Re-enact crimes is necessary: Thai police

[webfact]

Acting out crimes is necessary: police
Pravit Rojanaphruk
The Nation

Public has the right to know how the crime took place, officer says

BANGKOK: -- The common practice of parading criminal suspects in front of the media to re-enact their alleged crimes before judges have found them guilty is seen as a questionable practice by the human rights community - but the police say they are doing what is best for Thai justice and the practice will continue.

"Officers have the necessity," said Pol Colonel Chalotorn Sitthipanya, who represented the National Police at a symposium on the topic set up by the National Human Rights Commission at the NHRC office yesterday.

Chalotorn said the public had the right to know, so a press conference and re-enactment of crime was necessary.

"People who watch it will also not fall prey to such crime. It will show others that doing such things is not good.

"It will also encourage others who have leads to contact us and provide us with more information. These are the reasons why it's still needed. We stress that we conduct it in such a way that will not violate or demean suspects," Chalotorn said.


VIOLATION OF SUSPECT'S RIGHTS

Top human rights lawyer and chairman of Amnesty International Thailand Somchai Hom-laor said criminal suspects should be treated as innocent until proven otherwise by the courts, adding that the re-enactment of crime, which often sees an angry mob attacking the suspect, is contradictory to the rule of law and the justice process.

"The re-enactment of crime is like reinforcing that the person has committed crime," said Somchai, adding that going soft on angry mobs, who seek to physically attack suspects during the re-enactment, is tantamount to encouraging "private vendettas", which contravene the justice system.

A middle-ranking police officer at the symposium, who spoke to The Nation on the condition of anonymity, said suspects have to first "confess" to investigators before they are taken to re-enact their crime.

The source admitted, however, that physical assaults while interrogating suspects whom police strongly believe to be guilty, are not uncommon.

As for the media, they were also partly to blame, the meeting was told, as they tend to dramatise alleged crimes even before judges make a ruling.

Another speaker, Sumitchai Hattasarn, a committee member of the Human Rights Lawyers Association, suggested that showing the faces of suspects and victims who are woman, members of minority, or youths was not necessary.

Uajit Virojtrairat, a media expert, said in some cases, police act as if they're movie directors directing the re-enactment of alleged crime and questioned if it's necessary to do this in public for the re-enactment.


-- The Nation 2013-07-04

[ThaidDown]

Public has the right to know how the crime took place, officer says

We're not going to need a trial then.. 'This is how it happened and this is who did it'

Not mentioned was the fact that without the renactments how are the big wig police going to get their pictures in the media.

[NongKhaiKid]

Utter crap. The only necessity is for senior police officers to get into the media and be seen pointing.

[NongKhaiKid]

In many jurisdictions a suspect may not be shown as it is prejudicial since witnesses who have not previously identified him / her can now have their memory " refreshed " without being tested. This is what an identification parade is for.

Here it's just a photo op.

[chooka]

The common practice of parading criminal suspects in front of the media to re-enact their alleged crimes

The two main things, they are only suspects of an alleged crime. The police brand them convicted criminals prior to attending court and display them as if they have just won the world cup.

What is this stupid comment "People who watch it will also not fall prey to such crime." How on earth does parading a suspect (not a proven offender) protect people from becoming victims of others? Does this sort of thing have the same mystical powers of amulets?

What happens if a suspect is then eliminated or found innocent in court, can he sue the police for publically humiliating him and branding him a criminal. Do defamation laws cover these people?

[chooka]

In many jurisdictions a suspect may not be shown as it is prejudicial since witnesses who have not previously identified him / her can now have their memory " refreshed " without being tested. This is what an identification parade is for.

Here it's just a photo op.

That's true and they are also innocent people that are being paraded prior to their appearance in court. We always have to give a suspect the opportunity to cover their face denying them that and we can face internal disciplinary action and possible civil action.

[rkidlad]

Let's be honest, they're never going to admit it's stupid.

If they do get rid of this reinacting, they will make up another reason even more stupid than the fact that it's stupid.

[EyesWideOpen]

Police lunacy as always. To the best of my knowledge no other developed country does this, why on earth would the Thai police brain trust think this is a good idea ??

[chrisinth]

"The source admitted, however, that physical assaults while interrogating suspects whom police strongly believe to be guilty, are not uncommon"

That line in the OP was misplaced. It should have been before and not after this one:

"said suspects have to first "confess" to investigators before they are taken to re-enact their crime".

I wonder if they realize what they have just admitted to here?

[Thai at Heart]

Photo op.

I am amazed it's addmissable.

[NongKhaiKid]

My mate Chooka and I ( both retired cops ) could go on about this sort of thing and bore everyone's pants off, quite acceptable if you are a buxom Isan girl of the female persuasion, BUT we both cringe that this sort of thing goes and there's no accountability.

The rule of law here appears to be " make it up as you go along".

[EyesWideOpen]

"The source admitted, however, that physical assaults while interrogating suspects whom police strongly believe to be guilty, are not uncommon"

That line in the OP was misplaced. It should have been before and not after this one:

"said suspects have to first "confess" to investigators before they are taken to re-enact their crime".

I wonder if they realize what they have just admitted to here?

