Is rape prevalent in Thailand?

[Sheryl]

An off topic remark has been removed. Please stay on topic.

[evadgib]

Years ago I recall being served by a young girl (teens/20's) in a convenience store on a remote island in the Gulf of Thailand.

She had been beaten black and blue & in clear need of medical assistance.

On asking around I established that she had been gang raped by up to a dozen of the undocumented types to be found in such places.

The police hadn't done anything, she hadn't received any medical attention & had gone back to work the following morning while some of the alleged perpetrators were seen laughing & gloating outside.

My understanding of the above was that it was some sort of retribution or punishment.

Quite how a culture allows this is beyond me.

Edited September 26, 2013 by evadgib

[snake24]

Years ago I recall being served by a young girl (teens/20's) in a convenience store on a remote island in the Gulf of Thailand.

She had been beaten black and blue & in clear need of medical assistance.

On asking around I established that she had been gang raped by up to a dozen of the undocumented types to be found in such places.

The police hadn't done anything, she hadn't received any medical attention & had gone back to work the following morning while some of the alleged perpetrators were seen laughing & gloating outside.

My understanding of the above was that it was some sort of retribution or punishment.

Quite how a culture allows this is beyond me.

Did those that rape her were foreign or local men?

[dannyman]

Are you the one get real

[umbanda]

Have statistics saying that 1 in 4 Thai women are victims of rape, most of the time by family members....Talking with women I dated, asking them why is a custom for Thai decent women to take a friend to first dates with men, they responded that it is very common for Thai boys to try to have sex with a girl if they are alone.. Most of rapes cases happens with teenagers and are not reported. Say NO do not have meaning to them......because it is also a Thai women custom is to say NO...for few minutes...before going to bed. I also learned that NO means YES most of the times.

Confusing Thai customs...

[umbanda]

You're figures are all wrong.......that being said the actual figures are still horrific. Here's an abstract of the report you are referring to......

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-24021573

I don't have figures for rape in Thailand however I do know anecdotally Thai women regard it as a clear and present danger.

After being shocked by those statistics I perused this link to find that one of the questions asked was

"Have you ever had sex with your partner when you knew she didn't want to but you thought she should agree because she's your wife/ partner?"

Nothing about force or violence. This question could easily be taken as she wasn't in the mood but she let me anyway.

Rape is a very charged word and this article/study , to me, seems to have been designed to shock and outrage people rather than to inform people. Manipulating surveys to fit an agenda is nothing new.

I have an 11 year old daughter in Thailand so this study aroused particular interest in me. After reading the article I lost faith in the study as I believe it has little credibility and is pushing an agenda. Although I sympathize with the agenda of combating rape, I hate when people try to inflate a problem to manipulate the masses.

If you have a 11 years old daughter here, I will tell her the same many Thai mothers tell to their teenager daughters....to avoid being alone with any boy or man in any situation...even a very close relative. Sounds drastic, but that problem is not exclusive to Asian countries. I am a father of 2 now grown daughters in Brazil. Thanks God, Brazilian parents and teachers are open minded enough to talk freely with teenagers about sex and to prepare them for any bad situation...but...that is not common in most other countries....and not in Thailand at all.

[itsrebel]

Have statistics saying that 1 in 4 Thai women are victims of rape, most of the time by family members....Talking with women I dated, asking them why is a custom for Thai decent women to take a friend to first dates with men, they responded that it is very common for Thai boys to try to have sex with a girl if they are alone.. Most of rapes cases happens with teenagers and are not reported. Say NO do not have meaning to them......because it is also a Thai women custom is to say NO...for few minutes...before going to bed. I also learned that NO means YES most of the times.

Confusing Thai customs...

That reminds me of testimony from a man charged with date rape. It was on a show based on real life cases. He was convicted (thankfully).

Dude No means No. If the girl wants to have it, she will let you know.

Edited September 30, 2013 by metisdead
30) Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes, added emoticons, or altered wording.

[amykat]

We have several neighbors who work in the adult entertainment zones as bar girls and it is very common among the punters who use bar girls. Although they do not classify it as "rape" as they are "purchasing" a product the acts committed on some of these girls would get the "johns" arrested in the majority of the Western countries.....the locals are far worse though.

Utter shit. If consent is given then it is not rape.

Please desist from posting such nonsense.

Garbage

I agree with rct99q, just about every BG will be able to recount a story of where they had to flee a room as they were being brutalized. Intercourse is one thing, assault and brutalization is quite another.

You buy the right to have consensual intercourse, not the right to rape them.

