TG's New ROP Miles Calculations

[Jobo]

Do any members understand the new system that TG just introduced for expiring miles and how one now qualifies for Silver and/or Gold status?

For example I previously knew that by December this year I had a certain number of qualifying miles to accrue in order to go up to Gold status.

Now they have some sort of rolling 12 month basis for these calculations but nobody at TG ROP can tell me if that rolling 12 month period is any 12 month period (eg Jan - Dec, Feb - Jan, April - Mar etc)

Help needed as I'll otherwise have to start using other Star Alliance airlines where it's easier to understand their systems and you are not getting screwed for your loyalty.

[bubba]

If you have to fly Thai, want to collect miles for those flights but don't want to put up with their confusing mileage accrual system and also with their expiring miles (I really don't like this ROP policy), you can join another Star Alliance carrier's programme and accumulate your TG miles there.

[ezzra]

In theory, the ROP people should be able to answer and make sense of the new order,

however, since it's a new order, in practicality, I would suggest to give it some time

for the knowledge to trickle down to the low level people who man the phones and the

email with the members before you can get a coherent answer to your queries.

[Kripe]

A 12 month roling was introduced mainly because of Platinum status where you need 80.000 Miles 2 (now rolling) years in a row, on TG Business or First class

[khunbillmex]

It should be with ROP from last date of mile accumulation i.e. last date was Jan 1 2012 then roll off should be jan 1 2013 (or Dec 31/12) Usually there are in say US Star Alliance minimum things you can do -- create activity -- buy miles/rent a car/whatever and then that "buys" you a new year.

GONE are the days when you could fly a GF and her 'sisters' from CNX to HGN and back 4 tmes a day ((for $8 each way)) under your name get qualfing points

[iang]

A rolling mileage accrual is in fact advantageous and & an enhancement for ROP members. I will demonstrate how this works with a hypothetical example:

The threshold to go from normal to say silver member in this example is a hypothetical 25,000 miles. Under the old system that 25,000 miles would need to be accrued between Jan & Dec in the same year to qualify for silver.

In my fictitious example, I have several flights booked between July & January, which together would accumulate 27,000 miles in just a 7 month period. Under a 'rolling' qualification system, I'd qualify and have my silver status within 7 months. HOWEVER, under the old Jan - Dec fixed system, as 23,000 miles occurred between Jul - Dec and the balance of of 4,000 miles occurred in Jan, I would NOT qualify for Silver, as over the Jan - Dec period I'd have only accrued 23,000 miles!

So the old fixed date system does not fully reward client loyalty in the same way that a 'rolling' system will.

I hope my example makes things a bit more clear for you?

Edited July 24, 2013 by iang

[diggledunc]

If you have to fly Thai, want to collect miles for those flights but don't want to put up with their confusing mileage accrual system and also with their expiring miles (I really don't like this ROP policy), you can join another Star Alliance carrier's programme and accumulate your TG miles there.

Very true but I would suggest checking two things:-

- putting Thai flights on a partners frequent flyers card do you accumulate the same miles

- how about your card status. If you fly on another partners card ok you may get frequent flyers miles to some degree but some will not take the miles as an accrual towards membership level. You can't then benefit by any bonuses given for say having a higher status card or any other benefits.

I used to be in Thai and BMi before BA took them over. I got BMi's format for partner airlines and you lost miles with some.

Just a general comment as I haven't looked into Thai yet but it might be worth considering the above.

[wileycoyote]

To be frank

It is a shambles !

Not only have our previous miles been rounded down and multiplied,but I seem to lose 7000 miles in September,4000 miles in November and the balance by January 2014.

Even although ,I flew with them in April ! (both on LH and solely TG flights)

Countless ,e-mails ,no explanation ....so converted all my TG flights to LH ,as Star Alliance Partner claiming within 6 months for the total journey ,rather tham Royal Orchid for TG sectors & LH for LH Sectors!

