Bupa Platinum plan - skip outpatient?

[MrHammer]

Hi,

I know there have been many threads about health insurance but bear with me

I have done an extensive amount of research on health insurance here in Thailand and I think I am going to go with Bupa Platinum. They came recommended from Samitivej as well when I had a benign cyst removed (9000 TBH btw).

It just seems to me that outpatient only up to 60K is poor value for money provided you pay an extra 20K for the privilige. Or at least so is my rationalization.

I am 31 years old, so - knock on wood - not in danger of expensive outpatient treatment. The plan is to buy this plan now and then upgrade in a year when I hopefully have enough for a proper international health plan (maybe Bupa Intl.). I'd also like a plan in the future that can cover family properly outside Thailand.

In any case, what is the most expensive outpatient treatment I could run into if discounting cancer? Diagnostics I suppose are one such as MRI scans? But those only cost about 10K anyway, so not that big an expense. For a lot of other things, aren't the less expensive hospitals like Camillian (private) and public hospitals equipped to do these tests if you know what to test for? If something is an emergency, then it would be inpatient most likely and as I understand Bupa covers 10.000 for emergency visits even if sent home right away?

Any advice here would be greatly appreciated.

[Kalbo]

There is a marked difference in hospital prices within Bangkok for the exact same treatment and equipment, so you may get a lot of varying information. Would it not be better to direct your questions to an independent insurance broker ?

[richard_smith237]

For the same reasons I have chosen a similar plan for my Wife and I, but with BUPA international rather than BUPA Thailand which had cost ceilings.

Advanced imaging: MRI, CT-Scan, X-Ray, etc cancer treatment etc, pathology, specialist fees etc are covered.

I've never have a shocking outpatient bill.

In short, the small outpatient issues are readily covered out of pocket, it's the 'big stuff' that we require cover for.

[Sheryl]

I personally came to the same conclusion and I have BUPA platinum without the OPD option.

The most costly outpatient things you are likely to run into are diagnostic (MRIs, CTs etc) and there are avenues through which you can with a little trouble reduce those costs (i.e. getting the tests done at an imaging place instead of the hospital where you are being treated). Day surgeries -- including things like biopsies and cyst removal -- are usually covered under the hospitalization plan i.e. you do nto need to be admitted overnight.

So in summary I agree with your analysis. The OPD option is not good value for most people.

[hgma]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

[richard_smith237]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

Wow... Seems excessive: MRI at Bumrungrad a few years back was about 12,000 baht.

What is the price for the BUPA Thailand package?

BUPA International classic (female, 35 yrs) is about £1400 / 66,000 baht

BUPA International classic (male, 38 yrs) is about £1750 / 83,000 baht

Both plans cover MRI etc but not regular out patient visits...

Skipping the out patient premium is a reasonable and perhaps cost effective idea...

Edited July 4, 2013 by richard_smith237

[Pacificperson]

Stick the 20K/year in your rainy day fund. Then it will be available for both medical and non-medical emergencies.

[ppmacready]

Been in BUPA UK since 18 years old.

Now on BUPA International, I'm 53.

Cost is 300 pounds a month.

Covers cost of acupuncture which I recommend.

[hellodolly]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

Wow... Seems excessive: MRI at Bumrungrad a few years back was about 12,000 baht.

What is the price for the BUPA Thailand package?

BUPA International classic (female, 35 yrs) is about £1400 / 66,000 baht

BUPA International classic (male, 38 yrs) is about £1750 / 83,000 baht

Both plans cover MRI etc but not regular out patient visits...

Skipping the out patient premium is a reasonable and perhaps cost effective idea...

Here in Chiang Mai the price is 8,000 baht. Two months ago I was told by a respective surgeon he could get me one done for 6,000 baht. All though he is located in the most expensive hospital he has no problems recommending other hospitals or surgeon's. for my hip and knee replacement he recommends a doctor in Bangkok. Not sure if that is because the doctor is better or they have better facilities there. Not familiar with the situation here now but I know two years ago they used laser in Bangkok for more precision and it was not available here in Chiang Mai at the time.

[Minnehaha]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

Wow... Seems excessive: MRI at Bumrungrad a few years back was about 12,000 baht.

What is the price for the BUPA Thailand package?

BUPA International classic (female, 35 yrs) is about £1400 / 66,000 baht

BUPA International classic (male, 38 yrs) is about £1750 / 83,000 baht

Both plans cover MRI etc but not regular out patient visits...