Hi thebleter,

I'm surely being nitpicky with what I am about to say, and it isn't meant against you, I am sure you are a gentleman and this was just a quick post ...but I would say "you buy their consent to intercourse" and not you buy the "right to ..." This is probably what some customers think though, they have the "right to ...whatever" Small difference it might seem, but the thinking behind it is what counts.

On another hand, if prostitution is illegal, could it be argued that since one cannot "contract to things that are not legal" that they are unable, therefore to give consent? I don't know, just thinking here ...I'm probably wrong about this, but interesting to think about (for me anyway).

[amykat]

We have several neighbors who work in the adult entertainment zones as bar girls and it is very common among the punters who use bar girls. Although they do not classify it as "rape" as they are "purchasing" a product the acts committed on some of these girls would get the "johns" arrested in the majority of the Western countries.....the locals are far worse though.

Utter shit. If consent is given then it is not rape.

Please desist from posting such nonsense.

You buy the right to have consensual intercourse

As a man of the law I have to say these words caught my attention. Though I am still not sure what to make of them. A matter of definition and terminology, perhaps.

From a strict legal perspective I doubt the word "right" is used correctly in the sentence above.

But as I said, I'm still not sure...what say you?

Forethat,

I didn't see your post before I posted above. But I see we have some like-minded people here. Maybe a small group who attended law school at some point in their life? Good post and I agree obviously.

[amykat]

I take your point Forethat, especially in regards to the prostitution issue which is illegal in this country so by dint any contract would be unenforceable. I suppose a different phrase is that you are buying the expectation of intercourse, however we could end up in a legalistic angels on a pin argument.

Woops, sorry I didn't read this one either before I posted my initial post here. Sorry to TV readers. Usually, I read the whole thing before responding, but sometimes when there are pages of posts, I think I will forget some of the important points ...and so I answer. I think I will just finish reading this. Sorry again to make the same points as other people already did.

[Sceptict11]

In societies where women have a low social status rape tends to be common.

In patriarchal rural societies it is often difficult if not impossible for such assaults to be reported.

In some societies even reporting rape is dangerous to women as they may be blamed and punished for engaging in an "illegal" activity.

The problem will not improve until women are valued as equals and girls have access to education by right.

[thaibeachlovers]

We have several neighbors who work in the adult entertainment zones as bar girls and it is very common among the punters who use bar girls. Although they do not classify it as "rape" as they are "purchasing" a product the acts committed on some of these girls would get the "johns" arrested in the majority of the Western countries.....the locals are far worse though.

Utter shit. If consent is given then it is not rape.

Please desist from posting such nonsense.

Garbage

I agree with rct99q, just about every BG will be able to recount a story of where they had to flee a room as they were being brutalized. Intercourse is one thing, assault and brutalization is quite another.

You buy the right to have consensual intercourse, not the right to rape them.

Hi thebleter,

I'm surely being nitpicky with what I am about to say, and it isn't meant against you, I am sure you are a gentleman and this was just a quick post ...but I would say "you buy their consent to intercourse" and not you buy the "right to ..." This is probably what some customers think though, they have the "right to ...whatever" Small difference it might seem, but the thinking behind it is what counts.

On another hand, if prostitution is illegal, could it be argued that since one cannot "contract to things that are not legal" that they are unable, therefore to give consent? I don't know, just thinking here ...I'm probably wrong about this, but interesting to think about (for me anyway).

In fact, when a man ( woman ) pays the bar in Thailand, s/he is paying for her/ him to accompany him/ her ( or more correctly compensating the bar owner for the loss of the worker from the bar ), and anything that happens after that is between the customer and the worker. If that "anything" was for sex, then payment would indeed be the right to have sex, not to take her out to dinner etc, IMO.

[thaibeachlovers]

In societies where women have a low social status rape tends to be common.

In patriarchal rural societies it is often difficult if not impossible for such assaults to be reported.

In some societies even reporting rape is dangerous to women as they may be blamed and punished for engaging in an "illegal" activity.

The problem will not improve until women are valued as equals and girls have access to education by right.

< until women are valued as equals>

Faint hope of that in the Muslim religion, as in the Koran women are OFFICIALY valued as less worth. For instance, in the case of rape, I believe it needs 4 male eyewitnesses to testify ( correct me if I'm wrong ), and I know for a fact that after a father dies, female children are given less than male children under Sharia law.

[Jayroo]

We have several neighbors who work in the adult entertainment zones as bar girls and it is very common among the punters who use bar girls. Although they do not classify it as "rape" as they are "purchasing" a product the acts committed on some of these girls would get the "johns" arrested in the majority of the Western countries.....the locals are far worse though.

Utter shit. If consent is given then it is not rape.

Please desist from posting such nonsense.