[bangon04]

A 12 month roling was introduced mainly because of Platinum status where you need 80.000 Miles 2 (now rolling) years in a row, on TG Business or First class

Can a farang actually get platinum status now? I have only seen airline staff, wives and poo yais waving platinum cards so far....

[lomatopo]

http://www.thaiairways.com/frequent-flyer/download/ROP_News_Jan-Mar2013_20Dec12_EN.pdf

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/thai-airways-royal-orchid-plus/1421930-important-rop-changes-regarding-status-evaluation-mileage-expiration.html

[Jobo]

A rolling mileage accrual is in fact advantageous and & an enhancement for ROP members. I will demonstrate how this works with a hypothetical example:

The threshold to go from normal to say silver member in this example is a hypothetical 25,000 miles. Under the old system that 25,000 miles would need to be accrued between Jan & Dec in the same year to qualify for silver.

In my fictitious example, I have several flights booked between July & January, which together would accumulate 27,000 miles in just a 7 month period. Under a 'rolling' qualification system, I'd qualify and have my silver status within 7 months. HOWEVER, under the old Jan - Dec fixed system, as 23,000 miles occurred between Jul - Dec and the balance of of 4,000 miles occurred in Jan, I would NOT qualify for Silver, as over the Jan - Dec period I'd have only accrued 23,000 miles!

So the old fixed date system does not fully reward client loyalty in the same way that a 'rolling' system will.

I hope my example makes things a bit more clear for you?

Thank you. Yes this in itself is clear, however from when to when does the rolling 12 month period commence and end?

I have accrued 20,000 qualifying miles from February this year until now. Under the old system I knew clearly that I needed another 30,000 miles by December 2013 to get an upgrade

to Gold Status. And with two trips planned before then I would be on Gold Status by Jan 2014.

Now I have no idea whether the new rolling system is more advantageous or not but it seems not.

Using your theoretical example and my actual current status could you help with another example for me and tell me when I would qualify for gold status under the rolling system?

Thanks a million in advance

JE

[jpduggan]

Jeez I thought for a moment that bar girls or TGs as some people call them were now giving airmiles,,now that would be a Heinekan world.

[diggledunc]

If you have to fly Thai, want to collect miles for those flights but don't want to put up with their confusing mileage accrual system and also with their expiring miles (I really don't like this ROP policy), you can join another Star Alliance carrier's programme and accumulate your TG miles there.

Very true but I would suggest checking two things:-

- putting Thai flights on a partners frequent flyers card do you accumulate the same miles

- how about your card status. If you fly on another partners card ok you may get frequent flyers miles to some degree but some will not take the miles as an accrual towards membership level. You can't then benefit by any bonuses given for say having a higher status card or any other benefits.

I used to be in Thai and BMi before BA took them over. I got BMi's format for partner airlines and you lost miles with some.

Just a general comment as I haven't looked into Thai yet but it might be worth considering the above.

It is my understanding that no matter which Star Alliance airline you use nor which airline you are a member of, the mileage accrued for any given sector is the same as that which you would accrue on your member airline (or roughly the same).

And those miles will be credited (in time) to your actual member airline account.

The only problem I have encountered is when wanting to upgrade using say TG miles,more miles are required to upgrade on SQ than on TG.

The original post which I replied to said about collecting miles from Thai flights on another Star Alliance carriers card. If you do this the TG miles flown go on to the other carriers card and never find their way back to TG frequent flyers programme. It was in this context that I wrote my reply. If I flew Thai I could collect miles on my BMi card when they were part of Star Alliance (obviously not now) but as the flight was with another airline in the Star All group I would not get the miles counting towards the status or level of my card. The miles went on my BMi card and although a Thai flight would not go to my Thai frequent flyers account. The card you show at check in or put online is where the miles go not who you fly with. The TG SQ issue re upgrades is another matter.

Also need to check on the class of ticket you have. If you have an economy M class it may be treated differently by Thai if you are flying Thai than it would be flying Thai but using the card from another Star All carrier.