Skipping the out patient premium is a reasonable and perhaps cost effective idea...

MRI at Bumrungrad was 12,000 Baht?

Really? I find that impossible to believe. CAT scan maybe.

Also, it depends on what the MRI is for.

MRI of the brain vs. the foot would have different costs I would imagine; also what kind of dyes they use etc., will likely drive prices.

If Bumrungrad is cheaper than any other hospital in Thailand for any medical procedure I would be very surprised. I think Bangkok Hospital is very close second, especially if you are paying out of pocket.

One little known private hospital that is fairly reasonably priced and is very modern (can do open heart surgery etc.) is Vichayuth. Its over on Rama 6. Camillian is cheap and better than average small govt hospitals, and it is convenient to upper Sukumvit folks, but it is a little long in the tooth.

[Minnehaha]

Been in BUPA UK since 18 years old.

Now on BUPA International, I'm 53.

Cost is 300 pounds a month.

Covers cost of acupuncture which I recommend.

300 British pounds? 14,000 Baht a month? or per year?

[Minnehaha]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

Wow... Seems excessive: MRI at Bumrungrad a few years back was about 12,000 baht.

What is the price for the BUPA Thailand package?

BUPA International classic (female, 35 yrs) is about £1400 / 66,000 baht

BUPA International classic (male, 38 yrs) is about £1750 / 83,000 baht

Both plans cover MRI etc but not regular out patient visits...

Skipping the out patient premium is a reasonable and perhaps cost effective idea...

If you work in Thailand and have work permit you are already paying social security. Select a hospital conveniently located and use that for out patient stuff. Keep the international one for catastrophic events.

[GBK]

Disclaimer: I sell this stuff.

B20,000 for outpatient cover at age 31? Really?

As suggested above, see a decent broker and get alternative quotes, as that is way over the top, IMO.

I just had a knee replacement and Samitivej Sri Racha quoted B180k and actually charged B390k!

Stitches removal: B6500! Robbers!

Also, don't confuse OPD with Day Patient treatment. The insurers define them differently.

Good luck!

[sandrabbit]

Stick the 20K/year in your rainy day fund. Then it will be available for both medical and non-medical emergencies.

Sorry but I think that is a head in the sand approach. Haven't you seen enough threads talking about the lack of insurance people have and having to go begging to get/borrow money for treatment?. I have friends without insurance and they accept that people have to be hard on them if a medical problem arises, you can't expect other people to bail you out.

[Bcgardener]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

Wow... Seems excessive: MRI at Bumrungrad a few years back was about 12,000 baht.

What is the price for the BUPA Thailand package?

BUPA International classic (female, 35 yrs) is about £1400 / 66,000 baht

BUPA International classic (male, 38 yrs) is about £1750 / 83,000 baht

Both plans cover MRI etc but not regular out patient visits...

Skipping the out patient premium is a reasonable and perhaps cost effective idea...

If you work in Thailand and have work permit you are already paying social security. Select a hospital conveniently located and use that for out patient stuff. Keep the international one for catastrophic events.

I work in Thailand and have a social medical card but can't really afford to waste a day just to see a doctor at a Government Hospital. I don't know what the rest of Thailand is like but Queen Sirikit Hospital in Sattahip where I am registered usually takes at least 4 - 5 hours to see a doctor. My staff are always complaining about it.

For private insurance , I am looking seriously at LMG health as they have a good in patient and outpatient plan for around 100K per year (I'm 58). Coverage is not perfect but pretty good for the price. I would also suggest using a broker as I have found my one to be very well informed. If you go with an overseas based company it can be very difficult to claim the costs as a tax deduction with Thai Revenue Dept (so my broker tells me) i.e. Bupa Thailand vs Bupa International.

[Sheryl]

MRU costs vary by where you have them done but also by whether or not contrast (dye )is used and the number of body sites scanned.

in many areas the least expensive option is to go direct to an Imaging place e.g. http://www.mrithailand.com/e_contact_tbr.html (note that despite the name tyhey have up-country branches, and do CT as well as MRI).

They have no problem with self-referrals and will give you the actual film as well as radiologists' interpretation to take away. However, you will need to exactly what test is needed, on which part of the body and whether or nit contrast is required.So do your homework first. Also - if you will need contrast and have a history of allergic reactions then I advise against this route,m you need to have it done in a hospital as there is a risk of serious anaphylactic reaction in some people.