Garbage

I agree with rct99q, just about every BG will be able to recount a story of where they had to flee a room as they were being brutalized. Intercourse is one thing, assault and brutalization is quite another.

You buy the right to have consensual intercourse, not the right to rape them.

I suggest you use a dictionary if you don't know what words mean before you comment, as your above post makes absolutely no sense.

[ravip]

In societies where women have a low social status rape tends to be common.

In patriarchal rural societies it is often difficult if not impossible for such assaults to be reported.

In some societies even reporting rape is dangerous to women as they may be blamed and punished for engaging in an "illegal" activity.

The problem will not improve until women are valued as equals and girls have access to education by right.

< until women are valued as equals>

Faint hope of that in the Muslim religion, as in the Koran women are OFFICIALY valued as less worth. For instance, in the case of rape, I believe it needs 4 male eyewitnesses to testify ( correct me if I'm wrong ), and I know for a fact that after a father dies, female children are given less than male children under Sharia law.

in the Koran women are OFFICIALY valued as less worth.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

In Saudi Arabia when a man wants to marry, he has to pay a substantial amount of money to 'buy' his wife.

Why?

[boomerangutang]

In societies where women have a low social status rape tends to be common.

In patriarchal rural societies it is often difficult if not impossible for such assaults to be reported.

In some societies even reporting rape is dangerous to women as they may be blamed and punished for engaging in an "illegal" activity.

The problem will not improve until women are valued as equals and girls have access to education by right.

< until women are valued as equals>

Faint hope of that in the Muslim religion, as in the Koran women are OFFICIALY valued as less worth. For instance, in the case of rape, I believe it needs 4 male eyewitnesses to testify ( correct me if I'm wrong ), and I know for a fact that after a father dies, female children are given less than male children under Sharia law.

in the Koran women are OFFICIALY valued as less worth.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

In Saudi Arabia when a man wants to marry, he has to pay a substantial amount of money to 'buy' his wife.

Why?

Same in Thailand, though it applies more so when a farang wants a Thai or hill tribe lady, than if a Thai wants her for marriage. It's seen as a commodity. In other words, if the family can get 100,000 or 1 million or 5 million baht for their daughter getting married, then they'll gladly ask for it. For the same girl, if looking to marry a Thai, the 'sin sod' (dowry) amount might be 1/20th the farang rateor no money at all (probably just promises).

Farang are known to be loose with paying for such things, so (the Thais think) 'why not take the money - the dumb farang is willing to shell out'

[theblether]

We have several neighbors who work in the adult entertainment zones as bar girls and it is very common among the punters who use bar girls. Although they do not classify it as "rape" as they are "purchasing" a product the acts committed on some of these girls would get the "johns" arrested in the majority of the Western countries.....the locals are far worse though.

Utter shit. If consent is given then it is not rape.

Please desist from posting such nonsense.

Garbage

I agree with rct99q, just about every BG will be able to recount a story of where they had to flee a room as they were being brutalized. Intercourse is one thing, assault and brutalization is quite another.

You buy the right to have consensual intercourse, not the right to rape them.

I suggest you use a dictionary if you don't know what words mean before you comment, as your above post makes absolutely no sense.

Read the rest of the topic and work it out for yourself. The post has been covered already.

[ABCer]

Blether, here is one, specially for you.

No - from a woman quite often means - Maybe...

Maybe - from a woman almost always means - Yes...

Yes - from a woman raises a question - What kind of a woman is she? ...

(that was a joke, of course)

And here is a real story. A very attractive young lady once told me that she never ever can be raped.

When asked how can she be so sure she said: -

'Rape is so awful and traumatic... I will rather give my consent before it happens. And no male is quick enough...'

(this sounds as a joke but she was quite serious)

[johntren]

Buried deep in this thread is a post aggressively attacking someone for pressing the Like button.

Given the legal framework of the country in which most of us choose to live, and recent statements from the authorities on Facebook posts & sweets, this strikes me as disturbing.

What are we becoming?

Can we all just take a moment to draw breath, please?

Sent from my GT-S7500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Mr Average]

No - from a woman quite often means - Maybe...

Maybe - from a woman almost always means - Yes...

Yes - from a woman raises a question - What kind of a woman is she? ...

In a romantic setting, the word 'no' usually means 'yes'.

Men who don't know this are either inexperienced or 'nice guys'.

Girls aren't stupid. They know what they want. They know too that saying 'yes' either cheapens them or deprives the man of his feeling of conquest.

[Jayroo]

Garbage

I agree with rct99q, just about every BG will be able to recount a story of where they had to flee a room as they were being brutalized. Intercourse is one thing, assault and brutalization is quite another.