Hope you understand where I am coming from. This is not an easy thing to get heads round. Took me a while and a bit of research.

[gerry1011]

A 12 month roling was introduced mainly because of Platinum status where you need 80.000 Miles 2 (now rolling) years in a row, on TG Business or First class

Can a farang actually get platinum status now? I have only seen airline staff, wives and poo yais waving platinum cards so far....

Sure a farang can get a platinum card. You just have to fly a lot in first or business class (with a paying ticket). Very very easy.

I mysef have never seen anyone "wave" a TG platinum card anywhere. You are a lucky guy. It seems you crossed the path of many platinum card holders already

Hurry up. Buy yourself 160.000 miles of first class tickets and soon you will be able to proudly wave your farang platinum card under the nose of the "wives and poo yais" too

Next time I check-in I will also wave my card under the nose of every farang near me, hoping you are around

Honestly, were you in a bad mood when writing your post?

I don't believe you ever saw anyone "wave" a TG platinum card anywhere...

Don't be envious and grumpy. Fly first class and get your card as soon as possible

[bubba]

The original post which I replied to said about collecting miles from Thai flights on another Star Alliance carriers card. If you do this the TG miles flown go on to the other carriers card and never find their way back to TG frequent flyers programme.

Apart from some cheap, heavily discounted fares, you do earn base miles towards your ROP silver or gold qualification when you fly on other Star Alliance carriers, so long as you have your ROP number in the record. I have never had a problem with that, and I have been doing it for 10+ years, through today.

[bp832]

Join Aegean's ff program. They have the lowest threshold for gold status and flights on any star alliance partner qualify. You get 100% of economy miles on TG, 200% business & 300% first class. Miles last 2 years as long as you fly SA once.

[GrantSmith]

Join Aegean's ff program. They have the lowest threshold for gold status and flights on any star alliance partner qualify. You get 100% of economy miles on TG, 200% business & 300% first class. Miles last 2 years as long as you fly SA once.

Not entirely true, you need to ensure TG's fare codes correlate with A3 Miles & More earning.

Example the delightful V & W fare codes on TG earn sweet <deleted> all. They're great for after you've earned Gold with A3 though, as fare code does not affect your Star Gold Benefits.

Requalification for A3 is by the easiest too.

Edited July 24, 2013 by GrantSmith

[GrantSmith]

A rolling mileage accrual is in fact advantageous and & an enhancement for ROP members. I will demonstrate how this works with a hypothetical example:

The threshold to go from normal to say silver member in this example is a hypothetical 25,000 miles. Under the old system that 25,000 miles would need to be accrued between Jan & Dec in the same year to qualify for silver.

In my fictitious example, I have several flights booked between July & January, which together would accumulate 27,000 miles in just a 7 month period. Under a 'rolling' qualification system, I'd qualify and have my silver status within 7 months. HOWEVER, under the old Jan - Dec fixed system, as 23,000 miles occurred between Jul - Dec and the balance of of 4,000 miles occurred in Jan, I would NOT qualify for Silver, as over the Jan - Dec period I'd have only accrued 23,000 miles!

So the old fixed date system does not fully reward client loyalty in the same way that a 'rolling' system will.

I hope my example makes things a bit more clear for you?

Your calculations are a bit skewed.

One obtains Silver ROP with 10,000 miles in a year and 15,000 over 2 years. 50,000 for Gold over a year and 80,000 over 2 years.

[tw25rw]

I like this system. It's what I was hoping they would bring in when TG were my preferred airline. The calendar year thing made no sense.

[bigbamboo]

Always seemed to me that just as you thought you'd triggered Gold Status you lost it.

[Jobo]

Always seemed to me that just as you thought you'd triggered Gold Status you lost it.

That appears to be what is happening to me!

[Jobo]

Join Aegean's ff program. They have the lowest threshold for gold status and flights on any star alliance partner qualify. You get 100% of economy miles on TG, 200% business & 300% first class. Miles last 2 years as long as you fly SA once.