Suspected for many years, nice to see it in print. Now no need to be amazed at the incredible rate that the police get confessions.....

[Mole]

I guess there are strange customs and practises everywhere. Such as the funny wigs in British courts...

Thailand is the hub of pointing of suspects and crime enactation.

Edited July 4, 2013 by Mole

[kurnell]

Thailand. Forever mired in the 15th century

[chooka]

My mate Chooka and I ( both retired cops ) could go on about this sort of thing and bore everyone's pants off, quite acceptable if you are a buxom Isan girl of the female persuasion, BUT we both cringe that this sort of thing goes and there's no accountability.

The rule of law here appears to be " make it up as you go along".

Not retired yet.

[NongKhaiKid]

Police lunacy as always. To the best of my knowledge no other developed country does this, why on earth would the Thai police brain trust think this is a good idea ??

Re-enactments are used elsewhere but under strict conditions and rules of evidence.

If a suspect makes a complicated confession he may be asked to show what he did for example. He can refuse, he is told the video taken will be prosecution evidence and the media are kept away.

Here it's an all singing, all dancing Hollywood extravaganza with the cops all looking for Oscar nominations especially senior officers who were never involved in the original investigations.

[NongKhaiKid]

My mate Chooka and I ( both retired cops ) could go on about this sort of thing and bore everyone's pants off, quite acceptable if you are a buxom Isan girl of the female persuasion, BUT we both cringe that this sort of thing goes and there's no accountability.

The rule of law here appears to be " make it up as you go along".

Not retired yet.

Oops, sorry young man.

[BrianCR]

The latest idea is to set re-enactments to songs and music then with someone to choreograph them we have full blown musicals!

Edited July 4, 2013 by BrianCR

[Hornell]

Kurnell is absolutely spot on when he stated; "Thailand. Forever mired in the 15th century". This business of the re-enactment of a crime was fine in the days when summary justice was meted out by the head honcho and re-enactment was seen as necessary 'pour encourager les autres', but nowadays the arguments against this farcical practice have been well laid out at almost every level and i have seen no credible defence put forward in its favour. But it's not going to change here in the foreseeable future, we all know that.

[NongKhaiKid]

The latest idea is to set re-enactments to songs and music then with someone to choreograph them we have full blown musicals!

Forget Gangnam style now it's BIB style

[geriatrickid]

On the positive side, where else would a police force be as transparent and admit to an absence of professionalism, and no respect for the concept of justice?

I commend Pol Colonel Chalotorn Sitthipanya, who represented the National Police for his honesty.

Bless his soul, the chap probably didn't have a clue as to what he was defending.

[Tywais]

Sounds like they are trying to rationalize an irrational procedure.

[noitom]

Thai police reenactments are nothing more than a showcase spectacle for police to curry media attention onto themselves.

[trainman34014]

The part where he says 'They are doing what is best for Thai Justice' says it all. The justice system of a Banana Republic !

[chooka]

On the positive side, where else would a police force be as transparent and admit to an absence of professionalism, and no respect for the concept of justice?

I commend Pol Colonel Chalotorn Sitthipanya, who represented the National Police for his honesty.

Bless his soul, the chap probably didn't have a clue as to what he was defending.

Last seen sitting under a thatched roof shelter on the top of a mountain in command of 2 pigs and a chook.

[Halion]

This article is total crap. How often has anyone seen a member of the elite or a government official subjected to such action.

Just more bullshit from the RTP , pathetic parasites of a manipulated system.

[pinball]

They need reenactment cos there to dumb to work it out on there own

[Farangdam]

commit..surrender..confess ...reenect...reduced punishment...free...commit..surrender..confess..reenect..reduced punishment.....free.. commit...surrender..confess...reenect...reduced punishment...freee..................thais way leave them alone

[jpeg]

Under a judicial system which uses 'if it wasn't seen (the crime) it didn't happen, are we now truly down the rabbit hole of, 'well, look, we're making someone physically act out this crime, so it must've been perpetrated by this person'

Edited July 4, 2013 by jpeg

[chooka]

Thai police reenactments are nothing more than a showcase spectacle for police to curry media attention onto themselves.

The walkthrough of some incidents are helpful for clearing up some points however the suspect is not compelled to partake. "Not obliged to "SAY" or "DO" anything. Basic legal rights. In a normal court any evidence/admissions obtained under duress is "NOT" admissible in court. physical assaults while interrogating suspects whom police strongly believe to be guilty is obtaining admissions under duress. A dumb witted stumbling lawyer would even get this evidence thrown out. The same dumb witted lawyer would advise his client not to partake as if the police had sufficient evidence to charge him then there would be no need for a re-enactment. The onus is entirely on the police to gather evidence and for the prosecution to prove a case beyond all reasonable doubt. The suspect has absolutely no obligation to assist the prosecution in gaining a conviction.

It is like asking the opposing team to kick goals for you in a football match because you don't have the talent to do it yourself.

"Police say they are doing what is best for Thai justice and the practice will continue."

How is physically assaulting someone during an interview or forcing them to incriminate themselves in a re-enactment Justice? If this is Thai Justice then it is definitely one sided justice. It is more like perverting the course of justice which it in itself is a crime.