You buy the right to have consensual intercourse, not the right to rape them.

I suggest you use a dictionary if you don't know what words mean before you comment, as your above post makes absolutely no sense.

Read the rest of the topic and work it out for yourself. The post has been covered already.

I don't need to, plus you have no idea what you are talking about.

[GuestHouse]

No - from a woman quite often means - Maybe...

Maybe - from a woman almost always means - Yes...

Yes - from a woman raises a question - What kind of a woman is she? ...

In a romantic setting, the word 'no' usually means 'yes'.

Men who don't know this are either inexperienced or 'nice guys'.

Girls aren't stupid. They know what they want. They know too that saying 'yes' either cheapens them or deprives the man of his feeling of conquest.

NO means NO in any setting.

[farang000999]

It makes you wonder if all that supposed "political correctness back home" might actually serve a purpose in terms of equality of the sexes.

[Mr Average]

No - from a woman quite often means - Maybe...

Maybe - from a woman almost always means - Yes...

Yes - from a woman raises a question - What kind of a woman is she? ...

In a romantic setting, the word 'no' usually means 'yes'.

Men who don't know this are either inexperienced or 'nice guys'.

Girls aren't stupid. They know what they want. They know too that saying 'yes' either cheapens them or deprives the man of his feeling of conquest.

NO means NO in any setting.

Your inexperience is charming. And somewhat nostalgic.

It reminds me of the time when I was very young. I remember asking my mum what girls want. And she said .............

"Girls want nice men. Girls want polite men. Girls like men who are gentlemen".

Some men eventually realize that everything their mum told them was a lie. And they work out why it was a lie. But some men don't.

There are two types of men in this world, Mr Guesthouse. There are men who know the truth; and there are men who don't.

Some men are sexually very successful, and some men aren't.

Some men know how to play the game, and some men don't.

Some men know that NO (in a romantic setting) means YES; some men don't.

*********************

If it's of any consolation, it took me years to work out the truth.

But when you know the truth, it's just so obvious. And when you look back on your failed amorous encounters, you'll see that the truth was obvious all the time.

The truth was always there right in front of your eyes, but you were just too dumb to see it and act on it.

And that's why you were (and perhaps still are) a 'nice guy'.

And that's why you never got the girl.

Edited September 30, 2013 by Mr Average

[itsrebel]

No - from a woman quite often means - Maybe...

Maybe - from a woman almost always means - Yes...

Yes - from a woman raises a question - What kind of a woman is she? ...

In a romantic setting, the word 'no' usually means 'yes'.

Men who don't know this are either inexperienced or 'nice guys'.

Girls aren't stupid. They know what they want. They know too that saying 'yes' either cheapens them or deprives the man of his feeling of conquest.

NO means NO in any setting.

Your inexperience is charming. And somewhat nostalgic.

It reminds me of the time when I was very young. I remember asking my mum what girls want. And she said .............

"Girls want nice men. Girls want polite men. Girls like men who are gentlemen".

Some men eventually realize that everything their mum told them was a lie. And they work out why it was a lie. But some men don't.

There are two types of men in this world, Mr Guesthouse. There are men who know the truth; and there are men who don't.

Some men are sexually very successful, and some men aren't.

Some men know how to play the game, and some men don't.

Some men know that NO (in a romantic setting) means YES; some men don't.

And then there are men who go to prison because they "knew" that NO meant YES.

[Mr Average]

And then there are men who go to prison because they "knew" that NO meant YES.

The key phrase in my post is ROMANTIC SETTING.

[GuestHouse]

NO means NO in any setting.

Your inexperience is charming. And somewhat nostalgic.

It reminds me of the time when I was very young. I remember asking my mum what girls want. And she said .............

"Girls want nice men. Girls want polite men. Girls like men who are gentlemen".

Some men eventually realize that everything their mum told them was a lie. And they work out why it was a lie. But some men don't.

There are two types of men in this world, Mr Guesthouse. There are men who know the truth; and there are men who don't.

Some men are sexually very successful, and some men aren't.

Some men know how to play the game, and some men don't.

Some men know that NO (in a romantic setting) means YES; some men don't.

*********************

If it's of any consolation, it took me years to work out the truth.

But when you know the truth, it's just so obvious. And when you look back on your failed amorous encounters, you'll see that the truth was obvious all the time.

The truth was always there right in front of your eyes, but you were just too dumb to see it and act on it.

And that's why you were (and perhaps still are) a 'nice guy'.

And that's why you never got the girl.

So you have mum issues.

Next.

[soomak]

Very interesting read so far! And this one comes close to the verdict in the Delhi rape case, which on the face of it appears to be the correct one.