Not entirely true, you need to ensure TG's fare codes correlate with A3 Miles & More earning.

Example the delightful V & W fare codes on TG earn sweet <deleted> all. They're great for after you've earned Gold with A3 though, as fare code does not affect your Star Gold Benefits.

Requalification for A3 is by the easiest too.

So as knowledgeable as you seem to be do you know if the TG system operates on a random rolling 12 month period or a fixed rolling 12 month period?

Fixed meaning say April 2013 to April 2014 for example.

Random meaning any 12 month period for example Feb 2013 to Feb 2014, April 2013 to April 2014 etc

[GrantSmith]

So as knowledgeable as you seem to be do you know if the TG system operates on a random rolling 12 month period or a fixed rolling 12 month period?

Fixed meaning say April 2013 to April 2014 for example.

Random meaning any 12 month period for example Feb 2013 to Feb 2014, April 2013 to April 2014 etc

As I understand it, the rolling calendar is based on your joining date with ROP.

If you were a member under the original calendar, you would have an effective joining date as 1st January.

Once you crack into the tier windows your dates restart, that is, if you hit Silver in March you then have another 12-24 months to re-qualify, that is, March 2014 (for example) or March 2015.

If you rack up another 40,000 qualifying miles in that same initial 12 months or 70,000 in 24 months you make Gold and the clock starts again.

This becomes your starting point from here on in.

[iang]

A rolling mileage accrual is in fact advantageous and & an enhancement for ROP members. I will demonstrate how this works with a hypothetical example:

The threshold to go from normal to say silver member in this example is a hypothetical 25,000 miles. Under the old system that 25,000 miles would need to be accrued between Jan & Dec in the same year to qualify for silver.

In my fictitious example, I have several flights booked between July & January, which together would accumulate 27,000 miles in just a 7 month period. Under a 'rolling' qualification system, I'd qualify and have my silver status within 7 months. HOWEVER, under the old Jan - Dec fixed system, as 23,000 miles occurred between Jul - Dec and the balance of of 4,000 miles occurred in Jan, I would NOT qualify for Silver, as over the Jan - Dec period I'd have only accrued 23,000 miles!

So the old fixed date system does not fully reward client loyalty in the same way that a 'rolling' system will.

I hope my example makes things a bit more clear for you?

Your calculations are a bit skewed.

One obtains Silver ROP with 10,000 miles in a year and 15,000 over 2 years. 50,000 for Gold over a year and 80,000 over 2 years.

As stated repeatedly in my post, I was using a hypothetical / fictitious example to demonstrate the workings & qualification process & definitely not quoting actual mileages required by TG.

[iang]

A rolling mileage accrual is in fact advantageous and & an enhancement for ROP members. I will demonstrate how this works with a hypothetical example:

The threshold to go from normal to say silver member in this example is a hypothetical 25,000 miles. Under the old system that 25,000 miles would need to be accrued between Jan & Dec in the same year to qualify for silver.

In my fictitious example, I have several flights booked between July & January, which together would accumulate 27,000 miles in just a 7 month period. Under a 'rolling' qualification system, I'd qualify and have my silver status within 7 months. HOWEVER, under the old Jan - Dec fixed system, as 23,000 miles occurred between Jul - Dec and the balance of of 4,000 miles occurred in Jan, I would NOT qualify for Silver, as over the Jan - Dec period I'd have only accrued 23,000 miles!

So the old fixed date system does not fully reward client loyalty in the same way that a 'rolling' system will.

I hope my example makes things a bit more clear for you?

Thank you. Yes this in itself is clear, however from when to when does the rolling 12 month period commence and end?

I have accrued 20,000 qualifying miles from February this year until now. Under the old system I knew clearly that I needed another 30,000 miles by December 2013 to get an upgrade

to Gold Status. And with two trips planned before then I would be on Gold Status by Jan 2014.

Now I have no idea whether the new rolling system is more advantageous or not but it seems not.