[MoonShadow]

I'm also with BUPA international but check if they will accept a transfer from BUPA Thailand without any conditions as the advise I had from BUPA a few years back is that they will not cover any pre existing medical conditions despite them being the 'same' company. Also as I live on Samui I pay GBP75 each year for evacuation cover, which means they will fly me by air ambulance to BKK with this cover should it become necessary.

[jpshanik]

Just FYI, I have a brokerage here. I don't want to break any Thaivisa rules, so I won't bark out my company.

What I would recommend just for Outpatient coverage is that it's not for everyone. Unless you tend to visit outpatient pretty frequently, you could possibly pay more in coverage than you would ever use in a year. Having said that, sometimes some families get more than full usage out of the coverage. You also need to read the fine print because even with outpatient coverage, some things will not be covered.

There are always strange stories about overcharging at various hospitals and such. I don't think you should be scared off by any of those. Again, like the other person who sells and commented, I would recommend a good agent or broker. If you run into trouble, they / we should do the arguing for you.

As for the recommendation for other companies, I think everyone has an opinion based on experience, but again, an agent or broker would have a better overall experience with that. My humble opinion.

BTW, just because you have a good or bad experience with a company in another country, does not translate to it being the same here.

Also, BUPA just sent out their new rates.

Hope that helps

[bangkokstick]

So is it better to apply for BUPA international or Thailand ?

Where do you apply in Bangkok or Pattaya ?

Thanks.

[MrHammer]

Bupa Intl is better for sure. More coverage and higher limits. Bupa Thailand does not cover kidney dialysis and organ transplants, maybe not even cancer?

Bupa Intl covers those, so imo. Bupa Thailand is not a stand alone plan in the long run, where Bupa Intl is.

Bupa Intl is for me something like between $250 and $400 a month depending on deductibles and outpatient coverage. Not cheap.

[kurnell]

I dropped OPD from my policy for myself and my family cos it just wasn't worth it. It's cheaper to see the doctor and buy medication outside the hospital.

[jpshanik]

Depending on the coverage you want, some of the international coverages do cover more but to just say international is better may be a bit subjective. If you live in Thailand and don't travel 1/2 the year, the limits can easily cover the most expensive expenses at a private hospital here. And also supplement most anything during your holidays except for the USA.

If you travel excessively then international may be a better option. If you don't, then local coverage usually costs about 1/4 of international(this is a very generic estimation). And hospitals seem to be a bit happier with local coverage (in some cases).

The coverage will be different for sure. It just depends on what you want / need / expect covered. Also, there are other benefits to local coverage that are a bit harder to explain.

[taqila]

Bupa sure sounds worth investigating if you have the resources. If I had the extra money, I think I'd go for it or if I had a business again, not a question if a business expense. I've heard its the top of the line for those that can afford it since moving here 4 years ago. The only time I had to visit the private hospital (pattaya international and bangkok pattaya), my policy purchased in Pattaya didn't pay one baht and it was all out of pocket. Pattaya international was not much to talk about, but Bangkok Pattaya hospital was like flying good business class out of my wallet but very good service.

[asiamaster]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

MRI scam....

It is surprising how much more expensive the regional Bangkok hospitals (also Bangkok Hospital Pattaya) are than the Bangkok General Hospital in Bangkok....

[Sheryl]

recent MRI scan BKK Hospital Udon 35000.+

MRI scam....

It is surprising how much more expensive the regional Bangkok hospitals (also Bangkok Hospital Pattaya) are than the Bangkok General Hospital in Bangkok....

Lack of competition is a factor there. Upcountry the Bkk Hospital is often the only large private option whereas in Bkk there are many.

Another factor is volume of patients. The thing about MRIs and CTs is that the machines are extremely expensive. It is a huge capital outlay to get one and the hospital has to then recoup that, plus at least some profit, within the machine's life span. If there is a high volume of patients, they can do so at a lower per patient cost. If there are few cases (as is true upcountry) they have to charge more per patient.

This is why such tests are vastly less expensive in countries with high population density, e.g. India. they can charge a fraction of what is charged here and still recoup their investment in a year or two because of the sheer number of patients.

[Pacificperson]

Stick the 20K/year in your rainy day fund. Then it will be available for both medical and non-medical emergencies.

Sorry but I think that is a head in the sand approach. Haven't you seen enough threads talking about the lack of insurance people have and having to go begging to get/borrow money for treatment?. I have friends without insurance and they accept that people have to be hard on them if a medical problem arises, you can't expect other people to bail you out.

