest. as usual, it's all about greed.

ASEAN is not about helping the other, but all about enriching oneself.

[iancnx]

I am curious why Thailand things that the EU should help take care of the Rohingyas. Why not the UN? It seems to be more an UN type problem rather than an EU problem.

I might also add that many of the Rohingyas have been denied Burmese citizenship, so there might not be many of these folks that will meet the test for return.

I shouldn't imagine any of them will want to return, and no doubt will claim refugee status and eventually be resettled via IOM.

A good account of their strife can be found here

http://www.guardian.co.uk/global-development/poverty-matters/2013/jun/03/burma-rohingya-segregation

[stickylies]

I didn't mention UN obligations on the part of Thailand because I believe Thailand is not a signatory state to the convention on refugee rights but Thailand should seriously consider changing its position on these matters. I don't believe the Rohingyas should all be repatriated to the west just because we're compassionate. Many European countries are in a debt crisis right now and wouldn't have the resources to absorb these people - it's time for regional Asian countries to play their part.

correct, they are not. which says a lot about thailand.

i don't believe Rohingyas should be repatriated to the west because they don't belong there. the west must force myanmar to deal with it. why is everybody praising myanmar nowadays while there is civil war in kachin state, new fighting in shan state, ongoing rape and forced labour in eastern karen state, massive increase of drug business in golden triangle. and then we hear very little from remote chin state where rape of christian women is still a hobby of local tatmadaw troups.

been there too often, seen too much. i don't believe the happy harries.

[stickylies]

Why not the UN? It seems to be more an UN type problem

where was the UN when the Karens were getting slaughtered (last 60 years) ? where was the UN during Nargis (2008) ? this is Myanmar pal (basically becoming a province of China) and the UN has nothing to say. don't believe the hype!

Edited June 14, 2013 by stickylies

[rosst]

"However, Thailand is not a rich country, he said, and therefore the EU should also help take care of those people instead of letting Thailand solely shoulder the burden alone."

Thailand is not shouldering any burden. It is passing the buck. Rohingyas may be a Burmese problem although I don't think the conditions are right for most Rohingyas to return to Myanmar, but for Thailand to suggest that the EU should take care of this sounds like a typical racist response by a country that suddenly cries poor on this kind of issue but presents a "modern and developed infrastructure" story to investors who would generally rather go elsewhere in the region with more political stability. The Rohingyas would be much better off in Thailand than the EU, especially if they end up in a majority Muslim region like the far south. Who said that Europeans want more people from a religion and part of the world that they have trouble integrating? Thailand can integrate these people much better...just saying.

Oh no, Muslims do not integrate, that is the whole problem, send them all back I say. By all means, investigate the Navy but why cant the Myanmar government pay for their support. If as another poster has said, they are illegals to Myanmar, still not our problem. As the Muslim countries are so concerned about the Quoran, let them read the part about helping their brothers??

[iancnx]

i don't believe Rohingyas should be repatriated to the west because they don't belong there. the west must force myanmar to deal with it

Totally understand where you are coming from, but the issue is, is it safe for these people to return? I suspect not.... read the guardian report above.

If they are granted refugee status by UNHCR then (in this case it seems) EU funding already allocated for resettlement (regionally or globally) will kick in and countries prepared to accept such migrants will ready themselves.

For more explanation on the processes take a look at this:

http://www.iom.int/cms/en/sites/iom/home/what-we-do/resettlement-assistance.html

[stickylies]

the problem is religious radicalism (fascism).

it's not just against Rohingyas, it's against muslims and it has been spread by the fascist junta - all devout buddhists of course - for decades.

so, what's next if the west resettles Rohingyas? resettling all ethnic muslim indians too who incidently run a large part of businesses in major cities ?

and after that all christians ?

until myanmar finally becomes what the bamar always wanted: a pure buddhist state with them in control.

Edited June 14, 2013 by stickylies

[dunque]

Come on then Yingluck your own deputy has said it, you are PM of a poor country. Time to drop all the expensive populist policies and projects, stop all your overseas trips at the national expense and admit that tourists aren't fighting in the immigration queues to get in and spend their money.

Give this verbal blunder to your new PR committee and it's cast of thousands and see if they can sell an explanation.

I don't think national wealth is binary, so 'not a rich country' does not necessarily equate to 'poor country'.

[libralibra]

@stickylies

You claim to know the history of that particular region in Myanmar, then you should add some more info.

There are many Muslims in Rakhine and the rest of Myanmar who immigrated into the country in different waves. Many are not Rohingyas. In fact, most Muslims who are living in the rest of Myanmar for decades or since early colonial time do not want to be associated with them. For instance, the Kamen are living side by side with the Rakhine for centuries.

Rohingya is a more recent politicized categorization. Most are considered illegal Bangalis even by established Moslem communities since they can neither speak a local Rakhine dialect nor Burmese and do not integrate. They immigrated into Rakhine from Bangladesh especially during Ne Win’s time – no problem due to a corrupt immigration.

If you mention history, then you should also mention that during WWII Bengali/Chittagonian Muslims (who migrated during colonial time) sided with the British, they clashed with the Rakhine/Japanese; when the British returned, the Muslims murdered thousands of Rakhine in Buthidaung/Maungdaw (since then the Muslims have an overwhelming majority there). 1947, a Mujahid uprising started, the Muslims demanded an own state (that the British had promised for their loyalty!). The descendants of these Muslims call themselves now conveniently Rohingyas.

Shall we add to the complex mix the anger of the (Buddhist) Rakhine who feel burnt by both ends. A quickly increasing Muslim population on one side and a authoritarian, ignorant, discriminating central Burmese military government on the other that over decades could not care less what happens in Rakhine.