Using your theoretical example and my actual current status could you help with another example for me and tell me when I would qualify for gold status under the rolling system?

Thanks a million in advance

JE

The exact info from TG's website for ROP states:

Attaining Gold Status:

This top tier status is attained with Qualifying Miles, the miles earned with THAI and Star Alliance airlines, during 2 rolling month periods, 50,000 Qualifying miles during a 12 month period, or 80,000 miles during a 24 month period. Additionally, completing 40 international sectors on THAI in any 12 rolling month period also attains Gold status.* This is a system automated process whereby on the most recent activity all eligible flights are evaluated for the past 12 and 24 month periods. With each new flight activity, status is again evaluated during the past 12 and 24 months, ensuring that all eligible flights are counted for attaining Gold status.

*Excluding travel in G/V/W classes for both attaining and retaining Gold status.

Retaining Gold Status:

Evaluations for retaining Gold status are on a personal calendar year based on the validity of your Gold status, On the date which current Gold validity commences, eligible flights are evaluated for the following 12 month period to ascertain if the 50,000 Qualifying Miles threshold or 40 international sectors on THAI are achieved. The same process is done for the next successive 12 month period, until the end of current card validity, for 40 international sectors on THAI, or during the entire 24 month period in which 80,000 Qualifying Miles must be earned.

So to initially qualify for Gold status, you have to achieve 50,000 qualifying miles within any rolling 12 month period, or 80,000 qualifying miles within any rolling 24 month period. So this is within any 12/24 month period.

Therefore based on your holding 20,000 qualifying miles from last Feb, you'd have to achieve a further 30,000 qualifying miles before the anniversary of those first 20,000 miles - so notionally the end of next Jan, but this could run into Feb 14, depending on the anniversary date of the first of those 20,000 points.

If you qualify by then, the calendar stops rolling and you have 12 months from the date you achieved Gold status to requalify. It's not clear on how this requalification process would work for their 80,000 miles in 2 years?

I hope this helps.

[diggledunc]

The original post which I replied to said about collecting miles from Thai flights on another Star Alliance carriers card. If you do this the TG miles flown go on to the other carriers card and never find their way back to TG frequent flyers programme.

Apart from some cheap, heavily discounted fares, you do earn base miles towards your ROP silver or gold qualification when you fly on other Star Alliance carriers, so long as you have your ROP number in the record. I have never had a problem with that, and I have been doing it for 10+ years, through today.

Don't disagree with you but the OP was talking about Thai flights going on another carriers card. Really that's the opposite of what you are referring to which is other carrier's flights on your Thai card and how Thai treat them.

Post #17 illustrates the point I am making on how miles can be treated differently by different carriers.

What I am saying is if you did decide to put your Thai flights on another Star Alliance Carrier's card there is a need to check their approach to these. It may not be the same as Thai's.

[Jobo]

A rolling mileage accrual is in fact advantageous and & an enhancement for ROP members. I will demonstrate how this works with a hypothetical example:

The threshold to go from normal to say silver member in this example is a hypothetical 25,000 miles. Under the old system that 25,000 miles would need to be accrued between Jan & Dec in the same year to qualify for silver.

In my fictitious example, I have several flights booked between July & January, which together would accumulate 27,000 miles in just a 7 month period. Under a 'rolling' qualification system, I'd qualify and have my silver status within 7 months. HOWEVER, under the old Jan - Dec fixed system, as 23,000 miles occurred between Jul - Dec and the balance of of 4,000 miles occurred in Jan, I would NOT qualify for Silver, as over the Jan - Dec period I'd have only accrued 23,000 miles!

So the old fixed date system does not fully reward client loyalty in the same way that a 'rolling' system will.

I hope my example makes things a bit more clear for you?

Thank you. Yes this in itself is clear, however from when to when does the rolling 12 month period commence and end?

