English-language course a hit

[Lite Beer]

EDUCATION
English-language course a hit
Thanapat Kitjakosol,
Wanwisa Putna
The Nation

Ekachai School deputy director Thada Wiriyakul from Samut Prakan

BANGKOK: -- Popular course in Samut Sakhon school is now a prototype to help prepare for the AEC

Initially established to promote goodwill between Thai locals and Myanmar workers and encourage better communication between them at a Samut Sakhon community, an English-lanugage course at a local school has now become a prototype for many schools, amid the need to prepare for the ASEAN Economic Community (AEC) in 2015.

There are now more than 100 Thais, including adults, registering for the course at Ekachai School in Muang district, despite being limited to 60 students, said deputy director Thada Wiriyakul. He said this proved the course's popularity among locals.

The 15-hour course offers lessons focusing on conversation and real-life use rather than memorising from a textbook, he said. Those taking this course are encouraged to speak English even outside classes, or with family members or to each other while in the school compound.

The government school initiated the course a few months ago following the realisation that the English-speaking Thai population is almost the smallest among the 10 ASEAN member states. More than 50 per cent of around 250,000 Cambodian and Myanmar immigrant workers, 50,000 of whom are not registered, who work mostly in the province's fishery industry are able to speak English.

"Just greeting them with Mingkalaba [Hello] can simply yield a smile back, and saying the words 'beautiful' and 'handsome' as compliments to them result in an even broader smile," said Thada. He said good communication between Thai locals and foreign workers could ease tensions and improve relationships overall among the residents.

Ekachai School has been selected as one of four prototypes for the ASEAN Study Centre at the secondary school level. It has been funded jointly by an independent agency Quality Learning Foundation and the Romchatra Foundation, which are supported by local communities based on cooperation from schools, temples and homes.

The school's director, Somchai Chawalitthada, said there were now 10 other schools taking part in this ASEAN Study Centre project, which would also expand to other subjects. They would emphasise on teaching students about social values apart from academic competency, while the focus would remain on the English-language course.

He said a survey revealed that 60 per cent of Thai respondents were aware a little about the AEC and more than half of them did not know how the AEC would impact them when it comes into effect in the next two years. He said the ASEAN Study Centre project would be important along with the government's ongoing public relations drive to promote awareness of the AEC.

Three other prototype English course and ASEAN Study Centre projects at the secondary school level are being implemented at Mae Chan School in Chiang Rai in the North, Phibul Witthayakharn School in Ubon Ratchathani in the Northeast, and Nam Krajai School in Songkhla in the South.

The director of the ASEAN Study Centre project, Wassana Lertsil, said a large number of extensive projects relevant to it were underway. In certain schools in the South, Melayu language courses were given along with English language, and to many businesses located in the North, Myanmar language is taught to Thai employers and locals.

Endorsing this ASEAN Study Centre project at a recent seminar, former Finance Ministry secretary-general Sathit Limphongphan said English and computer literacy among Thai people were essential to keep up with ASEAN members and especially for Thailand's role in the AEC.

-- The Nation 2013-08-25

[chooka]

The 15-hour course offers lessons focusing on conversation and real-life use rather than memorising from a textbook

"saying the words 'beautiful' and 'handsome"'

Sounds like they are establishing a school for Bargirls. I guess the Masters will be when they can link two words together like Handsome man.

[NongKhaiKid]

The 15-hour course offers lessons focusing on conversation and real-life use rather than memorising from a textbook

"saying the words 'beautiful' and 'handsome"'

Sounds like they are establishing a school for Bargirls. I guess the Masters will be when they can link two words together like Handsome man.

I wonder if there are any native speakers involved or is it " English speaking " Thais teaching all the mistakes and bad pronunciation they were themselves taught ?

Conversation and real life use will be a joy to behold given that most Thai teachers shy away from actually speaking too much English because they know they can't.

Students are encouraged to talk English with their family but unless a family is better off and well educated where are all these multiple English speakers to come from ?

It would have been good enough to report these courses were in existence but since everything here has to be bigger and better outrageous claims and comments have to be applied.