I have but a few things to add here.

First off - I recently met a 40 something Thai woman, who said she was raped five years ago by five people and then they threw her into a river to die, but a fisherman saved her life. She was disowned by her family because this happened and she wanted to go to the police. She hasn't spoken to her family since, but they made sure that she wasn't able to file the case. How they accomplished that, she didn't want to get into. It was getting very hard for her to talk about this by this part, and I chose not to push her further. Thankfully, she is doing relatively alright now and has since been able to start her own business far far away from her home city.

Although, I don't have any statistics to cite, I think it is a safe bet to say that Thailand does not do a whole lot better than say India.

Second - someone mentioned the "Indian trash" - I hope they realize that not all Indian men are rapists. But I will also add at this point that there is a problem in that country on how women are treated. But that is a much larger discussion and probably not fit for this thread.

About the BG issue. I think it is kind of a rape. Not to trivialize the sufferings of women such as mentioned earlier, but paying for an intercourse where one party is most likely doing it because she is unable to provide for herself or her family is an "economic rape". It is similar to a gun being pointed at her, of course the "gun" here being the one of hunger and starvation or watching her kids suffer due to poverty. I do understand that there are some BGs who choose to do what they do for other reasons, but I believe the vast majority don't.

So according to you, it's "economic rape" because of hunger and starvation or watching her kids suffer due to poverty, this thread just gets better, talk about demeaning the meaning of rape.

All the guy's in Pattaya/Bangkok/Hua Hin etc etc are raping women because they pay a bargirl for consensual sex because her kids are starving and suffering due to poverty.....I'm off for a lie down to contemplate my sins of the past...

I really do believe so. In my view, if the bar girls were able to get other jobs that paid decent money they would most definitely choose those other jobs. So they are in a way forced into this profession, sometimes not just driven by economic conditions but trafficking, and are forced to have sex with strange men for money. Just because the world, the governments, their families or whoever is not able to provide them the education and/or job opportunities.

In the perfect world, these girls would have gotten a decent education and there would have been jobs available for them and they wouldn't have been forced into selling their bodies for money. So it is "economic rape" based on what they have been provided by the society.

And as I said earlier, I am not trying to trivialize the plight of women/girls that have been forcibly raped. But let's consider this, a girl/woman who is forced to sell her body also has to cope with the fact that may be if she could have done something different she would have been spared this shitty "job". You hear people talking about getting up in the morning and going to a job they don't like and how they dread it. Can you even begin to imagine what a girl/woman, who sells her body for money, might feel about going to her "job"? And it is not a one-off, it happens day after day after day.

I am not condemning anyone here. Everyone has a right to choose what they do.

The only ones who might be "forcing" these Thai women to go work in the bars are their families.

This happens the according to the Thai culture. Never heard of this happening in my country.

As for them being raped because they can't get a high paying job, that's one of the most illogical arguments I heard recently.

What about all the waitresses? Tesco-Lotus cashiers? Sellers in the market? The laundry women across the street?

According to you they all must go work in the bars, because they can't make much money...

If some bar girls are forced or pushed to this job, it's either by their parents, or by their husband/boyfriend.

[Mr Average]

NO means NO in any setting.

Your inexperience is charming. And somewhat nostalgic.

It reminds me of the time when I was very young. I remember asking my mum what girls want. And she said .............

"Girls want nice men. Girls want polite men. Girls like men who are gentlemen".

Some men eventually realize that everything their mum told them was a lie. And they work out why it was a lie. But some men don't.

There are two types of men in this world, Mr Guesthouse. There are men who know the truth; and there are men who don't.

Some men are sexually very successful, and some men aren't.

Some men know how to play the game, and some men don't.

Some men know that NO (in a romantic setting) means YES; some men don't.

*********************

If it's of any consolation, it took me years to work out the truth.

But when you know the truth, it's just so obvious. And when you look back on your failed amorous encounters, you'll see that the truth was obvious all the time.

The truth was always there right in front of your eyes, but you were just too dumb to see it and act on it.

And that's why you were (and perhaps still are) a 'nice guy'.

And that's why you never got the girl.

So you have mum issues.

Next.

Your reply is unbelievably childish. You just never worked out how life really works, did you?

I bet you hate men who are successful with women.

Deal with the truth: you're a 'nice guy'.

As you said ............. NEXT.

[benalibina]

This thread will have 8 pages of answers in the next 5 hours....

Not correct.

The self fulfilling prophesy speaks lol

There's either something wrong with your wrist watch or you entered another space-time continuum

He must be reading this topic in total disbelief. Timewise that is ! His guesses for the number of pages, well............not to bad.