I was referring to the purchase of the out-patient rider, which was the question that the OP asked. I was not referring to the purchase of the insurance policy. Medical insurance is for extraordinary needs. It is not for day to day routine care. When used that way, it is a waste of money.

[thailand49]

When it comes to outpatient it is not only Bupa but any and all policies being sold in Thailand. Based on the price no one can use that much outpatient and if you do it would be a matter of time before the cancel your policy which is what they do in Thailand. The want you to pay in but in the end they don't want to pay out!

Some of these hospital are all out to make money and the medical expertise isn't what it is make out to be on 60 minutes years ago. If you can and have insurance outside in your own country keep it and be thankful you have it. At your age or any age for outpatient like it has been mentioned sock the money away call it what you want Health saving account and use it when needed but do your best not to run to a nice hospital each time for pill. Each vist is recorded and your insurance can access the infomation at any hospital and find your history and might just use it if you didn't tell them as a pre-existing condition?

Bupa policy is 1 million or 1.5 million for the price is too high and does not cover enough for the money or baht. Give this company a try ACS, a French Company selling in SEA, the price is lower than Bupa and covers in USD instead. They have two MOD plans, 500,000 USD coverage is equal to 15 million Baht, based on the exchange rate today. They also have outpatient but expensive like everyone else Bupa is overpriced.

[Sheryl]

BUPA platinum is 5 million, which IMO is about the lowest level anyone should have. (It is also the highest cover available from BUPA Thailand).

A major factor for high insurance costs in Thailand is that few Thais take out private insurance. The formal employment sector is covered by Thai SS and everyone else by the "gold card" scheme. Hence the pool of insured people is small which bumps up costs considerably.

[jpshanik]

Not to be rude but I'm a bit confused as to some of the comments being posted. I know there are many differing prices of hospital care around Thailand but one of the main purposes of having insurance is that hospitals can't overcharge you. If you have a procedure done and the bill goes straight to the insurance company, the insurance company pays them directly at the rate that is appropriate (for the most part). That's part of the reason for buying a policy. It's much harder to scam the insurance companies than a foreigner without any insurance.

Also, for the person claiming 5 mil baht is too low, I'd be interested to know the reasoning. A routine surgical procedure with 4 or 5 day stay at samitivej costs about 150k baht. This is one of the priciest hospitals in Thailand if not the most.

I encourage ppl to compare policies in detail as I've worked in insurance for over a decade and have been more than pleased with the coverage here for the price.

Please note that even though some companies do drop policy holders, some have guaranteed renewal.

Also, depending on the policy, the max can be "per injury, per year".

I know insurance is not fun to read but your hard earned money is paying for it. You might want to see what exactly your getting. Or you can always get an agent that can explain what exactly you're getting. (Again, I am a broker so I'm a bit biased).

[Sheryl]

Not to be rude but I'm a bit confused as to some of the comments being posted. I know there are many differing prices of hospital care around Thailand but one of the main purposes of having insurance is that hospitals can't overcharge you. If you have a procedure done and the bill goes straight to the insurance company, the insurance company pays them directly at the rate that is appropriate (for the most part). That's part of the reason for buying a policy. It's much harder to scam the insurance companies than a foreigner without any insurance.

Also, for the person claiming 5 mil baht is too low, I'd be interested to know the reasoning. A routine surgical procedure with 4 or 5 day stay at samitivej costs about 150k baht. This is one of the priciest hospitals in Thailand if not the most.

I encourage ppl to compare policies in detail as I've worked in insurance for over a decade and have been more than pleased with the coverage here for the price.

Please note that even though some companies do drop policy holders, some have guaranteed renewal.

Also, depending on the policy, the max can be "per injury, per year".

I know insurance is not fun to read but your hard earned money is paying for it. You might want to see what exactly your getting. Or you can always get an agent that can explain what exactly you're getting. (Again, I am a broker so I'm a bit biased).

If it is my post you refer to I did not say 5 mil was "too low" I said it was the lowest one should have i.e. the minimum needed.

Obviously a routine procedure with a 5-6 day stay is not the concern here. Even a low-ball policy will cover that and for that matter, most people could manage to pay out of pocket if they had to. It is the possibility of a catastrophic event with prolonged ICU stay and multiple major surgeries one has to consider. I have known those to exceed 2 million at government hospitals, let alone private.