Thai flood: Picture of devastation emerges

[GentlemanJim]

Well, just think, the more land the Government allow to flood the less money they will have to pay out on rice subsidies as the crops will be destroyed. 2.5 million rai flooded already!

[hawker9000]

Nobody is ever forced to build a house where it floods every year.

It is personal choice, and the government should not be involved.

If they had built a traditional house on stilts, no problem.

When you suffer any calamity, we'll remember not to get involved-it is your problem, not ours. Heed your own words.

Fine by me. You will find this hard to grasp, but many of us are bought up to both be generous to those in need (and if you're in a position to help these flood victims I hope you'll do so) WHILE AT THE SAME TIME be self-reliant, responsible for the consequences of our own decisions, and NOT dependent on government or insistent on public aid or charity, and to in fact be humiliated at the thought of taking either welfare or charity. And yes, I've worked my way through some tough times - as have prior generations in my family - without welfare or charity.

All that said, it seems remarkable that Thailand is still experiencing this kind of periodic devastation in the year 2013. Surely the means exist!

[Thaddeus]

Glad to see the trillions in flood prevention funding went to such good use. Great job PTP!

I guess you're one of those guys that does not read the small print.

Trillion or billion make little difference if none of it went where it should have done.

[indyuk]

Hopefully compensation will be paid alot quicker than last time. Some of my wifes friends in Rangsit are still waiting for the promised payout after the 2011 flood.

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

In Thailand the distribution of relief money always gets to the entitled beneficiary.

The Thai distribution of funds targeted at villagers is very difficult to cheat.

This is my best attempt at explaining why: (Moderator please edit my errors rather than delete)

We foreigners need to see the good in Thailand rather than just believe what our partners and friends tell us.

The top down management systems in Thai Government are almost infallible. At the very least the Thai way is as good those The USA or the UK. However Thai systems are rather feudal in operation.

If there is corruption in flood relief it is in the shape of false claims, sometimes for properties that don't even exist.

In the first instance Government flood relief money is issued to the provincial Governors, they in turn share it out to the Tambon(s) who in turn share it out with the 'Poo Jai Baan' (village heads)' who intern pay the individual beneficiary.

Most Thai villager's know the village their 'Poo Jai Baan' personally and can challenge him to his face for any money unpaid.

Sometimes the pot of money is robbed out (very unusual) . If a villager believes that is the case the villager can approach the village welfare Officer 'Or Bor Tor' , or further can refer it to The 'Nai Yok Or Bor' Tor who is the welfare officer for the whole Tambon.

At Tambon Level there is the 'Gam Nan' who can judicate over all of the villages for in the whole Tambon.

If they are not satisfied with that they can get signatures from other villagers and send a complaint to the Ombudsman for a decision.

When someone claims that they were not paid is often because the member of the household that signed for it pockets the money him or herself.

If a villager tells you he has not been paid he is not the registered householder, he didn't file a claim, or maybe he is not speaking the truth and maybe seeking more money from you the foreigner.

[Benmart]

Nobody is ever forced to build a house where it floods every year.

It is personal choice, and the government should not be involved.

If they had built a traditional house on stilts, no problem.

When you suffer any calamity, we'll remember not to get involved-it is your problem, not ours. Heed your own words.

Nothing wrong with planning and not relying on an inept government or others in time of disaster. Build in a flood plain, below sea level, in a tornado belt or earthquake zone and expect trouble.

[ResX]

In Prachinburi at l;east, many places are flooding that never used to, so forget the "shouldn't have built there" bit.

Local government failed to open sluice gates when they should have, and their mismanagement is directly at fault. Didn't need a ton of money, just strong leadership and some sense.

Probably wanted to save the water for later for the rice farmers.

I hear they are even now still discharging water from the big dams (not connected to Prachinburi) but to the chao praya even though its not needed intensifying floods as now they are worried that it might not hold it. They really have no idea what they are doing.

Its all about saving Bangkok first the rest can wait

If that was the case they would not have opened the big dams.. then they would save everyone. But there was a small risk the big dams would not hold enough... so they rather have moderate flooding and no chance of big flooding then dry or a real big flooding.

You are right. That is what has been done. But it did not have to be that way. At least not since the last 3 weeks and up to today. They have to try to protect everybody that deserve such protection from floods until they know without any reasonable doubt flooding the minority is a must to save the majority. They have to have the system to know when such call has to be made and by whom.

The major problem is....beleive me that I can't be wrong with this one.....the authorities are unclear about what size of flood they are going to deal with. They think they can take whatever to come but they are dead wrong. While trying to meet the objective that cannot be achieved some flood plains will be inundated.. Colleteral damaged as some like to call it.

No. It should not be that way. It doesn't make sense to flood 2million people once for every two years since in 10 years the number of persons affected will become 12 million too. It took 50 years for a flood with the size of the 2011 floods to trouble 12 millions people. Now It takes less than 15 years to get the same outcome with the way the authorities deal with floods in Thailand.

