Visa requirements for Thai girlfriend staying in UK for few years.

[billybatson]

Hello all, my first post here so please excuse my newbie-ness. I have read several of the pinned threads and basics on UK visa requirements but I'm still not sure what the options are.

So here's the situation. I met my Thai GF online about a year ago and after 4 months of daily calls,messaging/skype I travelled to Thailand to meet her in person. All went really well and since then I've been back again to visit her and will be seeing her in Thailand for a third time in January.

After that, I would like her to visit me here in the UK next spring. I've told her she can stay with me for a month. I'll pay for her flight and everything else while she stays with me. As far as I know there's no problem with her staying here for that short a period (but correct me if I'm wrong) . It's after that, it gets a bit tricky.

We want to live together permanently and I'm willing to move to Thailand eventually but I can't move there for at least 4 years. So she has accepted that and is happy to come to the UK and live with me here until then. So I'm not sure what kind of VISA she'll need to allow this. I don't want a settlement visa but I'm not sure how the other types of VISA will allow her to stay for as long as 4 years. As far as I can see, the UK visitor/holiday visa would allow her up to 6 months. But is this 6 months out of 12, or just 6 months at a time? Could she go back to Thailand briefly (few weeks) then come back to the UK for another 6 months, and repeat, etc?

Any advice greatly appreciated.

[ThaiVisaExpress]

A visit visa is issued purely to enable a person to visit. If the ECO thinks that visit visas are being used to get around the settlement requirements then he will refuse the application(s). The immigration rules, for visitors, state, amongst other things :

41. The requirements to be met by a person seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom as a general visitor are that he:

(ii) intends to leave the United Kingdom at the end of the period of the visit as stated by him; and does not intend to live for extended periods in the United Kingdom through frequent or successive visits;

The maximum period for a visit is 6 months. There is a "convention" ( guidance) that a genuine visitor should not normally stay in the UK for more than 6 months in any 12 months ( hence the wording in paragraph 41(ii) above). If you want your girlfriend to live in the UK for up to 4 years, then you are looking at other types of visa - settlement, student, etc. She cannot remain in the UK for that period of time as a visitor.

Edited September 30, 2013 by ThaiVisaExpress

[7by7]

To expand on the above.

There is no reason why she could not use the settlement rules to move to the UK and then leave after 4 years without applying for Indefinite Leave to Remain. Of course, were she to do this then after she had left the UK she would need the appropriate visa to return. Or she could remain for 5 years, obtain ILR and then British citizenship.

However, she and you would need to meet all the settlement requirements; including the financial ones. As you have not lived together in a relationship akin to marriage outside the UK for at least two years she would not qualify under the unmarried partner rules, so you would have to marry, either in Thailand and she applies for a spouse visa or she applies for a fiancé visa and you marry in the UK within 6 months.

Assuming you don't want to do that, the other options, as TVE says, are that she comes to the UK either as a worker or as a student.

But as you will see from the links below, this is not straightforward and the major task in most categories would be to find either an employer or an educational establishment to sponsor her.

Working in the UK

Adult Students - Tier 4 (General)

[billybatson]

Thanks for the futher info. Been looking at this in more detail now. The partner Visa option doesn't look feasible. The 18.6k income requirement kills that stone dead. She does want to work, and I want her to work but I don't see how she get get anywhere near that level of income (assuming that's annual figure, not a one-off amount) So that just leaves the Spouse or Fiance Visa. We've talked about getting married (and having kids) so this is something I'm prepared to do but I'm unclear whether it would be best to get married in Thailand or in the UK. Or does it make no difference to the Visa process/complexity/cost ?

[7by7]

At the initial visa stage, if meeting the financial requirement through income it is your income which is used, not hers.

Any income she has from a job in Thailand and any potential income she may have once in the UK cannot be used towards the requirement.

So it is you who has to be earning at least £18,600p.a..

This is the case whether she applies as an unmarried partner, a fiancé or a spouse.

Savings above £16,000 can be used to reduce the required income (down to 0 if the savings are above £62,500) and these can be hers, yours or you both jointly. But the savings must be in cash and have been in her, yours or both of your names and under your, her or both of your complete control for at least 6 months prior to the application.

All settlement visas cost the same, currently £851 (43401 baht).

A fiancé visa is valid for 6 months and during that time she travels to the UK and you marry. Once married she has to make an application for Further Leave to Remain, current cost £578 by post, £953 in person for a same day decision.

This will be valid for 30 months, at the end of which she makes another FLR application; same fee as above; except it's bound to have been increased by that time..

At the end of this 30 months she can apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain. Current fee £1051 by post, £1426 in person for a same day decision.

If you marry in Thailand she applies for a spouse visa, which is valid for 33 months.

After 30 months in the UK she applies for FLR valid for a further 30 months, fee as above.

At the end of this second period she can apply for ILR, fees as above.