[Soutpeel]

The 15-hour course offers lessons focusing on conversation and real-life use rather than memorising from a textbook

"saying the words 'beautiful' and 'handsome"'

Sounds like they are establishing a school for Bargirls. I guess the Masters will be when they can link two words together like Handsome man.

this is the most striking "fact" in this piece for me..."More than 50 per cent of around 250,000 Cambodian and Myanmar immigrant workers, 50,000 of whom are not registered, who work mostly in the province's fishery industry are able to speak English"

Can 50% of the Thai population speak English ?...other than "Heeeello...hansome man" of course

Therefore one must conclude the English education programs in both Cambodia and Burma are more effective than what is happening in Thailand, after all if 50% of "lowly" immigrant workers can speak English, most of whom one assumes have not even completed high school, but the average Thai university graduate cannot string a cohesive senstance together in English....this suggests the english language programs in both countries are more effective or the comparable programs in Thailand are complete cr*p

[dickyknee]

I'm relating this to how much conversational Thai I learnt in 15 hours... which was basically SFA.

This must be a ripper of a course.

[Scott]

Oh, goodness, it's scary to think of some of these people considering themselves experts on teaching English.

[petedk]

15 hours is ample time to learn English!!

Last week I was asked to teach some Thais to speak basic English in four hours.

About 90 government officials are going to travel abroad (sorry don't know where) and they asked me to do a four hour (yes -four!!!) course to teach them basic conversation.

The money they offered was really good but I just couldn't bring myself to do it.

Edited August 25, 2013 by petedk

[doremifasol]

15 hours is ample time to learn English!!

Last week I was asked to teach some Thais to speak basic English in four hours.

About 90 government officials are going to travel abroad (sorry don't know where) and they asked me to do a four hour (yes -four!!!) course to teach them basic conversation.

The money they offered was really good but I just couldn't bring myself to do it.

Four hours..........What a joke!!!

[theblether]

The government should ask TESOL to test all Thai national English teachers to see if they are fit and proficient to teach.

Oh, cancel that, the results would be too embarrassing.

It's better to save embarrassment than to actually drive up teaching standards.

@soutpeel, crap isn't the word. I've only ever met one Thai that taught English, she worked in the local bar as a waitress. I had noted that she was easily the worst English speaker in the place, with an annoyingly limited vocabulary which she insisted on using on me 10 times a night.

I was stunned, absolutely gobsmacked when I was told that she was a full time English teacher. When I incredulously questioned her about it she beamed with pride that she was a teacher and told me all about her day job.

One of the other waitresses had to translate for her.

Seriously.

Edited August 25, 2013 by theblether

[bigbamboo]

With English set to be become the effective lingua franca of ASEAN at least there are some people here who are in a small way, albeit a very small way, at least attempting to address the issue of Thailand's problem in this area.

Of course, as with so many things, it is far too little too late.

[Soutpeel]

15 hours is ample time to learn English!!

Last week I was asked to teach some Thais to speak basic English in four hours.

About 90 government officials are going to travel abroad (sorry don't know where) and they asked me to do a four hour (yes -four!!!) course to teach them basic conversation.

The money they offered was really good but I just couldn't bring myself to do it.

cant see what the problem is, after all we are in country, which will solve the "Southern problems" in 90 days, Bangkok will be free of drugs in 30 days and mafia gangs will be put out of business in 90 days, and is the center known universe....teaching basic English in 4 hours...easy, whats wrong with you farang...A Thai "English" teacher can do it..so why cant you ?....

[IMA_FARANG]

Can 50% of the Thai population speak English ?...other than "Heeeello...hansome man" of course

------------------

My Thai GF's oldest daughter is a stall holder in a market in Bangkok.

She is quite capable of holding a conversation in reasonable English with any farang customer who wants to buy at her stall.

I think she is more representative of many Thais who work outside a bar to make their living than the ones you've apparently been speaking to most of your time in Thailand.

And, in spite of what you've apparently been seeing, more than 50% of Thais have jobs OUTSIDE of bars.

And often their job requires good English conversation.

[culicine]

Apart from the Philipinos in my school, the best non-native speakers were the Burmese staff. Mind you I'm assuming they were from better-off families and have a good education or went to international schools there. I'm hard pressed to believe 50% of the working class from surrounding countries 'speak english'....or perhaps the the average Thai....saying 'handsome' is considered as such! Been nice to see staff in the 7-11 speaking a little english to me theses days. Wouldn't have happened 10 years ago.

Clearly, many in this country are reactive and not proactive - in the end they will learn english out of necessity, and will not prepare over the next few years. Several billion baht would need to be spent on intensive courses in schools and private schools to get people up to a reasonable level. It hasn't happened in the past and I don't see that happening any time soon.