[robblok]

If that was the case they would not have opened the big dams.. then they would save everyone. But there was a small risk the big dams would not hold enough... so they rather have moderate flooding and no chance of big flooding then dry or a real big flooding.

You are right. That is what has been done. But it did not have to be that way. At least not since the last 3 weeks and up to today. They have to try to protect everybody that deserve such protection from floods until they know without any reasonable doubt flooding the minority is a must to save the majority. They have to have the system to know when such call has to be made and by whom.

The major problem is....beleive me that I can't be wrong with this one.....the authorities are unclear about what size of flood they are going to deal with. They think they can take whatever to come but they are dead wrong. While trying to meet the objective that cannot be achieved some flood plains will be inundated.. Colleteral damaged as some like to call it.

No. It should not be that way. It doesn't make sense to flood 2million people once for every two years since in 10 years the number of persons affected will become 12 million too. It took 50 years for a flood with the size of the 2011 floods to trouble 12 millions people. Now It takes less than 15 years to get the same outcome with the way the authorities deal with floods in Thailand.

I read your post.. and earlier in the topic i credit you and let people read your posts. Just repeating what you said and I read that the dams were not full at all so they could have stopped it for a while but they did not.

Anyway its bloody annoying, but I know I wont be hit only a 2011 kind of flood will hit me. But i got scared again because of the lack of information until i found the site bangkok pundit with good figures about the flooding. But once flooded its always in the back of your head. I don't mind getting flooded once every 50 or 20 years.. if it was in 3 to 5 year cycles id move for sure.

I did buy an expensive pair of waders after 2011... was not sure at that time and i knew after being flooded that they are worth their price in gold.

[teetersb]

Hopefully compensation will be paid alot quicker than last time. Some of my wifes friends in Rangsit are still waiting for the promised payout after the 2011 flood.

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

In Thailand the distribution of relief money always gets to the entitled beneficiary.

The Thai distribution of funds targeted at villagers is very difficult to cheat.

This is my best attempt at explaining why: (Moderator please edit my errors rather than delete)

We foreigners need to see the good in Thailand rather than just believe what our partners and friends tell us.

The top down management systems in Thai Government are almost infallible. At the very least the Thai way is as good those The USA or the UK. However Thai systems are rather feudal in operation.

If there is corruption in flood relief it is in the shape of false claims, sometimes for properties that don't even exist.

In the first instance Government flood relief money is issued to the provincial Governors, they in turn share it out to the Tambon(s) who in turn share it out with the 'Poo Jai Baan' (village heads)' who intern pay the individual beneficiary.

Most Thai villager's know the village their 'Poo Jai Baan' personally and can challenge him to his face for any money unpaid.

Sometimes the pot of money is robbed out (very unusual) . If a villager believes that is the case the villager can approach the village welfare Officer 'Or Bor Tor' , or further can refer it to The 'Nai Yok Or Bor' Tor who is the welfare officer for the whole Tambon.

At Tambon Level there is the 'Gam Nan' who can judicate over all of the villages for in the whole Tambon.

If they are not satisfied with that they can get signatures from other villagers and send a complaint to the Ombudsman for a decision.

When someone claims that they were not paid is often because the member of the household that signed for it pockets the money him or herself.

If a villager tells you he has not been paid he is not the registered householder, he didn't file a claim, or maybe he is not speaking the truth and maybe seeking more money from you the foreigner.

I'm not sure if you really believe what you wrote, or if this is sarcasm. If it's sarcasm could you please add a smiley face. If not, well I guess I know your opinion.

[ResX]

If that was the case they would not have opened the big dams.. then they would save everyone. But there was a small risk the big dams would not hold enough... so they rather have moderate flooding and no chance of big flooding then dry or a real big flooding.

You are right. That is what has been done. But it did not have to be that way. At least not since the last 3 weeks and up to today. They have to try to protect everybody that deserve such protection from floods until they know without any reasonable doubt flooding the minority is a must to save the majority. They have to have the system to know when such call has to be made and by whom.

The major problem is....beleive me that I can't be wrong with this one.....the authorities are unclear about what size of flood they are going to deal with. They think they can take whatever to come but they are dead wrong. While trying to meet the objective that cannot be achieved some flood plains will be inundated.. Colleteral damaged as some like to call it.

No. It should not be that way. It doesn't make sense to flood 2million people once for every two years since in 10 years the number of persons affected will become 12 million too. It took 50 years for a flood with the size of the 2011 floods to trouble 12 millions people. Now It takes less than 15 years to get the same outcome with the way the authorities deal with floods in Thailand.

I read your post.. and earlier in the topic i credit you and let people read your posts. Just repeating what you said and I read that the dams were not full at all so they could have stopped it for a while but they did not.

Anyway its bloody annoying, but I know I wont be hit only a 2011 kind of flood will hit me. But i got scared again because of the lack of information until i found the site bangkok pundit with good figures about the flooding. But once flooded its always in the back of your head. I don't mind getting flooded once every 50 or 20 years.. if it was in 3 to 5 year cycles id move for sure.

I did buy an expensive pair of waders after 2011... was not sure at that time and i knew after being flooded that they are worth their price in gold.