So you can see that all other things being equal, the spouse route is cheaper than the fiancé route as it involves one less in UK application.

See UK Settlement Visa Basics for more details.

I must stress:- if you are going to marry, do it for the right reasons; because you love each other and want to spend the rest of your lives together. Give it some serious thought and serious discussion between you both before embarking down that road. Make sure that you are both ready to make that lifetime commitment.

Do not marry her just to get her a UK visa!

It may be a cliché, but it's proven correct time and time again. Marry in haste, repent at leisure!

Edited September 30, 2013 by 7by7

[billybatson]

Thanks for that detailed response, 7by7. So the partner visa is a possibility, after all. But I'm really put off by all the barriers to work/employment.

It's really important for my GF to be able to work and send some money back home. I'm sure I don't need to tell anyone on here how vital is for face.

The spouse Visa is the cheaper option as you've explained (I noticed you didn't mention any cost for the application, is it free ?), and I prefer the idea of a Thai ceremony anyway. Of course I realise there will be costs associated with a Thai wedding, but that's another story

[wooloomooloo]

I'm sure I don't need to tell anyone on here how vital is for face.

Rome wasn't build in day, billy. Try to resist the urge of an ideal to every stage as it's nigh on impossible and the desire to micromanage every item will only result in further disappointment for you both.

One step at time and you'll both be fine. My wife and I have been through the mill like all others and approaching, within weeks, my wife being resident in the UK for three years.

We've hardly blinked over the last three years and never expected to. It was a trial from the outset and nothing has changed.

Maybe, that was the beauty.

[7by7]

If by 'partner visa' you mean an unmarried partner visa, then no. As I said, to qualify for that the two of you would need to have been living together in Thailand in a relationship akin to marriage for at least 2 years.

As said, the fee for the initial settlement visa is currently £851 (43401 baht); whether applying as a spouse, fiancé, child etc.

As for work; as a fiancé she cannot work until after the marriage and she has FLR; as a spouse she can work immediately.

[RAZZELL]

I think the OP needs to read the advice...

You ain't gonna get an easy solution...

The only way to get your gf to the UK without marrying is a student visa...or multiple visit visas (but no work).

RAZZ

[billybatson]

I'm now thinking the sensible thing to do is go for the visit visa initially, (that'll give us both time to really see what living together would be like) and then if we're both still feeling the same way, we can get married and apply for a spouse visa. My question now is will our spouse visa application be negatively affected by previous visitor visa applications ? Will they see it as some kind of deception (trying to get around the rules, etc) or am I being paranoid?

[paully]

My question now is will our spouse visa application be negatively affected by previous visitor visa applications ?

Not if she keeps to the rules for visit visas, ie she doesn't overstay or give the impression that she is living in the UK. As you've been told, billy, there is no way of supercharging the situation and getting her to live and work in the UK overnight. It takes time and planning but your end game is eminently achieveable. Be patient.

Edited December 3, 2013 by paully

[billybatson]

" I've told her she can stay with me for a month. I'll pay for her flight and everything else while she stays with me. As far as I know there's no problem with her staying here for that short a period (but correct me if I'm wrong) "

Boy, was I wrong.

Today I've only just discovered that all Thais require an entry VISA for the UK, regardless of the length of stay.

I feel like an idiot now or maybe just completely naive. I stupidly assumed if she had a valid passport, she could come to the UK for 30 days.

This will throw a massive spanner in the works. We've been talking about her visiting the UK and were hoping to do it this April. What are the chances of getting a VISA granted before then?

[theoldgit]

" I've told her she can stay with me for a month. I'll pay for her flight and everything else while she stays with me. As far as I know there's no problem with her staying here for that short a period (but correct me if I'm wrong) "

Boy, was I wrong.

Today I've only just discovered that all Thais require an entry VISA for the UK, regardless of the length of stay.

I feel like an idiot now or maybe just completely naive. I stupidly assumed if she had a valid passport, she could come to the UK for 30 days.

This will throw a massive spanner in the works. We've been talking about her visiting the UK and were hoping to do it this April. What are the chances of getting a VISA granted before then?

I thought it was pretty clear from earlier posts, especially the advice from Thai Visa Express, that your girlfriend would need a visa for her short holiday.

Anyway let's draw a line under that.

Given that applications for visit visas take in the region of two week or so, then yes your girlfriend would have time to submit an application for a visit visa if she plans to visit in April. She needs to apply and pay on line and visit the application centre with her supporting documents.

Plenty of advice on this forum but basically when submitting her application she needs to satisfy the Entry Clearance Officer that her proposed trip is genuine, affordable and that she is likely to return home at the conclusion of her trip.