I have accrued 20,000 qualifying miles from February this year until now. Under the old system I knew clearly that I needed another 30,000 miles by December 2013 to get an upgrade

to Gold Status. And with two trips planned before then I would be on Gold Status by Jan 2014.

Now I have no idea whether the new rolling system is more advantageous or not but it seems not.

Using your theoretical example and my actual current status could you help with another example for me and tell me when I would qualify for gold status under the rolling system?

Thanks a million in advance

JE

The exact info from TG's website for ROP states:

Attaining Gold Status:

This top tier status is attained with Qualifying Miles, the miles earned with THAI and Star Alliance airlines, during 2 rolling month periods, 50,000 Qualifying miles during a 12 month period, or 80,000 miles during a 24 month period. Additionally, completing 40 international sectors on THAI in any 12 rolling month period also attains Gold status.* This is a system automated process whereby on the most recent activity all eligible flights are evaluated for the past 12 and 24 month periods. With each new flight activity, status is again evaluated during the past 12 and 24 months, ensuring that all eligible flights are counted for attaining Gold status.

*Excluding travel in G/V/W classes for both attaining and retaining Gold status.

Retaining Gold Status:

Evaluations for retaining Gold status are on a personal calendar year based on the validity of your Gold status, On the date which current Gold validity commences, eligible flights are evaluated for the following 12 month period to ascertain if the 50,000 Qualifying Miles threshold or 40 international sectors on THAI are achieved. The same process is done for the next successive 12 month period, until the end of current card validity, for 40 international sectors on THAI, or during the entire 24 month period in which 80,000 Qualifying Miles must be earned.

So to initially qualify for Gold status, you have to achieve 50,000 qualifying miles within any rolling 12 month period, or 80,000 qualifying miles within any rolling 24 month period. So this is within any 12/24 month period.

Therefore based on your holding 20,000 qualifying miles from last Feb, you'd have to achieve a further 30,000 qualifying miles before the anniversary of those first 20,000 miles - so notionally the end of next Jan, but this could run into Feb 14, depending on the anniversary date of the first of those 20,000 points.

If you qualify by then, the calendar stops rolling and you have 12 months from the date you achieved Gold status to requalify. It's not clear on how this requalification process would work for their 80,000 miles in 2 years?

I hope this helps.

Yes that is very helpful and thanks for your input. I hope you are correct as that suits my forthcoming travel plans perfectly.

However your "assumptions" are slightly different from Grant Smith's above but both are very clearly put.

Questions have been resolved unlike the response I've had from ROP itself which has been zero!

[bubba]

The original post which I replied to said about collecting miles from Thai flights on another Star Alliance carriers card. If you do this the TG miles flown go on to the other carriers card and never find their way back to TG frequent flyers programme.

Apart from some cheap, heavily discounted fares, you do earn base miles towards your ROP silver or gold qualification when you fly on other Star Alliance carriers, so long as you have your ROP number in the record. I have never had a problem with that, and I have been doing it for 10+ years, through today.

Don't disagree with you but the OP was talking about Thai flights going on another carriers card. Really that's the opposite of what you are referring to which is other carrier's flights on your Thai card and how Thai treat them.

Post #17 illustrates the point I am making on how miles can be treated differently by different carriers.

What I am saying is if you did decide to put your Thai flights on another Star Alliance Carrier's card there is a need to check their approach to these. It may not be the same as Thai's.

You can fly TG and direct those miles to another Star Alliance carrier's membership number, and those count as base miles towards Silver or Gold qualification.

You can collect miles from other Star Alliance airlines and direct those to your ROP membership number, and those count as base miles towards your Silver and Gold qualification

I have collected miles on my ROP membership number and qualified for ROP Gold using flight mileage from Singapore, Turkish, United, ANA and Asiana flights.

After I qualified for ROP Gold twice in one year, just for fun, I qualified for Gold on United using a combination of Star Alliance miles, including TG flights.

One thing about UA is that they now require that you fly some minimum number of segments on UA to get their Gold, but nearly all the miles can come from another *A airline.