Thank you mate. I have read Bangkok Pundit quite often. Some of my statements made possible with the info from that site. Bangkok Pundit may not be water management and flood control expert but it tries to tell its readers something within it knowledge to do so. Very fair reporting too.

[phuket43]

More rubbish from a PM well out of her depth, sorry no pun intended.

This woman said there was no flooding and that there wouldn't be followed by another muppet claiming everything was under control. If she wants to speak out she should at least admit the government got it all wrong, again, but that's too much to expect as is an explaination as to what happened to all the flood prevention and defence promised after 2011.

All the floods have meant to her was yet another photo op in prachin Buri which she screwed up by looking as if she was delighted to be there. Apart from her usual blunders over words she didn't even know which game face was appropriate.

I think you're a bit unfair. Not one word about her Gucci rain boots.

[MikeOboe57]

The same team that flooded Thailand in 2011 is still in charge. So with a similar amount of rain and excess water we should expect a similar result. Our only hope is less available water for these buffoons to tamper with.

[MaiChai]

1000 years of Thai culture and you would think that in that timeframe, flooding would have been overcome?

If it were my country i would have permanent large flood canals ready to capture and drain off the water to the sea.

Talking about the sea, they need to start preparing for rising sea levels (hint: talk to the Dutch).

[shrimpythailand]

Hopefully compensation will be paid alot quicker than last time. Some of my wifes friends in Rangsit are still waiting for the promised payout after the 2011 flood.

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

5 5 5 i have been in Rangsit 12 years and got flooded in 2011.... never saw a baht of the "supposed" 5000 bt help.... then heard maybe 20,000 - never saw that either and we signed up in time and all that... seems like maybe money was handed out to whoever but then it ran out... whatever... am glad of cement walls tho... glad we don't have drywall and wood construction....was not that terrible to clean, re wire and paint...was not fun but a life experience...seems like this year the flooding is all from the other direction...

steve

Ransit

[thaibeachlovers]

1000 years of Thai culture and you would think that in that timeframe, flooding would have been overcome?

If it were my country i would have permanent large flood canals ready to capture and drain off the water to the sea.

Talking about the sea, they need to start preparing for rising sea levels (hint: talk to the Dutch).

Sorry, but you have overlooked the fact that large scale deforestation only occurred recently ( in an historical sense ), so it was unnecessary in most of those 1000 years.

[Mitch99]

... floodwaters have damaged 14,405 houses, 2.12 million rai of farmland, 4,899 roads, 197 bridges and 516 dikes or weirs.

That's called, what?

Thai attention to detail and perfect workmanship which balls all down to - "EDUCATION" - and, of course. LOVE AND CARE FOR PEOPLE?

Gimme a break.

CO-ruption throughout all government, starting with the "Logic" thinking PM girl.

Go to hell, will you!

[Mitch99]

Sorry, but you have overlooked the fact that large scale deforestation only occurred recently ( in an historical sense ), so it was unnecessary in most of those 1000 years.

... says the Thai economist, political analyst, historian and free government advisor specialist!

And so what, Thais will still drown themselves.

They better make it faster, hurts less.

[hawker9000]

Sorry, but you have overlooked the fact that large scale deforestation only occurred recently ( in an historical sense ), so it was unnecessary in most of those 1000 years.

... says the Thai economist, political analyst, historian and free government advisor specialist!

And so what, Thais will still drown themselves.

They better make it faster, hurts less.

What TBL had to say seemed like a valid comment to me.

[dutchisaan]

Dutch companies where offering there help. Ofcourse we are Dutch and whant to make a penny. However, they where not invited. I am wondering who is losing face again.

[Mitch99]

You have to have face first, before you can risk to lose it. Thus, Thai are in the best position to NEVER LOSE a face ;-)

[FarangTalk]

 

 

 

Karma is a biatch

Vote PTP and you get to live under water

 

Vote for the Democrats and be happy, save from all harm and been taken care of at all times!

Reality is a bitch, too!

 

I agree, the dems most likely would not have done much about the flood problems either, but at least with the dems in power, we would not have had to pay 350 billion for "nothing"

In short, it is better to have a government that does absolutely nothing, than a government that does nothing but steal public funds!

 

 

I am not sure Moses himself could have done anything about it.

 

 

 

If the Dems were in power with the amount of power that the PTP has things would definatly be a lot better. But when you depend on other parties like they had to do with Newin you are definatly in a hole. I am not saying there would not be problems but they would not be near as bad and the government would not be lying to you every time they open their mouth.

 

The Chuan Leekpai governments in the 90's were plagued by corruption. Deputy PM Suthep was partly responsible for one of them collapsing, you guessed it, due to corruption.

Just two cheeks of the same ar@#.

Sent from my SM-N900 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Thaddeus]

The Chuan Leekpai governments in the 90's were plagued by corruption. Deputy PM Suthep was partly responsible for one of them collapsing, you guessed it, due to corruption.

Just two cheeks of the same ar@#.

Sorry but, you are trying to compare a Pedalo with the Titanic.