[hookedondhamma]

The 15-hour course offers lessons focusing on conversation and real-life use rather than memorising from a textbook

"saying the words 'beautiful' and 'handsome"'

Sounds like they are establishing a school for Bargirls. I guess the Masters will be when they can link two words together like Handsome man.

I like your sense of humour!

[lemonjelly]

Just to counter the the sunday morning's grumpy old men's gang..... think teaching conversational English rather than grammar alone is a move in the right direction. I've been involved in a similar project here in the south, and the students have been really enthusiastic,

especially enjoying role plays to practice conversations. I do emmpathise with them, I can't remember much of the French from my school years.

[Scott]

It's really a crap shoot when it comes to English Language Skills. I stopped to get gas in the middle of nowhere in a place two provinces away from Bangkok. The young man, with shaggy hair, filthy clothes and yellow teeth said, "May I help you?" I told him to fill it up with 95. When he was done he told me the amount owed in English and I asked for a receipt in English and got it.

In the same province, I stopped at a local shopping mall to ask for directions and no one would speak English and were running away like the place was on fire! I did manage to get someone 'cornered' and asked for the directions of where I wanted to go. The person did grunt out a few words in English and did some pointing. Obviously they understood, but were very shy to actually try and speak English.

[tingtong]

happened after we moved countryside...2 yrs or so back.

amphur school, pratom/grade 4...beginning of the school year teacher asked on parents (and kids) meeting, raise the hand who cant read.

half the class had ( kid or parents for kids, as kids kind a shy)...

i was shocked!

after all they attemped that same school for 3 yrs already. my son was new there, obviously.

and the real shocking? it was READING THAI...or not being able to, actually!!

so, what to expect from the similar schools when teaching English?

kids often "taught" from kindergarten till university arent able to speak a bit. i know it isnt easy to have a different than your own second language to learn, it wasnt easy to me neither...but i havent learned just for 4 yrs in school, so, for sure, they could fare lot better than i did/do.

i fully agree, that "teachers" should have a standard test to pass, a test not set by thai standards, nor could be passed corruptly, ie. supervised by some foreign institution? to raise the level of thai teachers to international standards.

but then, again, i am afraid, it would not be only teaching English, but a whole bunch of other subjects that also would need to have normal standards of teaching.

[kuiburi]

The 15-hour course offers lessons focusing on conversation and real-life use rather than memorising from a textbook

"saying the words 'beautiful' and 'handsome"'

Sounds like they are establishing a school for Bargirls. I guess the Masters will be when they can link two words together like Handsome man.

Most bargirls seem to be still at the course , they mix Thai and English . When they greet u with " Hello Darkling " (wish means "hello monkeyass" )

If atleast they would teach them the word "Darling" then I would feel much better .

Allthough it's funny to see some fat farrang being greeted with "Hello Darkling" and the guy gets a big grin on his face , not understanding what they say .

[notmyself]

I wonder if one could get an ED visa with them on the cheap. Can't see why not if they are accredited. On a slightly unrelated note, does anyone know the legal technicalities (if any) of holding a funeral for someone who hasn't died? I'm planning a bit of a party but don't want to get in trouble obviously.

[Soutpeel]

Can 50% of the Thai population speak English ?...other than "Heeeello...hansome man" of course

------------------

My Thai GF's oldest daughter is a stall holder in a market in Bangkok.

She is quite capable of holding a conversation in reasonable English with any farang customer who wants to buy at her stall.

I think she is more representative of many Thais who work outside a bar to make their living than the ones you've apparently been speaking to most of your time in Thailand.

And, in spite of what you've apparently been seeing, more than 50% of Thais have jobs OUTSIDE of bars.

And often their job requires good English conversation.

My "heello hansome man" remake was made tougue in cheek, and obviously your trying to suggest my only experience in Thailand is from a bar stool in places frequented by BG's...which is simply not true, because Mrs Soutpeel would not be happy with me, but nice try anyway trying to turn it into a sexpat/barstool thing......

Completely disagree with your assessment, having been in many cities/towns etc in Thailand, not only BKK, and in my opinion English conversational skills generally are exeptionally poor, if one say compares similar situations in Cambodia, were people seem quite comfortable working between 2, 3,4 languages...ie English,French, Khmer and even Thai.