Plenty of advice here, but come back if you have any specific questions.

http://www.vfs-uk-th.com/

[billybatson]

Ok back to the drawing board and on with the visa application process. I'm quite confident about being able to satisfy the first 2 requirements (genuine visitor and visitor is fully funded) but the reason to return is the worry. Her job would be the expected reason but I'm guessing that her employer will not leave her job open for her (which employer do you know is happy for staff to take a 1 month holiday??). The reality is she'll have to get a new job when she gets back, which is not difficult in Thailand, but how will the ECO view this? I really hope they will not look at this as the main reason to return. I want to completely upfront about our intentions. We want to live together, in the UK initially, so this is a 1 month trial visit, which if it works out will be followed by a longer visit (6 months) or getting married and applying for a spouse visa. Should I write a supporting letter (explaining all this) for her to include in her application?

[howerde]

For a visit visa the reason to return to Thailand is going to be the main issue that ECO are looking at, family ties, children,job, concentrate on that

[theoldgit]

You're right in saying that most employers wouldn't take too kindly with a one month holiday, be they in Thailand or the UK.

It depends how long she has been with her employers and her status in the company. I don't think the ECO considering the application was told that your girlfriend is giving up her job to go on holiday for a month, in the hope she will get re employed on her return, I suspect it would ring alarm bells, but that's only my viewป

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[billybatson]

She has a large family (brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, nephews, nieces - all very close) but no children. She has to send money to her mum and dad every month and she also has bills to pay (including repayments for a car). So she has a strong motivation to get back and earn money.

[Jay Sata]

I'm not sure that is sufficient information to convince an ECO of motivation for her to return Billy.

Hundreds of thousands of Thai ladies are in a similar situation.

[theoldgit]

She has a large family (brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, nephews, nieces - all very close) but no children. She has to send money to her mum and dad every month and she also has bills to pay (including repayments for a car). So she has a strong motivation to get back and earn money.

The person considering the application could view this as a motivation to seek work elsewhere to enable her to send cash back to her parents.

She really needs to convince the ECO that she has strong ties to Thailand, and that's where he future lays.

Visit visas are just that, somebody who wants to visit the UK for a holiday, they are not really designed for somebody who wants to test the water, maybe they should be.

[7by7]

She really needs to convince the ECO that she has strong ties to Thailand, and that's where he future lays.

With respect, og, I disagree.

As I say in UK visit visa basics

Even if there is no 'concrete' reason to return, many people have obtained a UK visit visa based upon the strength of their relationship with their sponsor. If the ECO believes the relationship to be genuine then they will also believe that the applicant would not want to jeopardise future applications, such as settlement, by overstaying or otherwise breaching the conditions of a visit visa.

Unless ECOs are now wary of visitors in this situation overstaying in an attempt to by pass the new settlement rules, especially the financial requirement, and so are more strict on this than they used to be?

[theoldgit]

@7by7, OK fair comment, but in this case I don't really think there is a strength of relationship to demonstrate.

[transam]

OP, use your head and not a couple of months of .

[billybatson]

I've known her for over a year, I've been out to see her 3 times, I've met all her family, we speak every day, for hours, I can show a ton of photos, and correspondence. Basically I've invested a lot (of time and money) in this relationship. Why would I (or anyone) do that if it wasn't a real, serious strong relationship? I hope common sense prevails here.

[theoldgit]

I've known her for over a year, I've been out to see her 3 times, I've met all her family, we speak every day, for hours, I can show a ton of photos, and correspondence. Basically I've invested a lot (of time and money) in this relationship. Why would I (or anyone) do that if it wasn't a real, serious strong relationship? I hope common sense prevails here.

Nobody is trying to put either of you down or trying to put you off, we're all on your side.

At the end of the day it's your decision and you will have to weigh everything up and do what you think is best.

One thing I will say is don't overwhelm the ECO with too much repetitive evidence, not that you would but you don't need to submit tons of photos.

Good luck.

[7by7]

@7by7, OK fair comment, but in this case I don't really think there is a strength of relationship to demonstrate.

Fair enough, og.

But if billybatson thinks he can demonstrate such a relationship, good luck to him.

[Tony M]

It's one of those weird examples in the guidance for establishing genuine relationships in settlement applications. The guidance says this, amongst a lot of other things ! :

Factors which may be associated with a genuine and subsisting

relationship ........................

(v) The partner and/or applicant have visited the other’s home country and

family and are able to provide evidence of this. (The fact that an applicant

has never visited the UK must not be regarded as a negative factor, but it is

a requirement of the Immigration Rules that the couple have met in person).

I guess you could try saying that the visit is only to help establish a genuine relationship for any future settlement application, as suggested in the UKBA guidance ? But then the ECO would probably refuse the application because you had stated an intention to settle in the UK ! I'm not seriously suggesting that you try this, but it does show a kind of contradictory side to some of the UKBA guidance. This may genuinely be what some applicants and sponsors want to do, but are unable to demonstrate sufficient reasons for the applicant to return. You can't win !