Some activists, media outlets, and advocacy groups (HRW - ironically co-financed by Saudi Arabia, which has not signed the HR charta) call “all” Buddhists of Myanmar “Nazis” and “fascists”. They are not getting paid for presenting the complexity of an issue. They are getting paid for good stories and push-button outrage, not for thinking in realisitc terms and solutions.

Many comments have already mentioned it: today, no country wants Muslims that are uneducated and hard to integrate. Is it Islamophobic. Yes, it is and it is self-protection. And the Bangladesh government is happy for every uneducated person that is leaving their overcrowded land. They are the “three monkeys” in this whole matter. The international community knows the issue pretty well. Why does no government jump on this stupid Nazi “name and shame” business?

I do not envy any commission and politician involved in solving this issue.

[iancnx]

the problem is religious radicalism (fascism).

it's not just against Rohingyas, it's against muslims and it has been spread by the fascist junta - all devout buddhists of course - for decades.

so, what's next if the west resettles Rohingyas? resettling all ethnic muslim indians too who incidently run a large part of businesses in major cities ?

and after that all christians ?

until myanmar finally becomes what the bamar always wanted: a pure buddhist state with them in control.

Sorry buddy but I cannot agree with your arguments. I have supplied a wealth of non political non religious links..... Hoping you can take some time to read and assimilate

[stickylies]

@stickylies

You claim to know the history of that particular region in Myanmar, then you should add some more info.

There are many Muslims in Rakhine and the rest of Myanmar who immigrated into the country in different waves. Many are not Rohingyas. In fact, most Muslims who are living in the rest of Myanmar for decades or since early colonial time do not want to be associated with them. For instance, the Kamen are living side by side with the Rakhine for centuries.

Rohingya is a more recent politicized categorization. Most are considered illegal Bangalis even by established Moslem communities since they can neither speak a local Rakhine dialect nor Burmese and do not integrate. They immigrated into Rakhine from Bangladesh especially during Ne Win’s time – no problem due to a corrupt immigration.

If you mention history, then you should also mention that during WWII Bengali/Chittagonian Muslims (who migrated during colonial time) sided with the British, they clashed with the Rakhine/Japanese; when the British returned, the Muslims murdered thousands of Rakhine in Buthidaung/Maungdaw (since then the Muslims have an overwhelming majority there). 1947, a Mujahid uprising started, the Muslims demanded an own state (that the British had promised for their loyalty!). The descendants of these Muslims call themselves now conveniently Rohingyas.

Shall we add to the complex mix the anger of the (Buddhist) Rakhine who feel burnt by both ends. A quickly increasing Muslim population on one side and a authoritarian, ignorant, discriminating central Burmese military government on the other that over decades could not care less what happens in Rakhine.

Some activists, media outlets, and advocacy groups (HRW - ironically co-financed by Saudi Arabia, which has not signed the HR charta) call “all” Buddhists of Myanmar “Nazis” and “fascists”. They are not getting paid for presenting the complexity of an issue. They are getting paid for good stories and push-button outrage, not for thinking in realisitc terms and solutions.

Many comments have already mentioned it: today, no country wants Muslims that are uneducated and hard to integrate. Is it Islamophobic. Yes, it is and it is self-protection. And the Bangladesh government is happy for every uneducated person that is leaving their overcrowded land. They are the “three monkeys” in this whole matter. The international community knows the issue pretty well. Why does no government jump on this stupid Nazi “name and shame” business?

I do not envy any commission and politician involved in solving this issue.

1/ i never said Bengalis or Rohingyas have no blood on their hands. they are not my friends neither are their attackers.

2/ true, the rest of the muslims, whether they are burmese, indian, chinese or karen, whatever! don't wanna be connected with Rohingyas. logic since any party openly supporting Rohingyas will get into trouble. serious trouble with buddhist extremists (both monks and laypeople). even ASSK doesn't speak clear language about this issue. fact is that recent violence against muslims is not strictly limited to Rohingyas, see bago region, see mandalay region, see shan state recently, etc. the junta has always hated everything that is not buddhist and has always spreaded hatred. ultra-manipulators like all fascists.

3/ the reason why there are so many illegal bengalis in rakhine state is caused by CORRUPT IMMIGRATION officers in teh first place, Rakhiners and Bamar. they have let people in for ages in return for cash. same is happening on the other side of the "union" where 100.000's of chinese have been let in, able to buy burmese id-card (ever been in Muse? amazing!). recently the myanmar government announced it will investigate this. of course way too late again. as usual.

4/ sure, the rakhiners are very frustrated and deeply hate the bamar. not only i've been there numerous times, i know quite a few (locally) influential people there. i know how they feel. but focussing on a scapegoat (aka Rohingyas/bengalis) instead of the main oppressor is not brave. it's cowardish. that's what i told them before and will tell them again. btw. most of them, they consider me a friend, insist that i should become buddhist. in their eyes NOT being a buddhist is bad, very bad. rakhiners are extremely religious. unfortunately that is..

ps. regarding "adding more": it's impossible to mention everything about this very subject (or myanmar in general). it's a very complex country and many "issues" go way back in time. aloha.

Edited June 14, 2013 by stickylies

[Scott]

It appears that we have some very knowledgeable posters, with an informative historical background of the situation in Myanmar. We appreciate you sharing your knowledge, expertise and experience with us. Please keep the commentary closer to the intellectual side than the emotional one.

Your insights are appreciated and helpful. It is a complex problem, both for Thailand, Burma, much of SE Asia and now it seems further afield.