So I will state my question again....do we think 50% of Thai population have decent English conversation skills...in my opinion of 13 years here...the answer is no...and I would put the number at maybe 10-15%...but of course we are going to debate..what exactly constitutes decent conversation English...

so I am awaiting in anticipation for your comment that I should move to Cambodia or I should learn Thai then...

[ratcatcher]

It's really a crap shoot when it comes to English Language Skills. I stopped to get gas in the middle of nowhere in a place two provinces away from Bangkok. The young man, with shaggy hair, filthy clothes and yellow teeth said, "May I help you?" I told him to fill it up with 95. When he was done he told me the amount owed in English and I asked for a receipt in English and got it.

In the same province, I stopped at a local shopping mall to ask for directions and no one would speak English and were running away like the place was on fire! I did manage to get someone 'cornered' and asked for the directions of where I wanted to go. The person did grunt out a few words in English and did some pointing. Obviously they understood, but were very shy to actually try and speak English.

Many of the petrol / LPG stations in the central plains and lower north where I have stopped employ Burmese workers. Many are quite proficient in basic English. BTW you were lucky to get 95, must have been a Shell or Esso? Or was that a blend?

Your comment about shopping malls is quite accurate, most banks, supermarkets can barely muster one basic English speaker and the look of fear in the eyes of those you ask is scary.

Edited August 25, 2013 by ratcatcher

[Scott]

It's really a crap shoot when it comes to English Language Skills. I stopped to get gas in the middle of nowhere in a place two provinces away from Bangkok. The young man, with shaggy hair, filthy clothes and yellow teeth said, "May I help you?" I told him to fill it up with 95. When he was done he told me the amount owed in English and I asked for a receipt in English and got it.

In the same province, I stopped at a local shopping mall to ask for directions and no one would speak English and were running away like the place was on fire! I did manage to get someone 'cornered' and asked for the directions of where I wanted to go. The person did grunt out a few words in English and did some pointing. Obviously they understood, but were very shy to actually try and speak English.

Many of the petrol / LPG stations in the central plains and lower north where I have stopped employ Burmese workers. Many are quite proficient in basic English. BTW you were lucky to get 95, must have been a Shell or Esso? Or was that a blend?

Your comment about shopping malls is quite accurate, most banks, supermarkets can barely muster one basic English speaker and the look of fear in the eyes of those you ask is scary.

I would never speak English in a bank. I'm afraid I'd get arrested for attempted robbery.

[sms747]

Can 50% of the Thai population speak English ?...other than "Heeeello...hansome man" of course

------------------

My Thai GF's oldest daughter is a stall holder in a market in Bangkok.

She is quite capable of holding a conversation in reasonable English with any farang customer who wants to buy at her stall.

I think she is more representative of many Thais who work outside a bar to make their living than the ones you've apparently been speaking to most of your time in Thailand.

And, in spite of what you've apparently been seeing, more than 50% of Thais have jobs OUTSIDE of bars.

And often their job requires good English conversation.

Why is it then that Bank staff, including tourist areas, and who have all been to Uni are so poor at communicating in English? Even basic banking terms seem to be beyond them and usually they have to call for the one person in the branch who can at least understand what is being said in English. Go outside and market staff, tuk tuk drivers and waitresses can all communicate, bank staff -forget it.

[pookiki]

I teach conversational English as a volunteer at the Migrant Worker Rights Network School in Mahachai and at the Dear Burma school in Bangkok. I have been teaching in Mahachai for nearly a year now. I teach 2 and a half hours every Sunday. I have also attempted to teach English to Thai students as well. The biggest stumbling block I have encountered is correct pronunciation. I agree with several of the posts that Thais and Burmese need to learn from a native speaker. Otherwise, they will not learn to speak English correctly. Luckily, I have studied Thai, Burmese, and Cambodian at the University of Hawaii years ago along with quite a few linguistic courses. Therefore, I know the pitfalls of pronunciation that exist.

Unfortunately, a person's ability to learn a foreign language is directly proportional to the amount of time the student is able to use the language outside the classroom. The Thai government, if they are really interested in their students learning conversational English, will rely exclusively on native speakers who have a good grasp of teaching English. As long as they are more concerned with credentials than competence, it will never happen.

[Soutpeel]

Just to counter the the sunday morning's grumpy old men's gang..... think teaching conversational English rather than grammar alone is a move in the right direction. I've been involved in a similar project here in the south, and the students have been really enthusiastic,

especially enjoying role plays to practice conversations. I do emmpathise with them, I can't remember much of the French from my school years.

fully agree with you, the fact is, as first languge English speaker, we did not learn the languge by being taught grammer, for most of who were taught English grammar in say high school, I will hazard a guess that most of us hated it and dont remember any of it... know I certainly did, and was thown out the class on more than 1 occassion, simply because it was boring, but it hasnt impacted on my ability to converse or communicate in English

For the little bit I have seen as regards teaching English in Thailand, far too much emphasis is put on grammar

[kuiburi]

Guess it's all about the will to learn .I have a low education levell . The way i learned English was listening to music and watching movies that where not sychonized . Just eager to understand . I learned my mom English this was and now do the same with my kids . For an english student thats insecure about his or her skills its hard to speak in public because they are shy . Singing some favorit songs in public is much easier . BTW. Asians love karaoke , like "countly load" and stuff like this .

[Suffinator]

15 hour course? Do they really think this will help them compete in the AEC?

Can Thailand Successfully Compete Within the AEC

[Soutpeel]

Guess it's all about the will to learn .I have a low education levell . The way i learned English was listening to music and watching movies that where not sychonized . Just eager to understand . I learned my mom English this was and now do the same with my kids . For an english student thats insecure about his or her skills its hard to speak in public because they are shy . Singing some favorit songs in public is much easier . BTW. Asians love karaoke , like "countly load" and stuff like this .

Let me ask you this...how useful was learning English grammar...if in fact you were taught any ?...

[soomak]

Can 50% of the Thai population speak English ?...other than "Heeeello...hansome man" of course

------------------

My Thai GF's oldest daughter is a stall holder in a market in Bangkok.

She is quite capable of holding a conversation in reasonable English with any farang customer who wants to buy at her stall.

I think she is more representative of many Thais who work outside a bar to make their living than the ones you've apparently been speaking to most of your time in Thailand.

And, in spite of what you've apparently been seeing, more than 50% of Thais have jobs OUTSIDE of bars.

And often their job requires good English conversation.

Well my GF worked in a bank in Central Bang-Na (a big shopping mall in bkk). All of the branch employees (8 if I recall correctly) had university degrees of course.

She told me that none of them can speak even basic English, and she needs to help foreign customers although it's not her job to service the customers.

Waiters at restaurants usually can't speak English apart from a few words, and so do the 7-11 clerks.

I myself have helped a college student with some English lessons, and she couldn't speak or understand my speech at all. She could read and write quite well.

[Docno]

The 15-hour course offers lessons focusing on conversation and real-life use rather than memorising from a textbook

"saying the words 'beautiful' and 'handsome"'

Sounds like they are establishing a school for Bargirls. I guess the Masters will be when they can link two words together like Handsome man.

this is the most striking "fact" in this piece for me..."More than 50 per cent of around 250,000 Cambodian and Myanmar immigrant workers, 50,000 of whom are not registered, who work mostly in the province's fishery industry are able to speak English"

Can 50% of the Thai population speak English ?...other than "Heeeello...hansome man" of course

Therefore one must conclude the English education programs in both Cambodia and Burma are more effective than what is happening in Thailand, after all if 50% of "lowly" immigrant workers can speak English, most of whom one assumes have not even completed high school, but the average Thai university graduate cannot string a cohesive senstance together in English....this suggests the english language programs in both countries are more effective or the comparable programs in Thailand are complete cr*p

It does not necessarily have anything to do with the quality of the programmes in Cambodia and Burma. I've spent a lot of time in Cambodia, and I can tell you that being able to speak English is seen as a prerequisite for success for the middle class and a prerequisite for survival for the poor. Go to the tourist areas, and you'll come across hordes of multi-lingual kids (it's not just English that they speak). It's all a matter of motivation. Few Thais, relatively speaking, aspire to working outside of Thailand, few grow up wanting to work in the tourism (or related) industry, etc etc. Being able to speak English makes a bigger difference in a place like Cambodia than in Thailand.

When I first met my girlfriend, my Thai was actually better than her English. She said that in school she (and her friends) didn't put much effort into English because, after all, they were living in a farming community in Isaan and why would they need it? [similar to my logic for sleeping during Calculus classes]. Three years later, and her English has far surpassed my Thai simply because she is now motivated and she made the effort to learn (for example, she would write every sms/email message I sent to her in a book as a way of learning new words).